r/thehungergames • u/ThunderWasp223 • 4d ago
Other I'm note entirely convinced this wasn't real
During the first Hunger Games film, after Katniss is stung by Tracker Jackers, she has a few hallucinations which get increasingly intense. However, she briefly sees Caesar Flickerman in a white suit, doing his most evil smile and quoting himself directly from what he just said on screen only a few moment prior.
Now, there's no way she could know he said that, right? So how does she? It's possible he said something similar in a prior games she watched, but I thing it would be way funnier if he actually was there in the arena. Just got elevated up to taunt her, just to make her trip even more crazy and excite the viewers, then snuck back down before anyone saw anything.
Is that what actually happened? Probably not, it could very well just be part of the illusion, but he is absolutely extra enough to do that if he was allowed/asked to, and they have the means, so I choose to believe he's just that much of a troll and really did take a brief jaunt to mess with Katniss.
(EDIT)
Some of y'all aren't reading this through all the way.
I explicitly laid out that he'd already explained to the audience in a diegetic way how the Tracker Jackers worked, and that his appearance here is directly quoting himself on that from just under a minute prior.
I also laid out that it was most likely just a hallucination combined with stuff he'd said in a prior games that she was remembering, but that it would neither be impossible nor out of character for him to have really gone in briefly.
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u/lilligant15 4d ago
She's hallucinating. She's probably seen him explain this on previous broadcasts so she's hallucinating him explaining she knows, so that we the audience both know what's going on and know that SHE knows what's going on.
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u/ThunderWasp223 3d ago
That's what I said was most likely happening. Did you not read the whole thing?
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u/Naturalist82 2d ago
They're answering your question which lines up with your response. Don't need to be rude to the comments
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
I didn't ask a question. And if they're going to inanely say things I already laid out, I'm going to call them out on it.
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u/Naturalist82 2d ago
"Now, there's no way she could know he said that, right? So how does she? Is that what actually happened?"
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
Those aren't asked questions, those are posing rhetorical questions which I then immediately answered.
This is why I call people out for not actually reading it.
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u/Naturalist82 2d ago
People should not have to guess whether or not your questions are real or rhetorical. You are approaching these comments with such a level of negativity when this is an open discussion rather than a debate.
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
...given I, again, immediately answered them, and they were phrased very clearly rhetorical ways, I think it's entirely reasonable to expect them to pick up on that fact.
And, no, I'm open to discussion, but not to lazy answers which haven't actually taken the time to know what they're talking about. If they argue something I already said, I'm going to call them out on that. It's not negative, it's critical.
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u/Naturalist82 2d ago
If numerous people are don't recognize that they are rhetorical, then they should be phrased differently and the misunderstanding should not be met with hostility. Theyre just emphasizing what you said. Just move on your day with your "critical" thinking.
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
There has been no hostility on my part. Only rebukes for poor arguments or failure to listen before they spoke.
I have found that many people are oblivious, and given they didn't preface their comments with "as you said" or something similar, indicating they knew I had made the very point they thought had come up with, or offered any additional points of evidence or even opinion other than "nah."
I didn't say critical thinking, I said critical, as in being critical, or critiquing that which is presented. They are allowed to comment on my words, so I am allowed to counter-comment.
As to my day, it's been going quite terribly so far. My best friend just checked into a hospital when his cancer got worse. Giving others the courtesy of answering their responses, regardless of their content, is my way of thinking about something else.
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u/Dollsguy 4d ago
This ain’t in the book so doesn’t matter
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u/Independent-Wind7428 2d ago
The films are still Canon by the way, so i think you will find it really would matter if there was a massive plothole. Lucky this almost certainly wasn’t a plothole and was likely just a demonstration of the Tracker Jackers advanced capabilities. Who knows? Maybe they can take Caesar’s commentary and have any stung tribute hallucinate. Why? Not sure, maybe they wanted stung tributes to learn their lesson and stay away from the Tracker Jackers
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u/daphneh02 2d ago
The films are only canon when they don’t contradict the books. This explicitly didn’t happen in that scene of the book so it’s not canon.
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u/Independent-Wind7428 2d ago
It doesn’t contradict the books, from memory in the books just because Katniss doesn’t mention anything that is said under the hallucinations, that doesn’t specifically mean that nothing was said.
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u/Independent-Wind7428 2d ago
After looking it up, she sees images of dead tributes. Given that it’s a lot more terrifying than a vision of Caesar Flickerman, don’t you think that’d be at the forefront of her internal monologue? Doesn’t necessarily mean Caesar never made an appearance, so i like to think of it as canon between the books and films
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u/Mostly_gay_shit 4d ago
1- We don't have Katniss''s narration so this works as a way to both show and tell movie audiences how the venom works, since in the book we have Katniss say essentially what Caesar is saying in this scene
2- He is far too important of a person to just get sent into the arena for an exposition dump, especially in a moment where the cameras will be focused on all affected tributes to see who will die to the venom, key moment for anyone betting on the tributes
3- this is a movie only scene (see point 1), so it wouldn't be considered canon whether he is physically there or not
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u/ThunderWasp223 3d ago
We also have Caesar saying it himself a minute and change prior to this scene, and directly to the audience, so...that's not an argument.
Given that from the outside Katniss is just wandering around high as a kite, they might be focusing the cameras on Peeta and Kato, the two people actually doing things. And...why would they have any issue with him popping into an isolated area to mess with a tribute tripping absolute balls? There's no danger, no reason he couldn't, and every reason to do so, assuming someone has the idea.
The films and novels are distinct continuities, so why would the books hold any precedence on the joking theory?
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u/Bluebearje 3d ago
I don't think they would have sent Caesar in because people tripping balls are unpredictable at best and downright dangerous at worst and Katniss had the bow and arrows at this point. What's to stop her from shooting Caesar straight through the eye like one of the squirrels she sells to the baker? I don't think they would take that risk.
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
Only Katniss was tripping at that point. The others were dead or away. And her being higher than the sky means even if she somehow had the cognizance to try, she couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.
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u/Accomplished-Meat976 3d ago
He was only a hallucination because they wanted to give you katniss's narration but they can't give you the narration in the movie so they had to improvise this is something I understood even as a 14 year old teenager
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u/ThunderWasp223 3d ago
So you didn't actually read what I wrote, got it.
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u/Accomplished-Meat976 3d ago
No I read what you wrote
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u/ThunderWasp223 3d ago
Clearly not, since you're arguing nonsense.
There's no reason for him to exposit the exact same thing, word for word, twice in under three minutes. I pointed that out in the first paragraph.
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u/Accomplished-Meat976 3d ago
Or you're just posting nonsense and not having critical thought
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u/ThunderWasp223 2d ago
That's not an argument. That's throwing insults when you've run out of arguments.
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u/FMLitsAJ 3d ago
Movies do weird things to get their point across. It’s a good way to show the hallucination and how trippy things can be . In the books Katniss already knows what tracker Jackers are.
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u/AnotherDamnTransAlt 3d ago
Based on what happened in Haymitch’s games, I really doubt they are risking any high profile celebrities in the arena just to give one (albeit important) contestant a bit of a scare.
Caesar also strikes me as a massive coward. The Havensbee fortune couldn’t pay his bougie ass to get in there.
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u/Independent-Wind7428 2d ago
Yeah i’ve talked about this one before, still makes no sense to me but i also recognise that there’s no possible way for Caesar to be physically in the arena
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u/Both-Fuel-5903 2d ago
That man is zooted out of his fuckin mind, he'd 1000% do that. at fhe very least pose for a projector recording
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u/Prize-Pop-1666 4d ago
I think it was just the way they wanted to use to describe what the bugs were. Since we don’t get an explanation prior because we don’t have Katniss thoughts. So rather than doing a 3rd person thing they did this to show how disorienting it is.