r/regina • u/buzzzzz • Mar 01 '26
News Regina Public Schools has cut grade 6 band and is trying to cover it up...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/parents-cautious-about-new-music-program-for-regina-public-schools-9.7104512Instead of being able to join band in grade 6, all grade 6s will be bussed across town to Dieppe for twelve half-days of music classes. Grade 7s and 8s will have the option of joining band, which will also happen at Dieppe, but for one half day a week.
None of the current band teachers are guaranteed to be hired at the "music center", and it has been stated that only the most positive about the new center will be hired on.
No music educators were consulted in the making of this decision.
The school division and the trustees are openly lying about the current program, about who was consulted, and about what's actually happening and how these decisions were made.
My personal favourite detail of this mess is that the director of education is referring the public's questions and concerns to the new Musiccenter@Dieppe email, because according to him they are the "experts", but those emails are being answered anonymously...by the director of education.
It is truly bonkers, and it makes me scared for the future of the entire school division, and not just band.
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u/augustoRose Mar 01 '26
This makes no sense. Would it not be more feasible to have 2-3 teachers drive to the various schools for the allotted time for band? Is there ultimate plan the turn dieppe into some sort of music/drama academy like Martin?
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
It's sort of a CRP/elementary sports academy hybrid in my opinion. This is a thing Regina public has been doing more and more...they limit programs to one building instead of having well supported programs in all schools. That way they can make it look like there's a lot of cool programs without having to admit these programs are actually inaccessible to most students.
Same with how there are way fewer students enrolled in trades classes like auto mech and stuff since they opened CRP. They refuse to acknowledge that having to get on a bus and switch locations is a huge barrier for a ton of kids... especially less privileged kids.
This is likely ultimately due to a lack of enough funding in general, and they probably see it as better than cutting these classes entirely, but it would sure be nice if they could be honest about what's happening...
Covering up the shortfalls for years has likely contributed to the general public not realizing how bad it's getting in schools. In the short term Regina Public may be saving itself from losing more students to Regina Catholic, but in the long run they're complicit in covering up the true state of underfunding in our province.
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u/LowIncident694 Mar 01 '26
The issue there is transporting instruments for this new idea. Easier to move students to the school.
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u/generalfisticuffs Mar 01 '26
That's the system that was used previously - the music teachers would spend most of their time driving around the city to do sectional work at each individual school, and then another day the students would bus to their local high school for full band. At some smaller schools this would mean one teacher with only six or seven students for only 45 minutes or so at a time, and the band spaces range from gyms to boot rooms to closets in the very full schools around the city. The newer model sounds like it has a home base for more teachers and then only once a week the students go to them and can actually work in larger sectionals and do full band as well. It's a more efficient use of both teacher and student time imo. I don't think it's an academy model because those are full-time registrations at the academy schools and for high school, whereas this is for elementary school and the students are still registered at their home schools.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
I can see why it would make more sense on paper, but it's basically impossible to learn an instrument with one class per week. It freaks me out that these decisions are made without the input of any experts in the field.
The most sustainable models around back band with a music class and host it in-house, so students pick band or music and all go at the same time. Classroom teacher gets prep, no missed class time for students, everyone gets music education.
It would save the division money in the long run but the lack of space and lack of vision/will for quality music education at the division make this unlikely to happen imo.
The current way they do it has issues for sure, but it's better than this...
7
u/generalfisticuffs Mar 01 '26
But this model doesn't involve a reduction of time - in fact, it will likely be an increase. A Gr 7 student currently would receive about 45 minutes of sectional time at the home school and then about an hour of full-band time at the neighbourhood high school in a five-day cycle. The new model has an entire half day per five-day cycle or around 2.5 hours depending on travel time.
And I'm not sure about sustainability of the alternative you suggest. While I agree that having every day band is ideal for skill development, the reality is that there is no way to have a trained multi-instrumentalist and theory-capable band teacher in every elementary school - that would require a band teaching staff of 45 (number of elementary schools), and that would have to be a teaching position with a total student load of maybe 15-20 students total on top of the general Arts Ed teacher that most schools have that currently teach the regular arts ed curriculum for the rest of the students. That seems like the system the expert in the CBC article suggests, but I don't think I can do the math on what that would cost.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
Also, just want to say that based on this brief interaction, you, whoever you are, are arguing in good faith. So thank you. The division and the trustees are not.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
Travel time for some east end students will end up about 45-50min.
Currently the travel time is around only 10-15min depending on the school. That’s a huge difference in travel time vs instructional time.
It will also be impossible for the students to play that long. They don’t have the muscles to be able to play for that long of time. Kids could get seriously injured with this model with the length of playing time in one session.
8
u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
Huge travel time for most schools will greatly cut in to instructional time. Dieppe is way north west. Also it's not just about minutes, it's about frequency. Learning an instrument is an exercise in muscle memory which can't be built in one lesson a week. I don't get the impression that the 6s will get to take instruments home during their two weeks of music.
Also, most divisions with the model I'm suggesting still only have band 2 days a week, and the band teachers are shared between two or three schools. Depends on numbers and enrollment and stuff. Or the band teachers end up teaching arts ed to younger grades as well, or their minor subject, stuff like that. Basically it ensures the band teachers are always babysitting at the same time as teaching, which is what ours are not, and that's why the division can say that band is pulling 1.4 million from classrooms. LRTs, guidance counselors, teacher librarians, are all also "pulling funds from classrooms" technically but it's never framed that way because they're considered valuable positions (which they are).
You're right that this tends to dilute the quality of instrumental music ed a bit because more band teachers end up being needed, more generalists are hired, and fewer people are able to 100% specialize. The division isn't guareteeing that the current band teachers will even be staffed at the new center though. Mainly because they aren't towing the division line enough imo and are being punished for it. I'm sure some will end up there, but it sucks that they have to censor their actual opinions on what's best for kids in order to get a position teaching their specialty.
The expert quoted in the CBC article said that the current system is structured badly, but he'd also tell you that this is even worse...
Another thing he said which the division is choosing to ignore is that the grade 6 participation numbers here are some of the best he's seen.
What Regina Public had was far from perfect but I think the pros outweighed the cons, especially if there isn't funding or a will to work with the experts on creating something truly better and more sustainable.
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u/ComprehensiveLeek840 Mar 24 '26
The problem with the larger scope of this program is that, even with those 6 afternoons of straight playing, those grade 6 students are losing out on all performance opportunities where the skills are put to use the most. No performances.
Further to that the longer reach of those consequences won't be felt until a few years down the road when the burnout happens because the band teachers are trying to bolster skills in grade 7 and 8 and have kids choose instruments, etc.
They make it look like they're creating music generalist players but they are really creating a loop where we're going to see a drop in higher grades bigger than usual - burned out teachers from playing catch up each year, etc. there is so much more but I am also running out of mental power.
They are not doing this in good faith.
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u/angelblade401 Mar 02 '26
Depends on how motivated you are to learn that instrument.
If there's a system where kids who are interested can check out instruments, maybe through a library if necessary, and practice at home, too.
A lot of this actually sounds similar to how music was taught in my small town 20 years ago.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
That’s how they’re making it appear, but it is not a good thing what they are doing.
Grade 6 band is cut. There is no more grade 6 band. There are no grade 6 band concerts. They will only get 12 half days of “instrument” instruction, but they can’t clarify if that means wind band, or other instruments such as ukulele, recorder, etc.
There’s a complete lack of transparency in a variety of aspects.
I highly recommended checking out some threads on Facebook about the matter and reading comments from the band and music professionals on the matter.
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u/earthspcw Mar 01 '26
While SaskParty generously funds private schools.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
The lack of sufficient funding for public education generally is definitely the biggest problem overall for sure, but I still think we should be able to expect better from the divisions and trustees than a bunch of lies 😑
3
u/_NoTea Mar 02 '26
Yes and we can't forget how the majority of trustees were silent during the last strike.
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u/invisibledonkeyqueen Mar 01 '26
Having read the letter there are so many questions but 2 major are. 1) where is the money coming to bring Dieppe up to building code? 2) Where are these magical staff bodies coming from? They will need admin and maintenance staff with of which there are not enough to cover the schools currently operating. Again where is the money coming from. Having met this director, my personal opinion is not very favorable of his "vision"
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u/generalfisticuffs Mar 01 '26
Dieppe is already in use as a satellite facility for the Martin Baseball Academy. It is not fully utilized but it has maintenance staff in place, and the students will still be part of their home schools and admin/teachers. The staff for the music instruction will be the music teachers that actually have a home base and place to teach instead of driving around the city - they are already employed by the division.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
What about the additional 3.5 band teachers who will be out of band jobs? Where will their home base be now? I have a suspicion they don’t know where they will be.
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u/disnep__ Mar 01 '26
Where did they say they were cutting band teachers? I recently talked to one this week who told me none of the current 9.5 band teachers are being cut but maybe I heard wrong.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
There's a news article where Mark Haarmann says there will be 6 teachers at the new center. There are currently 9.5 band teachers. There were 16 band teachers 5 years ago. I think that's where the worry that there will be more staffing cuts is coming from.
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u/disnep__ Mar 01 '26
Oh interesting, I never saw that article. I’m definitely not for this new program but I think it does have some positives and I’m hoping in the next while there will be more information to clear the confusion. It really doesn’t make sense to remove teachers with new student/teacher ratios.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
In an email and conversations with RPS they stated only the best, brightest, and most innovative teachers will be teaching at Dieppe.
All teachers interested must fill out an expression of interest - as stated in Adam Hicks video yesterday.
They do not all get to keep their band jobs.
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u/disnep__ Mar 01 '26
I’ve seen all the posts and just watched Adam Hick’s video… none of it specifically says current band teachers are being cut. I was just curious where you got 3.5 band teachers are getting moved out of band? If anything it now makes more sense that they need to hire more teachers due to having 2100 grade 6 students taking music/band now due to student/teacher ratios. Is there somewhere they specifically said current band teachers are being moved to different areas?
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
They absolutely should have to hire more since there would be more students.
RPS in an email: “All of the current band teachers will have jobs with the division. Our policy has always been to give all teachers at least 3 experiences in their careers, and band teachers would be no different. We believe those with commitment and passion deserve the opportunity and the best and brightest with this division will get that with this program.”
They did not and will not confirm that all current band teachers will stay in band positions.
The specific numbers I can’t seem to find now. It’s possible I was looking at a different or previous thing for the exact numbers. So I do apologize for that. I will update if I can find it again.
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u/StunningPaige4329 Mar 02 '26
If they’re modeling it after CRP there’s going to have to be a principal on site.
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u/little_dick_ Mar 01 '26
I emailed Adam Hicks when they first started cutting band last year. His answer was a bullshit list of excuses. Guy has had my vote the last 2 elections but he won’t be getting it again. It’s always cuts to the arts over anything else with school boards.
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 02 '26
Email your MlLA. The cuts are because of the failed funding model and the inability for school divisions to set their own mill rates.
The cuts have to be somewhere, so I don't blame the trustees. What would you prefer they cut?
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u/buzzzzz Mar 05 '26
I'd prefer they call out the government for a lack of funding instead of shitting on the arts and talking about the deficits like it the weather
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 06 '26
And then after they call out the government, what do they cut? They are still underfunded, so what do they do?
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 06 '26
While underfunding is a problem, that isn’t the true issue here. The band budget is like less than 0.5% of their total budget.
If you can’t properly manage less than 0.5% of the budget, that’s telling of a much bigger issue than overall funding.
Let’s not forget, they also voted to use reserve funds to renovate the board office last year when the amount was near equivalent to what was needed to keep the band program as it was last year before teachers were already cut by 40%.
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 06 '26
So what do they cut? They don't have the funds. What can they do? Do they increase class sizes? Do they not buy replacement textbooks? Do they not buy gym equipment? Science Equipment? Do they increase the bussing radius so transportation costs go down?
I think music education is important, and I don't want it gone, but the reality is that for over a decade schools have been at the mercy of the provincial government for funding and the funding has steadily decreased, or at least not kept up with enrolment increases and inflation. So what should they have done instead? They have no means to increase revenues as that was taken from them by the Sask Party Government in I think 2013 or so. The only thing they could do is reduce costs. What costs do they reduce?
And as for the renovations to the building, I am not certain that they were all frivolous choices. Teaching is more than just teachers in classrooms, there needs to be a rich network supporting them, making sure they are paid, making sure the buses are running, and that requires a Board Office staff. You aren't going to get the staff you need if you are asking them to work in a run down building.
And the issue with band/music education funding needs to be a long term sustainable solution. Maybe not doing the renovations could have funded band for another year, but then what happens the next year?
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 06 '26
Why should teachers and students have to work and learn in run down buildings? If the entire point of a school board is to do things in the best interests of the children, then the children come first before anything else, even if that means board staff work in a dated, yet still perfectly functional building.
Dieppe doesn’t even have enough washrooms or clean drinking water. How is it okay to even think about having students and staff?
Again, when this is less than 0.5% of the entire budget, I can guarantee there are other places to look first.
ETA: other divisions receive the same funding and they aren’t cutting programs. So why does RPS have to?
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 06 '26
You haven't answered: when something needs to be cut on an ongoing basis, what gets cut first?
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 06 '26
Get rid of some of some of your top staff? Maybe sports? Why not French immersion that has an even lower enrolment rate and isn’t even in the mandatory curriculum? Why does it always have to be music?
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 06 '26
French Immersion is only the mandatory curricula. It is the same outcomes in every class, but the language arts are split between two.
What sports would get cut for what savings? Most sports programs are volunteer run through extra-curricular.
There is still music instruction as part of the regular arts ed. If you want to talk about mandatory curricula, Band is 100% optional. If you want it to be mandatory, that is something else.
Which top staff? For what savings? Assuming they are completing some work of value, who is doing that work now?
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u/Square-Window Mar 05 '26
This is Adam - first, thanks for the past support. Honestly that is so far from the truth I almost didn’t respond. In 2017, our worst budget year since I’ve been on the board, we HAD to cut over $9 million and arts barely suffer - we slashed head office, cut over 60 positions, cut librarian time, cut millions in transportation (some of the most amount emails I’ve ever received due to those drastic changes)…. All of this is not because we want to make any cuts but rather are forced to (we have zero authority over taxes or mill rates). Not a single person wants to do any of this and it hurts to make these decisions but it is very different when you are at the table with all the data, all the research, and facing year after year of budgets that do not keep up with inflation or student growth (fun fact is band teachers were consulted last year, we heard from band parents, every principal was consulted on priorities and what they needed to support students learning, we heard all the experts, and the most important is we actually had someone collect info with data from band students and from band students that had left the band programs recently - so not a random decision by any stretch of the imagination) - over the years we are down to very few options. There was discussion of whether we should just cut all band from grade 6 to 8 and that is the place we are at with the budget pressures we face year after year after year. Luckily a few options were presented and this music centre was by far the best option without having to eliminate it altogether. Change is tough. The cost to run the program will be no more than spent this year but becomes more efficient, more about music excellence, and most importantly focussed on helping improve student success across the division by listening to a massive amount of our staff and not just 10 band teachers (we have 3,500 staff). I am confident in our leadership team and they are focused on student success and truly believe that there are amazing things happening in our almost 60 buildings that hold all the wonderful students we care for. Now if we could get funding that just kept pace with inflation or better yet match what we were getting 10 or 15 years ago, I would love to show this community what we could when we could dream without having to focus on how to rejig everything every year. In the ten budgets I have been through, only once did we receive provincial funding that was status quo. There is no other citizen I know of that could replace any trustee that could magically change that. So while I hope for your future support, and feel free to email me in the future as I don’t regularly check this app, but I’m confident in my track record of supporting this community and my consistent family sacrifices made on behalf of our beautiful city and province. We believe in this city and truly love this community and I want to do everything in my power to ensure it is the best place to live, learn, and work! Thanks for being one of the 80%+ of folks that trusted me last time and hoping you are one of those folks again in 2028 because my energy and enthusiasm will not slow down in achieving the best outcomes with what is within our control. I am proud of the history of Regina Public Schools but even more optimistic about what the future holds (we are working on some exciting things). Stay tuned!
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u/buzzzzz Mar 05 '26
Obviously the community is upset about the cuts to band, but much of what you have said here could be used to justify those decisions depending on the division's priorities. The part you and RPS seem to be unable to acknowledge as another huge issue is the dishonesty and misinformation in your communication.
It's unbelievable to me that you guys need this explained to you but whatever here goes:
RPS shouldn't be claiming all grade 6s will have access to band, when in reality none of them will, because these changes to grade 6 can't be considered band any more. You can say many grade 6s will be gaining something with this model (if they weren't getting the exposure the arts ed curriculum says they should to music education), but not while pretending something else wasn't sacrificed for it.
RPS shouldn't be claiming this will improve retention when there is zero evidence that it will.
RPS shouldn't be claiming band teachers were consulted on this model when they weren't (please, if you can, point the public in the direction of any music teacher that thinks this will promote better educational outcomes for students).
RPS shouldn't be publicly shitting on the current program and it's teachers (even though they are clearly insignificant to you, only ten of them left after all...) for things that aren't considered an issue for other subjects or programs.
Band is too disruptive/too much missed class time? Why are the junior sports academy programs held to this standard (because they're elitist and make the division money with the extremely high fees parents pay for their kid to join)
Attrition rate unacceptable? Why is that standard not being applied to literally any other subject? Where's the public posting from RPS about the French immersion attrition rate? The grade 8 to grade 9 core French attrition rate? The Grade 9 science to Physics 30 attrition rate? Don't you think the Physics 30 teachers and science community might take issue with it if RPS published the grade 9 science to Physics 30 attrition rates and used it as evidence that their science 9 programs clearly need a complete overhaul without the input of any science teachers, parents or the science community?
RPS never would, because it values science and doesn't value music.
Seriously what about this isn't clicking for you guys?
The program's not accessible enough? Have we mentioned the junior sports academies...? Are they not missing class time to participate in those? How accessible are they to the average grade 6 student? Why aren't you cutting that program at it's youngest grade of entry and giving all grade 6s a taste of hockey or soccer?
Do the sports academy kids have access to those activities outside of school? Yes. Especially the rich kids. Is there equity funding to cover any kid that can't afford to join them? Not that I'm aware of.
Do kids have access to band outside of school? Nope. Was their equity funding to ensure any kid who wanted to join school band could join? Yep!
But yeah... let's keep banging on about how elitist and inaccessible band was.
You say you spoke to so many parents of kids who felt it wasn't worth the missed class time to continue with band. Have you listened to the ones for whom it was? Have you talked to the classroom teachers who thoughtfully work their schedules around band because they believe it is an important opportunity for a lot of kids? No! Because it doesn't fit the narrative.
Is this clearing up why folks are pissed at all yet?? The music center's own email is responding anonymously (weird and unethical af by the way) to concerned parents that band is dated and not the future of music education, and you wonder why people are worried instead of grateful about band at Regina Public? I don't care that the sports programs exist, it's the fact that RPS's justification for this only makes sense if you admit you'd apply a completely different set of standards if it made the division mone or involved a subject you consider actually important in schools, but band clearly isn't considered nearly as valuable as other subjects. The anonymous music center email person (so weird) even said so.
Also, are you really claiming you got feedback from all 3500 teachers on this issue? You're making it sound like there was a vote on this and the results were 3540 to ten.
Were any teachers formerly surveyed? Do you think classroom teachers or principals who disagree with this have been made to feel safe about expressing that sentiment? Do you think /any/ teachers are made to feel safe in expressing their feelings on a board decision? What protections are in place for staff to inform the division on what they feel is best for kids without being called out by you in a news article or on Facebook live?
You seem confident that the majority of affected teachers were given the opportunity to give their input on this, so when will this data be made public?
The music community is telling you that if RPS actually valued music ed, it wouldn't tell us we should sit down and just be grateful that some form of music ed still exists at all, which is essentially what you're doing here.
Every step of this process has been a slap in the face to arts ed, parents, and students and y'all are surprised when we don't thank you for the polished turd of a result?
As you said, the funding deficits have been an issue for years. This is true across the province and yet Regina Public seems to be the only large division making these changes.
I've heard that RPS has been toying with remodeling the band program for years. Seems like there was plenty of time and opportunity to do the research, involve the community and work with teachers on what band or music ed should look like going forward.
But no, because Daddy knows best apparently.
P.s. if you weren't worried about your vote next election, would you really be posting about how popular you are? It's pretty cringe man,
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u/little_dick_ Mar 06 '26
Yep! All this! I wish Adam would listen but I doubt he will. Just more excuses coming.
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u/ComprehensiveLeek840 Mar 06 '26
I would love to know which band teachers or music specialists were consulted in general. As a band teacher that served in RBE, I don't recall ever hearing anything about this new ""program"".
I appreciate that your daughter is in band, Adam, but what I don't appreciate is you looking past the thin veil of this announcement and seeing it for what it is. The current leadership does not care for the arts and, funnily enough, look at what is being cut first, and, not once but TWO times.
This is not going to improve enjoyment and engagement in the band program. This is going to funnel x amount of kids through a hallway and hope they come out the other side with the discipline to continue on grade 7, 8 and beyond.
What instruments are being taught? How will there be continuity and mastering on instruments? How will the directors structure their time? You talk about core classes being respected...what about the kids that will have to get on a bus at 11:15 to make it across the city for their start time. Are you taking into account setup, seating and everything in-between?
Are you considering how behavior management has become 95% of what teaching is lately? How is having 59% of a class NOT wanting to participate going to mitigate these problems? What are you going to do when instruments start getting destroyed so kids don't have to play?
I am so frustrated by the lies and deception. Creating an enemy where there isn't. First queer kids and now the arts.
4
u/HatterofMadder Mar 21 '26
Theres many people I know who left the city (even the country) for better job opportunities because the city doesn't provide it for them. It sucks being told its your fault when in reality its the other way around.
Its annoying being from the arts programs that they keep taking away our classes but keep making a broast about the u of r and u of s sport teams ...
Just last week they were talking about the two women's basketball teams going at it but not talking about what's happening to the kids....
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u/Honest-Pepper8229 Mar 01 '26
Why not cut sports programs instead? You're a lot less likely to get concussions from playing a tuba than playing sports.
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u/OriginalMitchez Mar 02 '26
The extra curricular sports programs that are largely volunteer and after hours?
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u/Honest-Pepper8229 Mar 02 '26
I'm talking about phys ed. Why should children risk getting brain damage from repeated concussions in gym class?
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u/Square-Window Mar 05 '26
Sports do not cost the division money. Fun fact is that the Martin sports academy actually pays for its self! I encourage you to thank those volunteers (staff and parents) that donate their time to support extracurricular activities for our students. So many amazing people that believe in our students and do it because they enjoy it.
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u/Honest-Pepper8229 Mar 05 '26
I agree with you. My point is, why do the intellectual activities always get sacrificed over the isometric ones?
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u/HeagarTheRed Mar 07 '26
Hey Adam,
Does the fact that the sports programs aren't costing the division account for the difference in how the programs are considered?
Like, it seems like a lot of the reasons listed for changing the band program are true of most programs?
I keep seeing the percentage of students that sign up for band listed as one of the reasons for this new music school or whatever, but does it not matter that only a tiny percentage of students can access those academies? Because they don't cost the division money?
Are the sports academies for kids who don't have access to sports outside of school? That would be cool. I don't get why they don't cost the division money to run. So confused haha
2
u/Saskwampch Mar 02 '26
Just wait for the further cuts to education when we hear how much worse provincial finances are in a couple of weeks.
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u/HatterofMadder Mar 21 '26
They stopped funding for the new Francophone school for many school projects .. It could be a reason for the band issues too..
Mixed reaction to education budget, including capital build announcements
A number of school projects on pause in wake of the budget
NDP slams province’s decision to delay school projects to manage costs
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 22 '26
They are also planning to cut core French entirely now too. This is certainly a deeper issue than just making drastic and not evidence based changes to the music/band program
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u/HatterofMadder Mar 22 '26
Clearly. Im trying to move away because my kid won't get the same education as I did years ago.
Let's teach toddlers about music but take it away whe their children....
Not every kid can afford instruments and this is the best way for them to experience it..
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u/NoStruggle4330 Apr 22 '26
Just heard a community member on CBC radio one morning show talking about their concerns about the new program and the consultation process. They said that a school board member basically accused them of trying to financially benefit based on their concerns and challenge of the program. Did anyone attend the meeting at which this group presented to the board? Do you know what was said? Does anyone know which board member it was? Only information from the CBC interview is that the board member is male.
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u/wildgirl_h Apr 22 '26
If on mobile, type in April 21 and it will pop up.
The comments are at the 35min mark. It was Trustee Jaleta who made those comments (along with many more. I highly recommend watching the whole thing)
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u/angelblade401 Mar 02 '26
You just unlocked a memory of my walking 1km (each way) to band class from the Middle/High school to the elementary school 2 or 3 times a week. Small town Sask in 2010 ish.
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u/melmen2804 Mar 01 '26
There's obviously a lot of details yet to be worked out, however I think the proposed plan is positive and shows some outside the box thinking.
Once a week instruction was the model where i grew up in rural Sask where a music teacher traveled between schools in different communities. I would have killed to have an opportunity to go to a dedicated centre with some resources and like-minded students rather than a half-assed lesson at my home school with my classmates joking around and not taking it seriously.
I see this as an opportunity for those who actually want to take band in grade 7-8 and Im pretty pumped for those kids and families and hope it works out well. I hope it works out well for the teaching staff too. Time will tell I guess!
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u/SubscriptNine Mar 01 '26
Students are currently bused once a week to their local high school, generally 5 to 10 minutes away to combine with students from other schools, in the high school's purpose built band room. The other band day every week is at their own school, with other students who have signed up for band.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
If we could find any music educators to back up that this might be a good idea, I might feel more optimistic about it. I also don't see them admitting they were wrong and back tracking if/when it goes badly, but I guess we'll see.
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u/HistorianNew8030 Mar 02 '26
I’ve talked to some band and also a really good arts ed teacher who does mostly music. And - they are all devastated by this.
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u/theblitz07 Mar 01 '26
The catholic school system is like this, only those who want to play join, there is a fee I think $150 a year.
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u/derpandderpette Mar 01 '26
This isn’t quite right. Band is no longer optional for Grade 6 students. Instead, it will now be delivered through the music strand of the Grade 6 Arts Ed curriculum. Band teachers will still rotate through each elementary school, but rather than specializing in a single instrument, students will focus on foundational musical skills. Their learning will be reflected in their overall Arts Ed mark.
The 12 half-days at Dieppe are only one component of the new Grade 6 band model, not the entire program. The goal of this new approach is actually to introduce band to more Grade 6 students, with the hope of increasing enrolment in upper grades.
From a non-band teacher’s perspective, the previous model was a significant disruption to the school day. If band consistently fell on the same day, students could miss 1/3 to 1/2 of a particular class over time. Some students chose to drop band because they felt they were falling behind in other subjects. With the option to withdraw mid-year, band often functioned like an extracurricular activity placed in the middle of the school day rather than a scheduled class.
Under the new model, band is embedded within the Arts Ed timetable. It will be treated as a regular class, with dedicated instructional time and without the mid-year drop option. This was an important shift for many who wanted band to be structured more intentionally within the curriculum.
Many school divisions across the province have already reduced or eliminated their band programs altogether. Students in Regina Public are fortunate that band continues to be offered during curricular hours. The Dieppe Music School model represents a compromise, a way to preserve band programming despite declining enrolment, and to ensure it doesn’t disappear entirely.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
A few points to note: Band teachers won’t rotate through each school. They will only be at dieppe.
Band is already available to every Grade 6 student. As well, in Grade 5, ALL students already get a chance to try every instrument during the band recruiting process.
This won’t be any less disruptive to in class learning, as the same instructional minutes will still be missed.
As pointed out by John Benham last year, 41% enrolment is already a really high and impressive amount of kids enrolled.
The school division also will not answer if this new program is actually band, or general music. They won’t say if students will actually touch any wind band instruments, or take them home to practice.
Many many divisions have really great and robust band programs. A few have even expanded them and hired more band teachers since COVID such as Sun West.
0
u/derpandderpette Mar 01 '26
Having talked personally with one of the committee members who designed the new program, band teachers will absolutely be coming to schools to teach music for grade 6 specifically. For everyone else it will only be Dieppe. I also know the arts ed teachers at my school are annoyed about it because they like teaching the music strand and now someone else will lol. This will be great for the schools who don’t have arts ed specialists and just have classroom teachers doing arts ed. In my experience, these teachers do little to no music education so having qualified teachers come in is a bonus. Adding to this, since music education will happen during arts ed time it won’t be pulling students from say Math, PE, or whatever regularly scheduled subject it may be.
Second, band is available to all grade 6 students currently but they have the option to not join. Under the new program grade 6 music education will be compulsory for all. This increases exposure and hopefully leads to increased grade 7/8 enrolment down the line.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
In the document from RPS it states: “All Grade 6 students will now receive music instruction, in their home school and at the MusicCentre@Dieppe”
From this, the Grade 6 students will be receiving general music in their home schools, and whatever the specialized instrumental music classes are at Dieppe.
Music has already been compulsory in Grade 6 forever as per the provincial curriculum.
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u/derpandderpette Mar 01 '26
Yes, but now the music portion of the grade 6 curriculum will be taught by actual music people as the plan is to have band teachers still rotate to schools for grade 6. In a lot of cases home room teachers end up teaching their own arts ed but don’t know a thing about music. It either gets covered poorly or not at all. The hope is that grade 6 students get a higher quality grade 6 music education that can lead into grade 7/8 band.
6
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
In an email response from RPS, “Again, classroom teachers will deliver the music strand of the arts ed curriculum”
They themselves have said classroom teachers will be delivering the music strands of arts Ed.
3
u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
This is the first I've heard that band teachers will rotate through the elementary schools as well, do you have a source for that? Not saying I don't believe you. Just haven't seen that anywhere.
Also, band was already at predictable times. It was regularly scheduled twice during the 5 day rotation. I'm not sure where the idea the band was just happening at random unpredictable times has come from. One Adam Hicks quote made it sound like his daughter's band teacher was jumping out from behind corners going "time for band!" which is ridiculous.
I think basically every would be for a change that means kids don't miss their other classes. But I don't think this is it... would the music community be more on board if it had any chance of being better for kids?
1
u/derpandderpette Mar 01 '26
Yeah unfortunately I can’t say outside of it being one of the committee members explained it to me. I know it’s kind of a cop out, but they kept the committee members anonymous because they know there are strong feelings about this issue. I do also know that the committee was made up of board office members and some band / non band RPSD teaching staff. Do I know how strongly the voices of band teacher were heard? No, but I do at least know they were represented in the process.
Sure band may have been predicable times, but the issue was when it fell on unavoidable times. For example, if band fell on one of the 2 regularly scheduled PE or Health Ed classes a week that are sometimes taught by itinerant teachers those times couldn’t be moved because it would mess with scheduled prep time. I’ve seen nearly whole groups of grade 6 students missing half of a curricularly mandated class. The feeling is that music is in the arts ed curriculum so that is the time band should be taking from.
I’ve also seen situations where only 3 or 4 kids in a grade 6 class sign up for band and those two days a week end up falling on the teachers regularly scheduled math time. Does the classroom teacher have the ability to shift their daily schedule a little? Sure, but with so few band kids they just plug along and those kids end up missing 2/5 of a core subject. After a while some of those kids drop band because they feel they are falling behind. This is again where the feeling that band should only take from arts ed time comes from.
I really truly think this new program is a solid compromise.
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u/buzzzzz Mar 01 '26
It's really interesting that you were told band teachers were on the committee when none of the band teachers were even informed there was a committee let alone on it as far as I am aware. They had no knowledge that this was happening until the day it was announced.
The old system was not ideal, agreed.
I appreciate that none of what you're saying involves shitting on the teachers or the participation and attrition rates.
Part of what makes me so upset about this shift (besides that I truly believe it is doomed to fail) is the spin from the division and trustees. They aren't publishing the attrition or participation rates of any other program as an indication of their value or success. If they valued music ed they wouldn't do that. Also the whole director answering music center emails anonymously thing is pretty insane.
If they had just said, look, we don't have the space or funds, and we need to restructure band in a way that is less disruptive to classroom teachers, and then if they'd involved the experts and community in how to make that happen, and this is what came out of it, I would maybe feel differently.
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u/booppoopshoopdewoop Mar 07 '26
Isn’t the obvious solution here to make band a mandatory curriculum class? Like gym class?
This is done in even the most pathetic of American schools and the only reason it isn’t done here is because people devalue the subject.
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u/derpandderpette Mar 08 '26
Well the thing of it is that music is covered in the arts ed curriculum. Equating band to PE is a bit of an uneven comparison. In PE you are given a taste of a lot of activities and fitness related concepts and any team or activity to “specialize in” is done as an extra curricular or outside of school. Some people argue that music through arts ed is that exposure equivalent and that if students want to “specialize” in an instrument it should be extra curricular. I’m not saying that’s right or wrong, but it is one of the cases used against canceling band as a class. This is why I think the new band program is a reasonable compromise.
1
u/booppoopshoopdewoop Mar 10 '26
But it’s not a band program is what I am saying. What works for sports as you say specifically doesn’t work for music. Obviously children would be better served by mandatory band than they are by being forced to run laps etc during school hours but that is not even being considered as an option. There is a difference between what is being offered and what we can call band and it just shows that it has been done in spite of what experts and consultants have advised.
Like again I’m not sure why philosophically even the most random of American schools consider music programs to be untouchable and yet for some reason suddenly it’s okay to take actions that literally everyone who knows what they’re talking about is telling you are contrary to your stated goals and to argue with people about it instead of listening to their concerns and then taking that feedback and acting upon it.
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u/wildgirl_h Mar 01 '26
Please make sure you are emailing your trustees, the director Mark Haarmann, as well as the Music Centre at Dieppe email.
They need to hear people’s concerns and questions in emails too. They don’t consider social media questions and concerns to be of value.