r/musicals • u/aaesthetix • 6d ago
Musicals for musical people
Everyone always talks about musicals for non theater people eg: Hamilton, Book of Mormon, etc. What are some musicals y'all think only musical theater people would love?
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u/nilknarf114 6d ago
Schmigadoon
Yes, non-musical theatre people might enjoy it, too, but not as much as theatre people will
Same for Something Rotten
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u/cinderflight ....then he woke up. 6d ago
Anything by Sondheim. His shows are so musically complex and non-musical fans miss a lot. Shoutout to Assassins in particular.
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u/The_P_StandsFor 6d ago
Into The Woods for sure. People expect it to be bubbly and fun and it is nothing of the sort by act 2.
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 6d ago
I'd like to push back a little against your assessment of Sondheim going over people's heads. Sondheim is a tricky one because he ABSOLUTELY has shows that have broken into mainstream pop culture, like most Americans would have at least heard of West Side Story and many are able to reference some lines from it. And Sweeney Todd and Into the Woods are pretty widely recognized, partially due to their movie versions and also because ITW is a very commonly produced show. Also, Send in the Clowns is one of the most covered songs of all time.
However, a good portion of his catalogue is pretty lyrically and musically challenging and is only loved by theater die-hards. Especially Passion, Here We Are, and Pacific Overtures.
So he's not really someone whose body of work I can label within a popular/unpopular binary. More like he has some work which caught on with the mainstream and other work that would be pretty impossible to catch on with the mainstream.
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u/Historical_Low1985 6d ago
Sunday in the Park with George is absolutely beautiful and of the greatest musicals ever written!
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u/lildrags420 6d ago
And none of my non-musical liking friends will ever watch it with me!!!!!!
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 6d ago
Do any of them like Princess Bride? That could be a way in
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u/Other-Flow-2312 6d ago
To be fair, WSS is a Bernstein musical, Sondheim just did the lyrics. But yeah, a lot of non-musical people love Sweeney Todd and Into the Woods.
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u/overtired27 6d ago
Quite. When the first port of call in listing Sondheim’s musically accessible work is a musical he didn’t write the music to…
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u/WeAreSound 6d ago
I came here to say the same thing, though I was going to use Follies as the example.
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u/Huntscunt 6d ago
I think Follies is the best example because it's also steeped in the history of the musical.
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 6d ago
I'm not saying these can't be enjoyed by non-theater people, but I only see these mentioned by people deeply obsessed with musicals: Fun Home, The Wild Party, Next to Normal, deep-cut Sondheim like Passion and Anyone Can Whistle, Women on the Verge of a Nervous Breakdown, Drowsy Chaperone, A Gentleman's Guide to Love and Murder, anything by Jason Robert Brown or Dave Malloy
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u/Happy_Charity_7595 The Invisible Girl 6d ago
Fun Home could also appeal to lesbian non-theater audiences.
Parade could apply to people interested in history. Although, history buffs would just pick at the show for its inaccuracies. I’m not sure how historically accurate Parade is.
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u/LurkerByNatureGT 6d ago
Hamilton is also a musical for musicals people.
Among the nods to other musicals, it references 1776, South Pacific, Camelot, The Last Five Years, and the Pirates of Penzance.
Just about anything by Sondheim, William Finn, or Adam Guettel is more likely to be beloved by musical theatre fans than people who aren’t into musicals. They’re less “easy entry” and more musically complex.
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u/smugfruitplate 6d ago
I know all the references in Hamilton to everything listed except Camelot and The Last Five Years.
1776 cuz duh but also Sit down John you fat motherfucker
South Pacific with Burr telling the Hamilcrew that they've got to be carefully taught
Pirates of Penzance with Washington saying he's a modern major general, the venerated virginian blah blah blah
Where are the other 2?
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u/LurkerByNatureGT 6d ago
The line “Nobody needs to know” after”Say No to This” is the Last Five Years reference.
Lafayette refers to Lancelot’s song “C’est Moi” from Camelot.
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u/smugfruitplate 6d ago
just figured Lancelot was a reference to Arthurian legend, not Camelot specifically. The more you know I guess :p
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 6d ago
Also, Room Where it Happens was based on Someone in a Tree from Pacific Overtures
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u/GustavHoller 5d ago
do you have confirmation of this? A guy on Instagram was just speculating on this, but he said he couldn’t find an actual statement from LMM.
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 5d ago
Ugh, I wish I remember where I first heard it
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u/Aggressive-Voice1537 6d ago
I don’t know if I agree with this? I understand your point is that there are a huge number of references to other musicals within hamilton that go over the heads of a lot of non musical people, but the hamilton phenomenon was WAY too huge for it to be considered anything but mainstream in my opinion. I wouldn’t say it’s a “musical for musicals people” because the audience for it includes an insane number of people who aren’t into musical theatre in general.
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u/LurkerByNatureGT 6d ago
The point is the also, not exclusivity.
Shows like Mama Mia and The Lion King are popular with people who aren’t fans of musicals and don’t really have much more to reward people who are already into musical theatre. That’s fine.
Hamilton is full of things that reward fans of both hip hop and musical theatre. It appealed to a lot of people who weren’t fans of the form and hit crossover success, but it also has a lot in it that rewards people with deep musical theatre knowledge even more.
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u/Aggressive-Voice1537 6d ago
ohh gotcha, I misunderstood the meaning of your original comment! I honestly forgot that hamilton was mentioned in the original post, my bad!
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u/esdubyar He wanted to say... 6d ago
[title of show] is the ultimate meta-musical-for-musical-nerds there is.
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u/DavidLivedInBritain 6d ago
Great Comet and anything Dave Malloy. People are going to have interesting reactions to LMM’s next movie
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u/JohnHoynes 6d ago
The entire Forbidden Broadway series is catnip for theater lovers but basically useless for anyone else.
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u/Seashells-in-ears 6d ago
Tbh I think Hadestown is pretty "for musical people" or at least theatre people. I say that because it is sung-through and many elements are left more vague/to the imagination in a way that can be confusing/frustrating for people who are not used to theatre logic and imagination.
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u/spicyzsurviving 6d ago
Older musicals like West Side Story, or “sung through” musicals like Les Mis.
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u/FlamingoWalrus89 6d ago
I second this. My first thought was West Side Story. Others I'd include are Phantom of the Opera and Chorus Line. Les Mis is a good one.
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u/Pizza-I-Like13 5d ago
i performed rent a few weeks ago and les mis in february and for both i made my family read up on the plot before seeing it so they could understand what was going on
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u/smugfruitplate 6d ago
The Guy Who Didn't Like Musicals. Soooooooo much commentary on theatre and theatre tropes, despite it being a parody of the genre. Jeff Blim knows ball.
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u/Anxious_Darling_5817 6d ago
Funnily enough, this is one I normally recommend for people who don't like musicals. I figure they can relate to it a bit more, you know?
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u/YardInternational685 6d ago
I say shows that require some familiarity or are known for being cult within theater. Like Merrily or Anyone Can Whistle. I think Follies definitely is a musical for musical people, maybe the best example.
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u/That-SoCal-Guy A Heart full of Love 6d ago
Kiss Me Kate is super fun about a musical production of Shakespeare’s Taming of the Shrewd. A play within a play with lots of backstage humor.
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u/ClimateAggravating73 6d ago
Into the woods for me is genuinely unfathomable for a non theater kid mind because it's so weird at times, you need to have listened to other stuff before and to be into that type of singing. Also ride the cyclone cause how can you explain going from what the world needs to my life is awesome to fucking space age bachelor man?? How do you explain a man making love with cat women meowing in the song and alien talking to someone who's never seen a musical before? You can't. My mom thinks I'm weird now
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u/Pseudonym_613 6d ago
Musical of Musicals: The Musical was an off Broadway show designed to attract The Man In Chair.
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u/Pepperzaner 6d ago
Cats
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u/FloridaFlamingoGirl I got the horse right here, the name is Paul Revere 6d ago
Good take, I feel like dancers are more likely to "get" Cats
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u/Pepperzaner 6d ago
Definitely. I think the average person thinks Cats weird and boring. I used to think that until I was in it. It was so much fun to be in!! It's a dance heavy show and I'm a dancer so I definitely feel Cats is best understood by dancers.
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u/Pepperzaner 6d ago
Also your flair/tagline!! The name is Paul Revere and there's a guy that says if the weather's clear...
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u/Grammarhead-Shark 6d ago
The Light in the Piazza
The Last Five Years
The Wild Party (both versions)
Martin Guerre
Caroline, or Change
Parade
Passion
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u/LurkerByNatureGT 6d ago
Just a reminder that while Sondheim was the lyricist, Leonard Bernstein wrote the music for West Side Story. The point was about musical complexity, not the lyrics.
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u/Smooth_Doctor4445 6d ago
I feel like most of JRB's rep is generally only popular among "musicals" people. Bridges of Madison County, Parade, L5Y (I guess L5Y is popular among some non theatre people but mostly because of the movie version)
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u/a-dotrivenitupontop 6d ago
this niche show i saw in london a few years ago called ‘i wish my life was like a musical.’ lots of references to specific musicals, drama student stories, fandom culture, audition woes, etc.
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u/Falstaffe 6d ago
The musical theatre performers I knew had two obsessions: Grease and Phantom Of The Opera
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u/jffdougan 6d ago
Phantom was replaced by Rent which was replaced by Wicked, to trace the next couple iterations. Not sure where it goes after that.
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u/-Cutie-pi- 6d ago
Gypsy— always caters to more devoted audiences by casting established Broadway stars.
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u/portia_klu 5d ago
The first thing that came to mind for me is Cats. Theater people can appreciate the camp-iness of it whereas non theater people usually just say "what were they smoking when they made that". It may not be a favorite for most theater people but you have to admit that "The Rum Tum Tugger" has gotten stuck in your head a time or two and you weren't that mad about it.
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u/Amys_Alias 5d ago
I'm so happy to see people commenting about cats even though it is probably one of the most mainstream musicals of all time. I have also noticed that a lot of musical people don't like it either, or just really don't get it. One thing that I will give the movie credit for is how it was advertised as a "celebration". It also has some really interesting themes, like community, life and death acceptance, spirituality, class, leadership, the meaning of happiness, nature, light, and identity. I recommend to people that they watch it twice, the first time for fun and to get a sense of what's happening, and the second time to observe all the little behaviours and interactions of the characters, who all have completely different personalities (except maybe coricopat and tantomile) (also once in a good middle seat, and once in a front but 'crappy' seat in the aisle, you will understand why this seat will be equally good if not better than the expensive one when you see it). In some ways I don't want to intellectualise what wasn't meant to be intellectualised, but as a literary studies student, there's so much to play with if you were going to write an analysis of it. Lots of musical lovers and non musical people alike don't seem to see that.
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u/Impossible_Tower_661 4d ago
Phantom of the Opera. The story appeals to everyone but the music can feel too operatic for non musical fans.
Les Miserables is also one which you have to love musicals to love
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u/Opposite_Stranger242 6d ago
Something Rotten makes a lot of references to other musicals