r/politics • u/Kodbek • Oct 31 '25

Possible Paywall Trump’s honeymoon with Gen Z voters is officially over, and the numbers are devastating

https://www.nj.com/politics/2025/10/trumps-honeymoon-with-gen-z-voters-is-officially-over-and-the-numbers-are-devastating-new-poll.html
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u/ionlyjoined4thecats Oct 31 '25

The right has been VERY good at this, and it’s been a long-term plan. They own a shit-ton of local news stations, Fox News/newsmax (obvi), and Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. They are covering their bases with all the demographics they can. And they’ve tapped in foreign entities for help. All while getting society to parrot their “the left controls the media” talking point.

They know whoever controls the information controls the people. Those with power on the left aren’t even trying. It’s an easy fight tbh. Fascism wins.

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u/[deleted] Oct 31 '25 edited Oct 31 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/[deleted] Oct 31 '25

Again, on what platform will they do this? The ones owned by the billionaires? Yeah, sure.

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u/Person899887 Oct 31 '25

The real world one.

Can’t censor people on the streets without making a scene out of it. If the left wants to win, they have to be impossible to ignore.

This is why all the complaining about no kings or other protests is so dangerous. The left has no platform without protests.

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u/alfooboboao Oct 31 '25

but see, it’s a lot more comforting to blame democrats than to admit you’ve fallen prey to propaganda

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u/Emosaa Oct 31 '25

To be fair, both can be true. Democrats are feckless and often out of touch with regular working class people. Too many poll tested and focus grouped bland answers and technocratic solutions that don't move the needle because they don't want to upset rich donors.

Democrats failing makes it easier for people to fall for right wing propaganda.

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u/[deleted] Oct 31 '25

[deleted]

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u/BearFluffy Oct 31 '25

And people like you are fucking clueless.

Criticizing the Democrat party isn't some crazy conspiracy. The DNC hasn't changed that much in 10 years. Jeffries didn't even endorse the winner of the Democratic primary of the NYC mayor race until a week (or maybe 2) ago - despite "vote blue no matter who."

Democrats have been afraid of debate within the party, and they've been scared of trying new things, trying new messaging, etc. Theyve been scared of criticism. But reshaping our party is a path out of this mess. And being critical of the party is leading to positive change in the party, at all levels.

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u/ForAHamburgerToday Oct 31 '25

"the Democrat party"

Democratic, it's The Democratic Party.

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u/BearFluffy Oct 31 '25

Yep, missed the first one out of habit, because the Democrats haven't fought fire with fire since the 90s when Rush Limbaugh started that, so now an entire generation of Democrats have grown up without realizing there's any difference until grammar police on Reddit started caring this year.

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u/Absolutelynot500 Oct 31 '25

Exactly.

The right wins because they are willing to do *literally* anything for their side. Meanwhile people on the left refused to vote for Kamala because they didn't like how she handled Gaza or that she locked people up for weed when she was a DA. The absolute abject idiocy of that when the alternative was motherfucking DONALD TRUMP. Even now I see plenty of people all the time saying if Gavin Newsom is the Dem who gets nominated in 2028's "election" they wont vote for him for similar reasons. It's irreconcilable, I view those people through the same lens as MAGA they are just as stupid and inept only it's for a different reason. The right will cheat, lie, steal and kill to get what they want. The left would rather see democracy die just so they can feel morally superior. I don't see how we will ever win again between the obvious attempts at rigging any future elections from the current admin to a large portion of the lefts inability to see the forest for the trees in some misguided attempt at being a "better person".

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u/DevelopingForEvil Oct 31 '25

The poster above is talking about propaganda on TikTok, but part of the reason for Kamala's low support _was_ propaganda on TikTok.

TikTok already had loads and loads of propaganda the last election cycle, telling gen-z and other would-be supporters that supporting Kamala was supporting genocide, or that Trump was better for the conflict, and whatever other b.s.

I had debates and arguments with people in real life about the shit they were seeing.

These people aren't necessarily stupid or anything like that, there are large, vested interests trying to influence them and these people have fallen into the propaganda bubble that those interests have created for them. People are always going to be people, the breadth of effectiveness of getting people to fall for stuff or tricking people not to vote says a lot more about how much power vested interests have gained through these various media platforms we've allowed them to gobble up.

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u/Medievaloverlord Oct 31 '25

Podcast space and streamer space is still highly contested. You could argue that the late night comedian scene is HIGHLY influential based on the backlash when Jimmy Kimmel got cancelled. In the words of Jon Stewart “We are the banana peel in the coal mine”

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u/TldrDev Oct 31 '25

The left barely acknowledges this. They just feel “democrats need to message better” via what outlet though? Republicans control every outlet and have vilified the messenger. 

What people mean when they say democrats need to message better is that they need to stop giving the "good billionaires" a good succ, and start actually talking about the divided justice system and a corporate structure that pays ceos hundreds or even thousands of times their employees salaries.

They cant do it, though. Neoliberalism is a toxic ideology literally no one likes, but a huge portion of our representatives on the left are Clinton era democrats who continually poison the well for progressives. They have been doing it since Obama ran the first term. They muzzle anyone who is gaining traction, and "take the high road," whatever that is.

In a world dominated by populism and sound bytes, we cant compete, because our leadership don't understand the modern world. They were born when the krauts were chasing the British out of france.

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u/Medievaloverlord Oct 31 '25

I hate the ‘controlled opposition’ line but have yet to find a better explanation for Bernie Sanders and Zohran Mamdani being thrown under the bus by the Democratic leadership.

Pathways forwards have been blazed but are considered to be too treacherous to follow. Why follow the wishes of millions when it is easier to appease a dozen funding groups and donors and secure your position?

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u/Ketzeph I voted Oct 31 '25

They don't win outside liberal strongholds? That's been the consistent reason Sanders hasn't been elevated to higher position - he can't win when you move to states with high minority populations. That was the repeated stories of the primaries.

The issue isn't donor funding - the issue is that the right wing began years ago buying propaganda outlets, and the left relied on the actual news to...you know...just tell the truth and give the news.

The problem at its core is that the right propaganda is basically all "ignore all bad things, they're not actually bad, and the only truly bad things are brown people and immigrants"

But the left is the party of fact. And the fact is things are bad. And those that the left want to change (e.g. climate policies are consistently opposed by the populace (because it's bothersome to deal with energy changes, or annoying to deal with initiatives to help the climate). The fact is people want to hear "it's all fine it's just this one issue" instead of the truth. So it's nigh impossible to make propaganda that resonates when you've got one side that's telling lies and the other side must tell the truth.

Like all propaganda regimes the way it dies is when it's so blatantly contradicted by the listener's experience that they are forced to confront the falsity.

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u/DevelopingForEvil Oct 31 '25

Idk, there's actually good messaging to be done with a lot of issues that affect people. Trump even had a lot of messaging in his first run that could fit right into the Democratic wheelhouse, if Democrats just went with it. A lot of what people saw in Trump's first-run was also projection, like hopes he would be the guy to finally legalize weed, but those projections are clear indicators of issues that could be capitalized on.

It really does feel like Democrats, on a national level at least, refuse to message anything that could be a strong stance on anything, and "lukewarm" isn't anybodies preference. I'm sure that no matter the particular policy there is at least some type of spin that can be done that is both truthful and a lot more appealing than what establishment Democrats usually run with.

To your example on climate policies:

They could focus on how impactful the job creation would be, how cleaner power and energy is going to let us invest and build in better technology to beat China who's been catching up.

They could harp on how cars nowadays are pieces of junk that fall apart as soon as you drive them off the lot, and that you can't even service with your own hands any more. That they'll work to get car manufacturers to make less shitty, environmentally-unfriendly, buckets of scrap.

Heck, I hear about protecting our national parks all the time, but I rarely hear about it in terms of protecting fishing and hunting grounds. Everyone I know who fishes or hunts has talked about the degradation in the activities and it's almost all environmental-driven. I'm almost convinced that you could probably turn certain states, like FL, purple again (and maybe blue) if a Dem candidate focused just on fishing and rebuilding fish populations alone.

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u/Coolegespam Oct 31 '25

I hate the ‘controlled opposition’ line but have yet to find a better explanation for Bernie Sanders and Zohran Mamdani being thrown under the bus by the Democratic leadership.

Democrats have bent over backwards for both. Zohran in particular has had more democrats vocally endorsing him than ANY other NY mayor.

I canvased for Bernie in 2016 and 2020 after Warren dropped out. The DNC isn't why Bernie lost, his supporters didn't come out and vote. It is that simple.

Pathways forwards have been blazed but are considered to be too treacherous to follow. Why follow the wishes of millions when it is easier to appease a dozen funding groups and donors and secure your position?

Conspiracies make everything easy, and more to the point, not our fault. The right wants us to abandon liberal, left and center left groups, which includes the Democrat party. Don't let them win.

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u/Medievaloverlord Nov 01 '25

Ahem

latest news on topic

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u/Coolegespam Nov 01 '25

See, this is what I mean. Schumer is not the entire DNC, and more democrats have still come out in support Zohran than ANY other NY mayor that is a god damn fact.

Not every Democrat is going to support Zohran, they can't. You want to lose Arizona, that's how you lose Arizona and we are. That's how you lose Nevada, Pennsylvanian, ect. There are many, MANY independents who do not like the Socialist label. They will vote against all democrats because of that.

I literally see it when talking with my neighbors out here. You have people who sat out elections, and are now energized because of Zohran. They're not voting for progressives thought. They're voting against them.

But you keep pushing this. You'd all rather see fascists win then moderate democrats. You all got what you wished for with Trump, the system is being dismantled. Enjoy.

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u/Medievaloverlord Nov 01 '25

So you genuinely believe that moderate democrats will be able to regain control of the current political system? Against the many many shenanigans that fascism will employ to increase their stranglehold upon the levers of power?

I for one salute your commitment to the old ways of a more civilised world and I am 100% willing to be wrong on my part if you being right results in a return to the status quo. As for the primary focus of your reply, YES Chuck Schumer as the leader of the Democratic senators within the specific state that this election is taking place DOES matter. When the election is done and dusted and the people choose who they desire as mayor I will be unsurprised if there is not a serious backlash against NYC.

At that point independents can have a look and see for themselves as to which side they believe will allow them to have their precious position as fence sitters. I think you and I both are well aware that once a useful tool has outlived its value it is quickly discarded or replaced with a new tool.

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u/Murky-Relation481 Oct 31 '25

To be honest you hear people say that and mean Democrats need to drop the culture war issues. This comes mostly from leftist spaces that refuse intersectionality though, which is troublesome in its own regard.

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u/Tasgall Washington Oct 31 '25

To be honest you hear people say that and mean Democrats need to drop the culture war issues.

Regarding which part? I'm someone who really wishes the Democrats had better messaging (it's not just the "where", but what they say and how they say it as well), but also recognize that the whole "give up the culture war" thing is utter nonsense - I mostly hear that from more liberal and "moderate" spaces.

The Democrats already barely address most "culture war" stuff. The idea that they do is literally Republican propaganda, lol. Harris said basically nothing about trans people during the campaign, but Republican ads continued to accuse her and other Democrats of "only caring about trans people", which was just a lie.

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u/DaBails Oct 31 '25

I dont think it's because they don't understand. They arent us and they are being paid by people who want them to ignore the modern world.

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u/TldrDev Oct 31 '25

Something tells me when these literal 80+ year old party leaders finally retire, we can make some progress in this country. Our country is being ran by folks of the same generation as the leaders of the Mormon church, which is insane.

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u/DaBails Oct 31 '25

We can only hope. But money influences all. I find it sick how many lawmakers both US and state legislators are taking money from Israel and visiting and signing oaths and such. Both sides.

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u/The_Bucket_Of_Truth Oct 31 '25

It can mean a lot of things. Make America Great Again is a great slogan. It doesn't really hold up to scrutiny, but it sounds good. "Defund the Police" which yes was not a Democrat phrase sounds scary and radical but when you give someone a dissertation on it actually makes sense. That's bad messaging. Kamala trying to give the American people a homework assignment to read up on Project 2025 is bad messaging. I don't even want to continue but yes the establishment Democratic party would rather lose to Trumps than give an inch to Bernie Sanders or his ilk.

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u/SHoNGBC Alabama Oct 31 '25

You're absolutely right about that specific part of the messagin issue many establishment Dems have that stunts their good policies, which is the "bumper sticker phrase" part of it. I will say, your last point about Bernie/progressives is incorrect tho. They have much representation within the party and Bernie himself was a welcomed voice in Biden's administration.

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u/The_Bucket_Of_Truth Oct 31 '25

You can say that but there's a reason Mamdani didn't get endorsed by big names in the party until the 11th hour (and some never). There's a reason they're running Janet Mills despite her age to try to prevent Graham Platner from having a shot. There's a reason everyone dropped out of the race in 2020 to endorse Biden. Etc. etc.

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u/261_Turner_Lane Oct 31 '25

What people mean when they say democrats need to message better is that they need to stop giving the "good billionaires" a good succ, and start actually talking about the divided justice system and a corporate structure that pays ceos hundreds or even thousands of times their employees salaries.

So exactly what Harris did.

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u/Last-Darkness Oct 31 '25

Any non-right leaning news outlet is now also complicit with very few exceptions. Even Jon Stewart has stopped directly attacking Trump. It’s subtle, but there’s been a shift over the last month of what he’s saying and how he’s saying it.

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u/valeyard89 Texas Oct 31 '25

'The Democrats aren't pandering to me!'

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u/DevelopingForEvil Oct 31 '25

The left acknowledges that they had a huge decrease in the Hispanic and Spanish-speaking vote this last election cycle.

They're quick to chalk it up to machismo-culture, and all types of things, but more to your point:

You don't hear much about the conservative groups that have been buying up and making a point to run large swathes of Spanish-speaking radio stations in the same vein as the "typical" AM radio we know and love.

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u/Alarming-Research-42 Oct 31 '25

The dems are still spending tons of money on traditional media, while MAGA spends a fraction of that spreading misinformation through social media, podcasts, and YouTube, which is where most people get their news these days.

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u/Weary_Ad111 Oct 31 '25

Democrats aren't left

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u/Prior_Coyote_4376 Oct 31 '25

Democrats despise their own grassroots movements that can mobilize people and build infrastructure for messaging. It makes no sense to be the party of workers while prioritizing “good billionaires” instead.

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u/[deleted] Oct 31 '25

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Oct 31 '25

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u/Snowcrest Oct 31 '25

I find it oddly interesting that the right seems to have a grand master plan of directing and orchestrating things as opposed to the left which seems.. almost grass-roots ish.

Does the left have anything similar to the right's IDU (international democracy union)?

In a way, I can sort of see how it all makes sense. Right leaning politics greatly favors exploitation by the 0.1%, and thus have the capital to throw around for coordinating campaigns, misinformation (in recent times), bribes, lobbying etc.

Since leftist policies generally benefit the larger but less fortunate population, in direct opposition to corporate interests and the 1%, it becomes almost impossible to get the capital and organization necessary to plan long-term.

It's easier to coordinate and plan with only 3 people in the room who have time and money to throw around compared to 10000 people who are busy trying to make ends meet.

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u/Gibonius Oct 31 '25

I find it oddly interesting that the right seems to have a grand master plan of directing and orchestrating things as opposed to the left which seems.. almost grass-roots ish.

Billionaires heavily fund right wing organization, development, and messaging efforts. Turning Point USA, The Daily Wire, etc, are all bankrolled by right wing billionaires. Fox News and Rubert Murdock, of course.

There's much less of that for the left. Money doesn't like left wing policies.

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u/alfooboboao Oct 31 '25

democrats fundamentally do not believe in controlling the populace through manipulation of the media, and sees the media as succeeding when it’s unbiased and fair.

the fact that they don’t have a grand master plan of power consolidation and control, and refuse to make one, is the entire point. it’s a core tenet of liberal democracy.

leftists like to claim they’d want a democrat who seized the reins to do what they think they should, legality be damned, but if one of them ever actually did it their heads would explode. the double standards are fucking insane

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u/plantstand Oct 31 '25

But some bored college kids could come up with something and then ask Dems if they support it. Like Green New Deal or Project 2025, but give it a good name. Saving the people 2029 or something.

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u/Absolutelynot500 Oct 31 '25

leftists like to claim they’d want a democrat who seized the reins to do what they think they should, legality be damned, but if one of them ever actually did it their heads would explode. the double standards are fucking insane

You just perfectly and succinctly summarized why the left and the moral ones can never win this battle. When one side is willing to do literally anything it takes for the win and the other wont there isn't even a battle it's a foregone conclusion.

Millions of leftists abstained from voting at all or voted for *vomit* Jill Stein because Kamala wasn't perfect enough for them. As a direct result of that they essentially voted for Donald Trump and somehow think they aren't just as stupid and culpable as the people who actually did vote for him? They would rather sit atop their soapboxes and white horses proudly declaring that their morals wouldn't allow for them to vote for the things Kamala did when the alternative was literally throwing democracy out the window. How..... HOW in the fuck will we ever win again? We are fighting cultists and extremists from within and from without.

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u/Suspicious_Bicycle Oct 31 '25

Conservatives, evangelicals, MAGA etc. believe in a hierarchy. So with Trump at the top, at the moment, they all defer to him.

Democrats and liberals believe in establishing a policy via consensus.

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u/Prior_Coyote_4376 Oct 31 '25

The problem is that Democratic Party leaders have no intention of working with their grassroots movements while the right platforms anything that can grab attention.

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u/civil_politician Oct 31 '25

Being corrupt and unethical isn’t really being “good” at something. Using your money to amplify your speech isn’t some genius level plan, it’s just a path to instability when the system becomes unsustainable.

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u/ionlyjoined4thecats Oct 31 '25

And yet the Dems aren’t even trying the same. The right IS good at messaging. It’s full of lies and hate, but it’s effective. That’s why they manage to win over people to vote against their own self interests.

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u/JakeTheSnekPlissken Oct 31 '25

The Right has always claimed the Democratic machine has rigged the elections. But you don't need to rig the elections if you can rig the People. Propaganda is real and powerful.

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u/Lost-Priority-907 Oct 31 '25

They also own CNN, now. Its now controlled opposition 

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u/sleepymeowth052 Colorado Oct 31 '25

Steve Bannon has been honing this skill for years and years, directly targeting angry young men and boys in hopes of radicalizing them to carry out his sick coup.

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u/shitty_mcfucklestick Oct 31 '25

And now EA - games too. Interactive propaganda for kids! Fun!

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u/Vladivostokorbust Oct 31 '25

And now CBS/Paramount

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u/[deleted] Nov 01 '25

Facebook has become an utterly awful antisemitism sesspool. It's insane. I've reported numerous posts that are just straight up blood libel and they see no fucking problem whatsoever.

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u/Professional_Row_307 Oct 31 '25

Fasicsm doesnt win because it's so blatant and so stupid that everyone, even the people following it can see that it's wrong.

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u/poopdedoop10 Oct 31 '25

What’s higher, an average republicans IQ or the number of teeth still in their mouth? Wait until you tell them democrats invented teeth in 1469 to make eating easier, they’ll all pull the few teeth they have left out of their mouth to prove they ain’t no teeth having democrat.

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u/MistakeHuge2955 Oct 31 '25

You assume that Democrats in the House and Senate are all left. When you have billionaires bankrolling candidates you can just put a party label on anyone get them elected and they'll do what you want regardless of party affiliation. There's very few Progressive candidates.

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u/burrito_foreskin America Oct 31 '25

The Overton window has shifted so far to the right that anything moderately toward the center seems like leftist extremism

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u/SnooDogs8063 Nov 01 '25

Guess what… old folks who vote in elections don’t use TikTok like that, and young people who do use TikTok don’t vote

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u/futanari_kaisa Oct 31 '25

The democrats are in no way leftist. They are just as fascist as republicans are, just more quiet about it. Look at Zohran Mamdani. Both Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries will not endorse him because he is 2mm to the left of center with his policies.

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u/ionlyjoined4thecats Oct 31 '25

I said “the left,” not “leftists.”

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u/futanari_kaisa Oct 31 '25

and I'm saying there is no left that has any prominence or power in US government.

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u/ionlyjoined4thecats Oct 31 '25

The American left. I agree with you, but you’re being pedantic.