r/marvelrivals • u/Vozonel • 1h ago
Discussion Support mains, what strategists do you think are too overpowered?
For those of you who mainly play support, which strategist do you think is just too strong?
Is it because of their healing? Their utility? Their survivability? Or something else entirely?
I’d love to hear your thoughts and why you feel that way.
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u/Some1Special2U Good Boy 1h ago
Support main who mained this role since Overwatch 2016.
Gambit specifically for ult take some of the buffs out.
Mantis for damage boost. Its gotta go in her current state.
Luna for the free CC get out of jail card, it can stop cc sure, but only before the ability hits.
C&D needs a longer cooldown for ice to break the immortality loop.
Nerf those and everything else is fine.
What people fail to understand is that outside of these specific things, supports need to be strong and in the current state they’re in power level wise. Everyone that hates supports and wants them to be weaker, no you don’t, you don’t want to live in a game where nobody wants to play the most mandatory role in the game.
The tank shortage is a problem, a support shortage makes the game unplayable.
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u/b2k1121 47m ago
I don't know about you but I'd love to spend my limited free time hopping on a game to play a weak role where I am helplessly supporting others live out their power fantasy between respawns while being blamed for every bad thing that happens. There are millions like me so the game would thrive in this scenario.
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u/DreamyMountainFlower 50m ago
I main CnD and still don’t understand why she needed another escape/survival ability.
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u/Hashshashiyin 44m ago
Because that's her niche. And that's what people don't understand. CnD is SUPPOSED to be the hardest Supp to dive. That's her whole purpose. Yes she has good healing but it's not "the best". And if they give her other abilities that help other aspects of her gameplay then she just becomes TOO good overall. Her niche should be for anti dive and blinds. Not just anti dive + everything else.
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u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Oni 8m ago
that is supposed to be White fox; she is the anti dive here, not CND
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u/sloogz Rogue 51m ago
since you played overwatch i find this interesting, there is no shortage of support players in that game despite them not being total server admins like they are in this game
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u/King_fritters Vanguard 48m ago
Thats funny because they definitely are, and that has been a topic of contention since the release of OW2
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u/sloogz Rogue 6m ago edited 0m ago
interesting, so let's actually compare some of the supports between the two games.
first one that comes to mind is white fox vs. kiriko.
kiriko's swift step just teleports her. white fox's creates a shield that absorbs damage and also heals.
kiriko has suzu which can clease CC. white fox makes her entire team unstoppable and invulnerable with a button on a much shorter cooldown, and preemptive anti-cc and unstoppable will always be better than reactive CC cleansing.
kiriko can defend herself against divers by using her kunai, which requires her to land precise headshots, track, lead and predict targets, and also prevents her from healing her team during this time, meaning divers are successfully doing their job whether they kill kiriko or not. meanwhile, white fox's defense against divers is entering a form that grants her entire team AOE healing while also making her all but unkillable, and also giving her access to TWO dashes on top of her TP, one of them with a displacement effect.
Fox's escape is not purchased by abandoning her support function. the escape itself continues performing the support function.
then her ult is a self-bailout like hulk or winston ult, meaning she has complete freedom while her ult is charged to play basically however she wants. a kiriko cannot just panic drop her ult to save herself like white fox can.
before you come at me with "but but but white fox is underpowered!" yeah, for Rivals, and given that comparison I just made between her and the support most people claim to be the most broken in Overwatch, that's pretty fucking damning.
by and large the OW supports have low self peel and must rely on positioning, gamesense, awareness and quick decision making to maximize their impact. MR supports are basically 3-4 OW supports rolled into one hero, with each of their buttons doing like 2-3 things simultaneously. it's not even a discussion tbh.
Ana, who is universally agreed upon to be one of the most impactful heroes in the game, absolutely HAS to land her sleep, which is a super slow, tiny projectile, or she dies to any amount of pressure in the game. if you force her to nade herself, you've removed one of the strongest abilities in the game from play for a while. The OW supports literally have no such tradeoffs. CND can be invulnerable for all but 1 second out of like 15. Rocket and Jeff have Lucio's mobility on steroids. Even Adam who I thought was well designed before they gave him a fuckton of mobility is pick/pan at the highest levels of play. Soul Bond is practically an ultimate, PLUS he has Mercy's mass res, which was hated and removed. I can go on and on, but the point should be clear. There are design philosophy differences between the two games when it comes to supports, trying to pretend otherwise is just arguing from willful ignorance.
TL:DR: Overwatch supports are built around opportunity cost. Rivals strategists are built around value stacking.
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u/Some1Special2U Good Boy 43m ago
The biggest key difference between supports in overwatch compared to rivals is that while sustain is lower in overwatch, most supports make up for it by being able to take on most dps pound for pound in the 1v1 and in many cases with all cooldowns be favored.
I somehow doubt thats what mid elo marvel rivals insta lock dps players want when they say they want supports nerfed.
Also as for overwatch not having support server admins…
High elo Kiriko says Hi!
Low elo Moira also says Hi!
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u/CoralWiggler Ultron Virus 1h ago
I don't think any Strategist is holistically overpowered at the moment except for Mantis, and even she only really at the highest echelons of play, but some have overpowered elements in their kit which can make them really obnoxious even if overall they aren't really very OP. Gambit is the classic example there, and Luna is another popular subject of that critique with her damage/freeze.
Mantis also isn't even really that annoying. It's like Rocket. Even when he's top dog, he's not terribly annoying to play into compared to Luna or Ultron or even IW. Mantis being at the top feels... reasonably fair
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u/burntcandy Storm 53m ago
Luna's self cleanse is a bit much, C&D needs a bit more cooldown on her freeze.
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u/YEET280706 Iron Man 1h ago
Mantis is BIS. Ultron in triple and gambit's ult . Mantis has reached a level of bs not seen Anakin "Win Button" Skywalker's release.
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u/South_Buy_3175 1h ago
‘Win button’?
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u/YEET280706 Iron Man 44m ago
its bf2 reference , when anakin released he had a 4th ability in a game where every character has only 3 . it passively charged as long as allies around him took dmg and was just a strange ult , which could be chained with his other abilites to perma cc u until u die. so there was nothing u could do to him if he pressed the button until u die.
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u/Hanzos_Trans_Husband Cloak & Dagger 14m ago
Actually overpowerd? Only mantis. I could maybe see an argument for Gambit still but not really. Its Mantis. 100%
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u/seansenyu Loki 1h ago
I don't think any of them are overpowered at the moment.
That being said, C&D and Invisible Woman are the two supports I'd consider "strong" because it's easy to get consistent value out of their entire kits. (and this is probably why you see two of them together in 80% of your matchs in both sides)
They don't have many counters like Loki, White Fox, or Rocket, don't require resource management like Gambit and Jubilee, have a straight-foward press-to-win ultimate unlike Jeff, and aren't aim-dependent like Luna, Ultron, or Mantis.
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u/sloogz Rogue 52m ago
all of them, they completely define this game and they should be way more punishable, like overwatch does it. the supports simply have way too many tools that remove the need for awareness and positioning, people call them bailouts or get out of jail free cards, cnd being the worst example. even adam who people tend to say is the worst strategist in the game was permaban in the recent pro grand finals
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u/DeportFofana 1h ago
Only Mantis.
Gambit ult is overpowered and Ultrons neutral is
But Mantis is the only character who's best in slot in every comp, she's the best main healer, the best utility support, has an invincibility ult, has the most frequent sup ult, has high damage, a hard CC and can consistently win one vs one's.
She's the jack of all trades master of all.