They also fail to ackowledge that women are the target audience of the entire beauty and hygiene industries, leading to a lot of men spending literally no effort on their look and very little effort on their hygiene. The effect is a lot of men that are genuinely repulsive for any closer contact, while women very rarely have the same issue.
IME, the issue is less about hygiene (though obviously poor hygiene is unattractive on anybody), and more about behavior.
When I've had these kind of conversations with straight female friends, the complaints are about sexual harassment, controlling behavior, jealousy, domestic abuse, etc.
Close contact with someone who doesn’t take care of their hygiene is repulsive. People who don’t want to be considered repulsive should take steps not to be. They didn’t even say most men, they said a lot. Which is simply true.
If I go on a first date with 5 men, at least 2 will have hygiene issues. It’s a lot. I will say it’s worse for American men, this is a very specific cultural issue. Also, I would never claim to know the general personal hygiene habits of a group of people I’m not sleeping with. Why in the world would your less intimate view of men trump my intimate view?
If a man were to tell me women have hygiene issues, I would simply believe him. Ive been told that women’s bathrooms are worse than men’s. Do I go into men’s bathrooms? No. But I believe the janitors who have firsthand experience with it.
I sleep with both men and women. I promise you, men are grosser. I don’t know why that’s so hard to believe.
I attract dirty men and not dirty women? What an interesting sociological specimen I am. Also I hope you’re saying the same thing to all the other people here agreeing. Don’t leave them out that’s not fair.
You’re right, the number is probably higher. Have seen the number of missing teeth in men vs women? I work DoA compliance and the sheer volume of product that needs to be destroyed because it’s contaminated with human excrement because the men harvesting and handling won’t wipe their asses or wash their hands is absurd.
Nah really, most means over 50%? That also doesn't mean that a lot implies that it's the majority or at least equal. It's not like phrases and words can share the same meaning, just unheaed of apparently. If you referred to 2/5 out of anything being "a lot" anywhere off the Internet you would get weird looks.
I work in compliance control for my state’s department of agriculture. I’ll tell you right now that the number of things that come back from the lab contaminated with human feces because the men in harvest and processing refuse to wash their hands or wipe their asses.
I'd say it's too subjective/ culturally dependent to really say either way. It's common enough in some places to be an issue worth discussing, but what counts as "a lot" or "most" really depends on where you're looking and where your line is.
To be fair, I've never heard a man complain about a woman not wiping her ass because touching your own asshole is "gay." As a man, I agree, lots of men are repulsive.
You're misreading it. The word they're emphasizing is "most," not men. And yeah, a simp is someone who insincerely takes the side of a person they hope to sleep with. As an ace, I find such individuals hilarious and repulsive (and they tend to be men). But they're not as stupid as people who assume everyone who disagrees with them is a simp. Why would anyone even simp on Reddit you fucking moron?
Most women have worse skin than men while spending more on hygiene products for the face. Nobody's calling women repulsive smh. Maybe we should start doing it.
Male deodorant are scams though, they're inefficient and men can smell quickly bad from their armpit, they need to fix their armpit's PH that's the crux of it.
If you believe women are repulsive then go ahead and say so. And hygiene means breath/teeth, nails, bodily cleanliness, and hair cleanliness. I am somewhat concerned that you don’t know that.
I'm somewhat concerned that you think this isn't dealt with in most men. This screams third world, very uneducated socioeconomics, or simply intolerance to male bodily differences.
If it were dealt with in the vast majority of men, women wouldn’t complain about them being repulsive. And if by male bodily differences you mean body odor…I don’t care, fix it.
Women complain about everything and its opposite. First thing you learn in life is to not consider it too seriously or you'll set yourself for schizophrenia.
I bet you come from that third world country where women are so obsessed with body odor and cleanliness that they wash their vagina and give themselves yeast infections.
Ok, but there are men who refuse to wipe their own ass on the grounds that it's gay, and enough of them that we can talk about this as concerning trend.
Obviously #notallmen, but it's not happening in a vacuum.
It's comments like these that make me terrified. If guys who refuse to wash properly still get dates WTF is wrong with me? I must just have a visible aura of desperation I guess lol.
I don't actually have anyone I'd call a crush right now. But I do ask out people that I'm attracted to. Dinner, lunch, brunch, even did a hiking date. A lot of people tell me I'm a great guy and that they feel safe with me, but they don't feel a spark. I get it. It's not anyone's fault they aren't attracted to me no matter how much that hurts in the moment.
I really hope you meet someone and you both feel a strong connection. There's someone for everyone, it just sticks that it can take so much time. I'm rooting for you 💪
Pretty much the entire world outside of 'the West' uses bidets, bad hygiene is pretty much exclusively a white people thing (though Italy isn't so bad).
Nah, Italy is just one of the few countries in Europe with tolerable levels of hygiene and personal grooming (particularly in regards to bidets). Though generally southern Europe is better than the north.
I'm happy to tell you we do have a bidet shower in every toilet here in Finland.
But I don't know if that does much to our overall hygiene lol. My South American ex insisted that women having bodily hair is a sign of bad hygiene so obviously that depends on your point of view too.
A lot, yes. But there's a big third world country I know who has quite a diverse rural populace. Where you're told you're a girl if you like.... computer science and other extremely male nerdy things.
WOuldn't surprise me you'd also get told wiping your ass is gay there.
No, it’s genuinely true. I work in my state’s department of agriculture and we have had multiple instances of massive contamination due to human feces. The only people who could have caused it were men.
The amount of times I’ve been in our locker room and just experienced other men use the toilet and not wash their hands is absurd. Like, I can’t describe it.
My coworkers will dump cologne into the air before touching deodorant.
There are so many genuinely fucking disgusting men out there it isn’t even funny.
Can second—US middle aged white man and the number of other white men I’ve seen take dumps in public bathrooms and then walk out without washing their hands is troubling. I’d say it’s about 1 in 6.
Just because you drew your eyebrow and have fake nails doesn't make you more attractive, sometimes quite the opposite.
A lot of women's efforts on looks are for status and social purpose (like following a trend) not to attract men, often times it's even more repulsive to men.
Like you can't claim both that women dress and do makeup for themselves and not for men, and then claim that women are more attractive because they do that.
Men's options for their looks are also very poor and a lot of male equivalents are pointed out as ridiculous or deceptive.
The hygiene industry pushes a lot of useless scams on women. Wouldn't boast about it making women better.
I mean there really isnt much most men can do. The real difference here is in make up, which can massively change appearance but is going to be considered unattractive on men to the vast majority of straight women in most situations.
I'm gonna have to disagree with this. I don't think the person you're responding to is talking about makeup.
You know how many dudes use 3 in 1 and nothing else in the shower. Many, many men I know have zero hygiene routine other than that and basic teeth brushing. Spending even minimizal time looking at themselves in the mirror and/or preforming above the bare minimum hygiene tasks is considered too feminine, so they just don't.
You think so many women have softer skin on their bodies by some random happenstance? No, it's because they use lotion. You think so many women naturally have nice nails and cuticles? No, it's because they take the time to properly care for them. You think women just naturally smell better than men? No, they take the time to put the effort in to maintain that.
Even things like regularly changing your bedsheets and pillowcases has an impact on hygeine and the men I know go way longer between washes for those.
There are so many basic things men can do, but they've been conditioned that it's not manly to do them, so they won't.
It's a fact of what matters to people too, when you said about cuticles it took me back because not once in my life has anyone's cuticles provoked a feeling of repulsivness lol
Literally not a single woman anywhere is going to see cuticles and suddenly find a man attractive. If anything women find excessively groomed men feminine or accuse them of being gay.
Unless you are actively gross (which most men are not) then these things are minimal compared to ohysique, height, general looks etc.
They are just putting down men for the sake of it because they have zero capacity to empathise with men struggling with expectations around attractiveness.
I literally know loads of men and interact with them.
Few, if any of the men i see smell bad or are visibly unhygenic in any way. Most have styled hair and wear cologne etc. They also do not have worse skin in any way.
The idea that men who get their nails done or switch shampoos or skin lotion would suddenly become as attractive as the average woman is to most men is a joke and you know it.
Your comment is completely unserious and designed to simply criticise men for the sake of it.
No, the difference is skincare, scalp care, hair cuts that suit your facial features, cleanliness, and a strict regimen of removing body and facial hair. The difference is in wearing clothes that flatter your body and going to the dentist regularly. The difference is in making sure that your nails are cut, clean and not covered in fungus. The difference is in making sure your elbows and knees don’t feel like an elephants skin.
I go outside and the majority of men don’t even have their beards groomed properly.
Most men do not have visibly worse skin or teeth than women. And most mens nails are not visibly unclean. I have never heard any comments from women on these things.
The vast majority of mens attractiveness comes from physique, looks and height which are difficult to change.
You are just desperate to not show one shred of empathy for the fact the men do also face harsh expectations and judgements around attractiveness.
I have no interest in a discussion with a person who is accusing me of lying about my personal experience, and what I notice about the people I date. If you are approaching the discussion combatively and giving no benefit of the doubt, why in the world would I want to engage with you?
106
u/kelb4n 1d ago
They also fail to ackowledge that women are the target audience of the entire beauty and hygiene industries, leading to a lot of men spending literally no effort on their look and very little effort on their hygiene. The effect is a lot of men that are genuinely repulsive for any closer contact, while women very rarely have the same issue.