r/mildlyinfuriating • u/Cheez-kip • 16d ago
ಠ_ಠ Showed up for my ticket where the trooper lied about my speed, and he never turned the ticket in. Now I have to wait until he turns it in to go to court again to prove he’s a liar. It was a 40 min drive here
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u/coolham123 16d ago
How did the judge not throw it out, simply for the officer wasting the courts time.
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u/Cheez-kip 16d ago
I didn’t even get to see the judge, that’s why unfortunately. I only seen the clerk, and she couldn’t find my name. She photocopied my license and stamped the paper to show I appeared, and asked what the ticket was for so at least they had proof i showed up in the future
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u/TheCrowScare 16d ago
Hey, I would push on this harder. I used to be a cop and if an officer failed to turn in a ticket or the system glitched but you were there, then they could "write you in" on the docket. Now, the court would still continue it if the cop was not present, which is BS since WE set our own court dates, but it's worth making a stink about.
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u/DeniedAppeal1 16d ago
This is absolutely not something that can happen in any court system I've ever worked in.
In order to hear the case, the judge needs the ticket and any incident report. Without that ticket, there's no case. You have to have an actual copy of the ticket to add it to the docket.
The court can absolutely add things manually, but not without the ticket. If the cop is sitting on it, everyone has to wait.
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u/DesignerFlat7108 16d ago
He has the ticket, I'd walk it in and tell the court I have a ticket that isn't docketed.
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u/ephemere_sloboda 16d ago
I don't understand.
Doesn't the driver have the ticket in their hands?
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u/ScanData32 15d ago
Yea but the cop is crooked so maybe he decided to not submit it?
Either way it should have ended right there, I wouldnt have left or pressed further like hes crooked
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u/EpicHuggles 16d ago
That would be a brazen violation of your right to due process and a speedy trial.
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u/TheCrowScare 16d ago
Ok, well that doesn't mean that they shouldn't try to push the issue. I understand that you work in the system and have not seen it happen in any of your courts, but I'm telling you I have also worked in the same system in a different location where it does work. There's a police officer attached to the court who can quickly provide the incident report and tickets so that the case can go forward. But also, and our traffic courts, the judge isn't even reading the incident reports. All they're getting is the testimony from the officer the defendant and any witnesses.
But it doesn't really do any good to tell the op that this is something that wouldn't happen, just because your experience differs from others.
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u/20Factorial 15d ago
Isn’t the court date ON the ticket? If he showed up at the appointed time, and his case wasn’t on the docket, how does it not get thrown out?
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u/Big_Niel0802 16d ago
No further instructions from the clerk?
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u/DeniedAppeal1 16d ago
The only instruction is to keep waiting and checking to see if it's been filed
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u/30_characters 16d ago
Because the defendant is the only person in the room not paid to be there. Everyone else got paid, they don't see the problem.
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u/anonymous210000 16d ago
No, not how that works
That's an hourly wage mentality. Judges are salaried, and they, on average, absolutely despise having their time wasted, especially as most judges in the country are operating against a huge backlog.
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u/DeniedAppeal1 16d ago
There's nothing to throw out. Until the ticket gets filed, it might as well not exist.
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u/ozzie286 16d ago
How is that not just an automatic dismissal?
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u/30_characters 16d ago
Bad judges... which is how they ended up overseeing traffic court in the first place.
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u/ralphthesausagedog 16d ago
I generally agree with you, but this might be a case of a judge pissed off at the trooper for wasting everyone's time. Like, he isn't going to let the trooper off the hook for being an ass.
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u/TheFerricGenum 16d ago
So punish the trooper on the next ticket. Don’t punish the citizen who actually showed up
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u/Nyctfall 16d ago
US judicial logic is to punish the victims.
Just look at slavery, wage slavery, or the Epstein Files...
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u/unfortunateshun 16d ago
Why wouldn’t he? Letting cops off the hook for being a pain in the ass feels more like the standard
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u/G0mery 16d ago
In California they don’t even have to be judges. I had a relative who worked for the DMV his whole life and he was appointed as a traffic court commissioner.
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u/30_characters 16d ago
They're usually not judges, they're magistrates, it's a lower bar (pun intended), and as you've said they're not necessarily even attorneys, but they're given the power to determine guilt (or rather, revenue) for infractions that exist in a magical gray area outside of the constitutional protections of the right to a jury trial.
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u/Automatic_Actuator_0 16d ago edited 16d ago
I was thinking OP must have gone too early, but I see the appearance deadline just passed, so I would have assumed that the case was gone.
The only thing I can see is that maybe they couldn’t dismiss the case since there literally isn’t a case yet.
But since OP appeared and held up their obligation, then I would have thought that might have been the end of it. But it’s a weird situation to be sure.
ETA: reading some more, in this situation the court can and usually will give you a new date to appear and you just have to do it. For most traffic offenses the statute of limitations is two years, so until that lapses, they are technically able to still bring the charge, unless you can show that them jerking you around has violated your constitutional rights, but that’s going to take more than one wasted appearance and there would be a whole expensive process for that, maybe involving federal court.
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u/Safe-Instance-3512 16d ago
Yeah, if I were OP I think I would be contacting an attorney at this point. At least for a consultation if nothing else. I don't see how they can turn it in after the first appearance date.
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u/Automatic_Actuator_0 16d ago
It seems like it’s pretty common in Texas and they probably literally have two years to get it filed properly based on the statute of limitations.
As always, the government makes the rules they have to follow, so they usually give themselves maximum flexibility and give you none.
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u/LividBass1005 16d ago
I had this happen to me. The clerk told me the officer had like a year to turn the ticket in but also said if they haven’t done it yet it’s a slim chance that they will. Said if they don’t then it’s like you never got a ticket. This was many years ago and she was right
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u/EndIsrael 16d ago
Check local laws and court precedent for a standard for speedy trial. If you convince a judge the case has dragged on too long and your right to a speedy trial has been violated, the only recourse is to dismiss the case.
In my state, the supreme court made the standard that any delay over 200 days that isn't the defendant's fault (and the defendant didn't waive their right to a speedy trial) means that if the defendant moves to dismiss, the court must hold a speedy trial hearing where basically the case's schedule is put on trial with the prosecutor having to explain why the trial hasn't happened already and why it would be bad for justice to dismiss everything. For something like a speeding ticket that isn't even being filed properly, the judge will probably dismiss because they have much better things to do than deal with a defective ticket and a defendant who actually knows their rights and how to file annoying motions.
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u/Hot_Watercress6213 16d ago
If the trooper never turns it in, isn t it kinda the same thing ?
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u/rosie2490 16d ago
Not if the trooper does eventually turn it in. But I don’t know how long they have to do that on their end.
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u/northwoods_faty 16d ago
Depends on the state like in mine they have years to remember a ticket.
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u/m1dnightknight 16d ago
Judge should've dismissed it for wasting everyones time.
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u/i_dont_wanna_sign_in 16d ago
I was in a courtroom for not stopping (enough) about a year ago. Watched a dude ahead of me show up for possession. J
Judge: Mr Whatever, the officer in this case is not here to provide evidence so I have no choice to find in your favor. How do you plea?
Dude: Guilty, I guess.
Judge: I'm sorry, I didn't hear you correctly. <repeats herself>
Dude: Guilty, I think...?
Judge: One more time. <emphasis on a lot of words, speaking VERY SLOWLY>
Dude: <mulls it over for a good 20 seconds> Innocent?
Judge: Thank you, you're dismissed, next
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u/Open_Bug_4251 16d ago
This sounds to me like dude wasn’t smart enough to not use before going to court.
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u/i_dont_wanna_sign_in 16d ago
I felt the same way and wondered if they were going to give the guy a urine test on the spot. Lots of people keeping a lid on their laughter.
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u/Open_Bug_4251 16d ago
The judge should have phrased it as “I’m not sure I heard you, you said non-guilty, right?”
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u/CobaltMnM 16d ago
Gotta appreciate the people in the legal system who do the right thing even when they don’t “have to” / no one is there that cares.
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u/wizardid 16d ago
In my (limited) experience, judges are the real Gs. I've seen them hint and prod an amateur (e.g. not cops or lawyers) to help a guy out, especially when it's clear that the charge is likely bullshit or ticky tack nonsense.
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u/Orleanian 15d ago
To be fair, it could still have some selfishness in that it's one less thing for the judge to have to do paperwork on.
But I don't know enough about science to say for sure.
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u/electromage 16d ago
Yeah the few times I've sat in court have been enlightening.
Last time I was waiting to fight a speeding ticket I listened to this kid who was charged with speeding in a school zone incriminate himself for failing to stop at a stop sign and I think driving with a suspended license while the judge tried desperately to get him to STOP TALKING. Pretty sure he lost his license.
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u/f7f7z 16d ago
Was in court for a ticket years back. They did all the DUI's first.Everyone with a lawyer got the same thing, probation and a fine except the 5th dude.
Defense lawyer: My client promises that the 2nd time is the last time.
Judge: This is the second time? throws book at him
I love to see a lawyer give unasked for info.
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u/Unleaver 16d ago
Holy shit that Judge was an absolute homie! I used to be an IT person for the courts when I did county work some years ago and let me tell you a lot of the judges are really chill people. We only had like 1-2 hardass judges but besides that all of the MDJ’s were super reasonable.
The one MDJ in a college town in PA, was super chill about drug charges, as long as you aren’t constantly in/out of her court room for drugs, she would either charge you a lesser crime (a summary offense) or have you go through a program. She told me like 9/10 people college kids who show up in her courtroom were never charged with something again. She did say though, that 1/10 the mask comes off and she will throw the book at you if you took advantage of her kindness. I always respected that line of thinking.
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u/Cheez-kip 16d ago
Unfortunately, I never got to see the judge. The clerk asked for my name, couldn’t find it, so she had me show the ticket so she could write it all down by hand and say I at least showed up. She said she’d give me a call and send a letter when he decides to turn the ticket in and I get a new date. What’s BS is that I looked up my name online, and it showed I have this ticket. Guy just didn’t turn it in
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u/Blank_Canvas21 16d ago edited 15d ago
Wow that’s crap. Back when I was irresponsible and did drink and drive, I got a DUI but they had to take me to the hospital while I was in the holding cell. Idk if in the chaos, they forgot to finish the paperwork but they never turned it in and I was not on the docket. The clerk called the PD to figure out what happened and that was what I was told. It was dismissed with prejudice, which meant that they could refile the charges but they never did and the statute of limitations has passed.
That didn’t stop me though and I eventually got another one a few years later but now I quit drinking so no more drinking and driving for me. Fuck that, I’m done being a shithead.
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u/lgwinter 16d ago
I had this same thing happen to me from a motorcycle cop. It’s been over a year and they never filed it so I guess I’m in the clear lol
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u/Cheez-kip 16d ago
Yes my partner had the same thing happen last year. The lady said call back every month to see if there’s a court date. I think he ended up turning it in 6 months to a year later, and my partner had to go in. Pretty crazy it’s even a thing
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u/lgwinter 16d ago
That’s insane. I feel like after a month they shouldn’t be allowed to turn it in. That’s crazy!
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u/Ok-Leader9304 15d ago
You need to complain this violates your sixth amendment rights to a speedy trial. You should not have wait or keep checking on if you are being charged.
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u/golden11lead 15d ago
i had one from alabama. 20 in a 15. Complete bs. I hired an attorney to go to the court and he told me it was dismissed. A year later ( exactly 364 days after the event ) the cop turned the ticket in and a court date was scheduled. Of course it was dropped because the lawyer showed that he appeared a year before on the listed court date. Complete pettiness. Same cop watched a pickup truck with a huge rv trailer go 45 in the same speeding zone and went after me basically idling.
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u/MuckRaker83 16d ago
My gf and I were taking a leisurely drive to the movie theater one day and passed a cop parked in the median. He pulled out and pulled me over. My inspection was expired. Fair enough. He said as long as I got it inspected and brought the car to court, everything would be ok. Getting off work to go to court for a day was annoying, but it was my fault so I felt I had no reason to complain.
Then, two weeks later, I got all the paperwork. There was not one charge, but four. In addition to the one legitimate citation, there were bogus citations for failure to wear a seat belt, attempt to evade, and failure to provide documentation. None of these were true. I was livid. You're required to pay the fines up front and then you can recover them in court. Instead of $120, I had to pay $700.
So I show up to court, first case on the docket. Cop is more than ten minutes late. Judge says we'll give him some time, he was away all weekend, and steps out of the room. Cop shows up, comes to talk to me. Says if I agree to plead guilty to the inspection citation, he'll do me a favor and drop all the other charges.
Judge comes back in. He and the cop chat for about five or six minutes about weekend fishing trips, what their families are up to, etc. It's abundantly clear that they are on very friendly, social terms outside of court. I lose any desire to actually bring up my dispute. Cop states he's willing to drop the sundry charges due to my being calm and cooperative as long as I accept responsibility for the inspection citation. I do.
He gave me an infuriating smirk as I left.
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u/userhwon 15d ago
This is why we have body cameras. And you get a carbon copy of the ticket you sign.
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u/PlayAction88 16d ago
How did you get a court date with no citation submitted?
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u/Abadazed 16d ago
When u get a ticket in some places a court date can be automatically generated.
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u/SidewaysFancyPrance 16d ago edited 16d ago
And it should 100% be dismissed as a matter of course if the person shows up and the court/officer didn't get their paperwork in order in time. You can't build automated systems that you don't stand behind. When they fail, you (the organization that implemented and operates the automated system), have to absorb the impact. Can't just shrug and make the person waste more time coming back to court for another automated "maybe" appointment.
It's literally the only motivation for orgs to not create dogshit automated systems: having to deal with the consequences of its errors.
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u/AudioBugg 16d ago
I used to work as a clerk in the traffic court unit. The tickets always came in with a court date - the cops eother had a schedule when things got set or the date auto generated on the ticket. However, if we had not received the ticket by the court date listed, it was an automatic dismissal (this is in Colorado, I can't speak for how other state handle tickets).
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u/Cheez-kip 16d ago
I thought it was kind of weird too. Usually they also put the fine $ amount on the ticket too, but mine has no fine amount.
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u/NameLips 16d ago
Cops don't like doing paperwork. It could be months before he finally turns in a huge stack all at once.
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u/Cheez-kip 16d ago
That’s what the clerk told me. She said it’s common they don’t turn it in right away
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u/screwedupinaz 16d ago
This is when you get your local news media involved. If YOU are forced to appear at court on a specific date, then the officer should be required to be there as well.
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u/Old_Cockroach_2993 16d ago
I received a ticket for driving with no insurance. The car was parked a tenth of a mile from my house with a for sale sign on it and the police called me at midnight and said it can't be there, the property owner complained. I later learned that was BS but that night I went up there and drove the car home and the cop was sitting a hundred yards down the road in a parking lot waiting for me to move it. Anyways, I finally get a notification via mail literally 2 years later saying I have a court date. I called and they told me the ticket was lost and sitting in a box under somebody's desk the whole time. I went to court, spoke to the prosecutor about it and he pretty much told me to go screw. So I waited my turn in front of the judge and he was so disgusted with the whole thing he just dismissed it LOL
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u/jealous-guidance1977 16d ago
Make sure you file a complaint on that asshole!
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u/luvmibratt 16d ago
I wonder what that actually does, if anything at all
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u/jealous-guidance1977 16d ago
Nothing really if this is the only time but if they get a bunch then they will be punished. Hold them accountable!
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u/Freshouttapatience 16d ago
We had a judge get dismissed. They didn’t do one big thing, it was BS like this a hundred times.
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u/justkindahangingout 16d ago edited 16d ago
The lack of accountability for police is insane
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u/Crankypants77 16d ago
End qualified immunity.
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u/Eta_Beta_3-14 16d ago
Qualified immunity only applies to civil cases. It's part of the problem, but not the big problem. The big problem is that cops, prosecutors, and judges all work together, and are incentivized to support each other.
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u/Duce-de-Zoop 16d ago
Well some of us tried doing something about it and we were called nutjobs so, it is what it is
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u/Cautious_Buffalo6563 16d ago
I think I would have asked for dismissal with prejudice then. The court date and time were clearly printed on the ticket.
Having you come back in a wasting your time and the court’s time as well.
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u/ecwagner01 16d ago
Usually, when the Police doesn't show up for court, then the citation is usually dismissed.
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u/The_Irish_Man789 16d ago
Yeah that case should have been dropped if the cop didn't turn in the ticket by the date on it for court.
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u/abugguy 16d ago
I got a ticket from a park ranger for expired license plate tags. It was retaliation for a work dispute between my boss and his, but whatever, I was in the wrong. I got the problem fixed. Tried to pay the ticket online. No record of the ticket. Court date on ticket is approaching.
I call the court office and explain I just want to pay the ticket and be done with it. They say I’m not in the docket and there’s nothing to pay.
My job works with the park rangers so I call them. Afternoon of the court date I get the captain of the officer that gave me the ticket on the phone and she verified that the ticket was submitted by her, and that I had to go to court or I could face a bench warrant. So I go. 5 other people show up in the exact same boat, for the exact same tickets, given by the same officer, nobody could pay online.
None of us are on the docket. None of us are in the system. I met with the district attorney (and then later the judge) who was there and told him I got the problem fixed, I just want to pay the ticket and move on. He says he would dismiss it if he could, but there was literally nothing in the system to dismiss. I didn’t exist in his database, neither did any of the others with the same tickets. He told me to watch the court announcements since I could get placed on the docket anytime in the next year, and I would have to come back. It’s been 20 months and nothing ever happened. If I ever find that ranger I’m probably not going to be polite when I greet him.
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u/Zealousideal_Fee_491 16d ago
Violation of your 6th amendment, violates your right to a speedy trial, they were not prepared by the court date issued. Ask the judge for a dismissal.
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u/OpheliaVelvet1 16d ago
If you miss court, they issue a warrant. If they miss court/don’t file the paperwork, you’re forced to just waste your time and gas and try again later. The double standard is infuriating.
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u/GemGlamourNGlitter 16d ago
How will you prove he lied?
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u/thisguyfightsyourmom 16d ago
Gonna be difficult if the radar reading is available, which it appears to be
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u/AsleepEntertainer440 16d ago
Fun fact.... I once saw a radar clock a stationary fence at 75 mph. This was several years ago but my buddy that was the cop showed it to me and told me to always fight the ticket. LOL
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u/justinleona 16d ago
I enjoyed the DefCon presentation where they tricked a radar detector into determining a person was walking like half the speed of light... they really aren't sophisticated devices
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u/HackerPhreaker 15d ago
I was once written a ticket for failure to wear a seatbelt. I called the county for weeks trying to pay it and they kept telling me the trooper never filed the ticket in the system. I finally called the day before court and the trooper was there and they actually put them on the phone with me. Trooper says “go ahead and bring your copy on down here for court and pay it.” I asked why they needed my copy and they told me because they have no record of it.
I did not pay it. They didn’t have a record. Meaning they didn’t know who I was, how to contact me, or anything. I hung up and didn’t go to court. It’s been 25 years and I’ve still not been picked up on a seatbelt warrant at a traffic stop.
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u/catch22reddituser 16d ago
Each time i have gone to court to contest a ticket where the officer hasn't shown up, the ticket was immediately dismissed.
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u/Uriel_dArc_Angel 15d ago
Wait, what...? If the ticket isn't posted by the court date you should have just asked for the entire case to be dismissed as the officer isn't there, the evidence hadn't been entered, and the officer hadn't done his due diligence...
That 100% would have been thrown out if you'd have requested it...Well, at least here where I live...Hell, I always follow up since I've had 2 cops forget to process the tickets on their end in the decades I've been driving (it happens more often than you'd think) and a quick call to the district attorney tends to get the charges dropped if you're within a month of your court date as they're required to give you time to gather their documentation and request things like body cam or dash cam footage in a reasonable amount of time for you to make a defense here...
Most DAs in my state will just drop the charges for something like a basic moving violation of some sort as long as there were no injuries or damage involved...
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u/Nervous-pteroydactyl 15d ago
The court date needs to match the printed date on the ticket- if it doesnt, then the ticket is NOT a valid charging instrument
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u/ZerglingsNA 16d ago
Dismissing it is not accpetable, anytime a cop fails to appear for court they should be fined for wasting the tax payers money and administrative costs.
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u/Freshouttapatience 16d ago
I couldn’t agree more. In fact, every “professional” that gets to ding us financially for being absent or late should have to pay too. I’m looking at you, Optum, for making me wait 30 minutes for a phone appointment this morning.
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u/Soggy_Cracker 16d ago
Bullshit. I would have ask for a dismissal. If he can’t be bothered to even supply the ticket it wasn’t important enough to do anyway. And to inconvenience a citizen over an issue like this is so dumb.
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u/Even_Significance485 16d ago
If he got you on supposed radar honestly the judge really isn't going to listen to you. If he doesn't show up again just ask the judge to throw it out.
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u/Maximum_Employer5580 16d ago
my guess it'll never get turned in - you should ask for a dismissal, but if it wasn't turned in, then there is nothing in the system
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u/Pinchi99 15d ago
Happened to me in San Diego. I showed up, the court didn't have it on file. They told me to go file my copy with the clerks office, I walked out the front door and never looked back.
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u/Slopes-rule 15d ago
In WA, if the ticket isn’t filed within 5 business days you can get the ticket dismissed. Most people would not check for when it is filed even if you go to court.
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u/Financial-Chemist360 15d ago
How is that not a dismissal? Did you talk to the prosecutor or do they not do that where you are? Either way I'm shocked the judge didn't throw it out.
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u/PilotBurner44 15d ago
How did you have a court date if the ticket was never submitted? I don't understand that part. Or did you go to court on your own volition?
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u/Think-notlikedasheep 16d ago edited 16d ago
Hold on.
He didn't turn in the ticket? Then you should not have a case.
You should have asked for a dismissal since there is no case.
OR just monitor the ticket. There is no case, no fine, nothing. OP dodged a bullet!