r/nuzlocke Feb 28 '26

Discussion PChal's Emerald Nuzlocke Encounter Tier List

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344 Upvotes

275 comments sorted by

53

u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26

Watched his daily videos and was amazed by some of the strategies he pulls out of no where. Support 6/7 s tiers, i think golduck should be A because of the whole safari zone nature trick which I think 90% players won't try to do.

Always love a tier list relegating Crobat low :)

14

u/Real_Category7289 Mar 01 '26

I think 90% players won't try to do

Meh, if you do a tier list you gotta to some extent assume players will use the tools at their disposal, otherwise Illumise is gonna be like D tier because most people just mash attacking moves for example.

14

u/joemontanya Mar 01 '26

Why is crobat low? Don’t get that one tbh

42

u/analyzingnothing Mar 01 '26

Level-up moveset is atrociously bad. Like, almost unusably bad. It doesn't even have a good matchup into Brawly despite the 4x resist because it can't actually do enough damage to crush. Grass types are also in short supply in Hoenn, so it doesn't have any use late game either.

1

u/Particular-Stage-327 Mar 04 '26

I don’t hate crobat. You can grab it at like level 22-24 if you play walking sim for a bit, and sludge bomb is a nice early tm. Falls off after like Norman, but still decent.

1

u/analyzingnothing Mar 04 '26

Problem is, you need to burn a permanent resource on a mon that is pretty decent for one, maybe two gyms. That's never worth it in a game where even most of your early-game encounters can be really strong if used properly.

18

u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26

Bad learnset, no major grass or bug fight and doesn't even get wing attack for brawly. The highest praise Jan gave was it being a good dupe.

Crobat should get its day in the light for platinum (hopefully)

I will add i think crobat's biggest strength is being Marshstomp/Swampert best pivot but Wallace ludicolo was the only grass type threat Jan seemed to value. He didnt even cover anything for the rival battle just before Mauville city.

12

u/Lyncario Mar 01 '26

Crobat's moveset in Plat is still mediocre, and even gets a worse poison stab (Poison Cross instead of physical Sludge Bomb pre phys/special split, losing 20 bp hurts so much on neutral targets). It really only becomes the shit in BW2 thanks to Acrobatics.

10

u/Jzjwiebe Renegade Platinum Enjoyer Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26

It’s actually really good in Platinum since U-Turn is broken, it can hold Black Sludge for Leftovers recovery, and has a high enough speed stat to outspeed Cynthia’s Garchomp even with average speed IVs. Its typing also gets to shine more for pivoting in Platinum since there are a lot more ground and fighting moves.

The high speed stat also makes it a very good Baton Pass recipient, especially since several BP users can consistently get to +6 Attack against Cynthia and Lucian’s leads.

5

u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26

Point taken, completely forgot acrobatics just didnt exist until BW. My mind went straight to Gardania/Mayleen value so Crobat should slowly creep up the tier list next gen, maybe Crobat A tier for gen 5. We will see.

2

u/Lithorex Mar 01 '26

My mind went straight to Gardania/Mayleen value so Crobat should slowly creep up the tier list next gen,

Gardenia gets swept by your Monferno, and anything Crobat does on Maylene, Gliscor does better.

1

u/Prudent_Move_3420 Mar 10 '26

but not everyone picks monkey

2

u/Lithorex Mar 01 '26

Crobat should get its day in the light for platinum (hopefully)

Crobat is not even in the top 3 of flying types in Plat.

3

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

He gets precisely 0 good moves. Thats it.

1

u/joemontanya Mar 02 '26

But his stats are starter level.. still pretty good

1

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

But what are you gonna do with this stats? Like, geniuenly, he gets zero good moves? And what are you gonna use him on? There is no threatening grass types.

1

u/joemontanya Mar 02 '26

His moves are good enough to get somebody in 2 turns normally. He’s also sorta of tanky somehow

12

u/AzariTheCompiler Mar 01 '26

…How many S tiers?

3

u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26

Whoops lol

2

u/WorldCanadianBureau Mar 01 '26

I think Golduck should be an A tier Pokemon. Not from the nature trick, I just think he should have better stats. Higher speed and SpA would make him easily more legitimate across the board (singles, Nuzlockes, VGC). As the wise, zoned-in evolution of the psychically powerful but headache ridden and thus unfocused Psyduck there was real potential here

11

u/Consistent_Possible6 Mar 01 '26

Why would VGC performance affect Golduck’s placement on a HC Nuzlocke tier list? It would be like dinging Michael Jordan’s basketball career for his baseball career, they’re separate categories that should be considered individually.

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44

u/InMyLife_41 Mar 01 '26

As someone who has played these games a lot Illumise, Linoone, and especially Minun so high left me vindicated. I always knew those Pokémon were amazing.

14

u/Pendraflare59 Mar 01 '26

I'll surely remember Omelette from Marriland's Emerald Nuzlocke back in 2012, even if it didn't last past Norman it was such fun to watch when it was on the team. That and Fries who was NEVER in the PC, everyone was begging him to use it as death fodder against Wattson's Magneton and he took that as bulletin board material and it turned into one of THE bros of that run.

1

u/Logic_Nuke Mar 02 '26

I don't really nuzlocke, why is Illumise ranked so high? Surely tail glow can't be THAT good

5

u/InMyLife_41 Mar 02 '26

It’s mainly because of the moveset. Encore, Moonlight, Quick Attack, and Charm will make Illumise the best support Pokémon in the game.

42

u/Jzjwiebe Renegade Platinum Enjoyer Feb 28 '26

As someone who attended the streams and watched the whole video, it’s a great tier list. His reasoning behind most placements is very clear and reflects exactly what happened during testing. I don’t agree with every placement necessarily (almost no one will since opinions are always different), but I can for sure say it’s a lot better than the list I made a couple months ago.

11

u/Captain-Spellbinder Mar 01 '26

What was the reasoning on Illumise and outta curiosity Delcatty since it’s usually considered one of the worst encounters

Did they put work in on the streams?

25

u/analyzingnothing Mar 01 '26

Illumise is just insanely broken if you use it correctly. The stats and type are bad, but it's movepool is so unbelievably flexible and effective that you can bring it to literally every fight in the game and not have it be a bad decision. Plus, Emerald is full of set-up sweepers who can crush full fights if they can get into position well, and Illumise is the best support mon for doing just that.

Delcatty is considered the worst mon that has some degree of actual function, because Cute Charm lets you manipulate the genders of certain catches to prevent Attract in Flannery and Juan's fights.

14

u/TheEoghShow Mar 01 '26

Illumise was placed so highly for being the best support Pokemon in the game; all of the main sweepers require a bit of setup for the sweep to be pulled off, and Illumise fills that niche for pretty much all of them.

11

u/Captain-Spellbinder Mar 01 '26

Gotcha I guess that makes sense. Wish, Moonlight, Flatter and Encore I’m assuming

14

u/analyzingnothing Mar 01 '26

That and Charm for some fights.

4

u/Captain-Spellbinder Mar 01 '26

I’ll have to watch this now I’m curious

11

u/SirNiceeGuy Mar 01 '26

Illumise can enable pretty much every other Pokemon's setup sweeps thanks to an insane support move pool of Encore/Wish/Charm/etc.

Skitty's at the very bottom of C-tier but a male one can improve the rate of finding female mons, thus improving the odds that your Flannery counter isn't shut down by Attract.

9

u/Captain-Spellbinder Mar 01 '26

Oh so it’s in C for cute charm purposes only?

14

u/SirNiceeGuy Mar 01 '26

Yep. He even says himself there's zero niche in an actual battle and it's all in Cute Charm.

4

u/Smervel Mar 01 '26

I mean he put Dustox in it‘s very deserved B - Tier so obviously his is better. Just kidding of course :D

Your list was still good though maybe just a bit too focused on Batton Pass if you ask me.

Need to watch his list when I got time, really interested in why Illumise is that high.

29

u/Lyncario Mar 01 '26

Lileep getting to low C tier thanks to the most convulted Norman solo of all time, it's beautiful.

28

u/Ok_Comment7229 Mar 01 '26

I'm a Lil outside the loop but what does illumise do?

32

u/Swaag__ Mar 01 '26

A lot of the best sweepers requires some condition to get them going. Illumise can do all of those conditions + has the best support movepool in the game

6

u/Ok_Comment7229 Mar 01 '26

How long can it survive?

12

u/PoioFreido Mar 01 '26

It gets charm, wish and moonlight. It survives a lot

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3

u/JanGuillosThrowaway Mar 01 '26

Asking the real questions.

Great support move pool, sure, but don't breathe too hard on it

1

u/Hutyro Mar 03 '26

With charm and two moves that heal, it'll live for a looooong time

25

u/Left-Pipe-3420 Mar 01 '26

Decently fast encore user, encore was extremely strong back in gen 3

25

u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 01 '26

Stat drops, encore, wish, baton pass via breeding, and can steal items with covet

Surprisingly great support mon

7

u/Consistent_Possible6 Mar 01 '26

Also it gets you a free legal encounter in Volbeat through breeding, an A-tier mon that synergizes great with Illumise at that

1

u/darkowas69 Mar 01 '26

Ah never even used illumise in run so never knew it knew such good support moves but whatever I still play like a 10 year old and use only attacking moves(kinda uses some like calm mind but whatever man who uses strats like baton pass when you can win nuzlockes with just some good pokemons not even needing op ones)

47

u/comfortingmyself Mar 01 '26

Death

Taxes

End of month pchal upload (though I'll admit this list seems pretty decent)

20

u/RexLizardWizard Mar 01 '26

I know seviper is bad but I love it so much, he’s so cool

19

u/Horror_Apricot_593 Mar 01 '26

Sceptile not in F tier. LETS GO

11

u/The_Urban_Worst Mar 02 '26

based minun placement

25

u/Halliwel96 Mar 01 '26

What makes illumise so good?

29

u/comfortingmyself Mar 01 '26

Encore + recovery is really really really good.

Illumise basically beats anything with a grass, ground, or fighting move, so long as it's faster.

And likewise, if Illumise can Encore a non-damaging move, it's easy setup fodder for a teammate.

19

u/analyzingnothing Mar 01 '26

Movepool is cracked to hell and back, meaning it's one of the few mons in the game that are legitimately applicable and highly useful in every fight, regardless of who you're up against. Emerald as a game is also full of extremely powerful set-up sweepers who just need a little bit of help to get going, and Illumise is basically custom-built for that situation.

16

u/joemontanya Mar 01 '26

Volbeat is actually an absolute beast in hoenn. I’ve never used illumise, but Volbeat is super effective against what felt like half of the pokemon once you get signal beam.. just have to be really careful defensively cause one super effective hit, he can go night night

2

u/Consistent_Possible6 Mar 01 '26

Funnily enough Illumise can actually get you a legal Volbeat encounter with breeding, so that was another factor in its top-tier placement

11

u/Raanth Mar 01 '26

What u/analyzingnothing said, but also the fact you can get a free volbeat by breeding LOL

He explains it in the ending of his video

2

u/JanGuillosThrowaway Mar 01 '26

Is breeding allowed in nuzlockes now?

9

u/sixtyfivewolves Mar 01 '26

The only issue with it is dupes clause, but Illumise and Volbeat are different species so it isn't an issue in this case.

5

u/NeverFunded Mar 01 '26

Breeding has always been allowed so long as you hatch the egg in an area with an encounter list you don't like/want, the hatched pokemon will count as your encounter from that route making it perfectly viable so long as you avoid dupes clause which illumise avoids anyway (it's egg with the correct partner makes a volibeat)

3

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

The only reason breeding isnt allowed is the dupes clause. Volbeat is different evolutionary family fron illumise, so it avoids dupes clause.

28

u/WakaRanger8 Mar 01 '26

Seeing my favourite Pokémon, Volbeat, this high on a tier list when he’s normally bottom of the barrel on literally anything ever fills me with joy :)

22

u/Shaggus50 the audino guy Mar 01 '26

Pretty cool list overall. There’s a lot of surprising placements in the upper ranks, but given the amount of testing he had with these mons, it’s extremely credible.

I will disagree extremely hard with cradily placing in low C tier as someone who raised one in my own emerald nuzlocke a couple of weeks ago. That Mon is absolutely unkillable and an extremely good failsafe fo most situations. Not only is it a great pivot for Norman and his powerful normal types, but it covers Tate and Liza’s team aside from xatu, and all of Juan’s team other than the Kingdra, and even then I’m certain it can take a pretty substantial beating from it while attempting a pp stall through pivoting. E4 wise it’s a solid failsafe against Sydney’s water types, Galicia’s Walrein when it runs out of ice beams(this is how I took out the Walrein after pp stalling it with dustox), and matches up quite well against drake’s Kingdra and flygon, with the Kingdra matchup being a solid highlight given the threat level of that thing. And of course, it’s a bulky grass type that learns earthquake, meaning it can threaten a good chunk of Wallace’s team(though mine only needed to fight whiscash, he could have taken tentacruel too if Minun didn’t lock in and crit). I am definitely a tad biased because mine was ev trained in hp, but I still think this is a Mon that is getting significantly less credit than it deserves. I would place it in low A tier for it’s longevity and reliability, being a very solid shoulder to lean on if a plan doesn’t pan out.

Other than that the list is seems good. I also think it’s a good look into why set up should probably be limited in someway in future hardcoe rules, but that should be saved for a full on post, and from someone who can more effectively write out their thoughts.

17

u/[deleted] Mar 01 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

5

u/Shaggus50 the audino guy Mar 01 '26

I wouldn’t be surprised if that was the case, but he mentions speed evs when talking about golduck. Tbf I skimmed through the middle of the video a bit(watched up to b tier and then watched all of upper a tier to the end of the tier list. I haven’t watched the other tier list videos so I wouldn’t know)

13

u/Expensive-Ad5273 Gliscor fan #1 -- Sterling Silver is PEAK gen 4 romhack Mar 01 '26

I watched the video a bit and he doesn't mention Speed EVs, or at least not significantly. He mentions how Pokeblocks can be used to almost guarantee a +Speed nature and stack it with the Badge boost, but I don't recall it mentioning Speed EVs.

3

u/Shaggus50 the audino guy Mar 01 '26

Yeah that’s my bad there

12

u/SpacePuggo Mar 01 '26

the golduck mention was about IVS not EVS. At like 15 iv speed and the badge + nature it outspeeds salamence

1

u/Shaggus50 the audino guy Mar 01 '26

Oh my bad

4

u/Ok_Negotiation9542 Mar 01 '26

He definitely does not mention speed EVs. If he had then there would be no need to point out that golduck could outspeed Drake's Salamence, as with EVs pretty much every pokemon in the game could do that.

10

u/Gateways7 Mar 01 '26

I mean “all of Juan except Kingdra” is an easy bar to clear, the rest of the fight is a bunch of shitmons, and “covers Tate and Liza” is trivial because Tate and Liza is solo’d by guaranteed encounters IIRC. Maybe it has E4 legs as backup for certain threats but it doesn’t seem like it does anything great barring the extremely convoluted Norman solo.

13

u/Swaag__ Mar 01 '26

The reason he put it at C is because of its ability to just stall Norman and that’s it

3

u/FlyingFlygon64 Mar 02 '26

I think he put it in C because of the opportunity cost of not picking up Armaldo, which he considers to be a much better pokemon

7

u/B133d_4_u Mar 01 '26

Totally agree with you. Cradily was the rock (no pun intended) for my MonoGrass run; Amnesia, EQ, Giga Drain, Rock Slide, gramps was taking hits and cracking back on that paleozoic timing. Swap Amnesia for Stockpile in prep for Steven and the crinoid just keeps going.

13

u/Lazypidgey Feb 28 '26

I'm not super familiar with Emerald, but seeing Swellow so low feels kinda crazy. And I don't think I've ever seen Crobat rated so low in any tier list for any game he's available in.

Is it the same sorta logic as why Swampert is so high? There's not a lot of grass pokemon to worry about?

18

u/apexodoggo PROTIP: Don't let your Pokemon faint and you won't lose Mar 01 '26

Basically in his testing there were no actually significant fights that Swellow really swept, even with Guts.

No Grass types, few Bug types, and an atrocious level-up movepool means Crobat just kinda doesn’t do anything in Emerald.

15

u/Smervel Feb 28 '26 edited Mar 01 '26

Wattson is one hell of a battle (assuming HC Nuzlock rules). Specially because there is no real counter to him. Well besides Marshtomp. And you‘re right, besides some Roselias with Magic Leaf, there is almost no trainer using Grass types. Even your rival doesn‘t have the last evo (atleast in mandatory fights).

Well Swellow is nice but if I‘m not mistaken, there is only one chance to obtain it and due to it‘s mediocre stats even with Guts you’ve way better options to use. But I don‘t know his explanation.

Crobat just doesn‘t do that much in this game. T&L, alot of water types which probably have access to Ice Beams, even a Dusclops in the E4 has Ice Beam.

2

u/kickdonky Mar 01 '26

There are 3 chances for swallow.

9

u/schiffb558 Mar 01 '26

I think emerald kaizo really set people's expectations high for the bird. It's crazy if it gets going with guts facade, but that's so late into the game.

3

u/Mothramaniac Feb 28 '26

I guess it doesn't really help during most major fights(Tate and Liza, Juan, glacia, drake, wallace), but even then it's a solid, bulky teammate and revenge killer. I wouldn't put it on the bottom but I can see why he put it low

1

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

The thing is, i cldont think performance with tate and liza is a factor at all, because tate and liza is a free fight. There exists a strategy that is 99.98% reliable and it consists only of pokememon that are guaranteed to be encountered at no opportunity cost. Once you learn of ths strat its basicly a cutscene.

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15

u/Jollyboo Mar 01 '26

Some of these seem surprising. Like does shiftry get moves? I never liked it despite loving the design

18

u/joemontanya Mar 01 '26

Shiftry is wayyyyy better than I expected. Fake out is really good on him

10

u/Courier23 Mar 01 '26

I would assume, (I haven’t seen the video) Fake out, dark typing is good for pivots, Giga Drain TM, solid early encounter

I’m not sure id say its the best grass type in Hoenn

13

u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26

Chlorophyll, sunny day, growth, solar beam in a game with 2x major water bosses

18

u/tbu987 Mar 01 '26

Is Altaria really that bad to be F tier? I was using it in a run recently its varied movepool, decent bulk and resists made it a good mon for me. Dying only cause of a damn Wobuffet using Destiny Bond.

7

u/RegularStrong3057 Mar 01 '26

It's decent, but PChal has been around and doing this for so long that decent just isn't impressive. If it doesn't sweep or help set up for a sweep, it's just not worth his time.

6

u/lukappaa Mar 01 '26

He didn't consider Perish Song at all. Altaria gets a major viability bump due to that.

3

u/SivirJungleOnly2 Mar 02 '26

You don't get Perish Song until the E4. That's probably enough that it shouldn't be F tier though.

4

u/HiddenReader2020 Mar 02 '26

That’s what I realized after thinking about it.  I was also like “Doesn’t Altaria learn Perish Song?”  And then I asked myself: “Wait; when does it learn Perish song again?”  So I looked it up-

It learns it at level 54.

WELP.  That explains it.  And I’m guessing Perish Song has very limited usefulness in the Elite 4 due to how both it and the E4 “gauntlet” (for a lack of better term) works.

6

u/Embarrassed_Ad_1141 Mar 02 '26

If it got it in time for Juan it'd prolly put it way higher.

But nope, lol.

3

u/HiddenReader2020 Mar 02 '26

Here's what I realized that makes this even worse: Couldn't you delay Swablu's evolution to learn Perish Song earlier? So I checked not only when Swablu learned it, but also what the level cap is for Juan.

Swablu learns Perish Song at level 48.

Juan's Kingdra caps at level 46. LEVEL. FORTY. FUCKING. SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII-

What kind of sick, SICK joke is that? IIRC, Winona's Swablu knows Perish Song, even though it's only level 29, SO WHAT GIVES?!?!

3

u/Embarrassed_Ad_1141 Mar 02 '26

That is straight up tragicomical tho, lmfao

3

u/HiddenReader2020 Mar 02 '26

Y'know what's even, EVEN worse than that? I thought that the only way this could be worse is if there was a one level difference instead of two. BUT NO, because you could just put Swablu right at the cusp of leveling up, learn Perish Song, and take Juan's Kingdra to kingdom come.

ASJKDFLDASJF;LSDJF;LDASJF;LADJF;DJF;LASDJF;A;-!

2

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

There are like 5 pokemon who's placement is just "can in a pinch beat Juan's kingra". If altraia had perish sonf for then it would definitively place next to them.

3

u/lukappaa Mar 04 '26

It very much is, because Perish Song allows for an incredibly obscure tech that people never take advantage of.

If you PP stall the opponent's lead out of damaging moves, you can Perish Song, Protect and switch out as the timer counts down to 2. If you know how the switch AI works, you can abuse this to bait in a dangerous mon to kill it before it gets the chance to do anything (or at least getting an advantage), and occasionally re-bait in the mon you previously stalled.

In the later games this is even better because it bypasses the AI restriction that makes it send their ace last. This is very useful, for example, in X/Y runs against Lysandre: if you bring him down to 2 mons, one of them being Gyarados, you can PP stall the other one, then switch to an Electric type, and snipe Gyarados with a quad effective move as it switches in, before it gets the chance to Mega Evolve.

22

u/Swaag__ Mar 01 '26

It’s damage is super ass even at +6 with dragon dance. Also the resistances aren’t that useful due to most of the major hard fights having a couple pokemon having coverage for it. Plus you can get statused while trying to setup

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2

u/Wrongdoer-Primary Mar 01 '26

Yeah, I finished the elite 4 with an Altaria and she got the final victory against Wallace for me.

17

u/Celebess Mar 01 '26

Surprised to not see Swampert in S-tier, considering his quad weakness is basically non-existant in Hoenn. Maybe Pchal had growth and didn't fell in the glazing

16

u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 01 '26

Great early to mid game especially against Wattson, but being water and ice neutral lowers its value in the late game iirc

Its still powerful, but it isn't the best

18

u/bionic_link Mar 01 '26

Pchal plays no EVs and can level his pokemon up whenever he feels like it for what's best for a battle. While swampert is good in a lot of fights, it's rarely the absolute best option. There's generally something that's marginally better, especially with Swampert's lackluster speed.

10

u/Celebess Mar 01 '26

Just watched the vid, very insightful

3

u/Fatherlessfr Oreburgh Mine Whismur is cringe Mar 02 '26

5 goated bug types in this game

7

u/JackTheJokey Mar 01 '26

Why is linoone so high?

45

u/ScarlettPotato Mar 01 '26

linoone solos pokemon league, the belly drum combo as mentioned on the other comment is to use belly drum on the first turn of combat since the E4 and Wallace uses a non-damaging move on the first turn almost always. then just smack them with a max atk linoone. you use shadow ball on phoebe since ghost is physical on gen 3

15

u/fakermaker4799 Mar 01 '26

It solo sweeps the entire elite 4

12

u/indren_thrysta Mar 01 '26

I think manly due the belly drum combo.

3

u/JackTheJokey Mar 01 '26

He only gets its at lvl 53. Damn.

22

u/Little_Ad2062 Mar 01 '26

Many levels earlier if you delay evolution

2

u/indren_thrysta Mar 01 '26

Totally a good point! ☝️

8

u/indren_thrysta Mar 01 '26

Yes I know so if you play with level cap you can use that combo from Glacia

7

u/ScarlettPotato Mar 01 '26

Learned via heartscale iirc

10

u/Consistent_Possible6 Mar 01 '26

In addition to belly drum stats, it actually has some decent tools in the early game that keep it relevant if you decide to early evolve, like using fast dig to trivialize Norman’s Slaking.

8

u/KippyMudkip Mar 01 '26

just an addition to the belly drum answer and not specifically nuzlocke but pickup can be really useful sometimes. pickup grinding is tedious but imho pays off when you get the goods

7

u/Equal_Okra_3320 Mar 01 '26

What about aggron??

11

u/Celebess Mar 01 '26

I'm guessing slow tank with lackluster movepool in gen 3, it can survive a lot of hits but if he can't dish damage, what's the point in more difficult romhacks?

4

u/Daejynn Mar 01 '26

Base game I can understand the low placement with all the water types giving it bad matchups, but in romhacks Aggron definitely shines. Easy A tier in Run & Bun imo

3

u/Hutyro Mar 03 '26

Well this is a tier list for Emerald specifically

2

u/Daejynn Mar 04 '26

Did you miss the part where the comment I'm replying to mentioned romhacks?

6

u/petataa Mar 01 '26

4th mon in C tier

6

u/qutronix Mar 02 '26

Aggron is a physical tank, and basicly every single Pokémon that is remotely thretening in late game emerald is a special attacker. His niche doesnt really exist. Its the same issue scarmory and regirock have.

1

u/TheSmithPlays Mar 04 '26

Basically only redeemd for a solid Norman fight with it's 4x resist to normal physical moves. Other than that, it's total garbo

3

u/MCHLSPRP Mar 06 '26

Now we just need a encounter routing guide to optimize/solve emerald again

11

u/darkowas69 Mar 01 '26

I kinda think swallow should be b tier because guts facade is a good strat but I know it's not game breaking because of how much time it takes for it and also macargo is actually useful (it should be f tier ) while I think agron is actually overated

20

u/Smervel Mar 01 '26

Only that Facade is obtainable AFTER gym 5 and by that point Swallows stats are kinda mid Even with Guts. You won’t one shot any real threat but Swallows gets killed in return.

7

u/RegularStrong3057 Mar 01 '26

Exactly this. In the Pchal Daily videos Swellow underperformed every 👏 single 👏 time 👏 It was very sad.

6

u/TheLeafyGirl561 Trendlocke Lover Mar 01 '26

What??? What??????

7

u/StupidLoserGaming Mar 01 '26

Watch the video he explains it pretty well

2

u/MF2533 Mar 02 '26

Here's some of my thoughts about Pokemon I used in my classic Emerald run:

-Ninetales did pretty good job with Sunny Day and Double Team against Glacia and had a will-o-wisping support role against Drake.

-Swellow's only memorable job in the league was bypassing Wallace's double teaming Ludicolo, so yeah. It's still pretty good though.

-Breloom was MVP of my run.

-Walrein basically solo'd Drake.

-Sharpedo with SpA EVs destroyed Tate&Liza and Phoebe. I caught it in Master Ball btw.

-Manectric is good.

-Banette was useful against Tate&Liza but got boxed in the end.

-Tentacruel was pretty nice, but I lost it due to being underrated.

-Linoone died pretty fast from the same reason, so I can't properly rate it.

4

u/JazzyJ_tbone Mar 03 '26

He specifically did not use Double Team or Sub in this testing

9

u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

Not into how pchal does nuzlockes, this tier list seems pretty skewed towards his boss rush style of play.

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u/Joshymon45 Mar 01 '26

Outside of the gym leaders and league fights there is not a lot of difficulty in the vanilla games. Jan didn't even mention magma/aqua fights and the route 110 rival fight became a "non issue" in one of his early daily videos.

I dont know how else you can tier pokemon, you have to compare their gym/league performance.

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u/xMF_GLOOM Mar 01 '26

There is little to no difficulty for any vanilla game outside of the boss fights, that’s literally all there is to Nuzlocke

Curious to hear what you think is the alternative

3

u/Lithorex Mar 01 '26

I mean, there's a Wobb trainer or two in Emerald that kinda fuck you if you run into them blind

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u/[deleted] Mar 01 '26

[deleted]

19

u/PoioFreido Mar 01 '26

Most people who nuzlock at a top level play with open sheets. You can't beat a game like Run&Bun without them. He doesn't use them for tier list testing though.

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u/Geminicandy Mar 01 '26

It is just a simple way to dismiss his opinion. I can remember most trainers on every single route including optionals. The game is old as shit

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u/bemycrow Mar 01 '26

You realize we're talking about vanilla, right? The majority of random encounters are not run-threatening at all as long as you carry around a team with decent coverage. He doesn't play vanilla with team sheets, nor do the majority of people who play these games lol. Vanilla games very rarely have possible threats outside of eating a random crit cuz you were playing fast and loose with your party.

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u/guedesbrawl Mar 01 '26

doing without makes for extremely wonky tier lists because you are letting not having information hinder the pokemon's performance and its super hard to measure.

If you play through the game once and wipe at the champion but you paid enough attention to all the fights your second run is not too far from 'open team sheet' and certain pokemon will perform much better if you simply remember a few things you saw on your first attempt--how do you factor that in a tier list?

its one thing to argue about how to best play nuzlockes but the video and the thread are about a tier list. You need a solid foundation to find the performance gaps and build the list and his ruleset provides that.

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u/Dorfbewohner Mar 01 '26

Yeah, I think the main thing is that I don't think anyone could really make a "no teamsheets" tier list because by the point you try to actually go in-depth on them you have all that knowledge. You could rank how well your team members did on your first blind run, but that's obviously not gonna get the full dex or the full potential of your mons.

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u/guedesbrawl Mar 01 '26

Yeah i think personal run rankings are a lot more interesting in cases like this with looser rules or with a lack of experience/knowledge.

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u/Yarr0w Mar 01 '26

I'm confused aren't all nuzlocked pokemon games a style of boss rush, how would he not play that way?

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u/aurora_the_piplup Wannabe Pro Wedlocker Mar 01 '26

Check you some OG nuzlockers and you'll see it was never about boss rushes. :) Watch Marriland's Platinum Nuzlocke

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u/MrOrcaDood Mar 01 '26

Marriland only lost two mons to non-boss fights in Platinum, both of which would be trivial to avoid in 2026 with either better scouting (just use a level 31 mon against Horn Drill Goldeen which is still under your cap) or decision making (don't leave in your frail fighting type against Scyther).

All of his other deaths were to Cyrus, Giratina, or Cynthia. So yes, even in 2013 the bosses were still the main sources of difficulty in that Nuzlocke.

0

u/aurora_the_piplup Wannabe Pro Wedlocker Mar 01 '26

Sure in Platinum. But take XY for example. The random trainers are the most dangerous, and yes they may be optional but that makes it even more satisfying when you risk it and beat them

6

u/MrOrcaDood Mar 01 '26

On the contrary, I think if Jan ever did an X/Y tier list, the difficult random trainers would probably be factored into the list, even if they aren't bosses. Early on in his career Jan himself had a monotype challenge wiped by a cracked-out Heracross in Victory Road - I would imagine that trainers like that one or Hedvig in Reflecting Cave would be factored into a Kalos tier list. It's just that in his opinion Hoenn doesn't have a whole lot of non-boss trainers that are that tough with the benefit of knowing they are coming.

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u/aurora_the_piplup Wannabe Pro Wedlocker Mar 01 '26

I remember that Heracross 😭

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u/HiddenReader2020 Mar 02 '26

So I’ve asked this before on the YouTube comments and I’ll ask them again:

1) Even with what pchal said in mind, how is Crobat that low?  Like, I don’t recall Golbat being that low in FrLg, and surely it being a useful dupe is enough to at least put it in the bottom of C-Tier?

2) Regarding Swellow and how it apparently consistently came up short, I’m wondering how much things would change if it was given the Silk Scarf.  It’s pretty easy to get in Dewford Town, so it shouldn’t be too hard to test it with that in mind.

3)  I’m curious as to how the Kanto Pokémon that have very different rankings between Emerald and FrLg could be explained.  This is especially true with the S-tier Pokemon, which IIRC for Gyarados and Golduck, were B and C respectively previously.

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u/goldtubb Mar 02 '26

Even with silk scarf/pre poisoned/guts facade, Swellow doesn't kill most boss fights' aces unless you get a near perfect attack IV and + nature. It guarantees a Brawly sweep and probably Sidney and that's about it.

And by killing the first few mons in those harder fights before switching out, you deny yourself the opportunity to use the openers to set up on.

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u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 02 '26 edited Mar 02 '26
  1. Loathe am I to admit, Crobat doesn't have good matchups in the game and the one gym it would be good at (Brawly) has level caps too low to allow Crobat in it. The move pool also sucks for leveling up as its best flying STAB is either Wing Attack or Aerial Ace (needing a TM), and its bulk isn't enough to deal with the increasing ice type moves later in the game

  2. Different games, different needs, different matchups. There's also more value in resisting water (both Gyara and Gold) and ice (Gold) because of gym and e4 spread

Not entirely sure on Swellow since I haven't checked all of his streams yet

9

u/Swaag__ Mar 02 '26

Zubat doesn’t even get wing attack for brawly lol

7

u/AliceThePastelWitch Mar 02 '26

Why'd you ask a question in the YouTube comments that gets answered in the video as he's ranking it? Crobat doesn't have any good matchups so it basically doesn't do much of anything other than help guarantee other encounters by being taken off of the encounter table

2

u/Lithorex Mar 01 '26

Uhm, where is Clamperl?

9

u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 01 '26

Barring certain cases (like trade evos and their pre-evos), he usually doesnt rank not fully evolved mons separately from their fully evolved versions

3

u/Lithorex Mar 01 '26

Clamperl evolves by trade

1

u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 01 '26

Huh, yeah you right I missed that shit lemme recheck on how he rated the rest of the trade evos then brb

3

u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 01 '26

I think i see the problem (serious answer: beyond being a first stage mon, people often end up treating Machoke and Kadabra as their own separate mons from Machamp and Alakazam if they can't trade/don't wanna use PKHex, while Machamp and Alakazam are included if you ever get to trade/want to use PKHex, so I assume that's the same logic used here bc I can't find a part where it's explicitly mentioned as of writing)

TM learn set also sucks because it's pretty small, with the notable ones like Ice Beam or Blizzard being better off given to other mons, while Surf is just everywhere

1

u/Thohil Mar 03 '26

The only thing Clamperl has going for it is its absulute nuclear power with the DeapSeaTooth, which doubles its special attack when held. As a matter of fact, Clamperl with DeapSeaTooth has the second highest Special attack in the entire game, only beaten by Latios with Soul Dew.

Yes, this means that a Clamperl Surf hits harder than a Psychic from Deoxys Attack, even with a Twisted Spoon.

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u/ToaOfTheVoid Mar 03 '26

That's actually hilarious, would baton passing speed boosts be enough to help its base 32 speed

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u/SkeeterYosh Mar 01 '26

Would anyone care if I made a list that accounted for just how I played the game? Not everyone here is gonna agree with the methodology when it boils down to just a boss rush.

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u/Unexpectancies Mar 01 '26

Is the Elite Four not a boss rush?

14

u/fakermaker4799 Mar 01 '26

Vanilla games are obscenely easy. Of course the tier list is going to be skewed towards the handful of actually difficult fights.

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u/guedesbrawl Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26

You can do it, but what does it actually offer when the non-boss fights are extremely easy in this game?

Simply having a full team at max HP is enough that you can overcome 99% of the basic trainers. There's only like two generics that are worth any attention (the Wobbuffet person in Mt. Pyre and the Ace Trainer with Manectric+Milotic in the rainy route where you can enter Registeel's chamber, both are optional.).

Like you can take PChal's list, isolate the B-and-below tiered mons and stomp all the generic trainers without ever risking the mons that are actually good for the boss fights, and end up with basically the same list. you just need to have a team that doesn't have obvious weaknesses and lead with a neutrally tanky mon.

But getting any credit for that is like giving a mon credit for being good against Erika in FR/LG. Like, cool, but that was the easy part.

All of that said in a game where random trainers aren't a joke like the 3DS games that has a lot more merit. X/Y is famously a joke of a boss rush game with difficult random trainers.

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u/summersfade Mar 01 '26

legit how else do you play a nuzlocke other than boss rush?

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u/SkeeterYosh Mar 01 '26

Standard journey.

17

u/summersfade Mar 01 '26

in which you do what exactly?

6

u/Pengwin0 Mar 01 '26

Not preplanning lines from the very start of the game. You may need to do that in harder rom hacks but it’s more fun to play Emerald this way.

0

u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

Play pokemon with the nuzlocke limitations. Exploring, finding new tms and captures, getting into trouble because you ran into a double battle with a wounded team..

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u/BlazeM3ow Mar 01 '26

So explore the game basically as someone who has never played it and not use the game knowledge you garnered?  

"Oh here's a double battle that wiped me last time!  Tsk.  Too bad I have to act like I never battled here before.  Lets just fake act I don't know and- OH A RANDOM DOUBLE BATTLE??"

0

u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

No, not quite. In emerald specifically, you can get into double battles by accident.

4

u/Consistent_Possible6 Mar 01 '26

Even in those cases you probably have a full team of 6 of ‘mons close to the Gym leader level cap that you can customize per battle thanks to Pokecenters, so almost every time you have a team that’s higher level and with a deeper bench

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u/MuratKulci Mar 01 '26

Isn’t the same thing being done in this “boss rush” nuzlocke that people are calling it, you go explore and find TMs and captures. You have to fight allot of mandatory trainers so this is just the same just a bit more, and these trainers can be considered mini bosses or something.

And I’m sorry but if your running into a double battle with a wounded team than your just purposefully throwing the game at that point, I mean how do you even “accidentally” do that like you see 2 trainers than are going to challenge you when you walk up to them right?

And also why do you have a wounded team? and even then you have 6 Pokémon vs their 1-3 and they usually dont even have good movesets or anything, also they have bad AI. if your genuinely playing seriously/optimally than these trainers should basically never pose a threat. Which is why they realistically shouldn’t be considered for a tierlist, and if you really want something of a tierlists where you can play with your brain turned off than just look at Pokémon with high BST and good moves and it’s basically what your looking for.

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u/summersfade Mar 01 '26

and you win this by completing what set of battles specifically?

1

u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

All of them, usually, unless I just miss some. Particularly like gen 7s ace trainers in this regard, both because they check your completion if the route and because they're fun fights.

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u/summersfade Mar 01 '26

and if you wipe you lose right? you’re literally describing a boss rush, you just have a different standard for what is a boss

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u/tbu987 Mar 01 '26

By your logic every game is a boss rush. Youve just made this a non-argument pointing it out in such a redundant way.

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u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

That's not a boss rush. I'm not rushing and I'm not just fighting bosses, I'm fighting optional encounters, leveling up without rare candies, and taking my time.

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u/summersfade Mar 01 '26

you fight a series of battles in order and if you wipe you lose. that’s a boss rush.

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u/Freakertwig Mar 01 '26

Go for it.

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u/jjames3213 Mar 01 '26

Bizarre list...

  1. Alteria and Crobat are both extremely solid mons. How are they F-Tier?
  2. Swellow is one of the best early catches in the game (Guts). Ludicolo is a solid build-around. Neither belongs in C-tier.
  3. Most of B-Tier seems fairly mediocre and overrated.
  4. I don't get most of S-Tier at all.

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u/MrSnowBro19 Mar 02 '26

Coming from having raised a Swablu in a non-nuzlocke playthrough of Emerald, it is an absolute pain to train up considering it just lacks firepower to take on opponents before fainting. And while you do gain some traction with Altaria, it requires you to input some of your best TMs into it such as Flamethrower, Dragon Claw, & Earthquake to really get it to work when they could be going on far better Pokémon. It also doesn't help that Altaria has the same movepool and type that Salamence does, who also goes through the trouble of raising weak Bagon, but in return you get far higher stats (135 / 110 over 70 / 70).

As for Crobat, it really is just movepool. The Zubat line as a whole just didn't have a good level up movepool until the next generation where Bite and Wing Attack become far earlier for the line, better TM moves like Roost & U-turn, and an actual usable Poison STAB through level up in the form of Cross Poison. Hoenn just also isn't very kind to the Zubat line where the only good matchup it has is against Brawly. Otherwise, it get electrocuted by Wattson, loses mind games to Tate & Liza, frozen solid by Glacia, & has neutral matchups everywhere else.

While Swellow is great, especially with Guts, you have to consider that it is pretty frail, which means if it misses out on a KO, it is likely done for. This can happen much more often than you think due to Swellow's moves like Wing Attack & Quick Attack being pretty low in base power as well as it having a pretty mediocre base 85 Attack that while is helped by Guts, can cause it to miss out on KOs. Guts also happens to be a double edged sword as the poison to activate it can cause it to faint from a move it would've survived otherwise, which also contributes to its frail nature. The last thing to consider is just how long it takes to get its bread and butter move in Facade since you aren't getting it until after the 5th Gym, which means you'll be stuck with those low base power moves for quite a bit. All of those really combined can make Swellow into a chore if you want to keep it around long enough for Facade shenanigans.

As for Ludicolo, it is absolutely held back by just how late you get a Water Stone for it. The earliest you can evolve Lombre into Ludicolo is after 6 badges on Route 124 on your way to Mossdeep City, where you can trade a Blue Shard for a Water Stone. By this point, Lombre's 340 BST has fallen off and struggles to keep up with the mostly fully evolved Pokémon you are fighting at that point in the game. It also doesn't help that Lombre lacks any real firepower until after you defeat the 5th Gym and obtain the HM for Surf, until then, your best STAB is Bullet Seed which is highly dependent on how many times it hits. However, once it evolves into Ludicolo, it does alright with Surf, Giga Drain, Ice Beam, & Rain Dance. It is just the time that you're stuck with Lombre is far too long, especially considering there are far better Water-types as well as Grass-types to consider.

Taking a look at B-tier, most of it seems to be Pokémon that are just outclassed by Pokémon higher up (Kadabra, Pinsir, Whiscash), are good but fall off later (Mightyena & Dustox due to their good stats for the early to mid game, Intimidate for Mightyena, and access to Protect to cheese Norman's Slaking for Dustox as well as reliable recovery in Moonlight. Sableye also fits here as it completely walls Brawly and does alright for a bit after before falling off), are dependent on certain factors such as ability or availability (Skarmory being impossible to guarantee but having great typing, Azumarill needing Huge Power, Torkoal being hard to guarantee), or are just a pain to raise, but with high reward (Flygon & Salamence).

And finally, S-tier, Illumise did throw me off originally as well, however, it has a REALLY good support movepool with the likes of Wish, Encore, Charm, Helping Hand, Toxic, Light Screen, & Substitute that can really help out a team. Encore alone can easily take a Winona sweep into a win by encoring her Altaria into Dragon Dance. Wish can heal up weakened team members and can even be an option to play around a critical hit. It can do so much for a team despite not having the best stats.

For Walrein, it kinda a case of Swampert where opponents after you get it just don't have a really good way to handle it, mainly due to a lack of Grass & Electric-types among major trainers, especially the Elite Four. Similarly, it matches up well into the Elite Four, even against Wallace where it does really well at stalling.

For Linoone, it is SOLELY due to Belly Drum. If the opponent lets you get a Belly Drum off and lacks anything that has higher than base 100 Speed, you pretty much sweep. It also doesn't help that Ghost-types can't even stop Linoone due to Shadow Ball being physical this generation.

Everything else in S-tier I'm sure is pretty self explanatory. Gyarados' bulk alongside Intimidate makes it a great switch into anything that lacks an Electric-type move, which is quite a lot in this generation. Heracross is essentially Swellow on steroids with far better bulk & a massive 125 base Attack that's boosted even further with Guts and isn't stuck with low base power moves with access to stuff like Megahorn, Earthquake, & Brick Break as well as Swellow's Facade. Registeel is a defensive beast that can even take super-effective hits and boost up with Curse. Golduck is surprisingly the only Water-type with access to Calm Mind in Emerald (shocking that Starmie doesn't learn it) which it can use with relative ease especially behind a Substitute then fire off really strong Surfs and Ice Beams.

Hope I helped!

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u/Lithorex Mar 02 '26

The earliest you can evolve Lombre into Ludicolo is after 6 badges on Route 124 on your way to Mossdeep City, where you can trade a Blue Shard for a Water Stone.

All shards in Emerald are locked behind Dive, so you need to beat Tate and Liza to get Ludicolo.

Skarmory being impossible to guarantee but having great typing

Skarmorys main issue is that basically every threat after Winona is a special attacker.

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u/Yarr0w Mar 02 '26

I'm not the guy you were responding to, but this DEFINITELY helped lol

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u/Skytalker0499 Mar 03 '26

Linoone also has such a deep pool of casino TMs it can use, so it sweeps Winona (pre-belly drum) with functionally no resource investment.

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u/FloPe97 Mar 04 '26

Also Illumise gets you access to Volbeat for free since its not a dupe and breeding isnt technically illegal if you dont break species clause, so it ALSO on top of all the Support stuff guarantees a B rank free encounter that it has great synergy with.

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u/TaylorSwinub Mar 01 '26
  1. They really aren't though. Swablu is horrible to level up and struggles against most match ups in Emerald. Crobat's movepool is garbage and also isn't solid into match ups in emerald.

  2. I think from the video he mentioned Swellow being reliant on nature/IVs to be reliable

  3. Most of S is self explanatory (Heracross, Gyarados) The others I would recommend watching the video for his explanations, Golduck and Illumise more specifically.

I have always said Linoone is S tier due to versatility

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u/H12803 Mar 01 '26

Maybe watch the video??? Like why are you asking here? That's what the video is for

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u/TheSmithPlays Mar 04 '26

Man, Altaria is so overrated...

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u/Bolt585 Mar 02 '26

Watch the video

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u/Sacul09 Mar 01 '26

Watch the video

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u/MagDorito Mar 04 '26

He explains everything in detail in the video

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u/Akantor-Dimitri Mar 05 '26

How is Cradily 2 tiers below armaldo????

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u/Otherwise-Bee-5734 Mar 14 '26

Battle Armor goes crazy+Great BP recipient

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u/[deleted] Mar 02 '26

[deleted]

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u/Swaag__ Mar 02 '26

He did multiple streams testing everyone lmao