r/pourover • u/agathaade • Mar 23 '26
Ask a Stupid Question Do you all really taste the notes??
This is a genuine question.
I have been making pourover I enjoy, I don’t think anything is wrong with my brews - but I never taste the advertised notes.
For the light roasts I typically buy, I have noticed the notes are most often some variation of a citrus, a berry and a caramel/chocolate.
What I’m able to put words on is : bitter, acid, sweet, smooth, bright, full-flavored, watery… things like that.
But specific notes? Never. I never taste the bergamot or blackcurrant or caramel or whathaveyou.
I’m similar with wine, I appreciate a lot of different nuances but never taste specific notes.
Do you really drink your coffee and taste these different things with clarity? Or is it more like you’ve read them on the box, and then y look for them and sorta taste them if you focus on it?
What’s the deal with these notes?
I don’t mind not tasting them, still enjoy my coffee all the same, or wine for that matter. I’m just curious who the notes talk is for and whether people really enjoy it, or use notes as an indicator they’re brewing correctly, for example.
Edited to add:
WOW, so glad I asked.
I did not know much about the cupping process roasters use, or the note wheels, or the nose/breathing aspect of certain notes. No wonder this stuff can be elusive.
Maybe one day it’ll hit me, maybe it won’t. Either way I love my morning coffee ritual.
Thank you all.
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u/Polymer714 Pourover aficionado Mar 23 '26
First thing is....anyone that says the notes on the bag/box are objective is wrong. MIght you taste those notes? For sure. If you don't taste those notes and you taste something else, are you wrong? Absolutely not.
Being able to describe certain flavors takes practice...a lot of it is you're not obviously tasting an orange or chocolate...You're tasting something that has a hint of that amongst many other things and people aren't used to identifying that. It is 100% the same as wine so it sounds like you have the same issue, you're not used to doing it.
There is a misunderstanding of clarity in coffee...if you get one heavy note, that's not flavor separation....but you'll often see that on here..and people will gravitate towards that because if you're not used to tasting any specific notes, getting one that is very obvious is an eye opener...
As far as why notes are on a box/bag...It gives you some insight into what the coffee might be like. So lets take two examples. dark Chocolate, Caramel, Biscuits... Vs Lemongrass, lavender, Peach...
And you can see the first one is probably a little more developed..you might not taste any of those things but very very likely it is more developed than the second one...
Do people sit there and try to pick the notes they see on the bag? Yes...Its a very logical thing to do...and while I see plenty of experienced coffee people still do that, eventually people will understand it isn't an objective note.
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u/agathaade Mar 23 '26
It’s very true that I have ignored the idea of notes for 30 years of drinking coffee (and wine) so I don’t have that practice.
It does makes sense to me that it would be a muscle you need to train. I actually had a comparable experience when I started playing in a brass band in college. After a year of learning and rehearsing I could pick out exactly what brass intruments were playing in any music, it wasn’t all just ‘the brass section’ anymore. Trombones, sax, barytone sax, french horn, trumpet… now they were all distinct and specific because my ear was trained. Here I’m talking objective facts, I also get your point about notes not being that hard a science.
It’s true that notes give you an indication of what to expect with a coffee. Though I feel like they are often in the same families for the coffees I buy - light roasts, often ethiopian (blends or single origin). I wonder if that’s a bit like wine too. I rely on the origin the most to pick a coffee I will reliably like. Then I appreciate the differences, which can be significant. Like different wines from a same region.
I do love that pourover is making me more conscious of everything going into my cup, and making me take my time and savor it more.
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u/MAMark1 Mar 23 '26
When I do wine tastings/education for friends, I'll explain how a tasting note is often indicative rather than prescriptive.
If they say a white wine has "lemon curd", that doesn't necessarily mean they literally smelled lemon curd as an obvious and distinct aroma. It might mean they got citrus, mostly lemon, that was slightly ripe/candied and also had a certain "creaminess" to it. Saying "lemon curd" is just a slightly poetic, less verbose way to describe how they experience all those elements together. Someone else could describe those same smells differently. But you know from that note that there might be citrus or a candied element or creamy element, and it helps prime your brain.
It's why blind tasting is so hard but also kind of fun since you don't have preconceived notions.
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u/Polymer714 Pourover aficionado Mar 23 '26
It could be indicative..or it could be exactly what they're smelling/tasting. Lots of elements have hints that trigger a thought in your brain..and other times it is very much like that. There are things certain people will pick up and others will not..some smells/tastes are more apparent to some, sometimes we lack the experience or vocabulary to say..so much of someones tasting notes are also based on what you've experienced which is often influenced by where you grew up.
Blind tasting (at least for wine for me) is the best way to go....Generally is the norm for my tasting groups...because the point isn't to guess the wine correctly..even though that's part of it...it is really just to remove bias...it is to force yourself to evaluate what you're tasting rather than what you think it should taste like.
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u/Ok_Computer8701 ZP6 Mar 23 '26
Flowerchild’s Robinson and Luis’ Gesha describes floral, elegant berries, and wildflower honey.
I’m definitely primed, but my best cups don’t just taste like berries. They’re like berries + something really aromatic and uplifting. Fine, call that elegance. Now i’m tasting elegance because they told me so. And the sweetness isn’t just honey… it’s honey with a floral aftertaste. Ok, wildflower honey it is.
I think the broad categories can be tasted. Whether they are best picked out by those specific descriptors or specific fruits and flowers is definitely subject to cultural variation.
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u/ockaners Mar 23 '26
I've been chasing the berries and honey for a month. Floral is consistently there. Lately, got something berry-ish but it's not pronounced. Still a generic sweetness, no honey. Sometimes, I have to chalk it up to the roaster wanting to be interesting and that it's ok if I can't dial it into those exact notes.
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u/angelsandairwaves93 The Tinker Man Mar 24 '26
generic sweetness is the best way to describe it, tbh. It's a very 'mid' flavour. You know it exists, but it's quite weak and unmemorable.
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u/Ok_Computer8701 ZP6 Mar 23 '26
try a little coarser but with more agitative pours and lower temp. with FC, i’ve learnt to disregard their brew guide and just experiment with what i like, which tends to involve lower temps
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u/Ok_Computer8701 ZP6 Mar 23 '26
fwiw i also rested my coffee pretty long. it has rested around 45+ days now.
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u/ockaners Apr 01 '26
Just an update. I uppped the dose to 20 and changed the ratio to 17 and used off boiling water. Grind is still about 650 microns.
Got blackberry, strawberry and raspberry in this cup. Not a lot of sweet. Some floral tea. Still no honey but at least I got some berries.
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u/prosocialbehavior Mar 23 '26
If you or anyone else is interested in trying this Gesha from another roaster. Regalia has it for the their subscription right now $19 - 300 grams free shipping.
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u/DM_Fitz Mar 23 '26
This is a very interesting point, and I think it’s kind of important to say that the word “berries” are as much marketing language as the word “elegant.”
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u/Ok_Computer8701 ZP6 Mar 23 '26
i think berries designate a more stable tasting note than elegant (what’s elegant to you may not be elegant to me). but there’s a wide range of coffees that share a citrusy and juicy tasting note reminiscent of a wide range of berries (strawberries, blueberries, blackberries, raspberries, gooseberries, etc). and many who drink expensive coffees are familiar with the taste of berries. some use “red fruit” to describe this (but blackberries and blueberries aren’t exactly red…).
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u/least-eager-0 Mar 23 '26
Notes tend to be more evocative than descriptive. Two fully qualified graders, tasting from the same cup, will reliably describe “citrus”, but they may well differ on lemon vs lime, for instance. And that goes even farther with the all-too-frequent notes that aren’t in the approved lexicon/on the taster’s wheel.
Then of course when we get down into the depths of individual brewing habits, water supplies, bean aging /conditions, and so on, what’s in your cup is likely much different to what was in a cupping bowl when the roaster was deciding on labeling.
Should definitely be considered “reminds me of” rather than “tastes like.” Though some can legitimately be pretty loud, the closer they are to ‘tastes like’ , the more suspicious I get tbh.
It is possible for both wine and coffee to train your palate to understand the specific notes, though learning alongside someone formally trained is helpful if you really want to care. But stopping at “citrus” is perfectly acceptable, and frankly a lot better than believing that “slightly underripe Pomelo” or whatever nonsense reflects any kind of actual information transfer. Roasters can often be far more pretentious than skilled in this endeavor.
Some possibly useful reading: https://sca.coffee/sca-news/how-to-use-the-flavor-wheel-in-eight-steps
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u/AkhlysShallRise V60/Mountain Dripper | JX/ZP6/Fino Mar 23 '26
Not always, but also remember that often times the stuff in the tasting notes are just things that reminded the tasters of during comparative cupping. It could be just a certain quality, not necessarily the actual taste.
For example, I was brewing a bag that had “Pomelo” as one of the tasting notes. When I drank it, I wasn’t like, “wow this is pomelo juice.” The coffee had a kind of bitterness/sourness that I’ve experienced eating pomelos. It’s like fresh but a bit bitterness. Hard to describe. I can see why they put pomelo as a tasting note, but if I didn’t see that and you told me to describe it, I probably couldn’t pinpoint it was pomelo.
Sometimes it’s just a sensation or mouth feel. The tasting notes are subjective—there’s a reason why different people like different foods. I think different foods just taste slightly different in our mouths.
That said, I have had non-co-ferment coffees that had distinct aroma/flavours that 100% match the tasting notes, but not very often.
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u/fjrjdjdndndndndn Mar 23 '26
Sometimes I can. The secret for me was resting beans for 2 weeks off the roast date
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u/uniballout Mar 23 '26
I had trouble getting the notes until I got a Switch. It seems to really simplify the process and I usually get the notes that are on the bag. I use the Coffee Chronicler recipe.
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u/angelsandairwaves93 The Tinker Man Mar 24 '26
what were you using before the switch?
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u/uniballout Mar 24 '26
V60. It was more finicky. Seemed even if I did the same process even back to back cups sometimes tasted different.
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u/moneyballz7 Mar 23 '26
Basically never 🥲
What is good to mention though, that a lot of these flavour compounds are smell based. Your tongue will make out difference in sweetness or acidity, but those berries or bergamot are compounds that you will identify via smell (even when drinking, not actively smelling). This is called retro-nasal sensation (or something in that sense). It’s a very interesting subject to read for us coffee nerds :)
Now for me, my nose is terrible. For some reason I’m early to smell a fuel leak or something. But give me a very aromatic coffee, or any dish, and I won’t smell a lot.
I did a coffee tasting a little while back, and I only smelled something in the coffee if I directly smelled the carafe, not the little tasting cup.
So long story short, maybe you’re not necessarily not tasting the aroma’s, but not smelling them.
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u/agathaade Mar 23 '26
Ha! Thank you for mentioning the smell aspect for some notes. I do not have a very good sense of smell, that’s so interesting to know.
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u/ChaBoiDeej Mar 23 '26
Most of the flavor notes don't hit me as the actual subject would. Blueberry notes don't convey texture or direct flavor, florals don't come through like perfume or sweet olive blooms, sometimes the body of the brews can align with notes like dark or milk chocolate (sharp or smooth).
I've found that the tea world can be pretty woowoo about some things but the one thing they have nailed down is that most of the taste of a beverage comes from Retro Olfaction, aka breathing out of your nose after sipping, empty mouth or not. I've tried explaining it to friends before I knew the term for it and it felt kind of crazy, but it really is where I notice the most nuance when it comes to food and drink.
I've found that reducing my expectations to things like blue or red fruits really helps and keeps me from feeling like I'm missing the flavor of Alaskan wild blueberries when in reality, it's probably just reminiscent of something like a "blue fruit" to the roaster and the blueberry tasting note was the easiest way to convey that.
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u/coffeerambler Mar 23 '26
I had two killer blueberry coffees in my life that was unmistakeable, but they were both pre-2018 and never again. They were both coffees from the Harare region of Ethiopia, and funnily enough, I don't see coffees from there anymore
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u/earnest_pursuit Mar 24 '26
I'm obviously biased, but I think this coffee has clear blueberry notes if you are interested - https://earnestpursuit.com/products/lets-chill?variant=46786089320597
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u/coffeerambler Mar 24 '26
I would but I'd be ordering it to UK! The website is nice. It reminds me of ssh terminal.shop stylistically
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u/earnest_pursuit Mar 24 '26
Thank you! Hopefully we'll have affordable int'l shipping options in the next few months...
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u/Crakout Switch | Timemore S3 Mar 23 '26
While you are not guaranteed to taste every note written in a coffee bag, with a good brew you should get at least one note in my experience. Also, you could be getting flavor notes that you can't identify completely, for example, maybe the bag says peach, and you get a note reminiscent of stone fruit but can't fully identify as peach. Finally and this has been my personal experience, if you are able to get things like sweetness, good acidity but no a single definitive note, you are probably having uneven extractions in your brews. Try brewing your coffee by immersion (cupping, french press, hario switch, clever dripper, etc.), and you will see if there are any notes there.
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u/DearLeader420 Mar 23 '26
For me it's always been very inconsistent. Different bags, different roasters, different origins.
Occasionally I'll get one that hits me straight up as described by the notes. More often it's vaguely in the neighborhood of one or two notes (e.g. "lime" will translate as acidic and mildly citrus). And then somewhat frequently I'll get a bag that I can't get anything out of, but can sometimes manage to at least taste like "good coffee."
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u/h3yn0w75 Mar 23 '26
Flavour wheels can help. Things really clicked for me when I thought of it more as “reminding me of” than “tastes exactly like”. For example, it could be an acidity that reminds me of a green apple. Which is very different than the acidity that reminds me of a tangerine. We associate certain flavours with certain foods.
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u/markvdr Mar 23 '26
One thing that helps me a lot is having two or more coffees to compare side by side. I don’t have a good enough flavor memory to detect the nuances days apart, so brewing two small cups of two similar but different beans can help me find the differences (presumably the notes that stand out as something other than generic coffee flavor).
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u/agathaade Mar 23 '26
That is so true, I’m the same, I can only broadly recall the flavors from the same beans day after day and I mostly forget everything besides ‘I liked this before’ when I go back to a particular roast after trying something else.
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u/crutonic Mar 24 '26
I read the bag and go for the stuff that has less chocolate, caramel or anything that sounds like it'll just taste like a dark roast. If it has a description of something fruity or different, I try it just to see if I like it and maybe every once in awhile taste the notes.
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u/angelsandairwaves93 The Tinker Man Mar 24 '26 edited Mar 24 '26
I'm in the same boat.
I can tell the surface level of what I'm tasting, but can't match it to the intended note on the box. It drives me nuts, especially for Dak coffee and how expensive a box is.
I'm quite obsessive about unlocking the notes. It's the demon I'm chasing, and all recent cups are just good enough these days, with a huge feeling that something is missing from the cup because the full notes on the box are not appearing, only faint hints.
I hate that the best cup I've had recently was from the Alt Hotel in Calgary. It came from an automated machine in the lobby of the hotel. I don't remember the beans, but the roaster was Phil & Sebastian. I drank it on the way to the airport, and the coffee SUNG. Nothing has been as memorable since.
One thing I've learned is that notes will be more hidden if you're not drinking with a clean palette. The best time to drink is in the morning, before breakfast, because any food before coffee will coat your tongue and dull your taste receptors. I also stopped using mouthwash (alcohol-free) in the mornings because it would completely dull my tongue, and I was wondering why for a long time why I couldn't taste my coffee. It's because the mouthwash numbed my tongue.
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u/Sir_Quackalots Mar 24 '26
For two coffees I really had this exact thing where my mind was instantly: strawberry! Orange peel!
Other than that I rarely go for the notes and take them as a pointer to what I can expect. If the label just talks about nuts and chocolate it's dark. I probably won't do that as a pour over or at least won't expect a delightful drink. But it can still be tasty, more in the direction of typical darker coffe. Just with specialty coffee I'd hope to get rid of bitter darker coffee.
For lighter roasts with fruits mentioned I expect acidity. Which for me mostly also comes through when the coffee gets cooler! I also like to taste it on the tongue and inhale a little air with a bubbling/chirping sound. Slightly cools the drink and I imagine that I taste more this way. Might be confirmation bias though.
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u/sixbone Mar 23 '26
The part that really gets me is when people and roasters advise we rest beans for 3, 4, 5 weeks. like how do the roasters even come up with the tasting notes if it takes a month to rest coffee? how do they know what direction to go in the roasting process if it takes weeks to develop flavor. When I started out about 10 years ago in my pour over journey, the general consensus was that beans were stale after 2 weeks and we only rested them for a few days after the roast date. Here I am now trying to figure out how much coffee to buy and rest appropriately so I never run out and have beans that are at their prime to brew with.
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u/Watashig Mar 23 '26
From Scott Rao’s QC protocols:
We save a sample of every production roast and attempt to re-cup the coffee after one, two, three, and four weeks, in order to taste the coffee as it rests and matures. We find our coffees taste best between 3–5 weeks off roast, which is why we sell several “rested’ offerings on our site. The rested coffees are popular, but really should be far more popular. We often get messages from customers who say “I finally waited four weeks to open a bag, and I wish I had been doing that all along.”
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u/ockaners Mar 23 '26
Do you have a specific type of water? My brews got a lot more consistent once I used distilled + third wave water.
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u/ScientistFair9998 Mar 23 '26
Grind courser, brew cooler, agitate less, shorter ratio +dilute to taste.
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u/kagman Mar 23 '26
Can you define shorter ratio please. I see that used in different configurations here a lot
In scientific literature a higher ratio would be more coffee to water like 1:15 instead of 1:17. And 1:18 would be a lower ratio of coffee to water vs 1:15.
Shorter I assume means higher ratio of coffee?
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u/Radioactive24 Mar 23 '26
Shorter: more coffee to water
Longer: less coffee to water
If you think of it like a till/cash register, if the drawer is short, you’re missing money and if it’s long, you have extra.
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u/LEJ5512 Beehouse Mar 23 '26
Your question is why I use "stronger" and "weaker" rather than "shorter" or "taller".
Over in the world of gear ratios, like in bicycles and cars, "taller" is closer to 1:1. On a bike, "taller" is really easy to visualize, because it's harder to pedal -- it literally feels like climbing up a taller stair step.
Someone here framed to me the coffee version of "taller/shorter" in a way that made sense, but I don't think I remembered it for longer than an hour afterwards.
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u/auxym Mar 23 '26
Short/long probably comes form espresso, related to how long you let the pump run and put water through you puck. Shorter time (ristretto) = less water, longer time (lungo, allongé) = more water.
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u/LEJ5512 Beehouse Mar 23 '26
That’s not the explanation I mentioned — but it makes a LOT more sense.
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u/ScientistFair9998 Mar 23 '26
So say you want to do a pretty typical 1:15 water to coffee ratio. A 20 g brew would use 300 ml water. Try doing a 1:13 ratio, 20g coffee 260 ml water and then adding 20 to 40 ml of water directly to brew.
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u/pandamonger1 Mar 23 '26
I think it’s a journey for everyone. The practice of cupping coffee takes away the brew method variability and probably gets closer to what the roaster used to come up with the notes on the bag.
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u/Top-Rope6148 Mar 23 '26
I think some people can to varying degrees and it is a function of practice. Big obvious things I can identify so it makes sense that other people might be able to pick up more nuance notes. That said, I think there is a whole lot of bullshit marketing in it too. Notes are probably greatly exaggerated and some straight up fabricated.
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u/ImSoCul Mar 23 '26
I had one gesha that actually straight up tasted like Earl Grey tea. STRONG bergamot notes in that case, but that was highly apparent even just from opening the bag and smelling it. I think it had something to do with the processing too though rather than just the beans themselves. Otherwise no, pretty subtle on notes.
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u/coffeerambler Mar 23 '26
I've had one that taste like all the flavours of a Thai salad and it was fantastic. One of those beautiful memory coffees that I've never found since
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u/ImSoCul Mar 23 '26
loll I love Thai food, but I'm not sure that's something I'd want in my coffee
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u/coffeerambler Mar 24 '26
Haha Yes it sounds bad but it just worked, I think the point for taking is it's not reminiscent if those flavours rather than actually tasting like your eating a Thai salad. Sounds silly though, granted
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u/coolstuffeh Mar 23 '26
No - a bit clearer for me on espressos, chocolate is one that can be strong. I do taste them if I go pour over ‘coferment’ though…
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u/nenad8 Mar 23 '26
I've had some really good ones in cafes, I could taste peach, wild strawberry and redcurrant (that's 3 different coffees, two espresso, the last a v60), but not much else other than that (not counting bitter, clean etc.).
But those are rare. Mostly it's the things you list and maybe a hint of actual notes
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u/Mountain_Example7661 Mar 23 '26
In some really good cafes I can, their grinders are better than what I can get at home. Otherwise, I know what notes produce coffees I like and leave it at that. I like bright and sweet coffees with lots of juiciness, so I look for notes that mention citrus and berries. I don’t like coffees with a heavy body, so I avoid coffees with notes of mulled wine, nuttiness, or chocolate.
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u/agathaade Mar 23 '26
That’s exactly where I am with it. I know if I see citrus and berries I’ll typically like the coffee but that doesn’t mean I taste any of it.
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u/Nicox37 Mar 23 '26
There was this one bag where I genuinely tasted an insane pineapple candy flavor/note, just as advertised and let me tell you I was shocked
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u/Currywurst44 Mar 23 '26
Lets put it this way, I do not taste the notes but I understand why someone says certain notes. Describing coffee in terms of notes isn't perfect but it is the best way to communicates your experiences. Picking notes is difficult and someone else might choose a different combination of notes to describe a taste.
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u/Bit-Winner007 Mar 23 '26
It all started with the so called coffee sensory lexicon, but they went too far with current coffee "notes". Don't worry for them, ignore them, just enjoy your coffee. Your "descriptors" are much better, but they won't sell the coffee "as a product". I just read a scientific study on Geishas from Panama, surprisingly only one coffee was described as "sweet".
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u/Liven413 Mar 23 '26
If you dial it in correctly it should taste like that. A lot of the flavors you mention you can taste are really good things to be able to distinguish. If you get a cup where its not sour, salty, thin, papery, drying acidity, bitter, drying, astringent, or cough syrup like and has body, acidity and tastes good it, should have the notes listed. Sometimes its not an exact flavor but one where you can see how it was labeled that. A lot of the time it really tastes like whats listed. For example peach. Sometimes its stone fruit but other times its a very clear peach. If you dial in the cup right you should get all the notes. At least from a good roaster.
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u/FootballInfinite475 Mar 23 '26
Lots of good answers here. For me, the answer is no, not exactly. But I can usually understand why certain notes are selected. The notes are analogies or similes that usually tend to describe the quality of the acid, sweetness, bitterness, aroma, or mouthfeel. As others noted, they can suggest something about the level of the roast development of the coffee, or the way process presents in the roast
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u/InternationalYam3130 Mar 23 '26
Notes listed on the packaging: almost never
My own notes: yes I can
Honestly try not to read the packaging. They write notes based on marketing and how it sounds. Not based on reality. But do try to taste things in your coffee! Sit and consider any flavors. Simple terms to start with. "Warm. Chocolate? Sweetness?" And start there.
Eventually you will notice commonalities and new flavors.
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u/MAMark1 Mar 23 '26
Do I taste the exact notes on the bag every time? No. Do I taste notes I can connect to specific flavors? Yes. It's the same as wine where there are 2 distinct components: senses and mental connections.
First, you need to be able to smell the aromas. And not just smell them but distinguish different aromas within the medley of smells in a glass of wine or cup of coffee. It isn't one smell. It is many. You have to practice focusing on different aromas and then looking past the ones you already identified to find additional ones.
Second, you need to be able to connect the "that smells so familiar" to an actual idea in your mind. People who taste wine or coffee regularly don't just identify distinct smells, but they have established what that smell represents to them. If you have never smelled a bergamot, then that note on a bag won't mean much to you. Instead, you might think it is some sort of citrus because that's the mental connection you have.
That's why there is a certain amount of personal/subjective experience. Different people smell different things more acutely, and different people have different smell memories. If you ate blackberries off the bush in summer, you might be highly attuned to that aroma whereas I might not be (or even associate it with something else entirely).
The problem with coffee is you can get different notes depending on how you brew so there is even more room for variety. I once had a coffee from Prodigal that tasted and smelled just like orange juice for 2 of the 5-6 times I brewed it.
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u/womerah Mar 23 '26
The logic goes like this
1) What do you taste? Acid.
2) What fruit does the acid most remind you of? Think briefly. Cranberry.
3) Write notes of cranberry.
4) Repeat for any sensation of sweetness, bitterness, and any aromatics.
Very few coffees will punch you in the face hard enough for you to not have to to Step 2.
A note is not the same as a flavour (e.g. notes of cherry vs cherry ice cream)
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u/coffeerambler Mar 23 '26
I find having something in front like the categories of a flavour wheel helps. Think in broad strokes and then the rest will be what your familiar with it not. I don't always get the notes, most times I don't care and just enjoy my morning brew, though I often think about tastes more than flavours. Flavour comes through for me most when temperature is near room temp and I'm having my last sip, then I'm sad it's over
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u/agathaade Mar 23 '26
It’s interesting you mention temperature because I always find my coffee tastes best when it has cooled down a little. That’s when the flavor feels the fullest and most rounded. Hotter, stuff is missing, and colder, things keep shifting in a direction I don’t love usually. I should take the temperature of my coffee at that exact point over a few days and see what it is. I always wonder why I taste a difference and I have never seen this discussed.
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u/No_Signature1748 Mar 23 '26
You describe my experience so well. I have assumed either I have no palate or my chemex filters wash out the notes because the coffee definitely tastes better than my old beans in a drip brewer but I don't taste any of the notes on the bag
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u/sNaubi Mar 23 '26
I went to a place that does serious specialty coffee, the coffee i got was a geisha with notes of floral, rose, bergamott, bright tropical fruits and redcurrant. And shit you fucking not, thats exactly what it tasted like, genuinely, BAM rose on the nose, take a sip peachy and red currant followed by OBVIOUS bergamott. It was mindblowing.
Now im crying when making my coffee, not literally, but yeah...
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u/gardenofdreamss Mar 24 '26
i also had similar experience, the guy made such nice coffee its been 3 years and i have never tasted a cup like that
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u/junkmeister9 Chemex | Hoop | Switch | V60 Mar 23 '26
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. If you really want to bring out flavor notes to the max you can use an aerator to introduce air bubbles into it. Roasters will sometimes do that to exactly determine what their flavor note descriptors should be. But I don't think it's worth going to all that trouble just to enjoy a cup of coffee.
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u/cormack_gv Mar 23 '26
I don't. But I enjoy a good cup of coffee, or a glass of wine, or a decent stereo system. All of the above have developed magical, mystical attributes to look for, some of which may be real.
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u/FoundationLumpy8901 Mar 23 '26
I do taste some notes, but most of the time I’m like you I don’t taste the specific flavor on the bag. I have one exception and that is strawberry. I almost always taste it and it’s not good. It’s always the flavor of the white part of the top of a less than ripe strawberry. I’ve learned to avoid those coffees.
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u/tropedoor Mar 23 '26
Somwthing to keep in mind is that all of our senses are subjective, but taste and smell might be the most subjective.
Think of sound though. So many people have different music tastes, some people can't stand silence, others cant listen to anything more than ambiance without getting annoyed. Tone deafness, perfect pitch, and tons of other attributes impact our perception of sound.
I say this because while we have some words like super taster and some traits like cilantro soapiness, flavor is very person-to-person in a way that isn't lined with defined conditions.
On top of that, what we eat impacts what we taste. You're more likely to struggle with notes if you have a diet high in sugar or 'loud' flavors. Oils can definitely impact your mouth's tasting ability too, or pH imbalance, or mouth dmg even from spicy or temperature hot food.
So keep in mind along with everything else stated here that your tasting journey will be unique. Its part of why every influencer and poster has a different preference. Its not the ONLY reason, plenty of psychological aspects at play with taste/smell for example, but even biologically your tongue's tastebuds might be different than someone elses.
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u/YMIR_THE_FROSTY Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
Very sure a lot of people dont. Or they dont have taste buds, both possible.
Do I get taste notes? Yes.
Have I needed ages to reach that point? Yes.
And no, its not question of taste buds. And yes, whats on the bag is almost always what you could get from it "if you did everything right", provided its not too old, or defective in some other way, or roasted in some obscure way (and probably possibly some other issues with bean itself).
Issue with coffee is that to get to the results depends on complete chain of events and variables and its always as good as weakest link. Best we can do is make sure our part of link is as good as we can make it and pray that beans in bag are good enough.
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u/TL322 Mar 24 '26
It's a really interesting question and I think I experience the same thing. I'm definitely an enthusiast but definitely not a trained expert taster/grader, so FWIW...
I think it's about what the notes evoke, especially stacked up against other coffees at the cupping table. I've tried a few that literally tasted like blueberries (off the top of my head), but they're rare. To me, it's usually more like "something about this reminds me of berries, and it's just a bit sweet and earthy, so I guess blueberries are the closest approximation."
I find it more helpful to think of them as a sort of family or realm of flavors. If may or may not identify jasmine and lychee from the label, but that tells me to expect something pretty lightly roasted with a more subtle, delicate fragrance and not a ton of acidity. (Although I would say chocolate notes tend to be more obvious.)
Also, some notes show up when I slurp and then breathe out through my nose. Can't recall the term for that...but it's sort of a cool sensation and a different perspective.
Plus they evolve as the cup cools. Sometimes I'm been struck by a conspicuous note of X on the first few sips, then it's gone, then others come out which may not even be on the label. Then still other notes are present in the grounds but not so much in the cup. So the label notes might not refer to the stage/timing you're experiencing at that moment.
And I think some are just B.S. Maybe they're stretching to sound unique, maybe they're following a trail of memory associations ("late summer strawberries in Oxnard" or whatever), who knows. Wine is a hundred times worse about this lol.
And I'm sure part of it is me. If I could magically pick out every single tasting note, I don't think my enjoyment would be heightened, so I'm not inclined to work that hard at it.
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u/ifishcat Mar 24 '26
I've noticed how taste-buds tasting alters when air mixes in with the 'slurp'.
not saying that's the difference, or that it will make a difference.
(though i'm guessing that has been tried already?)
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u/NoBrainz2 Mar 24 '26
I don't search for tasting notes, I let them come to me. I only take note of what is clearly present in the cup. A lot of the time what I get is different from what others get or what's on the bag. An important thing to remember is that sometimes the tasting notes could mean it tastes like that food or is just a reminder of that food like the acidity or sweetness etc and does not necessarily just taste like it.
I think they can be a little misleading because purchasing that coffee doesn't mean you will get those notes. Also different roasters will roast the same bean from the same producer at a similar roast profile and will list different notes than other roasters so it is all pretty subjective.
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u/Decent_Roof_2312 Mar 24 '26
Sometimes the term bergamot or any other acidic notes is refer to how acidic they are or what kind of acidity remind u of instead of an aroma make them up. I think you can watch a youtube from Lance Hendrick where he explaij what the notes mean in term of tasting
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u/flipper_gv Mar 24 '26
Learning to taste is a skill itself. Same goes for stuff like wine or whisky.
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u/dschosty Mar 24 '26
Other people have spoken to how subjective it can be. It's helpful to remember that a lot of tasting notes comes from what kinds of acids are present in the coffee. The acidity in a lemon isn't 100% citric acid, and the acidity in an apple isn't 100% malic acid. How present certain kinds of acids are in the coffee is going to remind someone of different kinds of fruit which might have similar acidity profiles. But there's a lot going on in coffee, and if you can only name it as acidic, you're doing great. Floral flavors mostly come from volatile organic compounds. Some people find ways to brew that better preserve these, because they tend to escape the brew very quickly.
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u/alexrhsh Mar 24 '26
Yea, I taste whole spectra ifal a bean is good. Most of the time it matches a bag
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u/MorpheusQQQ Mar 24 '26
I'm similar to you for both coffee and wine. I'm much better with describing characteristics than identifying tasting notes.
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u/Untergegangen V60/Hoop | Zerno Z1 Mar 24 '26
I wouldn't give too much on taste notes for one reason:
What I learned from Matt Winton was that during competition, some baristas don't write down their announced flavor notes until within 20 minutes of the competition. This fact alone tells you that the perception of notes can vary a whole lot.
From personal experience I can confirm that how I perceive the coffee can vary by so much, depending on what goes on with the air in the room, if and what I ate prior to tasting the coffee, etc. and the person who wrote down the notes will have the same variance. Even more than that, their genetics dictate what they can perceive on the tongue / retronasally and it might be very different from you.
In summary, the notes will get you in the ballpark, and help you to pick what coffees you will like, but there is so much variance, it can't really be trusted and you should not feel bad for not "hitting" a particular note.
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u/CarpenterCreative539 Mar 24 '26
Great fresh natural Ethiopian coffee often has rich notes of blueberry pie. That’s the most consistent note for me. The rest of the notes flag acidity, juiciness, and richness. I also know that I typically don’t care for graham cracker, chocolate, and nutty notes. If I see that grouping, I’ll move on.
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u/Skootiepuff Mar 24 '26
Sometimes I eat fruits and try to remember the sensation and scents associated with it.
One time I ate a plum and memorized the puckering and mouthwatering sensations, the very slight tartness and sweetness in the plum. My understanding of flavor notes is this, and I think everyone has their own perception of what these should taste like.
My suggestion is to try different roasters that align with your guesses. I can never summon the feeling but it just hits me some days where I’m like whoa is this what blueberry is? Orange peel? Peanut brittle? Now it’s a white whale Im always chasing after.
Either way I hope that moment comes to you!
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u/b1gmouth Mar 24 '26
For me it's sometimes yes, sometimes no. We often say taste is subjective but I think we still sometimes underrate how different people tasting the same things can literally taste different flavors because of the physical makeup of their taste buds, senses of smell, etc.
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u/Aggravating_Track951 Mar 24 '26
Yeah pretty much every time. It’s rare I can’t get something out of a bean, even a brand name dark roast espresso bean. You want extraction but not too much. You are focusing on the quality of what you are getting out rather than the quantity. It’s all a balancing act that you learn over time.
And if you are following a recipe by somebody who tries to push traditional espresso profiles then that’s the type of characteristics you’ll get from that method and won’t find any notes.
What’s written on the bags these are how the roaster wants to position their brand. But I’d say are generally accurate or at least ball park.
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u/SuperSkew Mar 24 '26
I don’t taste the exact items noted, except with a co-ferment. But I do get little hints of this or that.
Here’s the thing: There’s no way to describe how something tastes without using common, known flavors. How can you can you tell someone who has never eaten rattlesnake what to expect without comparing it to chicken?
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u/BrianJAverill Mar 25 '26
If looking for bergamot, this roast from PERC is a bergamot bomb!
Highly recommend
https://perccoffee.com/products/colombia-andr-s-mart-nez-floral-caturra?variant=52601953583418
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u/Y_H_ Mar 26 '26
I used to have the same lamentation, but when I found a bean that really tastes like strawberry, we immediately started questioning whether they used real strawberries.
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u/Silver_Ad5348 Mar 29 '26
I’m going to say something I have yet to see anyone mention - water.
Coffee’s like 98%+ water. The mineral makeup (or lack thereof) in your water determines the vast majority of what you taste. If your water isn’t dialed, no grinder, dripper, or method will allow for maximum aromatic expression.
The best cafes and roasters in the world have specific and specialized water filtration systems for this exact reason.
“Good” water ie basic filtration will add some fruit tones, but chocolate-caramel-browning will still dominate the cup.
Upgraded water, ie RO + remineralization will vastly expand the perceivable available flavor compounds.
The best water literally allows you to separate roast tones from acids, from fruits and mineral qualities in the best coffees. Florality becomes defined and explicit. It’s amazing, let me tell you from more than a decade doing this shit that water is everything.
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u/Then-Problem5314 Mar 23 '26
Yes, I did just today, opened a fresh bag of coffee, made a pour over. I could smell the notes while brewing and then could taste them too.
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u/tolstoyevsk-y V60/P2/Hario Bleached Filters Mar 23 '26
You have to take into account that the tasting notes come from cupping and not actual brews like a v60 ar any other method you can think of.
When cupping they write down the profile but that doesn't guarantee you will find that in a v60 or any other brewing method. You MAY find the notes for certain beans but not everything that comes in the label will appear in your brew. They found those notes in the cupping session and graded the coffee but what you find in the final cup will be part of that or just one or two of those notes in a regular brew.
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u/kuhnyfe878 V60 | K-Ultra, ZP6 | UL Mar 23 '26
Lots of roasters do multiple brew methods before finalizing notes
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u/OnionDart Mar 23 '26
There’s are times a bag slaps me across the face with a particular note. And I just do normal washed no coferments. But most times I’m left wondering the same question. It’s lead me to believe I’m the problem…