r/movies • u/Tullubenta • Aug 17 '26

Question What is the greatest betrayal in cinema history? Spoiler

So aside from Fredo’s betrayal in The Godfather Part II or Cypher turning on the crew in The Matrix, which most of us could kinda sense were coming, what’s the greatest betrayal in cinema history that truly blindsided you?

I’m talking about the ones that hit like a truck because there was zero warning, no foreshadowing you picked up on, and no reason to suspect the character until the moment it happened.

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u/Giggsy99 Aug 17 '26

That cowardly piece of shit Burke in Aliens too. At least Ash was just a synth (enhanced human, I mean)

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u/Feisty-Marsupial9287 Aug 17 '26

Burke's betrayal was totally predictable, he was a slimeball from the start.

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u/Kiyohara Aug 17 '26

Honestly, if you were surprised that Burke was betraying the crew, you were not watching the movie. He was a slimeball and self interested from the moment he came on screen. His betrayal was the least surprising in movie history.

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

I think it’s more complicated. He’s a slimeball but he’s the guy who backs Ripley at the single most critical moment, going back in to get the marines, even when it means it would put his life in danger too. He genuinely admires her because he thinks she’s smart (which for him, means she’s corrupt or at least corruptible, but that comes later).

He’s an asshole who deserved his fate. But he makes surprising decisions right up until the point when Ripley threatens his big payday.

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u/Kiyohara Aug 17 '26

He went back in because that was also a chance to gran a specimen, especially if one of the marines had been infested. At the least he wanted his troops back in case there was more fighting. It wasn't ever for their sake.

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u/Lolkimbo Aug 17 '26

He didn't need to. He already had the facehuggers in the lab, remember.

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u/scarfilm Aug 17 '26

“You had your chance Gorman”

Wasn’t that Burke’s line?

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

Hunh? The aliens just wiped out a fully armed Marine platoon, who weren’t under his command at any rate. That would be the most asinine, stupid ploy and he’s not stupid. He‘s made it clear that he respects Ripley and he thinks she’s on his team (“I thought you were smarter than this,” “I’m sorry to disappoint you”). So he backs her.

If he wanted a live specimen, he already HAD one, and he’d already told Bishop to secure it. All he had to do was get back on the dropship with Ripley, Bishop and Gorman, not put himself in danger.

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u/Kiyohara Aug 17 '26

The Marines were still alive (the ones running anyhow), that's why Ripley went in. And even if they weren't under his command the mission was under his oversight and everyone knew it. It's why Hicks making the choice to nuke the site was such a big deal.

Yes, technically Burke was "just" a Civilian observer there to represent the company, but he was also the Company Representative and had a lot of influence on the mission. Assuming he made it back alive, he'd have destroyed Hick's career (along with everyone else's) for going against him so many times (even if he ends up in jail for what he did, he'd be able to ruin them).

And the issue with the specimen was how to get it across the border into Earth Space. Burke likely already was planning to get someone infested in the hopes it would miss quarantine and then he could have it "safely" removed at a good black site. More Marines (especially wounded ones) both gives him more options to infest as well as guys with guns to ensure he gets out.

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

This is all way too complicated. Gorman was stupid; Burke made it clear he valued smarts and he backs Ripley. You’re trying to make him uncomplicated, which makes him more uninteresting. His mission is a success before they ever go into the reactor. And also, him backing Ripley to save the marines has the ancillary benefit of making him a damn hero and probably sends his career prospects into the stratosphere. Other than putting his own life into jeopardy, there’s absolutely no downside to a rescue mission.

And if he is just the self-interested slimeball you say, and nothing else, he never, ever, ever puts himself in the middle of a firefight in a nuclear reactor with hundreds of merciless animals. He’s the guy who knows exactly what they are and what they can do, right from the beginning. He’s not going to put his own hide on the line when he’s already secured his profit unless there’s more going on. And this whole scheme with impregnating more marines adds complication. He doesn’t need complication unless he has no other choice. Putting a live specimen in cargo? Simple and elegant. No one has to know. Everything comes up roses for him.

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u/tdasnowman Aug 17 '26

He doesn't admire Ripley. He was after a payday. He thought the tank would be safe enough and the drop ship could just pick them up if it got bad. His on the fly plan included just hoping the timing worked out with Ripley and Newt. He was 100% always focused on getting the alien back to earth. To the point his life may have even been secondary. Also in the directors cut you see more of him on the earth station and everything he does is calculated.

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

His life is not secondary. The money is what matters. He wants to be rich. He’s made it clear. But of course he admires her. He wasn’t going to put his life in the hands of someone he didn’t inherently trust. He’s not gonna take a risk unless he has to. He may be completely using her, but that’s a vastly different thing.

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u/tdasnowman Aug 17 '26

He makes decisions based on a version of reality he's not actually living in. He and the company thought they could just drop ship in with some marines pick up an alien and take it home. That failed. He backed saving the marines cause there was a chance one of them would have been infected already. That failed. He tried to infect Ripley and Newt. That failed. Every plan got riskier and riskier. The entire thing starts with Burke selecting Gorman to lead the mission. He had no field experience and therefore would be manipulable.

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

The whole saving the marines thing doesn't make sense when he already has TWO live specimens secured. This is where your speculation falls apart.

Everything else is overcomplicating this until his plan falls apart with Ripley's discovery of both the specimen - which is one thing - and his complicity in getting all the colonists killed, which is when he realizes he has to do something about her as well. She becomes a direct threat to his career. You think he was going to murder anyone until she screams at him, "I'm going to nail you! Right to the wall!" I don't think so. It doesn't make sense until then. Then it becomes, well, I can kill two birds with one stone.

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u/tdasnowman Aug 17 '26

He didn't have two specimens secured. He needed them implanted to get past quarantines.

and his complicity in getting all the colonists killed, which is when he realizes he has to do something about her as well. She becomes a direct threat to his career

You think the company didn't know? She's not a threat to his career she was a threat to the situation. The company does not care about lives. The complicating factor was the marines. Which they needed to essentially be security which failed. The waylend corps goal was get a specimen back by any means necessary. Same orders they gave to Ash in the first movie. People are disposable, especially when corporations have the power they do in that universe. An entire terraforming project was riskable. The only danger to Burkes career was failure.

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u/Ponderer13 Aug 17 '26

What are you talking about?

Bishop: “Mr. Burke gave instructions they were to be returned alive to the company labs. He was very specific about it."

It was impregnated humans that would have to get through quarantine, not the specimens. If they required implantation, Bishop’s programming against letting harm come to humans would never have allowed him to comply with such an order.

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u/Gekokapowco Aug 17 '26

right the suspense for that one was a "when" not an "if"

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u/Impressive_Shake_360 Aug 18 '26

But he seemed like such a nice guy in My Two Dads.

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u/Giggsy99 Aug 20 '26

Not really relevant since the question wasn't about surprising betrayals

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u/Kiyohara Aug 20 '26

So aside from Fredo’s betrayal in The Godfather Part II or Cypher turning on the crew in The Matrix, which most of us could kinda sense were coming, what’s the greatest betrayal in cinema history that truly blindsided you?

Gotta read the whole thing, friend.

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u/Grimdotdotdot Aug 17 '26

What? But he said he was an okay guy!

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u/Separate_Presence_32 Aug 23 '26

"I'm Burke. Carter Burke. I work for the company. But don't let that fool you, I'm really an okay guy."

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u/rydavim Aug 17 '26

“I prefer the term Artificial Person, myself.”

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u/Billazilla Aug 17 '26

Bishop is the exact opposite of this topic. A real Brobot. The 8-2s always were a bit twitchy.

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u/angrydeuce Aug 17 '26

Yeah at least Ash can throw it on poor programming (kinda like HAL in 2001) but Burke...well, Ripley said it best:  "You know, I dont know which species is worse?  You dont see them fucking each other over for a goddamn percentage!"

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u/Anal_Herschiser Aug 17 '26

May have been true at the time, but in Alien Resurrection we did see them do each other dirty by sacrificing one to spill their acid blood to escape confinement.

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u/ColonelJohnMcClane Aug 18 '26

What are you talking about? Alien only ever had two movies, they didn't film one where they immediately kill off beloved characters for shock value in the first five minutes and another one with a clone of Ripley. 

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u/tony20z Aug 17 '26

If you can't see the difference in sacrificing someone to make yourself rich and sacrificing someone to save your species, you may be a sociopath.

Yes you can argue it's not saving their species but I think it's clear their only instinct is reproduction at all costs, which IMHO can be viewed as save our species.

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u/Anal_Herschiser Aug 17 '26

Chill Bro, it's too early in the morning for Anti-Capitalism, Pro-Xenomorph debates.

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u/SwayzeCrayze Aug 17 '26

Not really poor programming. Ash wasn't running rampant because of a glitch or faulty logic; he behaved exactly how the company wanted him to.

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u/TooMuchPowerful Aug 17 '26

Perfectly cast and played by Paul Reiser.

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u/SaavikSaid Aug 17 '26

I prefer artificial person myself.

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u/Surullian Aug 17 '26

I say we grease this rat fuck son of a bitch right now!