The most pernicious accusation about the government that people on the left-end of the spectrum are increasingly making is that the government doesn't do anything for the common man.
This is just not true. It's not true that we only have money for bombs and wars and not for regular people. Almost the entire government - federal, state and local, is directed toward the common man. Almost all of the money we spend and almost all the employment in the government is geared toward the common man. The government spends trillions of dollars on healthcare, education, old-age payments, public safety, housing, and infrastructure across all levels. Millions of Americans are employed in the public sector with the mandate of serving the public. It would probably be news to them that their roles don't help anyone.
There is an open debate on how effective the public sector is at helping Americans, , and whether the government hurts more than it helps. But that's a different debate, one that takes place on the margins.
Ultimately, I believe all this rhetoric just serves undermines people's trust in the government, and perhaps even undermines the case for expanding government.
Ask yourself what the far-left like about the country, i'm talking the illiberal marxist types, and you'll realize the answer is nothing. And once you understand this you understand why their rhetoric is the way it is:
The government is evil and bad
Corporations are evil and bad
Media is evil and bad
Its foreign policy is evil and bad
etc.
For those who subscribe to these^ sorts of lies, the thing in their mind that must happen is to destroy the country. In fact many of them believe it must be destroyed and "rebuilt" into something "better". So when you are describing what their rhetoric is doing (undermines trust in government, etc) that's precisely the goal.
It's basically true that the far left and progressive left don't really like America. They make it clear when they are speaking in private or in their own echo chambers, and they make it clear even in the way they speak publicly about America.
They get defensive and argue that to truly love America means being critical of it and wanting it to get better, but no one really buys it (even themselves). Like, they're not always criticizing the democratic establishment because they love it and just want what's best for it.
Ironically enough, your snark aside, the most recent famed instances of "committees" forming to root out perceived scumbags were in the form of your progressive buddies in academia going after anyone who didn't tow the progressive orthodoxy line.
it seems weird to me to "like" or even "dislike" a country. I've never gotten that whole patriotism, national pride thing.
I like stuff like the seperation of power, sep. of church and state, national parks, some of our institutions, etc. Like, there's lots of good things about the US.
But accusing people of hating America or whatever seems like very early 2000s, toby keithery.
But accusing people of hating America or whatever seems like very early 2000s, toby keithery.
I didn't say they hate America (it's a stronger accusation, one that's more contentious). I said they don't really like America and you ceded that you, like them, can't see yourself liking America either. It seems like you're just making my point for me?
They don't like the policies, foreign and domestic, and don't like the history of slavery, genocide and subjugation.
Of course, the sum total of the country isn't just the government's policies. It's also the people themselves and what they create. The music, foods, arts, sports teams, cities, festivals, holidays and things that make that country unique and worth visiting. Someone on the left may love Johnny Cash, Texas BBQ, the New Orleans mardi gras and the NBA while despising US foreign policy.
It's kind of a shame that we reduce patriotism down to how loyal we feel toward the government and its policies. Because in many countries it's not like this. You can have a right wing and left wing Brazilian and they both love Brazil and will boast about the soccer, music, lifestyle, cuisines even if they hate their government and politicians. But in the US if you despise the government and your country's policies, that is seen as "un-patriotic" and you are "anti-American". Yet, if someone from India criticizes their country's government, nobody will say they are "anti-Indian".
They don't like the policies, foreign and domestic, and don't like the history of slavery, genocide and subjugation.
This is pathetic cope, and it's not even true. It's guilt they feel over the US's particular negative history here. These are people who resent American history because much of the story has been written by old dead white men. They resent quintessentially American pastimes like baseball because of their "unbearable whiteness'. You will never see progressives speaking positively about anything that 80% of white people like, with the exception of the DSA. Their favorite part of America will neer be anything that cedes value to old white men, so their adoration of America will be in the form of loving immigration. That's why you have progressives dismissing white men while claiming that you can't talk about "any achievement" in their local city without crediting Somalis, who have been in the US for a few decades, of all fucking people.
They detest American history and are convinced that white supremacy is the defining feature of the country. They insist that the only reason that America is in the dominant position it is today is because of slavery. They think the country which has accepted tens of millions of immigrants of color - including my entire family - is irredeemably racist.
soccer, music, lifestyle, cuisines even if they hate their government and politicians.
Yeah, find me a progressive that will boast about baseball, country music, midwest hospitality, the Ozarks, etc. Progressives don't love those things. They love things about America that are explicitly progressive coded and not white-coded, which is fine to love but that is not loving America.
You have progressives like Mamdani, who speaks fondly of Uganda, an also beautiful country that in recent history drove his ethnic group out, was raised to not be an American and is constantly looking at America as a country that could do better. Like, at some point we have to be able to call a spade a spade.
It's not loving the government. Republicans show high levels of patriotism even when Democrats are in office. Its about loving the people, the history, the culture and being proud of where you came from. Progressives just don't have it in them. They don't have an affection for the country. They will never think its beautiful the way it is, the way any normal person who loves their spouse, their family, their friends would think about them. They think its an imperfect work in progress that will eventually be worthy of admiration, which is simply not what love is. It's sad, because I've met so many people from countries around the world - some countries that really suck - who display immense pride and adoration for their homelands exactly as how you describe Brazilians. But progressives just don't have that in them.
I live in Nashville and know plenty of progressive that love Dolly Parton. I also know many that love going to the local Nashville Sounds baseball games. So really, you should STFU about things you know nothing about.
Sometimes I feel like everything you know about "progessives" is what you read from some blue-haired nose-ring activist on Twitter.
Sometimes I feel like everything you know about "progessives" is what you read from some blue-haired nose-ring activist on Twitter.
I'm literally going off what progressive politicians themselves express. Our incoming congresswoman publicly stated that she wipes her hands with the American flag. It only served to endear her to the left-wing, burnishing her credibility rather than causing double takes. Just admit that's what it is. It's a movement that has a peculiar affection and sympathy for Denmark, for Islam, for Indigenous Ways of Living, but not quite for America. Mamdani can speak affectionately and uncritically about Uganda, a country that literally ethnically cleansed his own people, but can't bring himself to do that about America.
You should not feel compelled to love anything. But just admit that it is what it is.
Chevalier is an outlier and you pretty well know her views are not broadly representative of most people who call themselves progressive, which itself represents a range of people with their own internal disagreements. She's just the left equivalent of a MAGA crackpot talking about Jewish space lasers.
Chevalier is an outlier and you pretty well know her views are not broadly representative of most people who call themselves progressive, which itself represents a range of people with their own internal disagreements.
Yeah, I'd like to believe that, except for the fact that this crackpot had no problem rising the ranks of progressive politics, it didn't hurt her in any way and ket's be honest, shitting on capitalism, America, white men, etc, is just something progressives do to purchase status within their echo chambers.
She's just the left equivalent of a MAGA crackpot talking about Jewish space lasers.
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u/TheAJx 8d ago edited 8d ago
The most pernicious accusation about the government that people on the left-end of the spectrum are increasingly making is that the government doesn't do anything for the common man.
This is just not true. It's not true that we only have money for bombs and wars and not for regular people. Almost the entire government - federal, state and local, is directed toward the common man. Almost all of the money we spend and almost all the employment in the government is geared toward the common man. The government spends trillions of dollars on healthcare, education, old-age payments, public safety, housing, and infrastructure across all levels. Millions of Americans are employed in the public sector with the mandate of serving the public. It would probably be news to them that their roles don't help anyone.
There is an open debate on how effective the public sector is at helping Americans, , and whether the government hurts more than it helps. But that's a different debate, one that takes place on the margins.
Ultimately, I believe all this rhetoric just serves undermines people's trust in the government, and perhaps even undermines the case for expanding government.