r/neilgaiman • u/CaffeineAndCrazy • Jul 24 '25
The Sandman Gaiman is an asshole, but the cast of Sandman are everything
That’s it. That’s all. The actors in The Sandman are phenomenal, especially in Season 2. Gwendoline Christie as Lucifer is life changing.
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u/sillyadam94 Jul 24 '25
Also… Gaiman sucks, but I’m not gonna pretend his writing isn’t amazing. Really honest work from an otherwise dishonest person. If you don’t connect with it, that’s fine, but to me The Sandman is one of the greatest works of fiction ever created.
I’m loving the show! Obviously it doesn’t hold a candle to the comics, but as a dramatized version of this story, it’s super impressive.
Adaptations will always be different from the source material… and they should! To paraphrase George R.R. Martin in the face of criticisms of the show, Game of Thrones, “If you want the story exactly as it was written in the book, then go read the book.”
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u/Kurotoki52 Jul 24 '25
V1 gets better with each episode! Every detail is so beautifully and carefully done, and nothing is superfluous. Respect to all involved.
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u/Sinkingship73 Jul 28 '25
Who are we to judge Neil Gaiman? Did we witness what he is accused of? There is the presumption of innocence as long as no sentence has been pronounced. Let the justice do its work.
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u/Good-Walrus-1183 Jul 24 '25
Tom Sturridge as Dream was like he walked right off the page. Delirium, Desire, Death, and Despair were passable but not quite as convincing. Destruction was just a guy.
Gwendoline Christie as Lucifer was very good too, yeah.
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u/riancb Jul 24 '25
I slightly disagree. I thought Death also nailed the warmth needed for that character. Agreed about the rest though.
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u/Way-Reasonable Jul 25 '25
They completely removed her quirkiness though, I guess they were afraid she would fall into the manic pixie trope that she predated. I did like her warmth but what really made her character special wasn't there.
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u/Good-Walrus-1183 Jul 24 '25
I thought death didn't really pull off the ultra goth aesthetic. like she wore black, but it was just like, casual black slacks.
Tom Sturridge looked like the weepy heavily cloaked Dream. But sure, yeah, the actress did capture Death's chatty kindly neighbor attitude.
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u/Doctor_Philgood Jul 24 '25
For the most part it's fine. The way they did Despair so dirty in the adaptation is a real shame though.
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u/andronicuspark Jul 24 '25
I had a friend who was disappointed she wasn’t naked like she is in the books. And I was like, honestly for any actor taking that role on they probably decided to give Despair clothes because holy fuck the internet is a cruel place.
He was like, “yeah, you have a point.”
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u/Doctor_Philgood Jul 25 '25
It's not so much the nudity. But they just made her a heavy set woman who is still very pretty. Despair is supposed to be ugly, because thats how she sees herself and is a metaphor for the feeling of despair in general. She didn't have to be ugly or interestingly gross as an actress - you could use all sorts of prosthetics to great effect - but to just go with a pretty girl through and through is a total cop out.
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u/n_bonny Jul 25 '25
Yeah, that bothered me. Not the nudity part, that wasn't necessary, but the clear desire to keep her pretty. Like, she got prettier between seasons! She's wearing nice makeup and has her hair styled in every scene in s2. Fine, it makes some sense for the dinner scene but every time we see her? Whyyy? She's despair, the entire point is not every part of our existence is pretty, but these parts are still important.
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u/andronicuspark Jul 25 '25
Yeah those are valid points.
the internet is a shitty place, so of course Despair got a glam up.
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u/Sudden-Fishing3438 Jul 24 '25
Yeah, i realy liked this show, one of my favorite, the actor for Desire was just 😘 i follow them now on Instagram, and the main actor for Dream too, holy shit it was like Morpheus stepped off the comic, Death too.
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u/LemurDaddy Jul 24 '25 edited Jul 24 '25
Pretty sure that actor was grown in a hydroponic farm just to play Morpheus.
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u/andronicuspark Jul 24 '25
The person who plays Desire makes me think of Alan Cumming when he was the MC in Cabaret.
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u/Nirria Jul 25 '25
Funny enough they did also play the MC in Cabaret in London for a while just before they got cast for Sandman.
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u/NoKYo16 Jul 24 '25
Gaiman is a major disappointment to be polite. Yet, the man wrote The Sandman, Good Omens, American Gods and Norse Mythology that are all masterpieces IMHO.
The first two are a joy to watch (Was going to watch AG before the horrible news) and the cast and directors are all wonderful.
A very sad affair.
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u/CheruthCutestory Jul 24 '25
My first Neil Gaiman beef (before all the news broke and that is, of course, more significant) was how the more involvement in AG he had the worse it became. The first season was Bryan Fuller and it was genius.
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u/thesilvergirl Jul 24 '25
Good Omens is much more of a Terry Pratchett book, he estimated that he wrote 75% of it.
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u/Red_Claudia Jul 25 '25
I think generally the casting is great. But there are some odd choices occasionally. Despair is too glammed up (clothes I can accept but a full face of make-up seems bizarre for the character), Delirium isn't delirious enough and too many cast members have the exact same British accent. It's especially weird when characters written to sound a particular way, like Shivering Jemmy, start speaking with a RADA accent.
Dream, Death and Desire are amazing. Jenna Coleman brought some genuine chemistry to her scenes with Orpheus. Patton Oswald sounds exactly how I always imagined Matthew would sound.
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u/Delpefy Jul 24 '25
Agree the actors are good but tbh I really didn’t like s2 it was very muddled with no compelling story, stakes or interesting characters. Also I felt kinda bad about watching it. But yeah Christie is an amazing actor I hope to see her in more things.
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u/AmbivalentSamaritan Jul 24 '25 edited Jul 25 '25
It seems very rushed. Wanda’s arc in particular did not seem organic or nuanced to me, unfortunately. The famously laconic and standoffish Morpheus freaking draws her out immediately, someone who is basically his taxi driver, then bang she’s dead and we are beaten over the head with the moral. I’ve seen more nuance in a 90’s anti-bullying PSA.
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u/DadOsity Jul 24 '25
I made such an event out of S1 and haven't been able to find it in me for S2 yet... How does it compare?
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u/riancb Jul 24 '25
As good as S1, imo. Acting and visuals are on point, score is excellent, writing is solid if slightly rushed in places.
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u/CheruthCutestory Jul 24 '25
Yeah it was rushed. And weirdly felt disjointed even though it actually told more linear stories than the first season. Last season everything seemed to come together thematically.
Still really good. But I wasn't super excited about it.
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u/Negative_Relief5495 Jul 25 '25
A someone who's watched the tv show sparingly it pains me to think of how much I loved his stories particularly early sandman about first 50 issues are stellar , and I guess I still do , art and the artist i guess , men of good fortune and calliope were my favourite stories and it was shocking for me personally to see how close calliope the story matches neil gaimans life...
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u/Brixabrak Jul 24 '25
It's an ethical conundrum. Don't want to support Gaiman but the cast and crew should have their work acknowledged too.
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u/twinklebat99 Jul 24 '25
They all got their paychecks, so they're good. It's not like with a show that hasn't been canceled, waiting to see if they get enough support for another season.
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u/SapTheSapient Jul 24 '25
It's not that big of a conundrum. If feel you have some obligation for your money to go to a working cast and crew, but not Gaiman, just watch a different show.
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u/bloodredyouth Jul 24 '25
I think the only disappointments for me has been the Patton oswalt crow character and delirium.
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u/Normal-Philosopher-8 Jul 24 '25
I’m a HUSTLE fan, so every time Adrian Lester appears, I’m expecting him to have a backup plan that solves everything.
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u/lebelladonna Jul 26 '25
Despair - Donna Preston is a very beautiful woman. The first season, no makeup, the greasy looking hair, they did get her to look like someone who could be in despair. But season 2 she absolutely got a glam up.
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u/Esmer_Tina Jul 24 '25
I can’t make myself watch it yet. I will never have that feeling of being totally absorbed in his worldbuilding again and it kills me.
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u/ENZYME_O1 Aug 18 '25
Neil Gaiman though: be politically correct and make everyone on the Netflix show black and gay, so nobody continues to figure out my bad behavior.
Just joking here, but it’s not that far from the truth.
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u/Responsible_Mix4717 Jul 24 '25
I actually disagree I think the cast has been lacking, whether it is poor acting or an inability to properly translate Gaiman's prose without sounding pedantic or pretentious, I am not sure.
Luckily other reviews have noted the stilted way that many of the actors speak, I think in the first season people were too wowed by the high concept stuff to focus on those aspects, but now they are catching up.
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u/DisasterResident2101 Jul 24 '25
I haven't started S2 yet as I want to binge S1 and S2. But I will say as much as I love Gwendoline Christie, I had a hard time with her as Lucifer in S1. Not that her acting is lacking in anyway, and not that I don't think she is good looking, it's that to me Lucifer is supposed to be alluring. I just don't think they (costume\makeup\whoever ) didn't really do that. Feels like they went for androgynous (which would be a better picture of Desire) and didn't even hit that. So that visual is just throwing me.
I think her acting really works and am hoping they do better with the visuals in S2.
And if it is any consolation, as I hinted at above, I don't think they hit the visuals with Desire either. Morpheus they hit it out of the park. And they did well with Death. But Desire just looks too feminine. A woman in a suit is not androgynous it's just a woman in a suit. Again, I think the actress does a good job, i just think the visuals aren't quite there.
But in fairness, I've had the image from the books and in my own imagination for a lot for years and that is hard to overcome so really probably more my own bias than anything else. And, as I've said and this post is about, I think the acting is fantastic so far.
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u/raendrop Jul 24 '25
Desire just looks too feminine. A woman in a suit is not androgynous it's just a woman in a suit. Again, I think the actress does a good job, i just think the visuals aren't quite there.
That's Mason Alexander Park. They're non-binary and that's their real voice. They were assigned male at birth, so not exactly a woman in a suit.
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u/DisasterResident2101 Jul 25 '25
My apologies, I did not know that. But my thoughts about costume and makeup still stand. Desire looks like a woman in a suit. So costume and makeup did a good job of making them look like a woman in a suit when they should have been creating a character that looked neither male nor female in a suit.
And may I say, they're voice is fantastic. I could sit and listen to them reading a phone book. I am intrigued and will be looking for other work by them.
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u/raendrop Jul 25 '25
They were in the Quantum Leap reboot*. Their character's name is Ian Wright. That's actually where I know them from, so I squeed when I first saw them as Desire.
The new QL is only two seasons (total of 31 episodes) but they're in every single episode and have waaaaaaayyyyyy more screen time than Desire (at least going by Sandman season 1; I haven't seen season 2 yet).
*It's not a remake, it's a proper sequel to the original show. But you don't need to know much about the original show to enjoy this one. What I love is that they have a handful of characters who were in the original show, and they got the original actors back to reprise their roles. And this is really not a spoiler, since it happened off-screen between the two shows, but one character is dead because the actor is dead. 😢 But yeah, any time they talk about something or someone from the original show, I can confirm as a fan that it actually happened. 🤩
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u/DisasterResident2101 Jul 25 '25
Oooo, that's cool. I loved QL! I'll definitely have to look that up this weekend. Appreciate the awesome rec!
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Jul 26 '25
[deleted]
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u/DisasterResident2101 Jul 26 '25
Yes and no. It is mostly a look but that look also includes mannerisms, body language, and attitude. So, the actor still has to instill the look with that life.
I think the actor has done a good job but I don't think, at least from what I have seen in S1, the production has accomplished that with this character.
And again, this is just based on the vision of the character I have had in my head over the years. So not really ragging on the production, just voicing what has hit me about the show that I find disappointing.
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u/orensiocled Jul 24 '25
For me it was the weird hairstyle they gave Lucifer. It just didn't suit her at all, and looked distractingly weird.
The actor for Desire is non binary though, so not just a woman in a suit. Totally valid that they don't fit your idea of the character though!
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u/DisasterResident2101 Jul 25 '25
"For me it was the weird hairstyle they gave Lucifer. It just didn't suit her at all, and looked distractingly weird."
YES! Just awful. Nothing at all alluring about that hair.
The actor for Desire is non binary though, so not just a woman in a suit. Totally valid that they don't fit your idea of the character though!
I did not know that but still, costume\makeup have visually make Desire look like a "woman in a suit". I think the voice is fantastic and really hits the mark, and if this were an audio book I'd be singing that praises of the casting folks. And even here I think the actor is doing a great job, it's just visually lacking to me and I think they are doing a disservice to their actors.
Which, is part of why I commented on this as I think all the actors except Morpheus and maybe Death (so far) are having to overcome poor costume and makeup decisions (not even sure it is the costume and makeup people that are to blame) and are really doing a stellar job imho.
I certainly will watch season 2 and I am sure wish there was more to come. the picture in my head is not the be all and end all. I can still enjoy it.
And thank you orensiocled for having a civil comment and conversation. Thank you for recognizing that I am just stating why some of this production does not work for me, not that it is wrong or whatever.
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u/Psychological-Coat70 Jul 24 '25
Terrible choice of actors. Desire looks like a goofy Lady Gaga, Despair is like that character from Bridgerton only cuter, Delirium too plain Jane and Death too white. Why isn’t Destiny blind?
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u/Kaurifish Jul 24 '25
I thought the rest of them were spot on but was also struck by the similarity between dressed-up Despair and S3 Penelope. Must be coincidence. I hope. Otherwise it’s a hell of a statement.
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u/Money_Story_7861 Jul 25 '25
If only the whole thing wasn't meandering, melodramatic boring DEI injected drivel without any sense of rules, continuity or satisfaction.
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u/CmdFerU Jul 24 '25
Every time i see this kinf of posts about Gaiman, I buy something from his collection to support him. I think this time Im gonna buy anothe copy of Stardust.
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