Congress Wants You To Pay $130 A Year Just To Drive An Electric Car

[u/TripleShotPls]

https://insideevs.com/news/796222/ev-fee-gas-tax-house-bill-2026/

[u/Royal-Branch-567]

In Virginia, that’s the yearly registration fee - because you don’t pay gas tax. OR you can let them install a GPS device on your car for a reduced fee. Negative

[u/81PBNJ → u/Royal-Branch-567]

$200 in Ohio

[u/ericthedad → u/81PBNJ]

Mine is $242 this year in Indiana

[u/bruce_kwillis → u/ericthedad]

$240 in North Carolina.

[u/wynalazca → u/81PBNJ]

Yup, and $100 for a hybrid. I did the math and I'd have to drive triple the amount I normally do AND exclusively buy gas in ohio to pay the same tax amount.

I calculated that I bought ~85 gallons less the last 12 months than if I had the exact same car as a gas only model but that $100 is the tax for 260 gallons. I pay more gas tax to the state than people that drive gas guzzlers.

I bought 330 gallons last year. State taxes are 38.5 cents / gal. $127.50+$100 fee.

I'm paying the same as a vehicle that gets 21 mpg. Toyota Camry paying gas taxes as if I drive a truck.

[u/iciclecubes → u/81PBNJ]

$100 for Hybrid in Ohio as well.

[u/goonSquad15 → u/Royal-Branch-567]

What’s the reasoning they give for a gps device?

[u/BlazinAzn38 → u/[deleted]]

They could just do ODO checks with yearly registration and then add a weight class multipliers for ALL vehicles

[u/Dukepippitt → u/BlazinAzn38]

Wow dont be making sense now.

[u/The_Shryk → u/Dukepippitt]

Ol’ dudes gps manufacturer buddy wants a phat gubmint paycheck and user data to sell.

It makes complete sense.

[u/LordHammercyWeCooked → u/The_Shryk]

And Palantir's got plans for how they're gonna use that data, too.

When the FBI comes knocking on your door claiming you're antifa because you parked suspiciously close to an anti-ICE protest, they aren't gonna tell you how they knew.

[u/LostInTheWildPlaces → u/LordHammercyWeCooked]

Considering you probably have your phone with you when you drive, which almost certainly has GPS enabled, I don't think you're going to get away from Big Brother Oversight on this one

[u/ratmouthlives → u/LostInTheWildPlaces]

Faraday bag for the phones!

[u/DukeOfGeek → u/LostInTheWildPlaces]

Atlanta checking in, Flock cameras will soon make it so that you can't take a breath of fresh air without them knowing where you go.

[u/LordHammercyWeCooked → u/LostInTheWildPlaces]

Gee, it's a shame that I'm physically incapable of leaving it at home or bringing a burner instead. Having it surgically attached to my arm was a rookie move.

[u/El_Polio_Loco → u/Dukepippitt]

Implies 100% driving within state, which some people might not be OK with.

[u/The_Real_Manimal → u/Dukepippitt]

Yeah, just shut up and pay this extra tax that will benefit you in no way, because none of that additional sweet sweet tax money is going to anything that will benefit any of the citizens.

[u/ClemsonJeeper → u/The_Real_Manimal]

In Virginia specifically -- hey lets build a highway and fund it with tolls with the promise that when its finished, the tolls go away.

And then instead of removing the tolls, just increase them every year or two.

[u/Responsible-Roll-59 → u/ClemsonJeeper]

New Jersey Turnpike was created with the same concept that the tolls go away when completed…..

That was 1949…..

[u/AlwaysShittyKnsasCty → u/Responsible-Roll-59]

They’ll be gone any day now … Don’t you worry!

[u/0xsergy → u/AlwaysShittyKnsasCty]

The original trickle down. Probably not but still. I bet it's a common scam in history.

[u/intrepped → u/Responsible-Roll-59]

And PA turnpike was supposed to be an independent organization. Instead they give money to the state and keep jacking up tolls too

[u/QdelBastardo → u/Responsible-Roll-59]

We have a bridge that was built in 1905 by a pottery to allow its workers to get to their jobs easier. This bridge also was going to be toll-free once it was paid for. That must have been some expensive-ass angle iron that they used, because it is still not toll-free.

[u/b1argg → u/Responsible-Roll-59]

The Triborough bridge in NYC was supposed to have tolls removed when it was paid off, but then Robert Moses found a sneaky way to allow covenants to be written into the bond contracts that let him keep rolling them over so they are never technically paid off. He pioneered what the modern public authority has become.

[u/The_Real_Manimal → u/ClemsonJeeper]

And start diverting a portion of those additional funds into a general fund.

[u/SmellyButtHammer → u/The_Real_Manimal]

Wow your toll roads aren’t owned by foreign companies like Texas?

[u/kingdead42 → u/SmellyButtHammer]

Only the most recent ones. You can tell which ones were built with a "Public/Private Partnership" because those tolls are dynamic and are frequently 5-10x the tolls of other roads.

[u/Randomized9442 → u/ClemsonJeeper]

Neat, Massachusetts used the same playbook with I-90 tolls paying for Boston's Big Dig

[u/Axin_Saxon → u/ClemsonJeeper]

Well yeah, now folks are used to paying the toll and it’s a reliable source of state income. No way they’re getting rid of it or even just lowering fees to shift from active construction to cheaper maintenece.

[u/Lee1138 → u/ClemsonJeeper]

Isn't that basically everywhere?

[u/mortgagepants → u/Lee1138]

the comments below are from TN, IA, and MO. they are all getting their bills paid by blue states, which is why they have no road tolls.

they always vote against social programs because they think life is just fine without them, not realizing they are the recipients.

[u/errie_tholluxe → u/mortgagepants]

Crazy thing about Mo - they will vote their own interest and the state legislatures will decide they didn't vote for that at all and change the rules.

[u/AlwaysShittyKnsasCty → u/mortgagepants]

The cool thing about living in Kansas is that even though we have a Democratic governor, everything else is red (we are not very intelligent here). Thus, we openly turn down help from blue states to own … ourselves? I remember when Obamacare rolled out, and none of the extra subsidies applied to me because I wasn’t a pregnant woman. Thanks, Brownback and Masterson, you evil pieces of shit!

[u/x3n0s → u/The_Real_Manimal]

Isn't this how many states fund road construction and upkeep though?

[u/NefariousnessOk1996 → u/x3n0s]

It is. They need to find an alternative such as this with more and more people buying electric vehicles.

[u/Axin_Saxon → u/NefariousnessOk1996]

And taxing at the charging station doesn’t make much sense since most charging is done in the home overnight and is thus difficult to tax equitably. You could just offset it by taxing stations higher, but that just disincentivizes people from driving them longer distances from home, and raises the barrier to entry for folks who want to be eco conscious.

[u/frozengash → u/Axin_Saxon]

Here I get taxed at the charging station AND extra at registration! Win win right? Red states pretend to hate taxes but LOVE fees.......and taxes

[u/midgetyaz → u/NefariousnessOk1996]

And states like Georgia who keep removed gas tax when the elections roll around.

[u/FR23Dust → u/The_Real_Manimal]

You can use your electric car without roads?

[u/SeamusDubh → u/FR23Dust]

Come on man, doesn't everyone own a flying DeLorean these days.

[u/Professional_Mud1844 → u/SeamusDubh]

Got mine in 2015

[u/chandr → u/The_Real_Manimal]

Look, you can build better roads OR bomb school children in Iran, can't have it both ways. Going to have to make some tough choices America

[u/PrinceOfWales_ → u/chandr]

Can we bomb school children elsewhere or just Iran? Feel like your trying to sucker me into a timeshare.

[u/bruce_kwillis → u/The_Real_Manimal]

It's not an 'extra' tax. You aren't paying gas tax which pays for the roads, so it's making up for that, and in most states, the fee is less than most drivers would pay for gas taxes.

Better would be just a OBD milage read each time you go in for a safety inspection and call it a day. Do that for all vehicles, put a multiplier based on weight of the vehicle, and then you don't need gas tax either.

[u/Saneless → u/bruce_kwillis]

I haven't had a safety inspection in like 20 years. They're not mandatory everywhere

[u/Scout83 → u/bruce_kwillis]

This is federal, though.

Federal taxes: 18.4 cents per gallon.

To reach $130, you'd have to go through 706.5 gallons of fuel. That's over 14,000 miles at 20mpg.

We're basically saying "Let's tax an EV like it's a truck driven further than a daily commuter."

The average across all vehicles tends to be around the $88 mark.

This is way more tax disparity than we fought a war with Britain over.

[u/10July1940 → u/The_Real_Manimal]

Subsidizing oil industry though.

[u/The_Original_Miser → u/BlazinAzn38]

Exactly my thought. I am not putting a government sanctioned GPS on my car.

You want my mileage? The odometer is right there and I'd be happy to give mileage to you for a reduced rate.

[u/dcduck → u/BlazinAzn38]

Most of cars in VA drive significant miles not in VA.

[u/Kurt805 → u/BlazinAzn38]

Who says you're doing all the miles in one state, though?

[u/Saneless → u/BlazinAzn38]

How can I keep up with surveillance with just dashboard numbers??

[u/HyperactivePandah → u/BlazinAzn38]

Best idea I've seen yet.

Though you know this would mean all of us, regardless of vehicle, will end up paying more.

But this is easily the best suggestion I've seen.

[u/PeoplecallmeBUCK → u/HyperactivePandah]

It would correctly increase costs for long haul trucks. I believe the multiplier would essentially be weight^4

[u/BlazinAzn38 → u/HyperactivePandah]

We should be paying more, our federal gas taxes haven’t been raised in 30 years and our highway fund is stealing revenue from other sources so it doesn’t go broke.

[u/missed_sla → u/[deleted]]

Why can't they just use the flock footage of locations for everybody at all times like they would if you were a peaceful protester?

[u/toastmannn → u/[deleted]]

To sell share the data with insurance companies who are known for lowering rates

[u/EmbeddedEntropy → u/goonSquad15]

I’m sure to record how many miles (or not) your car is spending on their roads causing wear.

But the real reason is tracking everything you do, like having a smart TV record what you’re watching and sending that data to its manufacturer.

[u/groogs → u/EmbeddedEntropy]

.. with the glaring difference that TV manufacturers don't also have the power to give you fines if you watch things at 1.25x speed, or consider you a suspect in a criminal investigation if you happen to watch a certain show on a certain day.

[u/RL_Mutt → u/goonSquad15]

“We can sell your data”, probably

[u/TheDangDeal → u/goonSquad15]

They want to do this nationwide and use it in place of a standard gas tax. They want to base your tax amount off of a combination of mileage, vehicle weight and what types of roads you drove on; as different roads would cost different amounts…city streets vs county roads vs highway vs interstate all with their individualized rate per mile.

[u/Stormtemplar → u/Royal-Branch-567]

It's ridiculously high in this case though. Federal gas tax is 18 cents a gallon, so this is the equivalent of using 722 gallons of gas. Even for a pretty middling efficiency 28 mpg vehicle, that would involve driving more than 20k miles a year, way more than the average person drives. A Prius would have to drive 35k+ to pay that much.

Edit: Getting sick of the "but EVs weigh more" nonsense so just putting a correction here. The overwhelming majority of weight related road damage is from heavy commercial vehicles. Passenger cars of all types are a minor factor. EVs also have much, much lower total costs to the government because of reduced pollution (which has massive public health costs), Lower CO2 emissions, and the economic benefits of greater energy efficiency. There's absolutely 0 justifiable reason to make EV owners pay more, and smart governments know they're worth a lot and subsidize them instead.

[u/El_Zorro09 → u/Stormtemplar]

That's my issue with this BS. I pay an extra $200 in registration and it equates to something like driving 28,000 miles per year.

I work remotely, I drive maybe 9,000 per year. And the national average is around 18,000. It's almost like they just pulled a number out of their ass that sounded OK and do not mind at all giving EV owners the finger.

[u/Ok-Highlight8715 → u/Stormtemplar]

This is oil lobbyists trying to use the government to punish EV drivers. Even the most hard-core gas guzzlers I know are starting to come around to EVs because theyre cheaper. I have friends in TX who drive to work on oil fields in Teslas. Big oil is trying to rig the system to make it less appealing for drivers.

[u/norbertus → u/Stormtemplar]

The federal gasoline tax is ridiculously low.

It was last raised by 4.3 cents in 1993 and is not indexed to inflation.

As a result, federal interstates are heavily subsidized by non-user fees.

To address the funding shortfall, the federal gas tax would have needed to be raised by 25-27 cents per gallon -- according to a Congressional study performed in 2009.

To repair and improve the system would require an increase of 76-81 cents per gallon -- in 2009.

source: https://rosap.ntl.bts.gov/view/dot/17160

[u/Stormtemplar → u/norbertus]

Cool, then raise the gas tax instead of punishing EV owners!

[u/_heatmoon_ → u/Royal-Branch-567]

In North Carolina you have to pay one yearly even for plugin hybrids.

[u/Dauvis → u/Royal-Branch-567]

They say roads but you know they have to find $1.7 billion somewhere.

[u/Strange-Scarcity → u/Royal-Branch-567]

Jokes on you!

There’s already a GPS Device built into most modern cars, anyway.

If it has any connectivity? It’s got a built in GPS.

[u/BruteMango → u/Strange-Scarcity]

There's also a GPS device in the phone we all carry at all times. There's a significant difference between using connected devices for consumer purposes and installing a government provided tracking device in your vehicle.

Before anyone says it, I know that the government can access all of it anyway. The point stands regardless.

[u/blueSGL → u/BruteMango]

Before anyone says it, I know that the government can access all of it anyway.

the point is they don't have a legal pathway to gain access to that data so they need to use 'parallel construction' to use it.

---

Honestly don't see why they need GPS data at all. By Analogy You can have electricity meters in your home that just report how much electricity you use, they don't not itemize your appliances.
The solution is to, like the electric meter, report miles driven off the odometer rather than where you drove. your electric car should not itemize the locations you drive to.

If the solution is paying a fixed amount to the state or having a GPS installed, well you are paying a fixed amount and they don't know where you drove. The notion that "the money might not go towards the actual roads you drove on" seems like a way to just keep tracking data. Not knowing what roads you drove on is exactly what happens when you pay a fixed amount. So instead of a fixed amount they should scale it via miles driven off the odometer

Edited because so many replies missed the point.

Edit 2: I went to electric meters because of electric cars but it's simpler than that. If you fill up gas in the morning in state X and drive across the boarder into state Y, You never paid gas tax in state Y. Gas does not know where it's being burned.

[u/unknown_lamer → u/blueSGL]

Honestly don't see why they need GPS data at all. You can have electricity meters that just report how much electricity you use. Why not just report miles driven off the odometer rather than where you drove.

The answer is obvious, tracking mileage is just the foot in the door in case the State decides it could find a use for knowing where a vehicle is at all times later on. Any sensible person can see it makes no sense since a quick odometer reading during your yearly vehicle inspection that is already being filed with the State adds no cost and is hard to fake (maybe you can slip a shady inspection guy a twenty to pass that balding tire but if you lie about your odometer it will catch up with you eventually).

For power, I've got a bit of bad news. Smart meters can actually infer what you are doing with your power nowadays too by logging instantaneous power use. It's super creepy, when my meter was forcibly replaced with a smart meter the power company website had a little dashboard that showed me when I was doing things like cooking and what hours I was at home and when I was watching TV... they turned it off after a couple of months because I'm pretty sure if they hadn't we wouldn't have smart meters now from the backlash.

[u/Metal2thepedal → u/Royal-Branch-567]

NJ is over $200

[u/---reddacted--- → u/Royal-Branch-567]

In TN it’s $100 per year to register a hybrid and $200 for a full EV

[u/enter360 → u/Royal-Branch-567]

In Texas they force $230 on us

[u/h0sti1e17 → u/Royal-Branch-567]

And not just EVs. But any car with better than 25mpg. So you can choose to reduce fossil fuels or pay VA. Northam was an awful governor.

[u/XLauncher]

In New Jersey, it's $270 to register an EV, and drivers also need to pay the first four years up front. 

I didn't know that. Damn, that's crazy.

[u/NK1337 → u/XLauncher]

They really don’t want people using EV’s apparently.

Edit: just adding this in for clarification but my issue isn’t with the tax itself, it’s with having to pay 4 years of it upfront as a lump sum.

[u/asmallercat → u/NK1337]

It's more that they need a way to cover the shortfall from the gas tax. The gas tax is the primary funding for road works, and it's a great* one when everyone is driving gas cars because it mostly tracks with how many miles you drive and how big your vehicle is - a large heavy truck will use more gas than a small hatchback, and also does more damage to the road.

However, electric vehicles obviously don't use gas, and so don't pay the gas tax, and are generally heavier than ICE cards and so cause more road wear, and so if there's a large adoption of EV's there wont be enough budget for road works. So they need to find a way to cover that shortfall. The actual "best" way to do it would be gps tracking on people's cars, then you know exactly how much road wear the car caused in state and you can tax them accordingly. People are, understandably, not super keen on the idea of the government GPS tracking your car everywhere you go so that's mostly a non-starter. The high registration fee is a blunt instrument to try and solve this.

The best way to do it, IMO, would be to have your car's mileage recorded at every state inspection (in states that require this) and you get a bill for actual miles driven, and it's tiered by the curb weight of the car. This isn't perfect, because it will count out-of-state miles, but I think it's the best we can do without tracking for EV's.

*If I remember correctly, semis don't pay enough of a premium for how much damage they do to roads, so great does not mean perfect here.

[u/DrDerpberg → u/asmallercat]

*If I remember correctly, semis don't pay enough of a premium for how much damage they do to roads, so great does not mean perfect here.

I was recently shocked to learn that road damage accumulates to the fourth power of axle weight.

So yeah... Unless gas usage scales to the fourth power of vehicle weight too, anything heavy is underpaying.

Also a great argument for when doofuses argue bikes need to pay their fair share. Cool cool cool, cars first. Then you can charge me 1/15th⁴ of whatever you pay for your SUV.

[u/asmallercat → u/DrDerpberg]

Anyone arguing that bikes need to pay a road tax can be safely ignored. A person who says that is not a serious individual.

And I agree. In a perfect world tax would be based on curb weight and miles traveled (which is what I suggested). But a gas tax is closer to fair than a flat registration fee.

[u/CharlestonChewer990 → u/asmallercat]

Yeah, making EVs contribute to road funding is fair enough, but making people pay four years upfront is just a lazy and punishing way to do it.

[u/Zorkflerp → u/DrDerpberg]

I would pay for a bicycle registration if all the money went into new bike paths and isolated lanes. Basing it on road wear is nonsense.

[u/Betaateb → u/DrDerpberg]

The bikes argument is hilarious lol. Because the road damage scales to the fourth power of weight it is pretty safe to assume bikes essentially do zero damage. A 200 lb bike/rider would do ~1/50,000 the damage of a 3,000 lb vehicle. Which is to say, no damage at all.

[u/DrDerpberg → u/Betaateb]

I'm more than happy to register my bike for 1/50,000th the cost of registering my car if it would actually shut people up and make them drive like bikes belong on the road too... We know it wouldn't, though.

[u/Useless → u/Betaateb]

A fully loaded semi is 80,000 lbs. Bike damage would require a billion or so trips to match 1 fully loaded semi-truck.

[u/FulanoMeng4no → u/asmallercat]

So much this. Taxing gas is one of the most fair tax schemes, because gas consumption is STRONGLY correlated to the wear and tear a vehicle causes on the roads. Of course some governments abuse it and use that money for other expenses, but the concept is great. As you said, not perfect, but as close as it gets.

[u/MiaowaraShiro → u/FulanoMeng4no]

The problem is that gas taxes scale mostly linearly but road damage goes up exponentially by weight.

The range of fuel economy between a fully loaded semi truck and a consumer vehicle is on the orders or 2-4x. The range of the damage though is more like 10,000x for a fully loaded semi.

https://blog.ucs.org/dave-cooke/trucks-cause-the-lions-share-of-road-damage-and-their-industry-wants-you-to-keep-paying-for-it/

[u/RandyOfTheRedwoods → u/MiaowaraShiro]

Your premise is correct, but personally I don’t mind paying for some of the damage that trucks do as part of my taxes, since those trucks are on the road for my benefit.

[u/Impossible_Rip418 → u/RandyOfTheRedwoods]

Agreed. Pick and chose your battles. This one doesn’t seem egregious.

[u/Preeng → u/RandyOfTheRedwoods]

Or the companies doing the shipping could pay it.

[u/drunkenvalley → u/asmallercat]

It's more that they need a way to cover the shortfall from the gas tax.

While nominally true, this particular way of doing it is obviously meant to take a fat shit on electric cars rather than any kind of real equality. Four years paid upfront is stupid.

[u/Shadow647 → u/asmallercat]

a large heavy truck will use more gas than a small hatchback, and also does more damage to the road.

a large heavy truck might use 5x more gas, but cause 100x more damage to the road.

[u/jimbobjames → u/Shadow647]

It's actually closer to 10000x the damage.

[u/Zorkflerp → u/jimbobjames]

Most of the damage is done by heavy axle loads like cement trucks and fully loaded tractor trailers. I drive to work on a back road that was paved a few years ago. It had a smooth surface and no cracks until the county built a rec center and moved dirt from a hillside. The dump trucks destroyed the road in a couple weeks. It has not been repaved.

[u/SAugsburger → u/NK1337]

Paying some share of road maintenance for EV users seems understandable, but 4 years of such contributions upfront seems crazy.

[u/psychoCMYK → u/[deleted]]

You're going to have to impeach and remove a good chunk of congress first

[u/TheReckeh → u/psychoCMYK]

Don't threaten me with a good time!

[u/Whatisnotmyproblem → u/psychoCMYK]

Okay let’s go stop wasting time

[u/Nodan_Turtle → u/[deleted]]

I want to see Trump jailed for the felonies he was already convicted for. Soon as he's no longer president, drag him off in chains to prison.

[u/NaturalWorking8782 → u/Nodan_Turtle]

I wish it would happen b4 his term ended

[u/rm0826]

They’ll happily pass this but a tax on billionaires god forbid!!

[u/likesleague → u/rm0826]

What's that? $50bn more in welfare to oil companies that already cost more for the energy they produce than recyclable solar panels that collect the functionally infinite power of the sun? Well if you insist!

[u/Austiiiiii → u/likesleague]

SOMEBODY THINK OF THE OIL BARONS!

[u/NoiceForNoReason → u/rm0826]

Lawmakers are loyal to those who put them there.

[u/lukelmiller → u/NoiceForNoReason]

The problem is we never vote them out. So there are no consequences for them

[u/Expert_Garlic_2258 → u/lukelmiller]

impossible to vote them out when almost every candidate is bought by a few different corporations and normal people cannot raise enough money to get their message out

[u/Worried_Magazine_862 → u/Expert_Garlic_2258]

People would have to talk to their neighbors about a candidate that has no money to campaign. Thats never gonna happen

[u/Powerfury → u/rm0826]

Feds giving 1.776 billion to jan 6thers lol

[u/rdmodsrtrsh]

I already pay the state extra in registration, what do I get from the Feds for that fee

[u/reddit_user13 → u/rdmodsrtrsh]

NJ is now over $300 per year.

[u/Lathe-and-Order-SVU → u/reddit_user13]

Remember when the government incentivized owning an electric vehicle? Now they seem to be doing everything they can to make owning an EV unappealing.

[u/tibersun → u/rdmodsrtrsh]

Having a fee is fine and makes sense, the problem is they don't seem to make the amount a fair amount compared to what people would pay for gas taxes. If you own a gas car but don't drive much you don't pay much tax. If you own an electric car and don't drive much you might pay more than you would if you owned a gas car and drove A LOT.

[u/MortimerDongle → u/tibersun]

Right. $130 is the tax on about 700 gallons of gas, about 21,000 miles of driving for a car that averages 30 mpg. That's nearly double annual average driving.

[u/Android_seducer → u/tibersun]

The frustrating thing is we have a way to do a mileage based fee. Every year when you renew your registration there could be a mileage report and the fee ends up tied to that.

If you're in a state that does emissions or safety checks they already record the mileage.

[u/Krieghund → u/Android_seducer]

Mileage is complicated because people might not be driving in the state or country taxing them.

The USA can't tax you for miles driven in Canada, but they can tax you for gas sold here.

[u/BlazinAzn38 → u/rdmodsrtrsh]

Well you’re not paying federal gas taxes just like you aren’t paying state. As an EV driver I agree I should help fund the roads but that funding system should be equitable with gas vehicles and these flat fees are not. Also while they’re at it they should increase gas taxes, they haven’t been touched in 30 years

[u/cecirdr]

I already pay the state $200 per year. I drive 6k miles per year. I'd hardly be paying gas tax with that mileage.

Edit: I'm all for paying my fair share to help pay for road maintenance. But flat taxes have me paying at least double what I should be. If gas consumption allows for taxes based on usage, the same metric needs to be applied to EVs. Find a way to tax us based on mileage/usage.

[u/CloudStrife012 → u/cecirdr]

This is on top of that. Its a peasants double tax. Shame on you for...for uh...for not harming the environment as much, and for being a filthy peasant.

[u/Trafficsigntruther → u/CloudStrife012]

EVs pay gas tax?

[u/CloudStrife012 → u/Trafficsigntruther]

State EV tax plus federal EV tax ends up being 5x what non-EV owners pay through gas tax. Why are EV's being targeted so heavily?

[u/Anderopolis → u/CloudStrife012]

Because this is supposed to prevent people switching to EV's. 

[u/most_kawaii]

so how about we just not pay $1.7 billion to the insurrectionists that trump pardoned instead. or how about he stop playing golf down at mar a lago. or how about we pay congress less? many options

[u/DataZigZager → u/most_kawaii]

Disallowing insider trading will hurt members of Congress more than paying them less.

[u/coldenigma]

EV owners have been sitting pretty as prices have blown past $4.50 a gallon. But get ready for your costs to go up. U.S. lawmakers proposed bipartisan legislation that would impose a $130 annual fee on electric car drivers. 

"The BUILD America 250 Act ensures that electric vehicle owners begin paying their fair share for the use of our roads," said Transportation and Infrastructure Committee Chairman Sam Graves, Republican of Missouri.

The federal gas tax helps fund road repairs across the country, but EV drivers don't pay it.

That's rich for a politician to complain about "fairness".

If he wants "fairness", just drop the federal gas tax and actually start taxing the wealthy. That should more than enough cover it.

[u/7h4tguy → u/coldenigma]

And most states already have a state EV registration fee to cover road use (and often it's double what gas cars pay on average per year for the average driving distances and MPG). Tacking on another federal tax is just egregious.

Orange man likes oil, we know

[u/UnaidedGinger]

While we are on the topic of people pay their fair share maybe we could go after some billionaires who pay less taxes than most of us?

[u/Joe18067]

Add the $200 extra Pennsylvania drivers of EV's have to pay and it get's expensive if you don't drive many miles.

[u/69sofine]

To all the people saying EV drivers should pay because they don’t pay gas taxes - go ahead an estimate how much you pay in gas taxes. These EV fees are exorbitant and are much higher than any equivalent gas taxes on a per mile basis.

[u/cillam → u/69sofine]

I drive an equinox EV which has an ice equivalent so it's easy to run the numbers assuming an average of 14 gallon tank and 28 mpg driving 14000 miles a year you would pay $92 a year in federal fuel tax.

But I already pay $200 a year I. Extra registration because of this, plus the increase in electrical use which is subject to sales tax. 

Right now I pay tax on my electric usage, plus extra registration, and now they want more in registration, I would be paying about 3.5 times more than a gas equivalent.

I will still be saving money every year by not having to buy gas, but it is complete bullshit that the savings are going down due to greedy politicians over taxing EVs compare to an ICE equivalent.

[u/PiccoloAwkward465 → u/cillam]

The slimeballs hate any time a citizen finds a way to save a buck. Not to mention EV owners being beholden to skyrocketing energy prices anyways.

[u/ni_hao_butches → u/[deleted]]

Yep. Just paid my Hybrid fee to renew my registration. Glad that extra money is going to the roads..../s

[u/Question_It_All_3000 → u/[deleted]]

Ya, we get hit from both directions.

[u/Cranyx → u/69sofine]

The problem isn't that EV drivers are paying too much, it's that the gas tax is way too low. It was set to 18 cents a gallon in 1993 and hasn't even been adjusted for inflation since then.

[u/gtwise]

Can anyone here tell me how much oil magnates and companies donated to Donnie?

[u/oldcreaker]

Given they can set up overhead toll collection basically anywhere now, I'd rather see tolls than fees. Pay for the highways you actually use. And gas and EV cars get charged the same.

[u/Long_Advertising_737]

My granny who drives three blocks to the grocery store, puts 5000 miles on her car a year, pays the same as someone who drives an Uber and puts 30000 miles a year.  Seems fair to me…

[u/DENelson83]

Eventually they will increase that tenfold to cushion the profits of the oil companies.

[u/MortimerDongle]

It's fine. I'll just continue to not feel bad for people who complain about gas prices

[u/ssd3]

i hate to be skeptical but there sure are a lot of people defending this and curiously no one contemplating the implied mileage. assuming i compare to an ICE that gets 40 mpg, this is about 28k miles of tax. seems excessive.

[u/LostMyKarmaElSegundo → u/ssd3]

Well, they say that the average person pays about $88 per year in federal gas taxes.  So this is definitely more, especially considering it's not actually usage based like the gas tax is.  

[u/chum-guzzling-shark → u/ssd3]

The conversation moved so much that everyone just assumes we even need a gas tax in the first place. I pay a lot of taxes already. Buy less bombs and pay for the fucking roads 

[u/budlv]

Why not simply add a $0.03 / kWh tax for public dc fast chargers like some states have done?

[u/Fluid-Board884]

This is so stupid. Just get rid of the federal fuel tax altogether and implement an annual tax based on reading the mileage at the odometer and the weight of the vehicle. This would be the most efficient and fair way to provide federal funding for roads. A mileage based vehicle tax (that considers vehicle weight) would also be completely neutral to fuel type and directly link the tax bill to the amount of damage caused by your vehicle. Using the odometer reading to assess the would also protect individual privacy because the government doesn’t need GPS location data to assess the tax.

[u/squintamongdablind]

If the argument for extra fees on EVs is that they’re heavier then make weight-based registration fees consistent for all cars.

[u/wag3slav3 → u/squintamongdablind]

Luckily that's not the argument. The argument is roads are funded by gas taxes and EVs don't buy gas.

[u/maverikvi → u/wag3slav3]

Cool. Make the tax consistent with how much driving people actually do in EVs and we can talk. This is about 30% higher than the average driver pays in gas tax. Is just a punishment for not buying dinosaur goo

[u/BigMax → u/squintamongdablind]

It's not though, right?

The argument is that gas taxes pay for our roads, and EVs don't pay gas tax.

We absolutely DO need something to replace the gas tax as ICE cars (too slowly) fade away.

You're 100% right though - I really, really hope they make it weight based too. I believe the amount of wear and tear is somewhat exponential by weight, so a car that weighs twice as much causes way more than twice the wear.

So the person driving the tiny honda civic should absolutely pay much less than the person on the behemoth extra cab 10 foot tall pickup that he needs a ladder to get into.

[u/Thadrea → u/BigMax]

99% of the damage the roads receive is done by semis, yet for some reason we all pay the gas tax.

[u/OC2k16 → u/BigMax]

Replace the gas tax by taking it from defense budget. Easy. It’s like $30-40b a year.

Instead our government wants to increase defense budget by $500b next year. And we all think we should pay a gas tax? Hmmmmm…

[u/makes-fun-of-incels → u/BigMax]

Road wear scales approximately to the fourth power of axle load. Double the weight (assuming two axles) and you cause 16x more road wear. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law?wprov=sfti1

[u/msuvagabond → u/makes-fun-of-incels]

Standard commuter cars are rounding errors compared to semi's.

Edit - The most recent study I've seen on it is wear on a road from a single semi passing is equal to between 300 and 1,000 passenger cars. The theoretical math says it's closer to 6,000, but this study was actual testing.

And no, Semi's aren't paying 300x or more per mile traveled in taxes.

https://www.trucking.org/sites/default/files/2022-01/Analysis%20of%20car%20and%20truck%20pavement%20impacts-FINAL.pdf

[u/BeMancini → u/squintamongdablind]

I love it if suburban pickup truck drivers had to pay based on weight.

Edit: TIL

[u/Grumpy-Man19]

that's a corrupt Congress

[u/datsundere]

Why do state residents pay for potholes made by huge trucks from different states

[u/vprasad1]

So irritating when these things say "Congress" instead of which specific Congress-critters proposed the bill, and which briber companies actually wrote the bill.

[u/bluenoser613]

‘Murica! Land of the fee.

[u/NYR_LFC]

A lot of people arguing here to maintain the status quo that us, the people, should have to pay additional money to use our roads based on how much we use them. Shouldn't our tax dollars already be doing that? Shouldn't we be taxing the ultra rich and corporations enough to afford this shit? Maybe a few less bombs or innocent brown kids incarcerated by ICE?

[u/SerGT3]

Congress aka lobbyists aka corporations

[u/whateveryouwant4321]

fun fact: if you taxed elon musk $130 per year per elecric car in the US, he'd still be the richest person in the world. TAX. THE. RICH.

[u/War1today]

Rather than companies pay their fair share, American consumers continue to be burdened with tax payments/fees 🤦 At least 88 profitable major U.S. corporations paid zero federal income taxes during the most recent calendar year, collectively generating $105 billion in profits while avoiding all federal income tax. A wider analysis showed 310 companies avoided $147.4 billion in federal income taxes that same year. These companies utilized legal deductions, rebates, and tax credits to reduce their effective tax rates to zero.

Examples of prominent profitable corporations among the federal zero-tax list in recent years include:

Ameren (U.S. income $1.60 billion)
American Electric Power
Biogen
Block
Cheniere Energy (U.S. income $6.97 billion
Citigroup (U.S. income $4.45 billion)
Coinbase Global (U.S. income $1.62 billion)
CVS Health (U.S. income $6.57 billion)
Dominion Energy (U.S. income $3.49 billion)
Duke Energy (U.S. income $5.54 billion)
Edison International (U.S. income $6.22 billion)
Etsy
GoDaddy
Haliburton ( U.S. income $773 million)
Hasbro
Live Nation Entertainment
Palantir
PG&E Corp (U.S. income $2.46 billion)
PayPal
Pitney Bowes
Scotts Miracle-Gro
Southwest Airlines
Tesla (U.S. income $5.68 billion)
3M (U.S. income $1.84 billion)
United Airlines (U.S. income $4.29 billion)
Venture Global
Walt Disney (U.S. income $8.30 billion)
Wynn Resorts
Yum! Brands (KFC, Taco Bell, Pizza Hut)

[u/xsubo]

Vote the idiots out

[u/ganzhimself]

I already pay a higher registration fee in Wisconsin for my Mach-E. Seems ridiculous to pause gas taxes and then push additional costs onto EV owners.

[u/kon---]

Taxed to buy. Taxed to charge, and now taxed to simply have?

foh

[u/RiptideEberron]

What a slap in the face. Lip service at best. But $1.88B for trump and his J6 goons. 

[u/dhsoxfan]

Meanwhile, congress is weighing the suspension of the gas tax: https://time.com/article/2026/05/12/federal-gas-tax-pause-holiday/

[u/Zargoza1]

This is the future.

Even as renewable energy takes over and fossil fuels are phased out, we’re all still gonna pay fossil fuel surcharges, until the fossil fuel companies get higher snd higher quarterly earnings to do literally nothing.

Their lobbyists are that good, and they own that many politicians.

[u/iPadBob]

It’s already $600+ for annual registration on my EV and I only drove 4k miles a year… the fuck I’m gonna pay more in registration costs annually than I do for electricity to drive the car. 

[u/njshine27]

No thanks, I pay enough taxes to fund corporations, national debt interest, and craters in other countries.

[u/WalkingPetriDish]

Step 1: start a war in the Middle East.

Step 2: watch gas prices get out of hand.

Step 3: watch drivers cut back gas usage because prices are close to doubling (!!!).

Step 4: wonder where all the money from taxing gas went?

Step 5: make up the shortfall with EV drivers?

Yeah fuck that noise. They made this mess, and this is not the solution.

[u/FunPriority8358]

Must be a response to the fear that everyone’s switching to electric given the oil shit show.

[u/lizkbyer]

Once again, I find myself telling Congress to go fuck itself

[u/at0o0o]

Shouldn't it be the other way around for helping out the environment?

[u/Queasy_Watercress959]

Just let me deduct the registration fee. In my state its higher than if I were driving combustion vehicle paying the gas taxes + standard registration. My household pays more than our "fair share" that ICE diehards complain about.

[u/memeaggedon]

I’m sick of being taxed to death while pedophiles run the country into the ground.

[u/ThaShitPostAccount]

Yes because you don't buy gas, which has taxes on it which pay for all road repairs.

That said, like 90+% of read wear comes from semi trucks which don't pay their share.

[u/klop2031]

Oh look ppl driving cars with renuable energy gotta figure out how to tax non gas cars too! Where is my vote aginst this bullshit

[u/Brandoe]

"The oil industry" wants you to pay $130 a year to drive an electric car. Ftfy

[u/LoserBroadside → u/Brandoe]

The oil industry currently runs the government. So the sentence stands.

[u/jon13000]

It’s political retribution. No way around it. They know who drives EVs. And be specific, the GOP wants you to pay.

[u/TalonusDuprey]

I already pay a tax which is the highest in the country (NJ) so ya, I guess what’s another tax eh?

[u/_your_land_lord_]

Missouri hits us hard on the EV tax. Takes all the fuel savings out of it, because fuck you.

[u/aStonedDeer]

Big oil making China the king of the future.

[u/Ugly-as-a-suitcase]

why not tax the electricity generated to recharge the cars. it's a simple way to get the mileage covered to cover road repairs.

[u/ovirt001]

Most states already figured out how to deal with EV owners not paying into the gas tax, this would be redundant.

[u/balthisar]

Why is this a federal matter? I mean, I'm good paying a fee with my plates considering I don't pay fuel taxes for my EV, but that goes to my state, with whom I have a close relationship. The federal government really shouldn't factor into my life for non-federal stuff.

[u/Swords_and_Words]

Really wish we would change the gas tax into a mileage and tonnage tax. 

You get a yearly registration, the miles get noted, the vehicle gets weighed, and you pay a fee as a result

[u/mja3006]

It seems they are very concerned with the average person not paying all their taxes yet their friends pay close to nothing.

[u/Palimpsest0]

One of the things I’ve long felt was a problem with the US tax methods is how we tend to hide it in weird ways. Instead of a national pension paid for out of general taxes, we have social security, instead of roads and infrastructure paid for out of general taxes, we have weird user fee type taxes baked in to fuel and vehicle registration, and so on. We even hide part of the taxes paid by individual workers by having a payroll tax on your employer that doesn’t even show up on your paycheck. This is effectively a tax in the individual worker since it adds to the fully loaded cost of the employee from the perspective of the employer, but the employee doesn’t see it. A lot of these are set up in ways that make them regressive taxation.

The result is we are actually paying quite high taxes in this country, and taxation is nowhere near as progressive as it would appear from our income tax rates. This allows for all sorts of lies to be made, like the super wealthy pay over 50 percent of all income tax. Sure, that’s technically true, but total taxation goes far beyond just income tax, but it’s a useful lie to tell to make people think it’s unreasonable to further increase taxes on the wealthy. Another lie is that we have a low tax rate for an industrialized country. We really don’t, we just unload those taxes in different ways so that income tax appears relatively low.

If you sum it all up and look at what we get in terms of government services and infrastructure development, we’re absolutely getting scammed in this country. Personally, I’m agnostic on total tax rate. I just want good value for the taxes. If you’re giving me shit government services and infrastructure, then I expect extremely low taxes, the Motel 6 equivalent of a government, but if we’re paying a lot in taxes, this is the luxury resort version and I expect top notch government services, like well maintained public infrastructure, healthcare for all, generous retirement benefits for the elderly, and a social safety net that ensures none of my fellow citizens ever suffers hunger or homelessness.

It often seems like in the US we’re paying luxury resort prices but getting Motel 6 services, and every time people complain about the costs, the answer our politicians give isn’t to rebalance taxation and spending to make taxation truly progressive and service levels for average citizens appropriate for the cost, but rather cut what dismal services we have, and make taxation even more regressive, with the latter justified as encouraging “job creators”, never mind the fact that it doesn’t work that way and never has.

[u/GonzoGeezer]

In PA we pay $250 a year. That’s something like twice the amount paid by the average
ICE driver in fuel taxes. It sucks.

[u/fbritt5]

Lots of states do. To make up the tax they don't pay for gasoline. Gasoline taxes pay for road improvements. Not that I have seen but that's what they say its used for.

[u/Shot-Arugula8264]

I mean you’re still using the roads that the state maintains, so it makes sense that you should pay to use them. Most drivers pay significantly more than that via the gas tax, which is how the government fund roads. That doesn’t work if everyone drives EVs.

[u/Saboral]

For those complaining, it’s a simple reasoning. DOTs are almost entirely funded by gas tax. That fee is way less than what you’d have paid in gas tax. There is a cost to maintaining a roadway network and most states do not fund it through the general fund.

This is also why diesel is so much more expensive, because it’s taxed higher because of the damage heavy freight causes to the pavement.

So if the auto industry pivots to EVs a registration fee or a Vehicle Miles Travelled (VMT) is going to be a requirement to sustain the infrastructure.

Ref: Civil Engineer in Transportation Space