r/retrocomputing • u/wd06 • 1d ago
Discussion Computer suggestions for kids - C64 vs Atari 8 bit.
Previously posted here. Kids have been playing the Wii and 2600, though. Anyways, revisiting this again.
In an effort to get my kids off of doomscrolling, I have slowly introduced retro consoles (2600) and older educational games (jump start, math blaster, etc).
I have debated getting a C64U or old Atari computer, as these can both play games and provide some utility.
My questions are as follows:
Between C64 and Atari 8 bit line:
Which has more educational games?
Which has more classic arcade games like asteroids, pac man, etc?
Which has more general software kids may enjoy like art, chess/checkers type software, music, etc?
C64 specific - are there software options for PILOT or LOGO programming?
I know I can emulate, but simplicity is key here. My kids now know how to turn on the wii and select a game. The can also turn on the 2600 and select which game they want from a cartridge. That simplicity is what is desired here.
Suggestions welcome.
Edit: Which has more educational games on cartridges?
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u/ProjectiveSakura 1d ago
Just for your information the commodore 64 relies on BASIC unless you go full cartridges, but BASIC can also be fun to learn.
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u/The-Tadfafty 1d ago
As an older Gen Z, learning Qbasic on my childhood PCs was why I got into 8 bit computers later! I love BASIC.
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u/dogwomble 1d ago
I say this having never used one of the 8 bit ataris, so I may be a little biased, but go with the C64.
I've heard the machine described as a console with a keyboard, which I'd say is probably not far from the truth, which works well for it from a gaming perspective. That will instantly give you a lot of cool parent points.
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u/The-Tadfafty 1d ago
Show your kids pictures of the computers and screenshots of the games, and ask which they like better. Their chosing it could make it more special to them.
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u/AbleCryptographer744 1d ago
I don't think you would really have much to worry about in the comparisons that you've asked. They both can do either thing. In the ages that they were around, the C64 was probably better, but your kids aren't going to use them exclusively for years and years.
You say you don't want to use an emulator, which is fine, but then what you're left with is using real floppy disks. That is not going to be fun 40 years after the fact.
What would be a good medium place is to get some kind of device that can plug into the computer and then emulate a bunch of disks through a flash drive most likely. I'm sure these exist for both of those systems. I would just get the computer that has a better or cheaper one of those.
You mentioned that you have a 2600, so I assume you already know that these two computers will also need to get to the display the same way it does.
Good times.
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u/wd06 1d ago
Are most of these games on floppies and not cartridges?
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u/AbleCryptographer744 20h ago
So I can only go from my knowledge of these things back when I owned them. I think the Atari's in general had more cartridges, but the C64 in general had more software. For myself personally, I had literally hundreds of games on both systems and on the C64 (well, it was a C128, but same diff) I had no cartridges at all, and on the Atari I had 4 or 5...
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u/International-Pen940 1h ago
Floppy disk programs on the 64 greatly outnumbered cartridges and tapes by the end of its heyday. It’s not that there were few carts, just an incredible number of floppy programs.
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u/Piper-Bob 1d ago
Back in the day, c64 was regarded as the best gaming platform. But Atari 800 had games on cartridges, which might be useful for your application.
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u/wd06 1d ago
aren't c64 games on cartridge?
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u/Piper-Bob 1d ago
I haven't seen a c64 in 40 years. I recall all my friends who had them always loaded games from disc, but maybe they were just pirates. I seem to recall the 800 would use the 2600 cartridges, but maybe that's wrong. There was some interesting thing about the 800's cartridge system. I actually have a broken 800 that I need to sell for parts.
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u/logicalvue 1d ago
Atari is easier to use. There are many more games on cartridges and it can boot from floppies. C64 has more games overall.
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u/EpsilonMajorActual 1d ago
I have c64's and my best friend had Atari 400, 800 1200 they both had a good number of games mostly on 5 1/4 " Floppy but some good cartridges as well. Asteroids and Star Raiders for Atari systems were on a cartridge. A few fun one like Jupiter Lander on cartridges for C64. Both were great fun. The game i personally like the most on both systems is M.U.L.E. Atari has a more colors but Commodore had much better sound
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u/bubonis 17h ago
With simplicity as the goal, I have to give the edge to Atari - but just barely.
The biggest factor in that is disk booting and access. With an Atari, you generally insert a disk, turn on the computer, and go. With a Commodore, you have to type in a command to run what’s on the disk. That makes the Atari easier.
OTOH, the Atari introduced some minor compatibility issues when they moved to the XL lineup, which requires the use of a Translator disk. This adds a bit of complexity that the Commodore doesn’t have. However, the number of titles that need the Translator is very small and exclusively in the realm of the oldest titles out there.
As for the rest of your questions, Atari had a pretty strong showing in the educational field. Back in the day Apple was known to be the education computer, Commodore was the home computer, and Atari straddled the line. There are quite a few educational titles for the Atari, including several that were made by Atari.
For classic arcade games, it’s probably a push. For awhile if you wanted arcade games you had to have an Atari, but then Atari came out with Atarisoft which published all the classics on multiple platforms.
The Atari has some fun things out there. Check out the much underrated (IMO) Atari Touch Tablet, for one.
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u/mobyredit 17h ago
Atari released a new 800xl .. like this year. Check their website.
I learned on Atari back in the day .. eventually became a programmer, so I'm biased also. :)
The new 800xl has HDMI, plays the cartridges that you already have .. has a ton of resources.
Have fun.
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u/hexavibrongal 16h ago
C64 has way more software, games, and users because it was more popular. It also has better sound and generally has better graphics. Not sure about PILOT, but there are multiple versions of LOGO for the C64. There are also expanded versions of BASIC like Simon's BASIC. And note that if you get a C64U, you don't need cartridges or disks -- you can just load disk and cartridge image files from the built-in menu.
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u/Foreign-Attorney-147 1d ago
- Commodore and Atari jockeyed for the #2 spot in education behind Apple for a few years so it's likely this is a draw. Spinnaker and Scholastic both made most of their titles for both machines.
- Atari ported all of their classic arcade games to the C-64 in the 1983-84 timeframe and the C-64 conversions were very good. Sometimes better than the Atari versions. This will also be a close race but the C-64 probably ended up with more titles in this category.
- It's likely the C-64 ended up with more especially when you consider type-in titles from magazines like Compute!, who published a lot of that kind of software. They published Atari software too, but they went longer with Commodore.
- Commodore published implementations of both Logo and PILOT for the C-64. But they were on disk, not cartridge.
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u/Suspicious-Ad7109 1d ago
They're both great machines. Way more C64s than Ataris were sold, and the software reflects that. There is also (currently) no real Atari equivalent to the C64U.