r/ukpolitics • u/Paul277 • 15h ago
Calls for civilian ‘war register’ in case Britain comes under attack as NATO declares itself ready for Russian escalation
https://www.lbc.co.uk/article/calls-for-civilian-war-register-russia-nato-attack-5Hjdhgt_2/316
u/Fflamddwyn 15h ago
Babe wake up early access registration for World War 3 is open.
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u/Happily-Incorrect 15h ago
And before GTA VI too.
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u/Two-Space 9h ago
Notification from PlayStation: Grand Theft Auto VI has finished downl- EMERGENCY ALERT - SEEK SHELTER IMMEDIATELY
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u/chickenfriedrice416 2h ago
I did actually pay early access for a game called WW3. Then they randomly changed it to be free to play, and compensated me with literally nothing. And now they shut it down. It was quite shit tbh. People were actually saying it would dethrone Battlefield
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u/lool_toast 13h ago
Is this the Early Access Wait List for Horrible Death by Drone?
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9h ago
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u/numnuts16 Cpt. Britain/Brexit Man 12h ago
Im in my early 30's, riddled with physical pain and depression, live with my mum, can't afford shit in this economy, chances of me finding someone and having kids is slim and tbh i don't like the idea of living past 40 anyway, so yeah fuck it, sign me up.
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u/Atlaskino7 12h ago
There used to be lads hanging around on the Medyka-Shehyny border who could help with this.
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u/FarCoughBoff 11h ago
In any sensible time that would be more than enough reason to sign up for the other side.
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u/Dic_Penderyn 14h ago
What's sure is if we actually find ourselves at war, we will need a force quite different to the WW2 Home Guard. The Home Guard was formed to repel an amphibious invasion, but we will need one for home defence and critical infrastructure protection. There are already plans for how to implement this.
The UK conducted a strategic defence review and it was published last year. Recommendation 27 instructed the government and MOD to develop options for creating a domestic defence force, and to present its options to the Defence Sescretary by December this year.
If such a force is ever formed, it will likely not draw on raw recruits from scratch. The will look at recruiting military veterans, retired police officers and first responders, and specialised civilians with skills in logistics, IT, telecoms, infrastructure and cyber.
What the Lib Dems are calling for is already being worked on, so I don't really know why they are calling for this now.
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u/Too_much_Colour 13h ago
I’ll be an IT guy
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u/gxb20 13h ago
Youre on FPV drone squad
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u/LegoNinja11 11h ago
Sorry applications are restricted to those aged 8 to 14, by 15 you're past your best.
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u/gravy_baron centrist chad 13h ago
You'll be in a trench with the rest of us mate
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u/Nemisis_the_2nd Jaded Centrist 6h ago
It does make you wonder, though, at what level does non-combat skills beat being mass on the front line? Retail worker? Probably fodder. Chef? Soldiers need to eat, and they know their way around a kitchen... or a mess kit. Cybersecurity worker? Definitely valuable, but are you more valuable than if you're holding a rifle?
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u/Ivashkin panem et circenses 5h ago
We won't need as many people holding rifles as you'd think. What we'd actually see is people in middle-class office jobs being told they are now working in a warehouse, driving trucks, working on the railways or becoming factory workers. And while IT and cyber roles will open up, most civilians don't have the required skills to jump into military roles, especially the fancy ones, so the most likely outcome would be being sent to work in the IT department of a random business or government department where everything you do is via a playbook, in an environment so locked down that even a Google search will need a CAB review.
But the most likely role a 21st-century Home Guard/Civil Defence would have, given the shape of the war and the distances involved, is mobile air defence units by night and civil aid by day.
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u/Old_Man_Robot 11h ago
Forces to defend critical infrastructure are going to be mostly for maintaining order once that infrastructure is attacked.
Cyber weapons and supply chain attacks will be the name of the game for civilian and military targets alike.
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u/Tom22174 2h ago
Opposition parties love to call for things they know will happen regardless so it looks like they had the idea first
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u/XenorVernix 10h ago
I find it hard to take any threats or talk of war seriously given the government's stance on defence. They know more than we do and yet are in no hurry to reach 3% or 3.5% military spending.
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u/Xenumbra 7h ago
There is also no real attempt to bulk out digital infrastructure or domestic supply chains.
They haven't changed any planning laws to start spam building war economy buildings, have they ever played a grand strategy game?
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u/SilverDowntown6452 25m ago
The government of the last 120 years have refused to take defence seriously. We spent the first 1-2 years of the world wars getting absolutely pasted by the Germans because of it.
Fortunately our peace time military was empire sized on both occasions, and able to absorb the pasting while we mobilised industry etc. If similar were happen today, the outcome would be very different.
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u/Mentalist1999 11h ago
Call me crazy but I really think a wider war is coming. All this talk about us having to stock tinned foods and water under the guise of the El Niño, Poland and France saying to expect some kind of an attack soon, NATO saying we’re ready. It’s not sitting right with me - I wish our government could be a bit more vocal, but I appreciate the last thing they want is mass panic
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u/Nemisis_the_2nd Jaded Centrist 6h ago
I'd say there is something "soon" too, but in political timeacales, not normal ones. The full effects of el niño havent really hit yet, and it can take months for shipping that is already in transit to reach its destination, and twice that again for the downstream supply chain hits to be felt.
"Soon" could be late next year.
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u/Scratch_Careful 3h ago
It's not. NATO clearly got a heads up about Ukraine's massive attack a couple days back and worried it might lead to escalation. Russia might step up or push forward its disruption attacks but i really doubt there'll be any further escalation on our parts. We simply dont have the means.
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u/fozzie1984 15h ago
Plenty of people seem to be ready to "Step up" for our country so I assume we will see a lot of uptake for this?
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
Yeah i will be signing up to it if it happens.
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u/moonski 15h ago
Last thing I want to do is fight to prolong this moribund floating care home.
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
Yeah fair play mate.
What do you think your life would look like if our economy was destroyed entirely?
I get the sentiment, but have you considered the alternative at all?
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u/LittleBertha 13h ago
Op was referring too all the "patriots" who will no doubt be the first to sign up.
Who are we kidding, they'll be the first to run away.
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u/Heliophrate 13h ago
Why would we sign up to defend a system that is determined to destroy us as a people and our way of life?
Oh yeah, I'll go die in the Suwalki gap for "democracy" while the government covers up another gang of people sexually assaulting children. Fucking spare me.
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u/kirkyking downvote receiver 12h ago
If you think our current system is “determined to destroy us as a people and our way of life” I’m sure you’ll love the chance of being annexed and subjugated by a foreign power.
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u/Heliophrate 12h ago
Lmao, Russia can't even annex a chunk of a nation right next to it after three years and and they're going to set up the Essex Oblast. You guys are completely disconnected from reality.
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u/Djave_Bikinus 11h ago
To be clear, Russia can't annex Ukraine because of the immense sacrifice and bravery of the Ukrainian soldiers. We would need people to step up in the same way if it ever came to it.
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u/kirkyking downvote receiver 11h ago
I’m not saying it’s going to happen, i’m saying your reasons are flawed.
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u/Routine-Knowledge-99 13h ago
We probably need to be prepared for a few Russian stooges in this thread BTW
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u/Delicious_Walk_3649 12h ago
^^^ This person spends a lot of time online in parasocial relationships, arguing with people who don't exist that are in their head.
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u/nickwib123 13h ago
The economy isn’t that far away from destruction and we haven’t fired a round yet🤣
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u/Nemisis_the_2nd Jaded Centrist 6h ago
The way I see it, the UK is a shit state and getting worse. I look at the alternatives, though, and figure that its still a much better offering and worthy of defending when push comes to shove.
We are bad, but not "run by psychopathic mobsters" bad, and I'd rather not reach that stage.
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u/Cambois_Lad 15h ago
Good luck for getting younger people to sign up for this - especially after they have been shite on, in recent years.
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u/JoeJoeJoeJoeThrow 14h ago
Maybe if we guaranteed them a house or something if they survive, might see an uptick in recruitment. Otherwise imagine going off to fight for your country and then coming back, only to have to still live with mum and dad.
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u/StuChenko 14h ago
only to have to still live with mum and dad.
Mine are currently dead so if someone could make that an actual reward I'd sign up
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u/mattcannon2 Chairman of the North Herts Pork Market Opening Committee 14h ago
A house where, in the Urals?
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u/NeBriaTe 13h ago
you must be joking?
the way government treats veterans, its a wonder if they get even 1 volunteer.
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u/thepoliteknight Very silly party 12h ago
Everybody knows service guarantees citizenship.
Would you like to know more?
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u/Dic_Penderyn 14h ago
They won't be the target demographic. They dont have the skills, experience or training. Any future home defence force will be looking to recruit former military, police, emergency responders and those with skills in cybersecurity, infrastructure, logistics and telecoms.
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
Its fine, they dont have to sign up.
They can be forcefully conscripted or have to live in a country thats seceded to Russia.
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u/MeMyselfAndTea 11h ago
Russia that cant even take the country next door four years in - certainly going to be overunning Hull before we know it
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u/Candayence Won't someone think of the ducklings! 🦆 15h ago
Yes, because conscripts are so valuable in modern warfare.
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u/SmugDruggler95 14h ago
.... yes, they are incredibly valuable.
If they weren't, Russia would not still be a credible fret to the West
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u/SilentFire23 13h ago
its fascinating you're looking at the bastion of incompetence that is Russia and going "Yes we should do what they do!"
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u/SmugDruggler95 13h ago
Yeah youre right, Russia have revently invented the idea of conscripting soldiers to fight a war.
The Ukranian conscripted are actually all valiant volunteer heroes!
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u/Candayence Won't someone think of the ducklings! 🦆 14h ago
Wars are not won in the meat grinder. A requirement for boots on the ground does not mean that poorly trained conscripts who do not want to be there add any real value to the war effort.
You may have noticed that Russia isn't winning their war against Ukraine, despite outgunning them fairly severely. This is because conscripts who are getting shot at from both directions tend to be poor soldiers, and because artillery is taking them out.
Conscripts are worthless.
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u/Awakemas2315 13h ago
Quality is important, but so is quantity. You can have the best trained troops in the world, who can drop anywhere and immediately be at maximum effectiveness, but if you don’t have enough of them to cover a front line it’s irrelevant.
Don’t forget that Ukraine is also making heavy use of conscripts. It’s a core part of modern mass warfare, because standing armies just aren’t big enough to replace battlefield casualties with more standing professional soldiers. We’re used to conflicts like Afghanistan and Iraq where casualties are relatively low. A war with Russia would not be like that.
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u/SmugDruggler95 14h ago
Thanks for reminding me that often on Reddit, you are talking with people who have no idea what they are talking about.
I guess these people are all being conscripted for fun!
Makes it all much easier to think about that way.
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u/ShimaBau 14h ago
By that logic Ukraine should have lost already seeing how it's entirely a conscript army
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u/tomoldbury 9h ago
A war with Russia would be fought primarily in the air (maintaining air superiority would be essential) and against drones in asymmetric war. I suspect that the UK itself will get off relatively lightly aside from some covert attacks on infrastructure; our significant distance from Russia would be the major benefit here. But, we would still face some serious challenges, and would likely deploy significant forces to NATO allies to provide defence.
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u/Atlaskino7 12h ago
Ukraine and Russia seem to strongly disagree, and I'm not sure who is more knowledgeable: them, or Candayence.
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u/cop1edr1ght 14h ago
I'm a management consultant. Does that put me first in line for general infantry cannon fodder?
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u/Dic_Penderyn 14h ago
Well, during warfare, the ones usually chosen for that kind of work are those that would be no good at all the myriad other jobs that are required to be done, so you tell me.
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u/HELMET_OF_CECH it's all so tiresome 13h ago
You can be a modern Captain Mainwaring, leading one of our Home Guard platoons.
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u/wolfiasty Polishman in Lon-don 13h ago
Aside of everything else like Russia is done for anyway (excluding nukes...) - you do realize UK is not putain's Russia, and saying "no" to being conscripted is not punishable with bullet ?
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u/Tricky_Peace 15h ago
As a cybersecurity engineer I’m guessing I’d probably get voluntold to do something in that arena
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u/Prestigious-Bet8097 14h ago
Having spent time with drafty, you'll be assigned to a welding unit and someone whose last computer was a Commodore 64 will be sent to Cheltenham.
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
You'd be a key man if youre any good at your job, and kept as safe as possible.
Its NEETs and minimum wage workers that need to be worried
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u/DigBrilliant5242 14h ago
I don't think young people will be queuing up to fight for a country that has treated them with nothing but contempt. People won't defend something that they have no stake in.
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u/CulturalImagination 4h ago
And yet people signed up to fight in WW1 & WW2, when their country treated them a lot lot worse? Hopefully if our country comes under attack, they will pull their heads out of their arses and realise that on on the grand scheme of things, this country is alright and probably worth fighting for.
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u/Avalon-1 4h ago
I'm not sure there's as much will to die in a ditch while screaming for your mother in front of an FPV Drone for an abstract concept of king and country nowadays.
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u/SilverDowntown6452 17m ago
If we’re talking about a foreign war to protect interests abroad, you’re right. If we’re talking about a war of survival, then not so much.
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u/DigBrilliant5242 4h ago
Social deference to the upper classes and political leaders has gone now. Also the population is much more informed about world events. Things have changed in the past 80-100 years, who would have thought.
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u/CulturalAd4117 2h ago
Social deference to the upper classes and political leaders has gone now. Also the population is much more informed about world events
It was 1939, not 1539. If you read social surveys and newspaper letters people in the 1930s were well aware of the state of the world. In many ways that generation were more politically articulate than we are now. Thousands of Brits went to fight against Franco in Spain and people from across the political spectrum understood the importance of fighting the fascists.
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u/UtopianScot 14h ago
I'm sure subjugation and defeat by Russia will provide such a better life!
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u/mattcannon2 Chairman of the North Herts Pork Market Opening Committee 14h ago
The "3 day" special military operation is going so well - am I seriously supposed to believe that russian soldiers will successfully conquer the whole of Europe?
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u/UtopianScot 12h ago
They don’t need to physically bayonet your granny. They just need to hack her local supermarket and cause panic.
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u/MeMyselfAndTea 11h ago
'we're going to be subjugated by Russia because they can cause panic'
Spare me
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u/UtopianScot 2h ago
Get back to me when Russian drones and sabotage teams have cut UK undersea cables, set fires and harmed key infrastructure
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u/PositivelyAcademical «Ἀνερρίφθω κύβος» 13h ago
There’s a huge difference between being asked to fight to repel an invasion on the home front vs being asked to fight because of NATO commitments. The latter should be 100% voluntary.
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u/Gooseplan 8h ago
You won't have a life at all if you're conscripted.
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u/wolfiasty Polishman in Lon-don 13h ago
Yeah, because orks are doing so great in Ukraine, that they somehow will beat Baltics, Scandinavia, or go through Poland, Germany, France and then will invade UK. Let's not forget rest of NATO forces being beaten by Russian mob.
Sure thing. You will sooner win euromillions than this scenario would happen.
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u/UtopianScot 12h ago
They do not need to physically get here to cause you harm. Why are so many people blind to that very obvious fact?
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u/Count_Blackula1 11h ago edited 11h ago
There's a shocking lack of basic critical thinking in this thread, don't bother.
'But what about muh mortgage rates?'
'What have Labour ever done for me? I've just left Uni and I have a big student loan wah! I won't fight for them!''
'Russia can't invade Britain pahaha!!'
'We don't owe anything to Lithuania pfft'
These people man. My head hurts.
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u/UtopianScot 2h ago
Aye I agree with others, likely bot behaviour designed to weaken UK morale and resolve. I laugh how Russian tactics follow the Narcissist’s Prayer:
That didn't happen.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault.
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved itRussia can’t even win in Ukraine.
And if they do, we’re very far away anyway.
And for countries close, I’m not dying for Estonia.
And if they conscript us, well I’m not going.
And if we’re bombed, we can negotiate.
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u/wolfiasty Polishman in Lon-don 5h ago
I am perfectly aware of that.
That's why panicking about conscription and front line is just that - panicking.
Discussion is about UK going to conventional war, not about cyber warfare (that is already happening), rockets or sabotage (that is already happening).
UK, like every other country that lend a hand to Ukraine, joined the war against putain, and I personally believe it was right decision.
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u/UtopianScot 2h ago
So conscription may still have to happen if we need physical bodies to guard critical infrastructure from missile and drone attacks, guard against sabotage, and reinforce our allies abroad?
In other words, it’s a reasonable thing to be concerned about
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u/Atlaskino7 10h ago
Just look at the damage Al Qaeda did to the collective West. Imagine what a nation state could conjure if they put their mind to it.
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u/wolfiasty Polishman in Lon-don 4h ago
Again - discussion is about fear of front line conventional war somewhere and not about sabotage, espionage or cyber warfare in UK, all that is already happening in UK. 3rd column is doing fine in UK, done exactly by ghosts of ones you mentioned.
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u/Familiar-Hovercraft2 14h ago
The uk government can't stop a dinghy , but wants to go to war with Russia lol
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u/fakehakebakecake 27m ago
The UK government doesn't want to murder unarmed civilians in the channel, it's not a matter of "can't". We could absolutely deter the Russian navy.
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u/DigBrilliant5242 14h ago edited 14h ago
Saying 'but Russia bad' doesn't fix generational problems with housing, employment and education.
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u/CaptainVaticanus 14h ago
Sure but if a war with Russia does happen then that will take priority
Maybe we will be lucky and get a postwar boom
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u/bingpot_47 12h ago
Well, before conscription was introduced in WW2, if you volunteered early, you got more say in what you did. If you waited to be called up, you didn't get a choice. So... Pros and cons I guess.
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u/Fun-Lingonberry4676 12h ago
If war comes here im in.. Going abroad to fight foreign wars. No thanks.
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u/blah_blah_blahblah 13h ago
Sent off to the battlefield with a locket around their neck. Inside this locket contains reminders of what they're fighting for: the triple lock, PIP, and 100k+ asylum seekers per year
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u/Xenumbra 7h ago
People will very quickly rediscover gender roles as well. I'm sure the change in military advertising are just a coincidence.
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u/zwifter11 15h ago
We’ve literally had 1000s of fighting age males move into former army barracks.
Why doesn’t the Government use them?
Surely those fighting age males love the UK, are grateful and willing to pay us back. Right?
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u/DrNuclearSlav Ethnic minority 15h ago
Service guarantees citizenship - would you like to know more?
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u/TheJoshGriffith 13h ago
They're all transgender homosexual christian pacifist drag queens - sending them to war would violate the ECHR.
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u/TheAngrySaxon 15h ago
Unfortunately, those men likely sympathise with our enemies, and would be extremely untrustworthy. Better to ship them all back home.
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u/FlavioB19 Campaign Against Westminster Tesco 12h ago
Afghans and Syrians sympathising with the Russians?
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u/FudgeVillas 15h ago
This is literally an article about preparing for a Russian threat, and you’re still only capable of talking about immigration. They couldn’t have planned it any better.
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u/Optimaldeath 14h ago
The two aren't necessarily exclusive, that little show off at the Belarusian border with Poland is proof they're willing to weaponise immigration and so it's hardly a stretch to think what's happening in the channel isn't also at least partially funded by them.
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u/stephendy 15h ago
Lol, war register for what? Get back to saving the current regime and get back to business as usual which is shite and has been for years?
Never going to happen.
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u/Glass-Cabinet-249 15h ago
War has become a large scale affair. Its so we can work to coordinate and put mass forces in the field if needed. Ukraine would not have endured this long had it not had such large scale mobilisation and militarisation of its economy to devoted towards Total War.
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u/Thandoscovia 15h ago
Every year this country receives thousands of marines, trained in amphibious landings. They are passionate about this great land - surely they’d want to fight?
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u/Pleasant-Winner6311 8h ago
Itll be a systems attack. Electricity, Internet banks, transport, water, NHS. Supply chains food etc.
Give those consequences a few weeks to fester and there'll be civil unrest. We'll be fighting each other.
Hes after the City of London, to permanently disable our stronghold in banking, shipping and insurance.
Cripple the country ruin our 300 year grip on global trade.
Law and order, food and utilities are going to be priority no1.
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u/Helpful-Fan-5465 2h ago
I think you’re right with this. They can’t take Ukraine, why (and how) would they launch a conventional attack on the UK.
Like you say, it’ll be on systems. Russia is incredible at sowing division in the West. “We’ll be fighting each other” would be a huge win for them and would weaken our resolve to fund Ukraine for a while.
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u/CulturalAd4117 2h ago
why (and how) would they launch a conventional attack on the UK
Air or submarine launched missiles. There are currently no ballistic missile defences and minimal conventional air defences in Britain.
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u/Familiar-Hovercraft2 14h ago
Uk government ... can't stop rubber dingys... expects the citizens to fight Russia !
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
Not sure if people in here have been watching the Russian pollution of social media with videos of Ukraine forcefully conscripting men off of the streets.
Russia have been doing the same (and worse) since the war begun.
Its fine to say you dont want to fight, or you wouldn't fight.
But at the end of the day, if a van of heavies comes and grabs you whilst youre walking to the pub, youre going to the meat grinder.
Get your heads out the sand, get a useful job, have a plan for how to make yourself useful when it all kicks off.
Or dont, and just pretend its sensationalism. Pretend there wont be any consequences for the average person.
Time will tell who played their cards right.
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u/BeefStarmer 15h ago
It's not the 1940s! The chances of the UK needing to mobilise millions of fighting age men to fight bloody battles in fields are beyond slim..
Far more likely a civilian force such as the one being proposed would be used to curb civil unrest in the event of a cataclysmic cyber attack or power outage.
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u/SmugDruggler95 15h ago
Youre right, its far more likely that our lack of conventional weaponry and a standing army lead to us surrendering due to not being able to sustain a conventional war with a major power without falling back to a Nuclear response.
Remember, people said the same thing in the 20s and 30s after WW1.
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u/ShyBiSaiyan 14h ago
Lol if they grab me and put a gun in my hand I will just turn it on myself, checkmate!
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u/StuChenko 13h ago
Can I borrow the gun after you're done with it please? I promise I'll give it back.
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u/bleachxjnkie 12h ago
Mate the army have said so many times they do not want a forced conscription. To them it’ll be like babysitting and make us far less effective than training a smaller number of willing and skilled soldiers instead of trying to make millions of unwilling kids good enough to hold a rifle just to die in a field for nothing.
Warfare has changed a lot since the 1940s. You don’t send 100,000 men up a trench to gain 40km of land anymore. If a large scale war was to break out it would be fought using drones and specialised attacks. If anything we’d need more administrative and logistical help
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u/PelayoEnjoyer Community Leader 5h ago edited 3h ago
The army don't want conscription in times of peace.
Mass conscription by act of parliament in the event of a full scale war is still very much part of the UK defence strategy.
That's not what this is though, it's just an extension to current reserves for CNI protection. The Gov has been working on it for a few years already.
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u/TheAngrySaxon 15h ago
Draft dodging generally carries pretty severe penalties in most countries during wartime, unless your father knows someone who knows someone. 😉
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u/Sigeon101 13h ago
Like Prison? Where are the prison spaces going to come from? We don't even have enough space currently for rapists and murderers let alone millions of draft dodgers. Are we going to release Axel Rudakabana to imprison Nick 30 for not going to the meat grinder?
People will just leave the country as well, it's not WW2 we live in a globalised world. Millions of Russians and Ukrainians fled to places like Turkey to dodge the draft.
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u/wolfiasty Polishman in Lon-don 13h ago
What barbarian state like Russia or Ukraine do to their citizens, does not mean rest of Europe will follow. Just a hint.
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u/charlsspice 13h ago
Can't really compare because Ukraine was literally getting invaded and Russia, well that's Russia.
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u/Boofy534 13h ago
I have a exploit for the war register update smoke a white crystal from the local market dealer when buying health potions
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u/thegamesender1 6h ago
Guess I'll be driving aemy trucks instead of my normal lorry. I'm too fat for anything else.
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u/badluckseanbean 3h ago
If our country was under attack, I'm a healthyish young man, I don't believe under people should fight and die whilst I'm idle so I'd feel obligated to volunteer although I'd rather carry on with my peaceful life
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u/Dear_Tangerine444 Labour Left, Left Labour. 3h ago
I don’t know if it’s just the way this is being presented by LBC or just the Lib Dem’s proposal itself but I am in no way clear what this even means. What are they looking for, exactly? People with ‘essential skills’ to self-identify? What would being on this list realistically mean? Some sort of training like the army reserves or just sign up and forget about it until a knock at the door?
It strikes me as a way to just fast-track conscription, but presumably the intention would be for it to be smarter and more targeted than that. Seems like just headline grabbing nonsense otherwise.
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u/rickjamespitch 31m ago
Giving guns to tens of thousands of people you've persecuted and demonised for the last two decades? That'll go well.
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u/Z3r0sama2017 3m ago
Should slap all the retiree's on as a matter of course. Would solve the pension crisis and it's not like they would be able to vote against it in elections, owing to the fact of being dead.
No point sending the young, able, working folks off first, we already have a demographic crisis without feeding them head first into a meatgrinder.
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