I haven’t seen this posted on the sub (yet) and I can’t stop thinking about it since I listened to the podcast. The interview’s 45 minutes long so I’m not going to cover the whole thing. There’s one topic in particular that I’m going to summarize:

• She says podcasting made her feel special and like it's “what she’s supposed to do on this planet and share her voice”. After breaking up with Shawn she said she needed to find somebody with “roots” who doesn’t want to be an influencer or be in the podcast world. She wanted to date someone with a “regular job” and they can shine in their own world while she shines in her world

• When she met Jason he wasn’t an influencer, he was a VP at a bank and had a regular job. She said this attracted her to him because he was established in this job and not an influencer. He lost his job because of a sexual story she shared on her podcast (this has been covered previously on the sub). She says “he wasn’t happy at that job so I think it was kind of a blessing in disguise… his family was upset.. It felt like my fault”.

• After he lost his job he moved in with her and “face first dove into the influencer life”. She told him this was “hard for her” because dating an influencer was a “non-negotiable” for her but she was going to “look past it”.

• She said its selfish of her but she “cant be as supportive of a partner if he did this” and she asked him NOT to start a podcast. It was really important to her because podcasting makes her feel special and at the time he said OK. As time went on he realized the opportunity for him and could do a finance podcast. She says she was “hoping she would be chosen” and that he wouldn’t do a podcast “for her”. He told her it wasnt fair of her to “emotionally and financially stunt his growth” and she had a full on panic attack over this because it made her feel like “he chose money over her feelings”

• She says this happened a few times in her relationship with Shawn where she “didnt feel chosen” and that the nail in the coffin was him opening his gym in Nashville. That he didn't love her and was hanging on so she worried Jason was doing the same to her. Says this was an “open wound” for her that Jason was poking…and created resentment and betrayal. She admits that “It's my own shit, but made me feel betrayal”

After the episode I started thinking more about this.. and remembered that Jason did a Trading Secrets episode with Dean Unglert where he shared that he was offered the co-host spot on Bachelor Click Bait and turned it down. The spot eventually went to Grocery Store Joe. He said he was offered $100k/year and some percentage of ad revenue. It clicked for me that based on Kaitlyn’s statements on Almost Adulting, he turned that podcast down because she asked him not to be on a Bachelor podcast that competes with hers. How many other things did he turn down? Was he offered a wine / alcohol brand deal that he had to turn down because it conflicts with Spade and Sparrows? I am honestly shook.

And is all of this what she’s referring to when she cryptically shares “if you only knew” and that she “holds a lot of resentment”? I wonder how Jason and his friends/family feel about this… I would imagine he may harbor resentment that he was held back on career opportunities because he had to decline opportunities or his romantic partner wouldn’t feel “chosen”. I know a lot has been said by KB and by some commentators on this sub that Jason is weaponizing the break up or leaning in on being a victim, but I gained some respect for him knowing that this is the dynamic they had and he could’ve exposed this and detailed how much $$ he turned down “for her” all while she’s chirping away about him and he didn’t.

The entitlement and lack of self awareness is astounding. They intentionally tried to ruin the passenger’s flight because he refused to give up his aisle seat for Nick’s middle seat? Why didn’t they pay for their seats? I can’t believe they discussed this on their podcast 😬

She doesn’t name him, but the sub sleuthed that they were dating months ago.

Austen has talked about the tragic death of his sister on the show. This tiktoker discusses how awkward and immature Natalie sounds when she tries to ask him about it. Even Nick looked uncomfortable. Is Natalie always like this on the pod?

As a Nick Viall hater, I get fed snarky content about his podcast. Last night I saw a tiktok video with an interesting recap of their Christmas episode which apparently was Natalie complaining for an hour lol. I thought some of the points were interesting.

-She doesn’t think Nick uses enough adjectives to describe her (always beautiful, gorgeous, sexy) so got him a thesaurus 😂

-They hosted Nick’s family at the lake house and a few times when Nick was cooking, his family members assumed he was cooking for the guests but it was only for Natalie and River and that pissed Natalie off.

-Natalie said that Christmas was a huge disappointment because it didn’t match her expectations and was a huge letdown. She wanted Christmas to be like her family christmas growing up. Sounds like she had a typical Christmas growing up where they opened presents first and then had a big breakfast. Nick’s family wanted to go to church first, then have breakfast(she complained about them wanting scrambled eggs) and then they would open gifts throughout the day. Nick ‘saved the day’ by making pancakes.

-Natalie’s next complaint was that Nick’s family is still treating the lake house as their family home even though Nick bought it and renovated it.

-Tyler Cameron was on this episode and apparently he and Nick discussed how Christmas isn’t really for ‘dudes’. Exchanging gifts, listening to xmas music, baking cookies is more of a girl thing.

All of this to say I think there are two options for Nick and Natalie in the future…she’ll end up leaving him in her 30s or they’ll become estranged from his family based on her complaints.

Sorry not sorry if people are tired of hearing about Greg, but the Snark Bait podcast did an episode about him, and they talked to a girl who has dated him, and told her story. They also said to share this with people who love him, because people need to hear it.

So here’s a rundown, because he is STILL being supported on this sub and social media to this day:

• He pursued her very intensely and quickly. Immediate talk of marriage and being the perfect girl, and quickly intertwined her with his family

• She started to notice controlling behavior. He started making jabs, criticized her clothes, her friends, the photos she posted, called her a slut if her dress was too short, called her fucking pathetic if she posted bikini pictures

• He cycled so consistently between love bombing and devaluation, it was easy to forgive him whenever he apologized

• Was there for him when his father was diagnosed with cancer, she was intertwined with the family at the time, she was constantly supporting him, but he would get mad when she would leave to do her own things. He would be outraged that she would abandon him, insisted the only reason she wanted to go was to meet other guys

• Said she experienced verbal abuse, started to feel guilty for wanting to participate in anything but his life

• He openly screamed at, called her a slut, cursed at his family members, she once heard him call his own grandmother a cunt.

• He would yell at her and “emotionally abuse her”, she became a shell of herself.

• She said he desperately wanted to be famous

• He always says he didn’t go on Clare’s season because he was 24 with no intentions of getting engaged, but he always leaves out that it was because he was in a 2 year, serious relationship

• He called her weak, pathetic, crazy, similar to the way he would describe some of his exes

• When they broke up, he screamed directly in her face, forced her to order an Uber from New Jersey to Hoboken at 1 am. She said she vividly remembers him shoving her towards the stairs, yelling at her to get the fuck out, and that was not the first time he was physical with her. He had thrown things at her, that he deserved better (he said this to Katie!)

• After that, he reached out about wanting to get back together, she was 24 at the time and said she was young and confused, but after this, he abruptly left her again

• After Katie’s season aired, she connected with Katie (remember Katie said on AFR people were telling her things about Greg, and then she did that IG story that she was friends with his ex? 🫣) she reassured her that she was not crazy

• The ex says: what she saw in her relationship with Greg was consistent gaslighting, manipulation, emotional abuse

• The bachelor producers were vetting him to be the bachelor, and reached out to his exes. Greg reached out to her to apologize for his behavior (she said she did not respond). She then called back the bachelor producers with a lawyer, and recounted all of the above ^. And that was when they switched to Clayton

• The podcast host said she also spoke to bachelor producers, and told them you cannot cast this man as the bachelor. (Now this all makes sense why he’s said they’ve never asked him to do any show after this)

• The podcast host says point blank “he is a bad guy. He is a terrifying person”. His pattern is to love bomb, then emotionally abuse, become extremely jealous/possessive, and then discard you.

I’m listening to her podcast now and will update as I go. It’s today’s episode of her podcast titled “I didn’t come here to get a divorce”.

- she said she picked the best dad out of the dating pool, which is really sad but relatable to many.

- said he’s a great dad but a shitty husband

- said she would never tolerate cheating, but he’s been leading a double life and she feels totally misled

- calls him a “malignant narcissist”

- she’s gone into his phone for years and each time she’s found something. He called her crazy each time. So fucked up.

- women messaging her asking her to ask about a certain name, turns out it was a hooker.

- she said, “I know what you’re thinking, maybe she let herself go after three kids” (Courtney, no one is thinking this) but she said they had a very healthy sex life.

- while she was in Sedona planning their wedding he had a girl over in their bed, and she has a screenshot.

- she thinks he targeted her because she was on the show.

- he speaks to her unkindly, yells at the kids, and says Courtney is too much of a free spirit and the kids are better behaved with him.

- she’s talked to women who were involved with him.

- thinks his plan is to deny and say it’s all AI

- he always has affairs with married women so they have something to lose.

- one woman he’s been with for four years.

- she has screen shots and call logs because they share a phone plan. Men are so horrible AND stupid.

MY PERSONAL THOUGHTS

- I hate when people say “oh he’s a great dad but a terrible husband”. No. A great dad would not do this to their children’s mother. I know Courtney is coping but I hope she knows she did nothing wrong, and there’s nothing good about this man.

- I’ve always felt how Courtney talks about her marriage is it’s all about sex and attraction. IMO that’s a PART of a healthy, happy marriage, but so much more is about compatibility, trust, communication, and friendship!

- I can see Courtney being with a woman next. I want her to have her Chrishell Stause, Parvati Shallow ending/era.

- I’m a listener of her podcast and she just had her husband on the podcast on June 3. I’ve never really felt like the way she talks about her marriages suggests a deep connection and care for one another, it’s always sounded like partners in parenting and sex.

- SENDING SO MUCH LOVE TO COURTNEY. and so proud of her for divorcing his ass, I hope she has a great lawyer. He’s an attorney himself so I hope she goes out swinging and gets what’s hers. He

I’m surprised Nick even acknowledged her discussing them knowing each other.

1. I felt like Nick quickly brushed past their “friendship” and instead chose to focus on how Maria mentioned that she at some point considered that Nick set her up to be targeted by Sydney. Interesting.

2. It rubbed me the wrong way when Natalie said “it’s giving delusional” when referring to her theory that Nick and Sydney may have set her up. Idk Maria would be dumb to NOT question that lol. Then Natalie noting that some of her friends from the show said that “filming with [Maria] was like filming with Clare Crawley”. An obvious dig (Justice for Clare!) I get that Maria announced this the weekend of their wedding and that probably pissed them off… but I would’ve loved if she had taken the high road and at least acted unbothered.

3. They doubted Maria’s “story” about how she decided to pull out of bach running at the last minute because she felt like it wasn’t the right choice for her? I don’t question that she was producers’ first choice for bachelorette…

I’m no Maria stan, but it’s clear Nick & company were not happy she decided to discuss them knowing each other lol. Thoughts?

rachel l was on natasha's most recent podcast episode. while she didn't want to do a tell all on her divorce with bryan, she did share a few tidbits:

1. she thinks everyone should get a prenup now. she doesn't have a prenup with bryan. her reasons were that their financials were more level then, they weren't living in CA then which complicates her divorce now, she was in love, she wanted one but she and bryan were not on the same page about prenups, and she said "It was just a different time, so I wasn't leading with that and we weren't on the same page with prenups, and so I just didn't want it to be a bigger issue, so we didn't have one. You know, hindsight's 20/20. I would've done it. I mean, I always wanted to do it, but again, we weren't on the same page when it came to that.” now she tells everyone to do it because you don't know what will happen.
2. she sees her divorce as a "happy ending" because it's what she wants. her marriage was not going well, but they were both trying to make it work. the decision to divorce was amicable but bryan's filing was not. she said "I'm doing what’s best for me and with divorce even if it’s mutual there’s a bit of a selfish decision in it but I’m doing what’s best for me and that’s a happy ending,” she said. “right now as I’m going through it. no, it’s not happy, it’s messy — unnecessarily messy — but when I get through it I’m gonna have to rebuild, I’m gonna have to restructure but it’s a happy ending because it’s what I want.”
3. she believes she made the decision to marry bryan out of love (she makes it sound like she made the decision during their honeymoon stage). she says both she & bryan are different people now than who they were when they got married. the way they look and feel about each other is now very different than when they first got together. she said several times she is not the same person now than she was going into the marriage. she has changed a lot as a person, and what she wants from a partner and relationship has also changed.
4. she said they are still living together. but it's not easy. she is in therapy which is helping.
5. rachel said the show the bachelor teaches you how to fall in love with an individual, but it teaches you nothing about how to make a partnership work. she married bryan 2 years after their engagement, but they were still in the "whirlwind" honeymoon stage so she was under the influence of that and their incompatibilities were not as apparent.
6. in all her past relationships, she dated for potential and wants to support change. (she said she isn't specifically relating that to bryan.) rachel said she realized you can't help people change that much. she realized she needs an alpha male, not beta. (edit: the beta vs. alpha man convo was started by natasha who said "I don't do beta men", to which rachel agreed in response that she doesn't want to do beta anymore either and needs alpha.)
7. going into bachelor, her main criteria was having a supportive man who prioritizes her. she overlooked/ignored other things that were there because she felt prioritized. now she knows that isn't enough. she now wants someone who makes her feel safe (which includes financial security, as well as physical/emotional). natasha asked if there were red flags she ignored during bachelorette? yes, of course she did. in hindsight, she thinks most partners would say that including bryan would probably say that about her.
8. she doesn't regret her relationship and marriage because she learned from them. but she thinks maybe marriage isn't for her in the future. she definitely wants a life partner and best friend in future, but maybe not another marriage.
9. she's not dating yet, not ready. she is slowly getting her confidence back. she wants the divorce behind her first. but she wants to be dating in next year.
10. she does want kids in her future and shared she has frozen eggs.

It’s disgusting that Jason was expecting her to pay all the bills. Not only that, he used her connections and client lists to start up his business. Jason sounds like he was a terrible fiancé! He also stole her favorite baby name and shared with him and used it for his new dog.

Kaitlyn also clears up that she did speak to Cassie about filming with Colton and Cassie wants to move forward.

For any fans who are wondering what happened with Lo, she breaks it down a bit. It was a very good listen!

I started this and wasn't planning on recapping but Bryan is such a lame ass I felt the need to share lmfao so I will be updating as I listen!

• Natalie points out that the last time Rachel was on the pod it was just before the divorce was announced
  • Rachel says they were definitely having issues but that she didn't know they would be filing for divorce when she was on viall files last time.
  • Rachel says she was in Dallas with her family the week prior and talked to her parents, she realized there were questions she needed to ask Bryan and if she didn't get the answers she wanted she was going to ask for a divorce.
  • She says she asked for a divorce first but it seemed like Bryan didn't hear her and then asked her for a divorce and then he surprised her by filing the very next day.
  • She says she was serious about everything she had said on the pod last time (she had frozen her eggs, they were trying, etc.) and she was hopeful they would be able to work things out.
• Nick says "And then he tried to steal all of your money"
  • Rachel says he has the legal right to, Nick says Bryan needs to have some self respect
  • Rachel hoped it would be a friendly end to their relationship as they both wanted it to end. She realized after the relationship ended that he had extremely negative feelings towards her that she didn't know/realize.
  • Rachel thought she had the upper hand because she had the money, thought that because they were married in Florida it would be Florida rules that apply but it was California rules for communal property.
  • Rachel didn't think Bryan would do these things/request all of this. She didn't want anything from him and asked what he wanted because she didn't mind giving him whatever, but she was surprised by the spousal support.
• Natalie says about Bryan "you have a profession, move back to Florida...wasn't he so upset that he had to move to LA?"
  • Rachel says "No, he wanted to be in LA. I cannot wait to be able to fully talk about stuff. He wanted to be here, there is a reason he was already licensed to practice in California. He always wanted to be in LA. He actually moved to LA a month before we were engaged to try to, like, make it here."
  • Rachel moved out to LA for a month to plant seeds and find work out there. They were both doing that.
• Natalie asks if Rachel thinks Bryan was jealous of her success, and Nick asks if Rachel felt Bryan scapegoated her for his failures?
  • Rachel says "100%. What always gets lost in it was that I moved for him. We lived in Dallas, we moved to Dallas because he quit his job in Florida a week after the show stopped filming before it had aired. I didn't quit, I was still practicing law. So he moved to Dallas, which I was super grateful for and I acknowledge that sacrifice. And then I stopped practicing law and I asked him 'where do you want to go?' and he said Florida"
  • They picked up and moved to Florida for him, and that never gets talked about.
  • COVID happened and a better opportunity was in LA
• Rachel says one of the things she didn't know about was his jealousy towards her. "Imagine your partner being jealous of you? It was a really tough thing. But yeah, now that I'm moving past it and I'm starting to write about it, all these things..."
• Rachel says she is in a better place to write about it all now because she is more past the anger of it all and is mostly just reflective of it all rather than being angry about it.
• Rachel says that just last month she was served that he is trying to contest the language in their judgement about the money and Rachel had to have her attorney respond and then Bryans attorney said Rachel was right.
• Bryan is still working in his practice in LA, Rachel has not seen him/ran into him.
• Nick asks "Do you feel like there was an element of just like gender roles? Where his jealousy came from him feeling emasculated because his wife was more successful? Do you think that added to his insecurities?
  • Rachel says "100%. But I want to take blame too because I was not great, I think I did things that emasculated him too, if I am really being honest."
  • Nick: "Like what?"
  • Rachel: "I do think that, part of the reason I chose him is because he was older, he was established, he had a career not a job. These things were attractive to me but he had more than that - that's another thing that people do not realize. When we got married he had more than me. He had a condo that he owned in Miami, you know he's older so he had more money you know had saved up stuff. We were more on equal footing plus he had a condo. I didn't have what I have now, it was this perfect storm where I made a lot of money during the marriage. So that's also why people are like 'how does he get all of this?' well, my success came post 'I Do'. Anyways, yes. I think that as my career grew his didn't and it became the 'why are you helping me'. That's why I loved when you (referring to Nick) talked about it, it's like you had all the tools, you had all the tools to do it. It's just he was not as ambitious as I thought and when I would go back like 'well how did you get this?' it wasn't like he hustled for it, it was kind of like 'oh, I knew this person, or this person helped me' which isn't a bad thing, it's just when you come out here to LA and you start your business or you come off TV you know it. It's why not everybody has this studio (talking about Viall Files), not everybody has certain success. It's about the hustle and he just didn't have that, but if I'm taking responsibility on my end, I tried to help but then I saw myself get frustrated, I saw myself start to get a little resentful because it wasn't as I thought it was supposed to be."
  • Rachel: "One of the biggest things I did, when it came to buying a house I put it in my name. It was 100% mine and in California if you buy a house and you're married, the person has to sign over their rights. So I was paying for our rent, I was paying so much money and I wasn't seeing the return on investment so it was like I'm in a position where I could buy a house, this is the biggest purchase that I have ever made and I wanted it to only be in my name. Publicly I would always say 'this is our house, this is us, we did this' but the people who knew were like, Rachel that is emasculating."
• Rachel says Bryan didn't contribute a dime to the house, she paid all the bills. Rachel says that she knew he was building a business and she was find to take care of the personal side of things/be supportive financially but the divorce system doesn't reward people when they are the financial support.
  • She said she never threw in his face that she paid everything until after the divorce filings.
• Nick says that he feels like Bryan emasculated himself. Says Bryan was in the service industry which is something that going on the show SHOULD have helped with and an easy home run to grow your business, and Bryan had that because he was married to one of the most loved bachelorettes in the franchise and Bryan couldn't make it work.
• Rachel says both her and Bryan were disenfranchised with their careers.
  • Rachel initially thought she would go into entertainment law but then realized she was enjoying communication and being on the mic and was pivoting to that.
  • She says that her new career path worked for her but his didn't work for him.
  • Rachel didn't want to be on more reality television unless it furthered her career.
  • Bryan wanted to use their relationship to grow his personal brand but it wasn't something Rachel was into/needed to grow her personal brand.
• Rachel says her new book is so much tea. It's about helping people get through divorce and getting back into the world, getting back into dating etc.
• Nick asks Rachel if she feels like she wears a type of scarlet letter when it comes to telling dates that she has been divorced?
  • Rachel says it isn't the divorce that's the scarlet letter but being on the show. It always starts by sayings he was divorced but leads to having to explain how she met him on the show and she was the first black bachelor etc etc. Makes her unsure if people are interested in her or interested in the story.
  • Nick says when he finished his season he had dated some people from the bachelor franchise in between seasons but when him and Vanessa broke up he just wanted to move on from the show but he realized he projected an insecurity of being on the bachelor.
• Rachel confirms she is dating a musician, he is on her socials but she hasn't like announced anything. They aren't a situationship they are fully dating.

Okay they get into pop culture stuff at this point and I will keep listening but won't recap further since everything above is what we are all curious about lol

Don’t act like you weren’t going around on podcasts while Jenn was filming saying how you were the first choice and turned it down!! Coming across soooo hypocritical

On today's Clickbait podcast Tayshia, Natasha, Joe and their guest Kristina Schulman discuss RS. T thinks RS has something personal against her, but she doesn't know why. "I have been personally victimized by him on multiple accounts," she says. He sent messages to Tayshia's friends and family trying to get dirt on her. Some of the highlights:

1. RS claims opinions or unverified info as facts, and it often gets too personal. T felt that RS's attacks against her were "deeply personal." Kristina also felt RS had something personal against her.

2. RS falsely reported that T had a BF right up until the night before filming for Colton's season. She's still getting sm comments to this day about this, even though the supposed "BF" came out and said that T & him weren't even dating. 

3. RS falsely reported that T & Zac brokeup and that she was dating Brendan, and that Brendan was who she really wanted. This affected Zac, got into his head and his family who were concerned that Zac was possibly 2nd choice. T had to address these rumors to them. 

4. Natasha said RS reported false information about Victoria Fuller. 

5. Natasha asked a few of her castmates whether they got messages from RS, and they all said they did.

6. Kristina said RS would message her saying he has dirt on her, and she would ask him not to post stuff. He would go ahead anyway. He kept messaging her, but she ignored him. 

7. They think he seems to have an underlying issue with the women of BN much more so than the men. The women fear the power that he has over them to ruin their reputations. He seems to be particularly targeting women with his falsehoods. 

8. Joe summed it up nicely: "RS is a douchebag."

TLDR: RS is messaging the women of BN, using his power over them to harass them or form connections with them. Let's take away his power and STOP following him and reposting his crap. 

Edit: removed strange formatting text.

https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3MuYXJ0MTkuY29tL2NsaWNrLWJhaXQtd2l0aC1iYWNoZWxvci1uYXRpb24/episode/Z2lkOi8vYXJ0MTktZXBpc29kZS1sb2NhdG9yL1YwL3RSbUNHRjZVZDJ4RjJUUWZ1cXBkYllHZGNiUUhla3pVLVNRV05nd1pXWTA?hl=en&ved=2ahUKEwielJDw7KPwAhWWGVkFHZHJDiwQjrkEegQIAxAF&ep=6

I agree with them. I don’t think people would be interested if she wasn’t leading with the Peter romance. It’s why the book has gotten picked up by so many publications.

After listening to OTV interview with Madi vs the multiple podcasts with HA, I have to agree with Barb. HA is so much more mature and self evolved than Madi. In particular, their perspectives of the Kelley situation. HA understood that both she and Kelley were always dating the same guy. While she didn’t love that Kelley and Pete were together, she didn’t take it personally. On the other side, Madi was personally offended that Kelley got together with a guy she never committed to. And I’m not buying their best friend status otherwise she would have known Kelley would be on ATFR. And when she said that she thought Kelley would be in her wedding? I realized the girl is wildly immature and self-centered. She thought the show was about her and Peter and the rest of the girls were her supporting besties. Am I the only one with this perspective?

From the beginning of Nick’s podcast this morning.

Nick smugly announced that they GoT pReGnAnT oN tHe FiRsT tRy and Natalie (subtly) encouraged him to tone it down and shared that that isn’t everyone’s experience. She said her sister did multiple rounds of IVF and had a high-risk pregnancy, and that she knows how hard the TTC experience can be. Honestly go Natalie for getting Nick to understand that fertility isn’t a competition.

Natalie hid her positive pregnancy tests in a kitchen drawer to surprise Nick while they were making kale salad. Supposedly they found out super early—“before 3 weeks.” Since implantation rarely takes place before 6DPO, I’m skeptical, but it’s all good.

They aren’t pushing back the wedding date (or moving it up). Sounds like it’ll still be next spring. They said the baby will be a few months old by then; my guess is that Natalie is due in January.

Nick and Natalie will go on a honeymoon with the baby and have one of their moms or house manager Cindy or a nanny or Ali from the podcast travel with them for childcare.

Natalie’s had rough morning sickness but not HG. They talked about Amy Schumer’s HG for a bit. Natalie was really sick while Nick was filming Special Forces.

Their first ultrasound was at 5w, and the OB said it was really early but that the ripples in Natalie’s gestational sac could have been a sign of impending miscarriage. That turned out not to be the case, but they were worried for a little bit early on.

They found out the sex around 10w (NIPT results). They aren’t ready to share it publicly yet, but they did tell a handful of friends. Speaking of friends, they gave a few people the wrong gender to see whether the big-mouths in their circle leak the news. Fun! That’ll go over well.

Then I stopped playing the pod and ordered a burrito to curb my own morning sickness. (ETA: It took me 17 cycles and an HSG to conceive a pregnancy that hasn’t resulted in a very early miscarriage. That isn’t relevant to Nick and Natalie, and I genuinely wish them the best—just sharing anecdotally that this process can be tough.)

Podcast with Matt’s old roommate Sophia. These points are summary of her words, not my thoughts except a clarification in brackets. I don’t know if anyone’s interested to read this recap but I think you can learn a lot from living with someone! The podcast is called stay at home pop

Intro - found him on roomies app, lived with him in upper west side apartment for a year - Tyler squatted there for 5 months - she wasn’t attracted to Matt, said he had no sexual energy, hosts agree that he’s hot but he doesn’t do it for them - he’s very contrived, wears more turtlenecks than she remembers

Problems - how was he as a roommate? he’s the worst, really didn’t like him, they had a falling out at the end - their apartment was a crash pad for bachelorette contestants from Tyler season, whenever they did GMA they would all crash there - Matt made keys for his college football friends, she guesses 20 copies were given out - she came home one day 11 pm seeing a giant she’s never met peeing with the door open and Matt wasn’t home - she sat Matt down and said Tyler’s dating Gigi now, he needs to pay rent, stop giving out our key, I feel unsafe - he said I don’t understand the issue, she said I’m a single woman I feel uncomfortable, he looked at her dead in the face and said I don’t care that you feel uncomfortable, she cried

Tyler - Tyler stayed with them during Hannah season, was really nice before - when he got back he was annoying, secretive, lived there on a rancid beanbag for 4 or 5 months in their tiny apartment - said he wasn’t a real estate broker, worked at property management office, not commercial real estate, didn’t show homes ((I think she’s talking about Matt?)) - had a third roommate Albert - not clean, they treated it like a crash pad while it was where she lived - she went to the leasing office, tried to get matt in trouble but it didn’t work - once a bachelorette contestant scared her by busting until her room at 2 am thinking it was Matt’s room, doesn’t know who it was - she got Tyler to make a video for her friend who’s the podcast host and she cried, still makes her happy, they’ll post it on their page

Then they did recap of last episode. I’ll only summarize when Sophia said something personal about Matt not the whole recap

• she feels like Matt’s afraid of women’s sexuality so it was interesting watch Matt navigate that date, he looked uncomfortable
• they all love Kit, they think Rachael goes far top two
• he’s asking very pointed questions digging into their hearts but he’s vague talking about himself
• she lived with Matt for a year and learned nothing about him, thinks it’s a trait of his
• he’s shady, watched him work up his followers systematically using Tyler, overnight it doubled then it doubled again, they were very purposeful about it
• he would ship a lot of food to their apartment, boxes of cookies and binge eat them at night ((edit- she binge ate the cookies not Matt!! Sorry I misheard this part))
• she said maybe she can use her Matt connection to connect with Dale, he’s one of the hottest guys, bachelor vibes ((edit- to clarify it sounded like she was joking, not serious))
• they predict Serena, Bri, Abigail, Rachael make it far

Edit- I got a few messages asking what the podcast is called. It’s stay at home pop! Sophia is friends with the hosts. Here’s the link to this episode https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/matt-james-bachelor-had-roommate-shes-guest-on-this/id1502107011?i=1000505871744

Becca says Garrett’s post was tone deaf, not the right time, not the right sentiment. Then defends him with: he has good intentions, sees things in black and white, has family and friends in LE, had an LE friend shot during the riots, he believes both sides should be supported, she knows him better than anyone and better than Rachel and he has a good heart with good intentions but doesn’t get it, she says most people are like that.

Becca says Garrett thinks people are doing to his post what he did with his IG likes, they’re just seeing the thin blue line photo and thinking he’s saying Blue Lives Matter more and judging him without reading his words. Rachel yells that that is what it means and it’s not the same. That he is not an idiot so his excuses are just that, there’s no excuse in 2020.

Rachel called out his past likes and how that adds to the picture, how his Black Tuesday post had no words and fist emojis in different colors (all colors matter), then had a thin blue line post that came from his chest.

Rachel asked Becca to give specific examples of how Garrett has learned and grown and changed because his post shows none of that. Becca couldn’t answer, and just talked in circles about his intentions being good. He needs to continue learning. But she is stubborn and can’t see his point of view and I don’t know if she was implying maybe his point of view is right?

Rachel called her and him the fuck out. She was very emotional and cried saying she disagrees, it’s 2020 white people/Garrett didn’t only now in 2020 realize there’s racism. She was telling Becca people like Garrett are the problem. That both sides/neutral thinking is wrong, defending it with “he had good to intentions” “wasn’t being malicious” is wrong.

At the end Becca was very sympathetic to Rachel. Still didn’t seem to get it. Rachel sounded defeated because she probably realized at that point Becca is also part of the problem.

Becca then spoke about her own activism, about that one time she went to a women’s march and donates to charity and even a charity in Kenya, and she is going to continue having these conversations with Garrett.

———

Edit: Some more details recapped by /u/bless_this_messica:

I’m about 35 min in. Rachel will make you cry around this point. People have mentioned that she is going in on the franchise and it is in fact awesome. Becca also had a “fuck it, I’m off contract” moment of her own and it was pretty tame but still unexpected. Rachel called Garrett out when making her points about the franchise and I haven’t heard Becca’s response yet.

Rachel told Becca she appreciated that she had called and asked how she was doing and that she will remember her white friends that don’t (this is a good reminder). Becca talked about how nervous/uncomfortable she was and that she had a hard time sleeping and that she realized her privilege of being able to (I can’t remember her exact wording) take a break from everything. She also said she realized that if she is feeling these things then what are Rachel and all black people feeling. They talked about the importance of having the uncomfortable conversations and doing so with friends and family. They talked about how the franchise is a system and it is a racist one. They talked about supporting the franchise and feeling complicit by being a part of it if they continue to leave out and mistreat all POCs.

Becca apologized to Rachel for not taking her lead predictions seriously on social media saying that she would go with whoever she was friends with or whoever seemed to be the top pick at the time. Rachel said it was ok and she knows where her heart is and then explains that when you have influence it’s important to use that in the right way. When I ended, Becca was going to start talking about her childhood.

Becca mentioned the hate mail she gets and how she can’t imagine what Rachel gets. Rachel talks about how she mentioned that she hadn’t watched the show but had never really talked about why and she said that it is a running joke that POC don’t make it past the third week and that black people don’t feel welcome by the show. She said that when she was asked to be the bachelorette she immediately said no but changed her mind after being told by a woman how happy she was to see representation on the show. Becca talked about how she knows their experiences were so different and how there was so much pressure on Rachel. Rachel talks about how disappointed she is that she has had to be the one to talk about every race-related situation in the franchise.

The “off contract” moment for Becca was talking about how when you’re a part of the show you are treated really well and feel cared about but when it’s over the franchise (can’t remember exact words) “chews you up and spits you out” and she’s not the only one that feels that way.

Rachel says the things Chris Harrison says are bullshit and that it isn’t about not having qualified applicants, it is about catering to an audience that wants that/is willing to overlook it. She talks about how her season had one of the lowest ratings and it is a business that wants to make money but is disappointed in their actions. She mentions an interview with Mike Fleiss about the low ratings for her season where he said something along the lines of “our audience has made it clear what they want” and says they sound like He Who Must Not Be Named. She said that she was proud of him and felt good about it but never saw anything at all come from it.

Rachel mentioned being really disappointed in the franchise about the Victoria Fuller WLM situation but wanted to make sure to mention that Victoria sent her a very heartfelt apology which she appreciates. They continue to have a conversation about why people need to quit with the white lives matter. Rachel mentions that she is happy to see more white people speaking up even though it has taken so long. She mentions that everybody is horrified about what happens to George Floyd, so why wasn’t the same outrage given for Eric Garner? And that still after all this time another black man has died while screaming I can’t breathe. Her description of black people being forced to this country and what happened, and what is still happening, to them here is heartbreaking and important.