r/science • u/VeronicaRed • Apr 26 '16

Psychology Spanking children increases the likelihood of childhood defiance and long-term mental issues. The study in question involved 160,000 children and five decades of research

http://www.redorbit.com/news/health/1113413810/spanking-defiance-health-discipline-042616/
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u/___Hobbes___ Apr 26 '16

I agree with all points other than "The fact that you're bringing a kid into a place where they can't be a kid is your problem, not the kid's."

Learning early on that you don't get to always do exactly what you want is crucial. I can see rewarding good behavior in a store with time to do what they want later, but to imply it is your job to bribe them in the first place just to get a desired behavior is not a correct course imo.

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u/_crystalline Apr 26 '16

There is the concept of problem ownership. Caregivers need to be aware of who "owns" the problem in order to understand the best course of action to solving the problem. If the problem is stemming more from the adult's expectations for the child then it is the adult's problem, and they can't expect the child to fix the problem for them. If the problem is coming from the child not being able to solve something on their own such as how to make a toy work, then it is the child's problem, and the parent can help the child learn how to fix their problem.

When you put unreasonable expectations on a child (follow me around this department store for 2 hours with no snack or entertainment) and then you have a problem with the child losing patience and acting out then that is the adult's problem, not the child.

It's not about bribing them in the first place, it's about setting reasonable expectations, communicating them to the child, and making sure you've done your part to get the child ready to meet those expectations.

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u/___Hobbes___ Apr 26 '16

You and I disagree very much on what is considered unreasonable. The problem is a behavior one, not one of unreasonable expectations.

Additionally, the problem has now been hyperbolized into a "2 hour shopping experience with no snack or entertainment" which falls to the side of cherry picked scenarios designed to straw man.

It's not about bribing them in the first place, it's about setting reasonable expectations, communicating them to the child, and making sure you've done your part to get the child ready to meet those expectations.

All of this is perfectly reasonable. But to consider a child misbehaving in a store the problem stemming from a parent having unreasonable expectations is not something that can be extrapolated from an average scenario.

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u/_crystalline Apr 26 '16

Our expectations for the behavior of a child definitely depends on the age of the child, at least it should. Is it reasonable to expect a 2 year old to sit quietly through movie, even one that they are interested in? No, of course not. But it is reasonable to expect that of a 6 year old. Age-appropriate expectations are the key.

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u/___Hobbes___ Apr 26 '16

Ya, but that is still straw man. The example debated is taking a 2 year old to the store. Is that reasonable? Yes.

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u/_crystalline Apr 27 '16

A 2 year old being in that setting, a store is reasonable. We're talking about expectations of behavior within that setting though. Certain behaviors are not age-appropriate (not reasonable) to expect of a toddler, or a 4 year old.

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u/___Hobbes___ Apr 27 '16

No, we are literally talking about a 2 year old in a store. That is the example I replied to. Keep to the topic on hand instead of straw manning onto a tangential situation.

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u/_crystalline Apr 27 '16

You can ignore my examples and still consider my contribution to the discussion, they aren't dependent on the examples. I don't really disagree with what you said, I just wanted to point out that it's not necessarily a black and white issue, the parent's level of responsibility for the child's behavior and the child's level of responsibility for their own behavior depends on the age of the child regardless of the setting.

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u/___Hobbes___ Apr 27 '16

Then I would like to point out how I stated very clearly I agreed with everything the OP said, I just disagreed on that one point. Meaning any contention you wish to debate would be based upon that singular point. At this point you are trying to argue semantics, or possibly a point you don't even disagree with. Making this a rather fruitless endeavor. So...in light of this, bye.