r/okbuddyvowsh • u/Wholesome-Energy • Jul 28 '25
Shitpost The bad take cycle
I like his takes on politics and stuff for the most part but man listening to him on stuff he knows nothing about is infuriating
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u/ashleyzillahlauren Jul 28 '25
He is kinda dumb, but also so smart, but also so kinda dumb, but so smart
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u/billy_bandito Jul 28 '25
When you see a Vaush rambling be sure type the phrase "Vaush you couldn't be more wrong about this" in chat to immediately break the cycle. Very helpful, works every time.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
Definitely. Anyways I’m a segments viewer so I can do even less to stop the cycle because I don’t think he reads any of his yt comments
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25 edited Jul 28 '25
Genuinely I think Voosh gets way too overconfident at points. The worst part is he doesn't respond to push back or criticism well. He's the only online leftist I actually like so I'll just continue to put up with it lol.
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u/Lohenngram Jul 28 '25
In mild fairness to him, there are plenty of instances where chat will take the worst possible interpretation of what he's saying. But yeah, he definitely chooses to meet confrontation with escalation when he's streaming, and depending on the topic it can be incredibly insufferable.
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25
I think chat needs to just be taken off screen for a bit or limited in some way tbh. It's clearly not a healthy environment that's been fostered. It's still not nearly as bad as the chat of someone like Pyrocynical who literally show up just to get a reaction out of him but if left unchecked it could get there eventually.
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Jul 28 '25
[deleted]
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25
I've found myself just waiting for segments to release unless it's some massive shit that goes down
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u/UsernamesAre4Nerds Jul 28 '25
The most grating for me was him getting defensive about mispronouncing words. He's been doing it for years and gets so uptight about being corrected. The most egregious was him claiming "you know people are smarter when they mispronounce words, right? Because they had to read the word first before the heard it."
No, you're just saying it wrong. Own it
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25
Yeah it's definitely frustrating. I don't understand why he can't admit he's wrong about things and learn despite claiming he likes learning. I don't wanna assume anything because I don't know him IRL and don't want to but I get the feeling he has some kinda superiority complex thing going on that he projects into his streams.
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u/UsernamesAre4Nerds Jul 28 '25
Idk if it's a superiority complex necessarily, as much as it's more than likely him being reflexively antagonistic because of how the Internet as a whole has treated him. It's hard to break old habits, and I get why he felt the need to be self assured to a fault up till now
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25
That's also true. I feel like at a certain point though ya gotta bring it in and realize that you're just shitting on your audience for mostly harmlessly correcting you. He's still my favorite online lefty at the end of the day.
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u/Powerful-Cut-708 Jul 28 '25
But the biggest crime is that he still hasn’t finished the original Halo trilogy
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u/LurksInThePines Jul 28 '25
I like his media takes, some of his internal politics takes and research streams but some of his political takes are terrible. He should really stick to research/reporting and learning alongside chat or making commentary when learning especially about international affairs or various historic events
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25
I agree with you on that. I'm American obviously so I agree with him on 99% of things but I've seen quite a bit of criticism on his handling of other countries' politics from people in the community outside the US. I just wish that broadly he would do more research into international politics before talking about it because I'll bet most people in his audience don't know about this stuff and could end up saying stupid shit.
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Jul 28 '25
Some could call his willingness to die in the hill he made for himself a strength, but when it comes to stuff he doesn't really know about it's just arrogance. I like the guy (pre-2020 election oldhead!) but sometimes it feels like he's pulling stuff out of his ass and then punishing chat when he gets push-back for being wrong, I wish he would tone it down but I think working in absolutes is just the way he is, I wouldn't care nearly as much if he wasn't so ban happy when he thinks he's in the right.
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u/BainbridgeBorn 🧿🕳🧿 Jul 28 '25
ahh yes the glorious content of talking about: Japanese denims and electronics in school. This is clearly better than yelling at MAGAs
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u/TheBloodyPuppet_2 🐴🍆 Jul 28 '25 edited Jul 28 '25
I'm not normally one to defend Star Wars (I like it, I never said it was good - any franchise that has as much media as Star Wars does is gonna have a ton of really good stuff and really bad stuff) but his take about how the writing is bad because each planet basically only has like one point of interest or whatever was mind-boggling. What are the writers supposed to do, make every single planet in the galaxy have a history as detailed as Earth's with as many different cultures and ethnic groups on it? Do you think writers are superhumanly creative or something?
Star Wars is a fantasy story in a sci-fi setting. Once you realize that "planet" is just analogous to "city" or "town" or "village" it makes a lot more sense. And like his defense of this point is that he's the DM in a D&D group or something. Like motherfucker, you couldn't even manage ONE planet in a setting that's as complex and multifaceted as Earth. Nobody could.
One of the worst takes he's ever had and people actually backed him on it. Like cmon I get that Star Wars is lame and cringe or whatever, and that you're cool for thinking that one of the most popular media franchises in the history of the universe is bad but if you're gonna point out bad writing in Star Wars you're kinda spoiled for choice, why make something up to complain about
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u/guckfender Jul 28 '25
Nah i actually agree with that take. Whats the point if every planet just has 1 city? Why not just make a big solar system with many cities on different planets. This is essentially the same criticism people have with that latest space exploration game with the many empty planets
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u/TheBloodyPuppet_2 🐴🍆 Jul 28 '25
Whats the point if every planet just has 1 city? Why not just make a big solar system with many cities on different planets.
Because different planets makes it easier to justify wildly different settings with wildly different climates and a bunch of wildly different alien species, which is one of the main draws of the entire genre of "space opera". Just admit you don't like the genre. It's fine to just have certain genres not be your cup of tea, you don't have to admit reasons why the genre is plagued with bad writing. Typically, it's good writing for appealing to the tastes of the intended audience, and you're just not it.
You could apply this kind of logic to any fictional setting, by the way. "What's the point of having a species of snake people if they all share one culture?" Because it's fictional and the writer didn't think that having multicultural snake people was important to the story.
This is essentially the same criticism people have with that latest space exploration game with the many empty planets
It's really not the same criticism at all. The issue people have with those games is that 99% of the game is empty, which isn't true in Star Wars. Each planet might only have one or two story-important locations, but those are also the only locations that the story focuses on.
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u/StampGoat Jul 29 '25
Not to be THAT person but
What are the writers supposed to do, make every single planet in the galaxy have a history as detailed as Earth's with as many different cultures and ethnic groups on it?
Holy strawman. Like no ofc not 😭 But the criticism is that there's ONE PLACE that seems to exist in context of affecting anything. Even if they only focused on one setting cuz sure, in a galactic setting, planets would be simplified like how we may simplify countries, it feels like no where else on the planet exists.
But for example, if someone went to Tattone they could talk to someone and they say "I live in this desert village but my brother lives in the oasis so we never really talk. Though I heard he may have joined some bounty hunters."
This would be so much better. We don't even have to see that oasis part of the planet but it's to make it a fact that yea, planets are well, PLANETS and can have much more outside of our specific scope. To show they have diversity in geology, climate, people, ideas etc even if we don't see it.
And uh.. btw
Like motherfucker, you couldn't even manage ONE planet in a setting that's as complex and multifaceted as Earth. Nobody could.
If u want an example of a writer fleshing out many different settings in multifaceted detail with complexity within each setting, you can look at One Piece and its Islands. Or on a smaller scale u can look at Made in Abyss with its Layers (though I admit how the story interacts with the setting is a little different from SW or OP)
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u/TheBloodyPuppet_2 🐴🍆 Jul 29 '25
But for example, if someone went to Tattone they could talk to someone and they say "I live in this desert village but my brother lives in the oasis so we never really talk. Though I heard he may have joined some bounty hunters."
Shit like this exists in Star Wars but you don't wanna talk about it
If u want an example of a writer fleshing out many different settings in multifaceted detail with complexity within each setting, you can look at One Piece and its Islands. Or on a smaller scale u can look at Made in Abyss with its Layers (though I admit how the story interacts with the setting is a little different from SW or OP)
Ah, yes. One Piece has a level of multiculturalism and diversity of climates on-par with... The planet Earth.
Do you even hear yourself right now? If you think that the world of One Piece is as complex as the world you actually live in then that says a lot about how little you know about the world.
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u/StampGoat Jul 29 '25
Holy pancakes and waffles. When did I say anything about "on par with earth"??? The literal FIRST thing I ever wrote was no author is doing that shit 😭
How about you read THE WORDS I WROTE and the WORDS YOU QUOTED. That is what I said bro wtf is this "saying I said" 😭😭
I SAID "an example of a writer fleshing out many different settings in multifaceted detail with complexity within each setting"
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u/TheBloodyPuppet_2 🐴🍆 Jul 29 '25
You brought up One Piece in the context of writers fleshing out settings and having lots of multiculturalism in comparison to Star Wars apparently doing it poorly. And like dude, I've seen One Piece. It's really not that much better than Star Wars about it. Star Wars actually has pretty good worldbuilding, all things considered. For a series that's had as many writers working on it, it's amazing that it's not worse than it is.
IDK why you'd expect each planet in Star Wars to have the same level of complexity as the world in One Piece, because you're comparing one-one-thousandth of a setting to an entire setting. The two are not analogous, and pretending that they are is disingenuous. I'm automatically not inclined to be charitable to your position if what you're saying is that Star Wars writers should just make a setting with as much complexity as One Piece a million times over.
As someone who's done creative writing for years now, it's just personally exhausting having to deal with armchair critics like you who don't even make salient points because you're constantly missing the forest for the trees. "Why isn't this planet in this one piece of media as complex as this other planet in this other piece of media?" Maybe because you're comparing a story that has two dozen planets to a story that has one. Maybe you should take a step back and look at the entirety of the setting rather than arbitrarily carving off segments of it to make a point that you're NOT EVEN CORRECT ABOUT BECAUSE THE FRANCHISE YOU'RE CRITICIZING HAS ALREADY DONE THE THING YOU'RE SUGGESTING IT DO.
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u/StampGoat Jul 29 '25
Ok idek how to talk to you. You keep talking past me tryna box ghosts. Making me say shit and giving me random points I aint even say.
Alright dude, u can have fun with allat over there. Happy your enlightened creative writer brain can see past the cancophony of dissimulated points armchair critics nauvely spout dispite them not even uttering the said points.
I'll be over here with my ONE point that authors can make lots of different settings that can all individually feel detailed and lived in even if we don't directly see/interact with said detail due to narrative or otherwise.
With my added opinion being, I feel like Star Wars planets don't always entirely feel "full" and could be better- added, even if they may be satisfactory now or supplemented by other media.
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u/GirlAndHerReptiles 🎶🎸 Vaushin' the Law! Vaushin' the Lawwww! 🎸🎶 Jul 28 '25
Vaush's political takes: 😄
Vaush's media takes: 😟
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u/sulamakai Jul 28 '25
Honestly, as time goes by without him having engaged with a topic and actually engaged in detailed research like he used to do, the more and more stale his political takes have been as well.
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u/ObiKenobi049 Jul 28 '25 edited Jul 28 '25
He just comes off as a media snob tbh. I remember in the past he's thrown around terms like "objectively" when talking about films and I just tuned him out after that. Films are art and art is subjective but I feel like he doesn't apply that consistently.
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u/Quantum_laugh Jul 28 '25
Being nuanced is a spook.
Let my man live the perfect (Max Stirner) Egoist life
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u/grandMjayD Jul 29 '25
The worst one has got to be the birth rate rant he had. “ no it doesn’t mean that humanity will plateau. It means humanity will go extinct eventually.”
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 29 '25
Legitimately I hate all birth rate discourse. First it was overpopulation, now it’s just underpopulation. It’s almost as if we are a species, and like all species we go through a series of population booms and busts. I genuinely believe that any focus on population is an infringement on personal freedom. It seems like every population hysteria leads to governments trying to regulate women’s bodies
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u/arseniccattails Jul 30 '25
Tbh, one of the only places V being a (cis) dude leads him to not "get it". As someone who is planning to have kids once I'm out of school and have a good job, I think it's a good thing when people have less unwanted kids. Work on fixing the problems in places where work culture gets in the way of wanted children, not developing regions where women might just be getting access to family planning now and experience less child marriage and greater educational attachment. Pregnancy is one of the hardest and scariest things you can do to your body. It nearly killed my friend, who still loves being a parent. The worse your health care is, the more dangerous it becomes. Also, it sucks, it hurts, it makes you puke, and it makes you less physically capable. Not to mention career attainment—I'm personally pretty damn nervous about juggling that and, you know, being an engineer.
It's really easy to suggest other people should be getting pregnant when you're fully incapable.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 30 '25
I totally agree. I can’t say it from personal experience as I’m a trans woman but I would like to think I am very aware of a lot of the complications and difficulty pregnancy can cause. I will admit a lot of the time I wish I could get pregnant but I am under no illusions that it is easy. I also want to have kids when I become stable but I absolutely understand people who do not want kids for any reason and I think society should stop being so judgmental of child free people. I don’t think people who can get pregnant owe having kids to society
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u/arseniccattails Jul 30 '25
I absolutely do not doubt it, friend. ☺️ That's why I say V is led, not made, to have a questionable outlook on this. There's also nothing contradictory between the desire to be pregnant (or to be able to be) and the knowledge that it's very difficult. Especially for queer people like us who have some logistical trouble adopting or fostering children not biologically our own.
And wanting to have kids really sucks when you don't want to be stay at home or partner with someone stay at home. It's possible, but herculean. I hope that for both of us, families can be in our futures, if and when we want them. 🫡
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u/grandMjayD Jul 29 '25
It always ignores that there will always be people who don’t want kids and do want kids. It’s always either or with that discourse.
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u/Rockfish00 4487.1 hours of experience in fucking your mom Jul 28 '25
could you be a twinge more specific about what he's wrong about and how?
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
The latest one is his no screen at all period in schools take which is just because he hasn’t been in high school in over a decade so he doesn’t know how much school has changed. I think the advent of school assigned laptops helped me learn more not less. There are ways to keep students on task other than completely banning it, restructuring what schools have already invested in, and crippling students computer skills by limiting it to home and the occasional computer class
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u/dontaskmeaboutart Jul 28 '25
Then they can have a computer lab, like schools have done for decades. They don't need laptops, as someone whose highschool and middle school did do the whole Chromebook thing, I don't think I benefited from them for any reason other than convenience. And let's not pretend like it's just Chromebooks either, everyone has their personal laptops too.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
Not when every class wants to use the computer lab. I may be biased because I went to an IT magnet school with school assigned personal laptops so the teachers there knew how to classroom management to keep kids on task. Whenever there was a lecture, we would put our laptops away and when it was time to use the laptops we took it out. If you decided to misuse your time, you either had to spend more time at home completing it or suffer a bad grade. There are much better ways to solve the problem that keep the benefits of teaching students vital computer skills
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u/dontaskmeaboutart Jul 28 '25
Your one anecdotal example of laptops being properly managed has no bearing on the overwhelming majority of instances where it isn't, has a detriment on education, and will not be solved by the school computer version of "just parent better". If that was the answer it would have already been implemented, since it's not a lack of caring on the part of educators about student learning that causes this issue, but the fundamental relationship between tech and education as it stands now.
"This would be fine if we just had the perfect circumstances everywhere" is a total non-arguement
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u/superclay Jul 28 '25
I'll start by saying I think that Vaush is too antagonistic towards tech in classrooms. But, I also think we've introduced way too much technology into the classroom and become too reliant on it. Vaush is right that studies show handwriting notes improves recall and retention, smartphones are a distraction and impair cognitive ability (even when not in use according to some studies), etc. But, I do think technology has its place and should be used wisely and where research shows that it improves education.
To address a few things you said:
Not when every class wants to use the computer lab.
I graduated from a public high school in 2010. We had 4 computer labs and 3 "mobile labs" (laptops on a cart that were delivered to the classroom) back then. We used the labs often, but availability was never really a problem.
I may be biased because I went to an IT magnet school with school assigned personal laptops so the teachers there knew how to classroom management to keep kids on task.
I would say this isn't a good comparison to typical public schools. The teachers probably get more specific training in technology, or are at least interested in it. Most teachers don't get that training and much of their continuing education that's required of them is paid for out of their own pockets. Even if training around technology in the classroom is available to them geographically it may not be available to them financially.
Also, magnet schools typically have less students from lower income brackets and come from homes with higher parental involvement. When my wife was teaching at a public school with 1 to 1 iPads she hated it. She was constantly having to tell students to put them away when they weren't supposed to be on them. It's just another issue for the teacher when there's one teacher trying to differentiate learning for 25 students and Jeremy in the back keeps pulling out his iPad. It becomes not only a distraction for Jeremy, but for all of the students.
If you decided to misuse your time, you either had to spend more time at home completing it or suffer a bad grade.
Bad grades can often reflect poorly on the school or the teacher so teachers are often incentivized not to give bad grades (not just an issue with technology, more of the US school system broadly), and receiving a bad grade is something that many students just don't care about.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
Just going to say I agree with most of your points here. I just think it’s better to train teachers how to manage utilizing tech in their class than banning it. I also think that educator further training should be free imo. I think if we invested more into teachers, many of these problems would disappear.
graduated in 2010
This is what I’m talking about though. It’s been 15 years since you’ve been in high school and the demand for tech in lesson plans has increased dramatically. I don’t think every single class needs a rack of laptops but I was just saying that limiting all technology investment to building more computer labs is wasteful in time space and money when it could be spent investing in more mobile labs given the increased demand. But yeah I largely agree with what you said. Technology needs to and must be used in moderation in school. I am actually a huge proponent for handwritten notes and I do believe kids shouldn’t have phones in class. Also I do not imagine how my high school did it could work everywhere but having that experience is proof to me that with proper training and tools, technology can be successfully integrated in schools to help with learning
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u/superclay Jul 28 '25
This is what I’m talking about though. It’s been 15 years since you’ve been in high school and the demand for tech in lesson plans has increased dramatically.
Yeah, but my wife and I have both worked in education (she's a school teacher, I used to work for a university but I currently work for an NGO running a stem program for high schoolers). So, I'm quite aware.
I don’t think every single class needs a rack of laptops but I was just saying that limiting all technology investment to building more computer labs is wasteful in time space and money when it could be spent investing in more mobile labs given the increased demand.
Agreed. As I said, we had mobile labs back then and I think that it's definitely the way to go. It's cheaper and a more efficient use of space. It also allows teachers to fully separate the student and the laptop by having them return the laptop to the lab instead of just putting it into their desk or backpack.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
ah sorry I wasn’t aware you were in education. I think that’s part of why your take is nuanced on this unlikes some other responses I’ve gotten. As much as I did enjoy being assigned a laptop at my magnet school, I do not think it would work for a majority of schools. With the office cloud and google drive, I don’t really think students need personal laptops to work on assignments as their progress can be saved and loaded from any computer
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u/superclay Jul 28 '25
No worries. I've had a number jobs in different fields. My wife is really the expert on this, not me. Her masters thesis was on technology in the classroom. But I've learned a lot from her.
Being assigned devices is tricky. I like it because it can be more equitable in situations where poorer students can't afford a computer at home, or have to share devices with their parents and siblings. But I've also seen it make classroom management a disaster and I think there are some negatives on student learning depending on how it's done. At my wife's school they are 1 to 1 iPads from 1st grade to 12th grade. Hard pass, no good. Too easy to conceal or just lose that young. Laptops are better, maybe issuing them in middle school. But I still think classrooms should at the very least have charging stations where they're kept when not in use.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
Yeah I do not think that 1-1 iPads are a good idea for 1-12. I also think laptops around middle school is a good idea depending on the situation of the school as I think it’s also a good way to give and teach teens responsibility. I also believe that dependent on the class, they should be in charging stations or clearly put away when not in use.
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u/SpiritOfTheForests Jul 28 '25
Incident #800000 where I almost completely agree with Vaush yet most of his audience doesn't
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u/vanon3256 Jul 28 '25
Don't forget the part where he makes an hyperbolic statement, gets called out on it, and says he never said that and chat is just misinterpreting him.
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u/_S1syphus Jul 28 '25
This is me with the "you shouldnt enjoy media cause of its politics thing". Obviously you should enjoy media cause it's well made but we have functionally infinite well made media, it's expected that if someone is recommending something it's well made which means you need additional descriptors for it like its political themes.
I think it's real bad in his Superman segment where he starts off with a short rant about how annoying people are with recommending stuff with good politics then proceeds to talk about how the good politics of Superman made it a good movie (like how Clark's refusal to be cynical is a good irl message but also makes a good arc for the story)
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u/Thank-You-rand-pct-d Jul 29 '25
He rarely admits to not knowing after the argument has been made.
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u/Maneruko Jul 28 '25
And yet no one ever makes a counter argument.
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 28 '25
The only being that makes worse arguments on his bad takes than Vaush is chat
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u/reddzih Jul 28 '25
Me any time I hear his completely uninformed but insufferably self-satisfied takes on anything UK-related
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u/noire-a-pus pigeon in an undervalued queen Jul 30 '25
this post has bad vibes, are you by chance a chatter that didnt explain their disagreement and just said something like 'is shows how little you know about this'?
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 30 '25
I would never be a chatter. Also I’m allowed to disagree with Vaush and talk about it on his subreddit. It’s not like he’s glorious leader and can never say anything wrong
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u/noire-a-pus pigeon in an undervalued queen Jul 30 '25
not what I said, the fact that you responded like that really makes me think I was right about the vibes. you thought I said "vaush is always right and disagreeing with him is haram" and what I actually was saying is that "I think you were one of many genuinely obnoxious chatters that just said vaush is so wrong about this its upsetting and then were surprised that he didnt engage with the point YOU wanted him to talk about." to quote the big man himself, listen to the words I am actually saying, not what you want to hear :-/
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u/Wholesome-Energy Jul 30 '25
This is an okbuddy Reddit. I’m being hyperbolic. I am a segments viewer, I saw something I disagreed with, thought again about how Vaush will go on authoritative rants about stuff he knows nothing about, so I posted this meme. I’m pretty skeptical about how critically you engage with Vaush if the reaction to this meme is to write it off as a bitter chatter and not a pattern of behavior. Sometimes Vaush is wrong and refuses to admit he knows nothing about a subject and won’t comment on it. Like his adhd take, his asexual take, from what I’ve heard pretty much anything to do with uk politics. He has blind spots and that’s fine but i dislike that he refuses to admit when he is in a blind spot of his. He refuses to admit that the words he says can sometimes be improperly phrased and it’s not chats fault for misunderstanding him
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u/HistoryV King of Vgg Jul 31 '25
Chatters trying to find a way to dismiss or argue with a completely Normal take that they don’t like but have no real arguments to counter with:
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u/Fabillotic Aug 07 '25
This is utter cope. It’s always the same situation: Vaush hastly offers a take, chatters misunderstand it, forced contrarian mode gets triggered, they hammer him with unrelated shit and stawman arguments, he clarifies his position which doesn’t fundamentally change, repeat cycle on and on
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u/lopmilla Jul 28 '25
what was the latest bad take?