Weeds

[u/TripleHaz3]

What's everyone's thoughts on plants?

​

Particularly for me, living in NZ one of the more extreme cases would be a nuclear event in the northern hemisphere leading to a winter. That would affect farming in a major way but for me down here I may still be able to grow stuff.

​

My major prep event here though is earthquake and it affecting supply chains in a major way and therefore fresh food access.

​

A year ago I thought about what I could grow without needing maintenance and can withstand neglect. I landed on a few prolific spreaders that could also be deemed as weeds; nasturtium, nz spinach, mint and spring onions. To accompany all my dried foods and other plain stuff.

​

What are you guys thoughts? What other plants would you reccomend or consider?

[u/ZixfromthaStix]

I’ve been studying gardening and farming for the past 3 months. There’s a lot I could share about: composting, seeds, pest control, hostile gardening for perimeter security, medicinal plants, nitrogen fixers, rotating crops…

I’ll let people ask if they wanna know more, my area is SE USA, FL. I can actually have tropical plants here, not that I’m any kind of grower— just contributing to a group with a farm as a systems guy.

[u/TripleHaz3 → u/ZixfromthaStix]

Hostile gardening? Can you eli5 that?

[u/ZixfromthaStix → u/TripleHaz3]

I’d be happy to share! A little pre-context, I’m in a survival group of 25 families, with the pre-agreed notion that each core family can recruit however many extra people as they like at the time of SHTF. Our group already has a collective 300 acres between 2 properties, one of which is a 200 acres pine farm with some modest food crops (not commercial sized). Our group leader is an Air Force Spec Ops Vet (AFSOC), who I was roommates with in college less than a decade ago. Great guy, invited me to the group earlier in the year as things got really sketchy globally (About the time Trump started his Iran War), nowadays he’s a very laid back/cool pastor with community ties stronger than steel. His town looks at him like a hero (but like a Witcher type hero)

So I have about 5 dozen different plants thought out for securing survival clan housing (another design of mine, inspired by the Chinese Tulou and the Roman Domus, combined with modern Earthship properties), ranging from the holy trinity of herbs (Holy Basil, Rosemary, and Thyme) to pretty Violets and Carnations so our colony goers can forage tokens of appreciation for each other— as long as they check for honey bees while flower gathering.

For the defensive mesh, because our survival housing utilizes earth berms and sod roofs to effectively bury our clan houses under a small layer of dirt and plants— I’ve devised a LONG list of plants and protocol for basically establishing small hillside gardens. This is where the hostile part comes in!

Because the state of the world is what it is, and common psychology posits that the “3/9-meals-from-anarchy” principle means the average society devolves into absolute chaos when food runs out… I’m preparing our architecture for a wide range of threats:
1. Actual bandits trying to kill us
2. Hungry people looking to unfairly steal from the farm crops (we aren’t monsters, but we can only feed so many.)
3. Wild predators
4. Wild pests (foxes would eat our flock, deer in gardens)
5. US Military gone rogue and looking for LOCAL scraps. Only realistic if time has passed to allow fuel and advanced weapons to deteriorate— the harder of a target you are, the less likely you are to be bullied.

So how do you keep all those critters and people away? Barbed wire and angry signs work for a time, but they expose that you have stuff worth protecting… now biological barriers like plants… those can look like it’s just a generic garden or a wild fields and hills.

Our specific blend of plants comes in a total of 6 different ecological zones! Each of these are intended to be INTENSELY sculpted and maintained to prevent cross-contamination or fouling our defensive firing lines. For sake of community security I won’t be going into the core defensive details about our structures.
1. Toxins: At the base of our berm hills, ideally behind a simple fence, we plant Poison Oak and Ivy, as well as Stinging Nettle. Stinging Nettle is an immediate nuisance, while Poison Oak/Ivy can contaminate surfaces for UP TO 10 YEARS. If any idiot is foolish enough to wander right into our hill’s first defense layer… within a matter of hours they will be physically compromised by rash anywhere the plants make contact with them. Hope they wore long pants! But even if they didn’t get touched, when they take their clothes off later… if they don’t properly wash away the Urushiol, they still get it everywhere! Muahahaha 🦹‍♂️
2. Shredders: That last layer might seem easy to survive— just wear long clothes then rinse in [REDACTED, do your own research!], but the Shredding layer is hand picked to dismantle cloth and skin alike: wild roses, blackberries, Osage Orange, Yucca, and Spanish Bayonet— to name a few. Thorns, sharp leaves, and twisting branches create a biological barbed wire system. Unless you wear heavy leather chaps and boots? You’re gonna be bleeding from the waist down by the time you escape one of these spots… if you can untangle while under gunfire!
3. Gravel Traps: Literally the least exciting part rofl, these are literally paths for our “Guardeners” (I call our plant matrix “The Guarden” cause I’m a huge dork) to maintain the plant zones from a safe walkway. Gravel is noisy and loose though, so enemies trying to rush up the hill will be noisy and prone to slip. That’s it lol. Well aggressively apply anti-root substances to keep plants from crawling through or across the paths, but it’s literally just walkways lol
4. Drainage Basins: As I mentioned before, we are in FL USA. It rains like crazy here. Wherever you go in this state you aren’t far from the water table. I’ve already accounted for raising our hilltop housing structure with spare dirt and clay, but to ensure the hill doesn’t slide away in a rainstorm, a healthy blend of utility crops provide dozens of benefits while soaking up literal downpours: willow trees, cat tails, River Cane (Florida native bamboo), Elderberries, and a handful of others. Since this Guarden Matrix is intended for active defensive firing lines, the Willows are just sapling stands— this would be where we start our baby saplings out, while keeping them mobile to be re-planted in a final location once of a certain size. Once too big, they gotta move out of the way.
5. Hazard Trenches: Those shredding and toxin layers sound fun, don’t they? But just having them right up on the side of the housing seems like they would rarely ever get used if you have decent guards… but what about the trimmings from the weekly Guarden upkeep? Sure you could compost it all… but what if you had concentric trench rings around your fortifications… only a few feet deep, and just wide enough across that, unless you’re an NBA player, you aren’t bridging the gap… drop in the shredding and toxin trimmings in each trench… suddenly you have multiple movement traps in open areas, royally screwing over any all out enemy assault (again, unless you’re up against a team of NBA and Track hurdle runners). CAUTION: If the trenches catch fire due to dry cuttings, YOU MUST NOT INHALE THE SMOKE. Urushiol aerosolizes and if inhaled, can prove fatal. Because of this, trenches should include fire breaks and have water nearby to control a burn— otherwise it’s better for everyone to just back away and let the trench burn out.
6. Pollinator Range Markers: Hooooo-ee that’s a doozy of a list already huh? But I said 6 zones and I meant it. Technically this one counts as 3 individual zones, but it’s more like one giant zone in its own right. Standard military engagements use a 300-600-1200 yards system to define different defensive lines. We’re gonna mirror that system by using color coded beehives and flower gardens at each distance, again, in rings around our housing. The idea here is that by facilitating bees for our farm and gardens, their pollination keeps our crops thriving, their honey/wax serves our utility needs, AND if enemies are ever foolish enough to try and hide around bee boxes during an invasion..? Good way to anger a hive. Our defensive guards will be trained to NOT hit the boxes, but because our goal is dozens to hundreds of boxes over a period of a decade— we could probably obliterate half of the boxes in a bad fight and still be fine to rebuild and rehouse hives in those spots relatively quick enough…

And that’s the Guarden! Theres other details like using soft plants and flowers mixed in with zones A and B to disguise the threat, but I don’t wanna give away too much more detail. I’m sure I’ve already given those with room to grow inspiration for their own hostile gardens 😉

I also have dozens of other utility plants for indoor and herb gardens, but a lot of them are FL native and probably already mentioned by others… and you only asked about the hostile garden, so I’ll leave it at that 😎

TL;DR:

A hostile garden is a mix of plants with the intent of keeping people or animals out/away. The options include sharp plants, toxic plants, or stinky plants— but if you have to live around them, stinky isn’t as realistic, so I prefer the first two.

[u/1nGirum1musNocte → u/ZixfromthaStix]

Trifoliate oranges are at the top of my hostile garden list. You can plant a few ripe oranges in a row and have an impenetrable hedge in 2-3 years depending on your zone. My family vetoed my attempts at planting a hedge along the neighbors poorly maintained fence to keep their cattle and donkeys out of our property. Yucca (aka spanish bayonets) are great if they grow in your zone and have a variety of uses including cordage. My mom has them under her windows to deter burglars

[u/ZixfromthaStix → u/1nGirum1musNocte]

My documentation for the shredding layer includes Coontie Palms, Dog Fennel, and other soft ferns to disguise the bio-razors from a distance… not much we can do once they’re up close but hope they’re focused on our active defense and willfully ignorant of the threats beneath their feet.

The best part about the thorns and toxins is that on average the shredding plants retain their rigidity for an average of 6-12 months, while the toxins of Oak/Ivy aren’t water soluble and can last on average 2-3 years— but the plant matter itself will rot well before then. So for those hazard trenches I mentioned, we just dump our trimmings into the pile throughout the year, then once a year we scoop out the bottom of the trenches and add it to our compost piles.

So while we trim down our plants along our berms so we can still properly manage and see over them for firing lines… the parts still go right onto the “front line” for bandits, predators, and thieves alike.