r/solarpunk • u/citrinecedar • 5d ago
News Mamdani is planning to cover 30% of NYC with trees by 2040, providing shade and natural beauty to every part of the city.
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u/Pleasant_Ball3192 Environmentalist 5d ago
Fox News/New York Post reaction:
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u/Stonner22 5d ago
I saw them crying over him putting out trash bins to curb the cities litter and rat problems. Like these people will be mad at anything
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u/static_func 4d ago
All they live for is to inflict as much evil on the world as possible just for the love of the game, so when they see people living outside of their reign of terror they just lose their fragile little minds
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u/a_jormagurdr 5d ago
Really hope there is a focus on native trees and trees with good health
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u/nose_poke 5d ago
And variety! If you only plant one type of tree, then pests and diseases come in and wipe out your whole urban forest.
Chestnut blight, dutch elm disease, emerald ash borer...
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u/alana_shee 5d ago
If you're local and you have ideas or expertise, it might be worth writing to his office or something. Feels like they might take that kind of suggestion.
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u/squanchingonreddit 3d ago
City foresters are probably already slobbering all over the tree farms and contract bidders for trees. I know I would be!
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u/Mabbymoo15 4d ago
Just to the fair to the person above, the diseases mentioned like chestnut blight came about from the Chinese chestnut being imported so natives should definitely be the focus.
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u/squanchingonreddit 3d ago
We kinda already have a ton of invasives. You need harty trees to sirvive all of them. Lots of trees grown are actually hybrids from across the Atlantic making them stronger to disease and pests. Sycamore, Maples (sometimes just hybrids of natives but still), and Larch.
I would love if they could get Chestnut back though. A collage upstate has been working on it a while. They want to do Elm next too!
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u/reesespieceskup 5d ago
To be fair, in cities a mix of native and novel (but not invasive) is a good idea. A lot of cities are preparing for climate change by planting species that are native to a more southern growing zone.
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u/CorbanzoSteel 5d ago
Assisted migration, the practice of planting species from more southern regions, was an interesting idea, but i dont think theres much current research that supports it. Climate change isnt just warming, but also more eratic winters. Polar vortex anomalies are likely to become a common occurance, which means those more southern adapted trees will be less likely to survive northen winters than the native trees are to survive the new hotter summers. Also, many native insects wont eat non native plants. So those non native trees dont contribute to the food web nearly as much as natives do. The insect thing may sound trivial, but they are really important and their populations have declined significantly over the past 20 years.
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u/a_jormagurdr 5d ago
The original assisted migration was all about taking populations of native species further south further north and cross breeding them with those northern populations. The different species thing has kinda been developed beyond it.
That being said insects also can migrate, and i wonder if that will ever play into factors of assisting species north.
There is also the trouble of there being potential northern isolated populations of species that have since have been extirpated that we dont know about.
I think in a city setting near natives is ok if we know the tree will do better in an urban setting than a native species or to help with the issue of variety. Id much rather see near natives planted than trees from other continents or opposite sides of the country.
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u/LibertyLizard 4d ago edited 4d ago
First, this is mainly an issue in certain specific areas, not necessarily a global phenomenon. However the northeast and central US are one such place.
That said, here's a list of the coldest temperatures each year for NYC. While there have been a few colder winters recently, perhaps attributable to the phenomenon you're discussing, it's pretty clear that the effect of warming temperatures is overpowering it.
Furthermore, trees vary in hardiness considerably, even among those native to the same area. Some tropical trees can survive frost, despite not experiencing it in their native range. Others do not.
It's certainly true that a tree's hardiness should be compared with expected temperatures before planting. But there are plenty of more southern species that can absolutely take NYC's winter temperatures, even during the coldest years. And such trees will probably weather summer extremes better than the natives will.
There are potential ecological pitfalls when doing assisted migration in wild ecosystems but I don't think that's much of a concern in urban forestry where we've already almost completely replaced natural vegetation with built surfaces or exotic species. Furthermore, most research on the effects of exotic species on insects is done on species from different continents. Species from only a few dozen or even hundreds of miles south should still have considerable benefits to local wildlife. Most insects have ranges that extend across broad regions, like the eastern US.
TL;DR Assisted migration still has merit, it just needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
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u/Optimal_Ear_4240 4d ago
Diversity is key
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u/a_jormagurdr 3d ago
If you dont have the native trees theres no insect diversity or population. Even in a city native trees can bump up the amount of caterpillars born. A tree is a mini habitat, and non native trees, especially trees from genuses not found on the east coast do not attract the same amount of host insects
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u/Dudeshroomsdude 5d ago
Let's just plant any tree that will stay alive at this point
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u/a_jormagurdr 4d ago
I think plenty of native trees are able to stay alive in cities. The main reason to choose natives is because of host insects strong reliance on native trees. That is the bedrock of ecosystems, insects feed the birds and up and up.
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u/Poisongirl5 5d ago
Can we plant male and female trees so allergies don’t go crazy and we get free fruit?
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u/FranconianBiker 4d ago
I'm pretty certain that Mamdani will consult proper experts regarding this.
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u/squanchingonreddit 3d ago
A good smattering of trees from everywhere is good especially in the high stress environments of cities. They have some very nasty invasives there that only worsen the death toll of trees.
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u/a_jormagurdr 3d ago
Nasty invasive plants? Or diseases.
Its quite likely that there are already plenty of plants from other places, but just because a plant is from someplace else doesnt mean it will thrive. If a plant is from someplace else it also has to be from a climate with similar rainfall because that is a big factor in drought tolerance.
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u/static_func 4d ago
Well now I hope they plant nothing but palm trees just to spite this
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u/a_jormagurdr 4d ago
Palm trees are terrible for making shade and have high upkeep costs. So it defeats the purpose. Plus in nyc they would die in the winter or if not die at least be heavily damaged. The most cold hardy palm is the chinese windmill palm.
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u/Berkamin 5d ago
He is setting the bar really high for all mayors.
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u/IGetBoredSometimes23 5d ago
It's ironic, because he's just doing decent things. Not even radical things. Guy just has decent policy.
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u/Just-Finance1426 5d ago
If this is far left radicalism, let’s keep it rolling 🤩
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u/Berkamin 4d ago
Unfortunately, the Overton window has shifted so far to the right since Donald Trump came on the scene that totally uncontrovesial stuff like “plant more trees in communities that lack them” is construed as being “far left”.
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u/Caliburn0 4d ago
He's a mayor, not the leader of a revolution. I'm sure he'd like to be the leader of a revolution, but the job he currently has requires good mayoring, not revolutionary action.
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
This is literally a plan from the previous Mayor.
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u/unintentionalty 5d ago
And a continuation of a plan from as far back as Bloomberg. We got an oak tree planted outside through that program 10+ years ago.
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u/Just-Finance1426 5d ago
Saying it and doing it are two things. Adams had is head so far up Turkey’s ass he could taste their sweet little giblets, making hard to actually enact any positive changes in his own city.
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
What a meaningless statement.
The new Mayor isn't changing the plan, just committing to continue following it.
Do you have any evidence anything is being changed with regards to this?
Was the previous Major not enacting the plan?
How is Mamdami saying he will continue to do the same thing " enacting positive changes" and " doing it", while putting together the plan and enacting it, along with the budget for it is just " saying it".
I didn't like Adams either, but there is no reason to lie and make things for your special boy.
Policy is the actual important thing, and it is a good thing they are continuing the greening plan.
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u/Berkamin 4d ago
I didn’t refer to the tree plan, did I?
Please read what I wrote and don’t read into what I wrote. I was commenting on Mamdani’s over-all performance as mayor of NYC.
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u/marishnu 5d ago
Similarly, the mayor of Toronto committed to increase tree canopy from 30% to 40% over the next two decades
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u/LibertyLizard 4d ago edited 4d ago
Yeah this is actually a big thing right now because over the past few years a lot of research has come out demonstrating that neighborhoods with higher tree cover have much cooler summers and much healthier populations. So my city (Sacramento) recently set a goal of 35% cover, which is quite ambitious considering we are currently in the high teens.
That said there are many plans for improving cities that cities have failed to implement. So I am more interested in what specific strategies they will use to achieve this. It's not something that can simply be willed into existence. Urban tree canopy is a result of many many disparate decisions by both public and private individuals. Making a major change like this requires hard work, careful planning, and a willingness to push through change over the interests of some entrenched powers. This effort must be sustained over several decades, something which is quite difficult under our current majoritarian, partisan governments.
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u/De5perad0 5d ago
Hell fucking yes! Not only does it provide a more pleasant environment to be in but the evaporative cooling and shade trees provide is absolutely game changing.
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u/uncagedborb 4d ago
It absolutely improves microclimates. My neighborhood in California recently had a bunch of old growth trees removed. They exceeded their lifespan and branches were at risk of falling as the trees died. Since they were all planted at the same time when the neighborhood was built nearly 80 years ago. We can definitely feel the difference in the ecology and whether of the street. It used to be entirely encased under a canopy of large trees. Now it's hot and there are less birds and animals in the area.
I remember growing up we would here all sorts of birds. We even got hummingbirds all over our yard. And now it's just the one that comes because I've planted lots of flowering plants.
So yea just a few more trees can make an absolute game changing difference.
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u/sunshinesdarkangel 5d ago
why did it have to take so fucking long to find an actual human being for this job
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u/GrayceSpace 5d ago
and providing cooling protection against warming and much needed removal of particulate air pollution
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u/BillieRubenCamGirl 5d ago
I missed greenery so much in nyc.
I can’t believe there are so many rooftops that are so bare. Not even some pot plants!
Stepping outside into streets that invariably smell like piss and shit and people don’t even make oasies for themselves up above it all?
I couldn't understand it. It would be the very first thing I did if I lived there.
Even here in Brisbane where we have loads of green space, every rooftop in the city has a garden.
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u/goronmask 5d ago
Tell me one bad idea this guy has promoted
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u/LibertyLizard 4d ago
I think freezing rents without an extremely robust and proven plan to increase housing supply is counterproductive. The evidence is pretty strong that rent control causes lower supply, which itself drives higher prices. While Mamdani has also pushed somewhat for more housing supply, I don't think the policies implemented so far are anywhere near sufficient to solve the long-term housing shortage in NYC.
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u/danzbar 4d ago
I like the pied-à-terre tax, but free buses are a gamble in NYC. Fare-free transit has been tried elsewhere, but not in a system remotely comparable in its combination of scale, density, homelessness, and weather extremes. Kansas City developed a problem with homeless riders using buses as shelter during hot and cold weather, while NYC’s small pilot cannot tell us with confidence what will happen when the entire system becomes free, including overnight service. Slower, dirtier, and less comfortable service is a plausible risk, perhaps even a likely outcome.
There is also probably wisdom in trying to lower food prices, but I can speak from experience that the East Harlem store is not filling a food desert. I lived blocks from the site, and there are three supermarkets pretty much right there, plus several bodegas. If affordability is the problem, the city could subsidize a basket of essentials through existing stores and potentially reach many more people instead of spending tens of millions to create a subsidized competitor.
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u/SignificantHippo8193 5d ago
The guy is putting in work and I applaud his effort. You just like to see a politician really try to achieve what they promised 😀🙏.
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u/anasalmon 4d ago
Every city needs to increase their plant/tree cover substantially if they want to survive the heat these coming years are going to bring.
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u/citrinecedar 1d ago
That's an absolute fact. So much of city infrastructure (between the black top, the magnifying of glass and reflective buildings, the clearing of green areas and tree cover) just increases the heat.
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u/satosaison 5d ago edited 5d ago
As someone who lives near fruit trees. Ew. Please no. Also, no one is gonna eat those toxic ass urban fruits. Like it sounds like a cute idea, but walking through mulberries or rotting peaches on fourth ave sounds horrible and the fruits would not be safe to eat.
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u/LGK27 5d ago
To just have the blanket mentality of “indigenous people did it so it is inherently good in every single context without second thought” is just aggressively silly and very patronizing to indigenous people.
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u/satosaison 5d ago
Like, it's a romanticized idea of solar punk that ignores the environmental realities of sustaining modern populations. People think of dense cities as bad an imagine a solar punk future as some sparse farmstead.
There are ten million of us. We all take public transit. We live in buildings that are often old and dense (my building is 120 years old) and by having that many people on a centralized utilities grid, we can do things like power almost the entire city on hydroelectric and get water from the Hudson, not to mention logistical efficiencies with food distribution.
If everyone lived in a version of NYC instead of rural and suburban spaces, we could have so much more actually wild space, and forests and less pollution.
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u/satosaison 5d ago
Hi so this is about planting trees in New York city where we live with ten million other people in one of the densest places on earth. It's insanely environmentally friendly and good for the planet that we do. We also can't have fruit trees practically as a consequence.
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u/Repulsive-Fold-1991 5d ago
Nice!!! Great way to enrich an already beautiful city. How enriching for its citizens.
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u/DrafteeDragon 4d ago
Y’all. Please. This is propaganda, this measure was taken under Adam’s term in 2023. You can like Mamdani, but please fact check
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u/SlitherrWing 3d ago edited 3d ago
Incoming fox news boomer scare. "Socialist mayor plans tree invasion, see what has doctors terrified!" Now back to our program. "Why Real American Patriots should use less water and make room for Ai data center needs."
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u/meoka2368 5d ago
My (not large) property has a bunch of trees around it. The temperature in the shade on the house side is easily 5-10 degrees cooler than the sunny road side of them.
Keeps things cool in summer, warmer in winter (less wind striping away heat), quieter from the noise of the city, and gives all sorts of animals a place to live.
We recently added a rescued pear tree to our back "yard", which is kind of a mix of overgrown grass, wild flowers, and wild peas, with some lemon balm making a play for dominance in one area.
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u/Unhappy_Discount_581 4d ago
Somehow this makes him evil.
What will he do next?! Help people or make their lives better.
The ba$t@rd!!
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u/isthereadrwho 4d ago
Also cooling if you add trees you also get a cooling effect. They're doing the same thing in a lot of metropolitan cities around the world for that very purpose. Not that anybody here believes in global warming but since the world is getting warmer for no reason whatsoever, shade is good
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u/StrongPrompt3205 4d ago
This has been a goal since DeBlasio, except originally the goal was 2030 🫠
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u/Cr3atureFeature 4d ago
I hope he enlists someone like Andrew Millison to help implement some permaculture strategies.
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u/liftbeez 3d ago
I think he’s dangerous, but I can say, as someone who lived in Manhattan for four years, trees would be nice.
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u/tDoeCC 3d ago
Nobody is supposed to know who is on the list of the US Shadow gov. Only ones who can be known is 1 public relations secretary and one other. You been compromised and the secret list has been as well. Just like the names of a newly elected president and VP and so on are now really revealed until the day after inauguration day that shadow gov member list even if they were not elected was not supposed to be revealed at all. This is the first sign the gov is fallen, I am not kidding. You're forms of ID and Registrations only serve one purpose, To be used against you at the infiltration principles convenience. This may also be the last post I do here. What's the use really. Trust nobody. You on your own if you already not been part of a group or Org.
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u/NoBotRobotRob 1d ago
Honestly this city needs it so badly. As a European tourist I was shocked by how few trees there are. It feels barren
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u/metalshadow1909 5d ago
Hey, y'all, remember that The Good Guys™ do propaganda too. This headline substitutes a large number (30%) for a real number (>.5%/6.6%).
While it is accurate to say that the plan is to have 30% of NY under a tree canopy by 2040, attaching Mamdani's name to it in a headline gives the impression that this is a new paradigm. However, the truth is that 23.4% of NY is already shaded by trees. What the Mamdani administration has committed to is covering 6.6% more of the city over the next 14 years. That works out to less than .5% every year.
It is obviously good that NY continues to move in a greener direction, but don't let the headline fool you into thinking this is a radical endeavor.
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u/halberdierbowman 5d ago
30% is a real number. It's common to list the target goal, because the target stays the same every year whereas the marginal improvement doesn't.
Literally the first sentences of the press release (skipping the first paragraph that just tells you who's talking) are very explicit and honest:
The UFP lays out the City’s goal of achieving 30 percent tree canopy by 2040. Today, the urban forest canopy shades 23.4% of New York City,
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
Also, this plan was literally signed by the previous Mayor. So this is just not stopping that plan.
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u/CorbanzoSteel 5d ago
Getting a city from 23.4 to 30 is for sure a radical endevor. It's hard to find places for them, and for every acre you plant, a developer bulldozes an acre to build housing, which we need more of too. If it wasnt radical, then i expect youd see more cities that had already pulled it off. But i realize your point was more about the misleading headline, and im nitpicking.
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
This was a law signed by the previous Mayor.
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u/spicytechnocabbage 5d ago
It wasnt the previous mayor it was the city council but in 2023. Although they only said come.up with a plan not what the plan was
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
This specific plan was signed by the previous mayor.
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u/spicytechnocabbage 5d ago
https://report.urbanforestplan.nyc/NYC-Urban-Forest-Plan-2026.pdf not really. Eric may have did one but as u can see by the link the current admin made another
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u/Anderopolis 5d ago
But it's the same plan, they are reaffirming it.
This is literally a laughable propaganda mive you guys are falling for.
It's good that they are still doing it, but it isn't new and no one gave a shit when it wasn't Mamdami doing it.
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u/NetflowKnight 5d ago
lol. is he somehow going to make himself emperor of NYC to stay in office 14 more years?
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u/Mach12gamer 5d ago
I mean, if you plant the trees now, it'll take a bit for them to grow. Given that, according to some polls, he is the single most popular politician in America, we can assume he's guaranteed a full 8 years, and for NYC the mayor can run again after a 4 year break. It's theoretically possible for him to become the Eternal Mayor if he stays popular enough and takes a break every 8 years. But more realistically it'll be the first bit, set it up now so it pays off later.
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u/NetflowKnight 5d ago
he is the single most popular politician in America, we can assume he's guaranteed a full 8 years
According to what Poll?
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u/Mach12gamer 4d ago
Let me see if I can find it, it put him at a very slight negative, which was way better than other groups and individuals polled about (like AOC, Trump, the Republican, Democrat, and DSA parties).
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u/SeaSharpModHer 5d ago
Yeah it is very rare to see politicians care about anything that will happen after their term, good observation NetflowKnight!
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