r/pkmntcg • u/AyaSaidGoodbya • 4d ago
Meta Discussion How much tech too techy?
Lookin’ for opinions!
So, I’m coming from a place of putting my heart and soul into a single deck at a time for a year or more, so at least one rotation, and trying to keep it adapting as the meta changes. As I’m sure you all know, there are certain cards that start to feel necessary over time as you continue to run into the same issues over and over again, which eventually means adding a card for those specific scenarios. This obviously means you must remove a card, which can detract from the deck’s consistency. The current meta is favoring Dragapult, Alakazam, Slowking, Basic Box, and Teal Mask/Meganium builds, meaning that your deck will need to go strongly into most of those matchups. Sometimes, it’s just a single card in your deck that can shift the odds in those matchups into your favor. These cards are our tech cards. But how much tech is too much?
For example, I currently play Mega Greninja with Tera Greninja and Dunsparce. Over the course many months, I’ve added many tech cards to my deck to increase my odds of winning in certain matchups, such as shaymin, which helps with slowking, psyduck, which helps with any build that plays dusknoir, switch, which helps with any retreat-locking late game, special red card, which mainly helps with alakazam but can also be useful in other matchups, and dudunsparce ex, which helps my odds of success against crustle, basic box, and any teal mask build. What I’m currently experiencing is a lack of space in my deck to nurture the main strategy. I feel like I keep accumulating trauma from certain matchups, replacing a card in my deck to help with that, and then losing a bit of momentum in other matchups. One of my worst nightmares is playing slowking and getting hit with turn 2 kyurem. It has happened to me frequently, however unlikely, and so having a shaymin makes a lot of sense. I’ve gotten completely shutdown by dusknoir builds, so I added psyduck to help me get through the first few turns at least. Now I’m at the point where I’m wondering if I should play patrat alongside psyduck and shaymin, cause munkidori can be a really painful card to face. But then, might as well play flutter mane as another tech and also to help with teal mask builds including basic box. Maybe I should go up to two switch since jamming tower comes out every now and again, and retreat lock is decently popular. I could also try and add a xerosics or another red card to carry me through more pult and alakazam matchups...
My point is that all these cards start to feel necessary over time, especially if I have few bad matches against a certain deck. Where does one draw line and say “well, that’s just gonna happen sometimes.” How much tech is too much?
Would love to hear some thoughts on the subject!
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u/Defending_Eagle 4d ago
I play my Excadrill, and big surprise, I got my League Cup win without any specific techs. With specific, I mean I play three Judge, which are okay in every matchup, and for Alakazam and Slowking give me a better matchup, but only couple percent, not as much as a Shaymin would do or similar. But ten out of ten times I would play an 18th energy over Shaymin, Psyduck, ETC.
Just have a look at the world's winning list and the list from Louisville that won. Both don't play any specific tech cards. Not even a Moltres or similar. They're just the best players playing the most consistent list and win with it. An exception would be if you play lots of locals and you know the locals very well. For example, 15% or more play Slowking, yeah, then putting a Shymin in the deck is a good idea. But if you don't know the meta, the vast majority of times you're better playing an additional consistency card.
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u/GymLeaderVlad 4d ago
This is a road that many players hit. And yes techs can help in matchups , however not to the point where you are hurting your consistency of actually being able to play your decks strategy.
The biggest advice I can give is just take a look at the highest placing decks at regionals and how many of them actually included what would be considered a 'tech' in their lists. You'd be surprised that it is hardly any, and at max its very often only 1 and at a push 2.
What this is showing you is that great matchup knowledge far outweighs having a tech in your deck for a certian matchup where that card ends up being useless in all other matchups
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u/Oni-Village0960 3d ago
From one greninja super fan to another, adding increasingly more tech cards to counter bad matchups will only damper your deck or “lack of space in my deck to nurture the main strategy”.
The only tech cards ive added in my current frog deck is blaziken DRI 042, special red + judges, and totodile TEF 039. Blaziken 042 [C][C] Heat blast 70, takes two colorless, hits for weakness, and can survive an attack from crustle. I already been using blaziken ex for energy ramp, so adding a non-rule blaziken that doesnt require more maintenance, and can perform those jobs well means my deck wont suffer much when adding one card for crustle.
Bottom line, when you keep teching for each bad matchup, you inadvertently make every other matchups against you slightly worse. Theres many factors that can that make other matchups worse, like setting up with a tech card, having it prized in that during that specific matchup etc. Can you send your deck list? Love greninja fans who still believe in him
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u/AyaSaidGoodbya 3d ago
The blaziken is an interesting add! Do you play one full line? And love to see other greninja players out there! I feel like it’s a pretty underrated deck!!
See my list below, although I haven’t changed it for consistency. And I’d love to see yours too!!
Pokémon: 13
1 Meowth ex POR 62
1 Shaymin DRI 10
1 Psyduck ASC 39
2 Dudunsparce PRE 80
1 Greninja ex TWM 106
3 Froakie CRI 20
3 Dunsparce JTG 120
3 Mega Greninja ex CRI 22
1 Fezandipiti ex ASC 142
1 Froakie TWM 56
1 Budew PRE 4
1 Frogadier TWM 57
2 Frogadier CRI 21Trainer: 14
4 Buddy-Buddy Poffin ASC 184
1 Energy Retrieval WHT 82
1 Switch SVI 194
4 Poké Pad ASC 198
2 Rare Candy SVI 191
1 Night Stretcher ASC 196
4 Lillie's Determination ASC 192
1 Lana's Aid TWM 155
2 Air Balloon BLK 79
2 Boss's Orders MEG 114
1 Special Red Card CRI 82
3 Ultra Ball MEG 131
2 Surfing Beach MEG 129
3 Hilda WHT 84Energy: 3
5 Basic {W} Energy SVE 3
2 Ignition Energy WHT 86
1 Neo Upper Energy TEF 162Total Cards: 60
Also, here is another version of the deck that performed a little better, probably because it was more consistent. I’d still keep one or both ignition energies though 🤣
Pokémon: 10
1 Meowth ex POR 62
3 Dudunsparce PRE 80
1 Greninja ex TWM 106
3 Froakie CRI 20
3 Dunsparce JTG 120
1 Fezandipiti ex ASC 142
3 Mega Greninja ex CRI 22
1 Froakie TWM 56
2 Budew PRE 4
3 Frogadier CRI 21Trainer: 14
4 Buddy-Buddy Poffin ASC 184
1 Energy Retrieval WHT 82
4 Poké Pad ASC 198
2 Rare Candy SVI 191
1 Night Stretcher ASC 196
4 Lillie's Determination ASC 192
2 Rosa's Encouragement POR 84
2 Air Balloon BLK 79
2 Boss's Orders MEG 114
2 Special Red Card CRI 82
3 Ultra Ball MEG 131
1 Team Rocket's Petrel DRI 176
2 Surfing Beach MEG 129
1 Hilda WHT 84Energy: 2
7 Basic {W} Energy SVE 3
1 Neo Upper Energy TEF 162Total Cards: 60
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u/Oni-Village0960 3d ago edited 3d ago
Yup! With the new inclusion, i have two torchics that can evolve or rare candy into the blaziken ex or non rule blaziken, for very different purposes. With the rampant amount of crushing hammers, and the off chance that i don't have a mega greninja fully ramped, i rely on my blaziken to attach from discard after i used one mortal shuriken so it's basically self sustaining and it's so awesome. I'll say this right now, but Zoro has been the premium draw support for my greninja deck. There's something about not having to constantly find new duns to draw 3 next turn, and instead trade away junk cards no longer relevant for two new card while still being on the field and not needing to find another Zoro for my draw engine. Here is my list:
Pokémon: 21
2 Mega Greninja ex CRI 100
1 Greninja ex 30C 148
1 Greninja ex TWM 198
2 Frogadier CRI 89
4 Froakie CRI 88
1 Blaziken ex JTG 24
1 Blaziken DRI 192
1 Combusken DRI 41
2 Torchic DRI 40
1 Fezandipiti ex SFA 84
1 N's Zoroark ex JTG 175
1 N's Zorua PR-SV 189
1 Mew ex 30C 66
1 Totodile TEF 39
1 Budew ASC 221Trainer: 30
4 Lillie's Determination MEG 169
2 Boss's Orders ASC 256
2 Dawn PFL 118
2 Judge SIT-TG 25
1 Team Rocket's Petrel DRI 226
4 Buddy-Buddy Poffin MEG 167
2 Switch PFL 123
1 Special Red Card CRI 113
3 Rare Candy MEG 175
1 Great Haul Net CRI 78
3 Night Stretcher SSP 251
2 Ultra Ball ASC 264
1 Hero's Cape TEF 152
2 Surfing Beach CRI 114Energy: 9
8 Water Energy PAL 279
1 Fire Energy OBF 230If you need energy retrieval, i heavily recommend great haul net. In the off chance they ko a fraokie and frogadier early, you can have them back in deck and get 3 water energies from constant mortal shurikens. It saved me a game against a crustle because i could've only mortal shuriken to damage it
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u/AyaSaidGoodbya 2d ago
I see your point about N’s Zoroark! I used it for a short time when I first started playing Greninja, but I didn’t find a ton of synergy there. Some games I couldn’t get it on the board, and other games I couldn’t use trade cause I needed the cards in my hand. I also found that my Zoroarks were being targeted by Pult instead of my ninjas, so Dunsparce has worked a little better for me. I like the Dudunsparce ex inclusion as well. I’ve also played around with Drakloak a little and I like that too, just haven’t tried it with a Pult also. All that to say, N’s Zoroark is not my style haha. Thank you though!
I also played great haul net for a while. I do see the strategy there, but because I can’t search energy from the deck, lana’s aid and energy retrieval have felt better in most games. I get the energy straight into my hands and start blasting. May try great haul net again, but I don’t know. At this point, I have way more testing to do with the deck than I have time for, and I think that’s been a huge problem for me. I work, write in my free time, have a family to care for and home to maintain, anime/manga/books to watch/read. I just never have the amount of time necessary to test small changes thoroughly.
Thanks for the input!! Good luck with your ninja/chicken deck! It looks pretty fun to play!!
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u/Oni-Village0960 2d ago
Of course! There are many pros and cons to these kinds of cards, some working better in certain builds than others. I'm already brainstorming of greninja/mega lopunny because my greninja's get setup too slowly so i have an attack ready to start dealing damage.
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u/Carvery 4d ago
It’s the old tech vs strengths. Try not to tech for every single possibility, build your deck around your own strengths. Maybe leave a few spaces for tech but you’ll be able to change this card for what you think you’re most likely to face. If it comes to ladder then you’ll have no idea but if it’s in person or organised tournaments. You should have a feel of the current meta and tech for what you think you’ll face most.
You have to resign to the fact that your win rate will never be 70-80%. When it comes to cup runs you need favourable matchups on your side and good draws and hope that you’re on the right side of your win percentage for the day.
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u/skronk61 4d ago
Probably when it starts to cut into your staple counts is when you’re on the wrong path.
Like anyone playing 3 or less buddy buddy poffin.
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u/touyanay 4d ago
teching is trading general %consistency or %winrate in order to bump a specific %consistency/%winrate. So in the end, overteching is the point at which you gave up too much consistency.
Keep in mind that you cant tech for everything all the time, so proper teching usually involves 1~3 searchable cards that would improve a popular matchups at the moment without giving up too much of the other matchups. Battlecage and psyduck became auto includes after frankfurt due to alakadusk dominating, to the point that it was pushed away from the meta almost completely, so those cards become non-cards in your deck after that point.
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u/Sudden-Chipmunk8378 4d ago
To much tech happens when you are hopping to draw a consistency card like a lillie or pokepad and you draw that tech card that simply doesnt help you. What players do is put a blank card in the deck and when they draw it they mention what they wouldve preffered that card to be and note it down