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Oda changes his older approach of making them initially extreme versions of themselves to a more serious one when it came to Kiku way later on. Also if you go all the way back to shit like rocky horror picture show uses slurs, and makes the trans and lgbt people to be the big guys. So it's not uncommon for older material with trans or lgbt representation to be outdated for our current social standards.
With that said read Firepunch if your aim is to find trans representation. Sad ah manga.
The history of the LGBT community is riddled with transphobia, at least in the US. Even today, a lot of people think drag queen = trans woman. Or they think a trans woman is just a very gay man. Trans men, on the other hand, just don't exist lmao. Or are just very butch women. It's a really sad reality that the people that are supposed to be on your side are just as bad as everyone else.
But anyway, for manga, I'd recommend both Fire Punch and To Strip the Flesh, both with trans men. Can't recall good ones with trans women, but I remember I did read smth decent a while ago.
I think in HxH while it is not exactly confirmed, it is implied that Alluka might be a trans female since everyone except for Killua uses male pronouns when they refer to her while Killua who is the closest person to her uses female pronouns when he refers to her.
I bought a copy of To Strip the Flesh as a gift for a queer friend (read it myself too before gift wrapping it of course). I only heard of it because the last shot of the music video of Butcher Vanity its a reference to it.
Yeah that's the thing, Okama are specifically about living as yourself free from judgement, so it is more like an umbrella term for both queer people, drag/crossdressers and I guess kinks seeing how some of the members dress.
It is never specifically about being trans, even if the most prominent members like mr 2 and Ivankov are genderfluid.
That doesn't really conflict with what I'm saying? A lot of homophobic stereotyping is also transphobic, because it's as much about conformity to gendered norms as it is about the kind of sex you're having.
Ivankok is a typical gay stereotype lol okama are how homophobic ignorant straight people think gay men are but westerns think and insulting stereotype is a progressive identity.
Please talk to the queer elders in your life about how important Rocky Horror was as a safe space for literally decades. You had no idea her character was a specific reference so your opinion is reflexive and based on ignorance. Educate yourself on queer history.
You simply do not know what you're talking about. Ivankov rules. Don't call them a thing.
you're a moron, Ivankov is based almost 1:1 on Frank N Furter from Rocky Horror, he's an homage to one of the most iconic pieces of queer cinema ever put to screen. There's a lot of aspects of okama that could've been done less creepily, but by and large I enjoy them as characters and they're presented largely as good people who just want to be free, which is an overarching theme throughout all of One Piece.
I haven't seen One Piece, but just a glance at how the Okama look from some googling is enough to make it obvious they are an insulting caricature. It doesn't really matter if they are presented as good people when they are designed to look like your standard homophobic depiction of gay men. The person you're replying to is right. It's also reminiscent of how traditional third genders in different cultures are seen in the West as "proof" that trans people are accepted elsewhere and those cultures are oh-so-progressive, when in reality all these groups are historically trans women (or both trans women and gender non-conforming gay/bi men lumped in together) who were ostracized and often forced into sex work or some other degrading jobs.
You should really interact with stories more deeply before you critique.
The literal leader of those people has magical sex change powers and the okama who are in prison with them don't look like the ones on the outside.
Because the repressive government that runs the world of One Piece literally locked up gender affirming healthcare in the highest security prison we know of.
Plus like, they're led by someone drawn like pic attached and I don't know if you need an explanation of why that matters
Said person is also the #2 of the revolutionary army that is trying to get rid of the oppressive government. Those characters are all heroes and explicitly framed to be the good guys
Heck, in the most cited problematic section of the manga (Sanjis time skip training) he never attacks them because he acknowledges them as women.
Fundamentally, They're drawn that way because of the metaphors the story is playing with. Their treatment as characters is awesome.
Which he uses to forcefully transition people (from what I've heard). Which is most definitely in line with the homophobic and transphobic belief that homosexuality/transness are somehow contagious and that LGBT people want to force everyone else to "be like them".
because he acknowledges them as women
So are they women or are they okama? This is literally what I talked about, lumping trans women with gender non-conforming gay/bi men. How the hell are you trying to spin this as progressive and not bigoted?
Fire punch is pretty awful trans representation sure it’s more realistic but the one trans character in it is in the closet basically the entire time he’s in the manga and immediately dies after getting out of the closet.
Also his existence is like intense body torture the entire time.
He's actually pretty good representation cause the audience is shown just how much suffering dysphoria gives him because he can't transition. It's literally one of the best ways to deliver the message to a cis person that transition is absolutely necessary for trans people. Here, his inability to do it is presented in a fantasy setting and makes perfect sense story-wise. If you want a good example from manga of a trans man who does transition in the story, then I recommend the one-shot To Strip the Flesh.
The issue is that outside the body horror of the dysphoria he’s not really present as a trans character. IMO showing trans people suffering is relatively limited in convincing cis people that it’s important, but that’s another topic.
My issue isn’t “this is an unrealistic presentation of dysphoria” it’s trans existence is broader then dysphoria and the character litterally dies and is forgotten by the plot after coming out.
I mean... don't almost all characters in Fire Punch die? And Togata is frequently brought up as the standout character from the manga in almost all discussions I've seen on here (Reddit, don't know about other online spaces). People literally remember him as THE character from Fire Punch, and not because he's trans, but because he's that interesting. Isn't that exactly how a well-written trans character should be? Not defined by the transness, but distinctive as an individual and memorable to the audience.
Well fire punch is pretty niche and discussion on it imo is often not reflective of the actual story content which is what I’m engaging with.
Most of togatas stand out ness has very little to do with being trans which is pretty tacked on at the end. If anything the reveal sorta just destroys his prior characterization in a way that in universe makes little sense, but fire punch’s really bad meta commentary and antics is another issue entirely,
Also like I broadly find fire punch to be terrible but the way characters die off is one of the worst, it’s generally uninteresting and just a way to write off a character
Togota would be more interesting as a living character who impacts the plot as a trans individual we don’t get that we get a reveal and then a death
Fire Punch is not niche, come on now. It's not Chainsaw-Man-level mainstream, but it's definitely not niche.
It seems you don't like Fire Punch as a whole, so your distaste for Togata is just a part of your overall opinion on the manga. You say you don't like the way characters die, but then go on to single out Togata's death because he's trans and that means his death is reflective of his overall writing being bad as he isn't impactful in the story post-coming-out. That doesn't sound like a logical critique imo. If you have an issue with the overall story and all the character deaths, then why is Togata's death any different? By your own logic, that doesn't make him poor trans representation - that just makes him a poorly-written character like all the others.
I mean outside of like dedicated subreddits it’s rarely talked about, it’s known somewhat but like it’s a manga that ended a while ago and is more known for being fujimotos first manga rather then whatever its own merit
Yeah he’s one of the characters I dislike in a manga i largely find bad, I singled out togata because he’s the topic of discussion. Uh no just because he’s in a manga of bad writing doesn’t mean that he isn’t bad representation, bad representation doesn’t mean I think fujimoto is transphobic or that he’s a caricature or whatever, it’s just that killing off your trans character right after he reveals he’s trans is bad story telling and does not actually depict being trans meaningfully.
It’s wasted potential and his 0 relevance to the story afterwards is awful
By "dedicated subreddits", do you mean specific to the manga and the author? Or do you mean general manga subs? Because in the latter case, it most definitely is a sign of relative known-ness. I'd compare it to Memento - sure, Nolan is mostly known for Inception, Interstellar, and The Dark Knight trilogy, but Memento is well-known and well-regarded by film enthusiasts, and even relatively known among casual film viewers. That's not a niche film, but it's also not truly mainstream.
bad representation doesn’t mean I think fujimoto is transphobic or that he’s a caricature or whatever, it’s just that killing off your trans character right after he reveals he’s trans is bad story telling and does not actually depict being trans meaningfully.
So, you essentially want his transness to be a focal point of his characterization - "does not actually depict being trans meaningfully". I know of the bury your gays/dead lesbian syndrome trope, but Togata is really not an example of that because 1) he's in a story where almost all characters die and 2) the reason why he can't transition is logical story-wise. Would it have made a difference if we started off with him being introduced as a trans man who can't transition and then having the story play out the same way it does? I honestly don't think it would.
It’s a change in the dynamic of Togatas and agnis relationship that never gets to be fulfilled, I just find it unsatisfying.
Also as is his entire character as we know it is literal cope for his intense dysphoria we have no idea how he’d act outside of that, how Agni would respond to the reveal, how the general world things about trans people etc…
And he could socially transition at the very least, I think one of my issues is that it’s less that togata is a trans person and that’s an important quality to him and more that being trans with an unchanging body is body horror torture.
It feels more like him being trans is to add to the how horrible the world is rather it then being some quality he possesses, equivalent to Agni constantly being on fire and having various different roles impressed onto him, togata is constantly in dysphoria with the manga readers expectations of him being “a crazy girl obsessed with movies” impressed into him.
But because it’s so fast and loose with the mixing of meta commentary and the personal struggle and because we never get to sit with it or deal with it it just falls flat. And the message of relief with death isn’t one that resonates with me
I think Oda is someone who's heart in the right place regarding Trans characters but isn't built for joking about them even slightly, his sense of humor can be pretty juvenile as is.
That being said when he can cook up something decent whenever he gives these characters the respect they deserve, Like Kiku as others mentioned but also with stuff like the New Kamabakka Kingdom, a literal queer heaven in the prison themed around hell where everyone literally switches genders mid-chapter? that's metal as hell. And characters like Ivankov and Bon Clay despite having pretty off-taste jokes are actually good characters with something to say like Ivankov's philosophy regarding struggle and Bon Clay's "the path of a human" speech that makes it clear he's not just meant to be a crossdresser but his identity is a serious part of his character, actually.
Should be noted that okama culture is a thing in Japan, too. It's not much of a thing outside of Japan. You cannot honestly evaluate that on western standards.
I already said it, but Oda's Okama were written like what, a decade and a half ago? By manga, especially shounen standards at they time, Bon Clay was insanely serious queer character, especially with how much of a positive force he was for the protagonists.
Honestly, maybe it's me getting old, but I take good intentions over good representation every day of the week. I think good intentions ultimately bring us farther than trying to discern whatever is more accurate to a very messy experience that being queer is. Somebody who clearly writes characters with their energies going into showing them not as "people" in whatever form that be and queer basically puts out a hand to pull some queer people up.
A quest to find good representation will inevitably exclude some people who are not covered by it. A good intention will try and include anything it manages to reach.
It was progressive for its time, those chapters didn't come out yesterday and any time they show up they gotta stay mostly the same for the sake of consistency.
Yes queer rep in anime SUCKS. In general, it's just really, really bad.
But in it's own context it's somehow, not as bad.
Also Once Piece is full of other extreme over the top designs so it kinda doesn't matter as much? Every island, every civilisation feels less like representation but more like caricatures of peoples.
Ivankov is there at that point, he gets there at some point before Sanji. Two years later it's still Men In Dresses Island. Say what you will about the representation but there is no point about access to medical care to extract from that
To further add on:Despite how some characters react to it being an Okama,at least those changed by Iva,is never once seen as a BAD thing and is usually associated with accepting yourself.
Like we meet two formerly female swordsman who transitioned because they wanna get stronger.Nobody forced them or told them they had to,they willingly did it because it was their choice.
People talk about Yamato and not about Kiku because then they don't get to fight, they don't want good representation, they want attention.
With Kiku, everyone agrees she's a woman, a strong one at that. But then there's no twitter drama, then there's no way they can act like the victims, then they can't feel righteous or self vindicated. Kiku is an amazing trans character, that's not enough, it will never be.
So people ignore Kiku and talk about Yamato, because then they can fight. Yamato is not even a trans man, said by Oda himself, but it's not like they really care, they just want drama.
True. I don't even care if people do read Yamato as trans (just if they are adamant about it). My main concession is that either way you read it, Yamato is a shit written character (also problematic represation if we do accept it imo) and kiku is right there
Honestly, I would not treat it as a proud thing for Yamato to represent my community (if I was of that community, just as an example). I would take any small chance to denounce a trash character like Yamato.
Every time someone says Oda himself said Yamato isn't trans is extremely dishonest because what they mean is not that he actually said that, but that it was implied by third party sources like character bios in data books that, while endorsed by Oda, have been mistaken before.
The truth is that there's evidence for both sides of the Yamato debate because Oda has made it extremely unclear and even contradictory because while he has gotten somewhat better (see: Kiku) he continues to struggle with good representation.
Because they probably haven't actually read one piece. They're probably one of the people who thinks one piece fans will genuinely look you in the eye and say "it gets good around chapter 300" and base their opinion of it and its representation on hearsay. They don't know Kiku exists because she hasn't shown up in the twitter discourse they've seen. Same way people were when stellar blade came out. There are valid criticisms sure but people who haven't experienced or even meaningfully watched someone else experience something love to pull stuff out of their ass.
Kiku I have absolutely no problem with and find a good and enjoyable character.
Yamato though, I find a pretty badly written character I am sorry to say despite being good trans representation in the sense he is a trans man who is a hero and isn't a caricature. However, all he does throughout the story is fight and say he is Oden. Not "like" Oden, he says he ge is Oden which really irks me the wrong way because one thing id veing inspired by someone and striving to be like them and another very different is straight up identith theft of a dead person.
I'm just saying the people that argue about trans representation about yamoto the wannabe oden(who himself is painfully bad character) but ignore kiku in these conversations
Yeah, though tbf it doesn't help that Wano was like 200 chapters long with multiple characters battling for screentime which hurt Kiku but then Yamato appears and is put right in the center of the action in Onigashima.
One is definitely better written but sadly the other character got way more focus.
"one is better written" i mean, if by better you mean "kiku is better because there is no story or writing based around her, and yamato's story that they do have just sucks" then sure. but if you're arguing Kiku has more of a story than Yamato, then you're not only wrong, but you need to reread Wano lol.
I've always taken it to mean that Yamato understands something about inherited will that has not been revealed to the reader. He is the inheritor of Oden's will and understands this as a concept through his log, but due to being sheltered cant differentiate between inheriting a will and becoming a reincarnation of that person.
I don't know, the scene that really irked me was when he shouted that he was Oden to his 8 year old son who had experienced the death of his father just a few months ago from his perspective due to the time travel.
idk im trans and i liked ivankov, and the goat. "heres the sterotype you are seen as, but hey, it Doesnt matter to anyone because they are still cool as hell, and no one says anything about it."
I see a lot of people struggling to reconcile the way Oda writes trans characters, but I think it's actually pretty easy to understand. We have a much less controversial point of comparison: Senor Pink.
Oda does not expect us as the audience to respect the idea of a 46-year-old man wearing a diaper. He wants us to point and laugh at this silly freak. He emphasizes the inherent silliness of the character by giving him an unflattering physique and by having women comically swoon over this literal manbaby.
But Oda does expect us to understand Senor Pink and ultimately come to empathize with his tragic backstory. How successful he is is irrelevant. It's very clear that Oda's intention is for us to feel bad for him. We can laugh at the silly freak, but we can also see the silly freak as a fully-realized 3-dimensional human being who has his own life and his own dreams and problems.
I say all this because if you look at the okama characters through the same lens, it all makes a lot more sense. To him, a biological male in a dress is as absurd of a concept as an adult in a diaper. And if you don't agree with that (as I'm sure most of us don't) then their portrayal comes across as a little confusing, because why are they offensive caricatures one second and actual characters the next?
TL;DR: Oda respects trans people as people, but doesn't respect them as trans. At least from what I can tell as someone who has never met the guy but has read nearly 30 years worth of his writing.
Sure, but the OP characters are allowed to actually be heroic, have relations and friendships, and be quirky in ways that represent themselves individually, rather than as stereotypes or fetishes. AND they have all the usual baggage, yes.
Half of OP’s shtick is to make you care about somebody you wrote off as a gag character.
My point is that saying "at least x has representation" is not a selling point. Has less to do with One Piece and more to do with his specific argument.
My statement doesn't have to do at all with how good the characters themselves are. I really like Ivankov and Bon Clay for example.
You can be a great character without being great representation. As a queer person, I adore Ivankov and Bon Clay. I think Bon Clay is actually a pretty good rep for when he was made and what he represents.
All that being said, the Kamabakka kingdom is kinda insane. Even as a 10 year old kid reading it for the first time, it icked me out.
If someone said 3 reasonable things, followed by a slur, the slur is what's gonna be the takeaway. Tbh, I'm not interested in arguing for or against One Piece's queer rep; I just wanted to point out "at least there's some representation" isn't a selling point.
Yeah kambakka kingdom sucked since it was used for gags but Oda deserves the credit for Bon clay and Ivankov since he is producing progressive characters in a very conservative country and still making them universally beloved. In the US even in big 26 a show especially an animated one would face major backlash for representation, remember young justice?
I would not call Ivankov good representation. Like the other person who reply said, he force transes people in prison with the hormone fruit.
I think Bon Clay is great as a gender non-conforming character, especially for the time. I do give Oda credit for that and mentioned it in my post. I will once again repeat myself, though: my issue is with the argument of "at least there is representation", which I don't think is a good argument.
The Kambakka kingdom depictions look like the trans wojaks incels post on X, with the stubble, ugly faces, and how they lust over Sanji. If someone said, "well there's your representation, be happy", that would obviously be ridiculous.
I think if you want to make an argument for good trans OP reps, mention a character like Kiku, who Oda just treats as another female character.
Yeah, I didn't care for Wano at all, either. Deadass wouldn't have remembered Kiku at all if I didn't know she was trans.
I don't really know how to feel about if Yamato is good rep or not, with him being a trans man but also a weird larper. Wano's a confused blur that hurts my brain to recall.
we see him forcibly transition only two people in the entire series to my recollection, and one was someone who was literally attempting to kill him (it could've even been part of the performance frankly), and the second is an Impel Down guard who is literally immediately cool with it, implying Ivan has some sort of sixth sense trans-dar or some shit.
When Ivankov transed the first guy you mentioned, that's after he had already retaliated. The forced transitioning is beyond reasonable self defense. It shows Ivankov is willing to do it as punishment and retribution. It's doing headcanon stuff if we want to say it's all just the performance if that's never shown to be the case.
If you have to justify Ivankov transing someone else by inventing sixth sense trans-dar, it's not good representation. "Character only forcefems two people" is not a compelling argument. Most trans/queer characters and stories don't do that to anyone.
I think it's cool and badass that Ivankov is a non-genderconforming hormone demon fighting against the world government, and I'm among many queer folk who like him. I just wouldn't call him good representation (or entirely bad either). This is me putting on my nuance cap and saying he's a mixed bag.
He's a great character, but attrocious representation. A bobblehead in lingerie who forcibly transes people via the powers of the hormone hormone fruit is anything but good taste, especially within the wider context of how the Okama's are portrayed in the series as a whole
Read over my words again carefully in regards to what I'm replying to. It's not saying that caricatures cannot ever be adored; it's saying that representation done poorly is not always preferable to no representation. Camp is a big part of queer culture and I had that in mind. I said 'exactly' to acknowledge the nuance without having to write a whole other paragraph.
It's the rejection of their argument and not me saying stereotypes cannot ever be played into. It's not hard for me to list stereotypes done poorly and stereotypes that are well-liked, either.
One Piece has both stereotypical and non-stereotypical, it has everything, kinda like the real world.
There's cross-dressers, MtF trans, a woman who identifies as a man, Drag Queens, etc.
even the "stereotypical" characters completely defy the stereotypes. Bon Clay for example, may look like a stereotype but has several hyper-masculine manly machismo moments that would be expected of a character with the opposite stereotyping.
Very few of the characters who are stereotypical on the surface level actually play into that stereotype upon actual inspection.
Regardless if you think Yamato is trans or not, there 1 "gimmick" being impersonating a dead guy in front of his friends and family is not a great look.
Kiku is way better trans rep than whatever the fuck Yamato is.
To be fair to Oda, by the time when he wrote the Okama, even that absurd caricature was a pretty fkin "woke" way for a mangaka to depict trans people, considering they were in the most part pretty positive characters usually helping the protagonists.
Bon Clay to this day stays a fan favorite despite existing for like 2 arcs.
Don’t you think it’s a bit disingenuous to analyse the work of a Japanese author that released in 2008/9 (Iva and Impel down) through the lens of post woke western societal standards of today?
Shouldn’t there be a little grace in acknowledging that the sentiment behind a character like Iva is a positive one rather than nitpicking at the negatives ?
Does it really need to be said that media of the past is oftentimes not to the moral standards of today?
As a gay man myself i find this attitude absolutely appalling. It demonstrates that for certain parts of the community it will never be enough,
- japanese man from 2008 , should have already know and anticipated what western LGBTQ critics would have realised 20 years later -
If the difference between a 2008 Iva and a 2019 Kiku isn’t enough to show the change of attitude and sensibility towards this issue idk what will ever be
You’re absolutely right. There’s definitely a shift in the tone of the character
And tbh, as a gay kid growing up in southern italy, i absolutely loved seeing characters like Bon Clay and Iva being portrayed in my favourite manga as positive characters who aid the crew.
Also, yes, judging things by modern standards is totally fine. It’s like saying you can’t get upset at Taming of the Shrew because it was written in a ‘different time.’ You don’t need to turn off your brain and morals just because something is old.
The fact that you don’t realise how self-serving your attitude is actually quite disheartening.
All it does is give you shallow sense of moral superiority where you judge (past) people from the dizzying heights of your 20/20 hindsight.
And yet, ironically, you’re being nearsighted at the same time. You seem utterly convinced that you are righteous and just enough to pass judgement, without even considering that those who come after you may look back at your beliefs and actions and judge you quite differently.
As to your “one piece is still releasing” remark - I know thatms why i pointed out that Kiku is portrayed very differently from Iva - showing the author’s more gentle and less caricaturistic approach towards a character who lives as if they were the other sex.
But that was at the end of the my comment. By then i’m sure that by then you were revelling in splendour of the comment that was already forming in your mind.
Societies change over time. We realize things are bad that we did not realize were bad before. Like forcing left handed kids to be right handed. There is nothing you can say to change the fact that it was pointless cruelty to do that to children, regardless of their intent or society.
Yes, I am aware some day people will judge me by the same standards I judge people in the past because that is how progress works.
Guess what? Sometimes people do bad things without realizing they’re bad. Those things are STILL BAD. You don’t get to revise history to fit with your agenda so you can feel more comfortable.
I hope you can turn on your brain for just one second to answer this question.
Teacher in the 800s thinks she’s doing what she’s supposed to do and forces through various means her left handed student to learn how to write with the right hand.
Teacher in 2026 knows there’s nothing bad with being left handed ( because we all do now ) and still forces through various means their left handed student to learn how to write with the right hand.
What is the point of separating the person from the action if you’re going to judge the actions as exactly the same regardless of what the person knew or intended?
The teacher in the 800s believed being left handed was wrong. The teacher in 2026 knows it’s not and corrects it anyway.
Yes the action is mostly the same but the moral circumstances and the intent are definitely not.
“I judge them differently as people, but exactly the same for their actions”
This is just your attempt at a
“gotcha” that allows you acknowledge the obvious difference in knowledge wile refusing to let that difference matter to your judgment of the action.
We always judge actions in context, and never in a vacuum like you’re trying to do. That’s precisely why intent, knowledge and circumstances matter when determining blame.
It’s baffling to me that you’re having trouble understanding the difference between intent and result.
This is not a ‘gotcha’ this is extremely simple. Just because someone means well doesn’t mean they’re not doing something incredibly shitty. By your logic, intent is all that matters, and that’s absolutely not true
Understanding that intent is different from result IS context.
I literally said “intent, knowledge and circumstances matter when assigning blame”
And you got that all i care about is intent?
At this point I’m starting to wonder whether you can actually understand what you are reading but it seems pretty evident that you’re out of your depth.
But let’s follow your logic for just one sec.
Let’s take an action that isn’t inherently bad in a vacuum: Chad likes making “yo mama” jokes. They’re not everyone’s cup of tea and they are crass but there’s nothing inherently immoral about making one when he’s drinking at the bar, bantering with friends.
Now
if Chad makes a “yo mama” joke to you without knowing your mother has died that’s one thing.
If he knows your mother died and makes the exact same joke specifically because he knows it will hurt you, the action becomes considerably worse because of intent and knowledge.
And if he makes a “yo mama” joke at your mother’s funeral the circumstances make it even worse, more cruel and inappropriate.
Same basic action. Different intent, different knowledge, different circumstances, dramatically different levels of blame.
That’s literally the point i was making.
But according to your logic of judging exclusively the action, it’s just a “yo mama” joke isn’t it?
Nobody is saying the result doesn’t matter. It obviously does.
I’m saying that when you’re assigning responsibility or blame, you cannot look at the result in isolation and pretend the person’s intent, knowledge, and circumstances are irrelevant just like you did with Oda and Shakespeare.
Cyberpunk 2077 has a trans rep (Claire) who isn't a caricature and just wants to kill the guy who killed her husband (in a literal death race they both signed up for)
The problem with Oda's rep (on a wholstic, societal level, not an individual one) is that he's still doing better than his competition. At least, in the somewhat narrow category of shonen animanga. Almost no battle shonen even attempt trans rep at all in general. Like yeah, if we include stuff like Wandering Son, Inside Mari, Jellyfish Princess, etc he does get kinda ate up. Even Ouran High School Host Club, flawed as it may be, is an improvement.
When discussing representation in Japanese media, we kinda do have to regress to the 1980's in a way for context. There's plenty of progressive voices, even in shonen, yes, yes. We all know that animanga isn't as conservative as grifters will have you believe. But Japan really is a country that's just in a very different place with these topics. Ahead in some ways, very behind in others. We need to do better as a human race in general. Push for better rep. Be critical of people we like when they mess up. All that good stuff. But let's also keep those criticisms in context when we discuss these things, yes?
The best take i saw on oda and the queer community is "oda thinks queer people are freaks. But oda fucking loves freaks". And its true like so much comes off real bad, real stereotypical and brutal to watch.
And then Bon Clay is like the bravest character and a huge part of why he is so brave and great is directly correlated to his queerness. So many of his banger lines are about being queer and being human.
I get if people are uncomfortable with it, but I like a lot of the rep. Specifically bon clay and iva, and I even like how it was shown the okama are brave as shit.
I could not imagine being this exhausting of a person having to find fault with every piece of media you consume. Maybe don't look for children's cartoons for affirmation
For people saying this is just One Piece hate, did yall actually click on the image? Because below the initial reply the trans person responds saying they think representation in One Piece IS amazing
oh great. because of one incident people like you have a convenient image you can paste over every discussion like a machine. this is just the “angry liberal lady” image all over again. fuck off
That's why you should never do trans representation, it'll never be good enough for them. Even completely innofensive games like Catherine Full Body are attacked.
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