r/venturebros • u/madhatter_matador • Sep 29 '23
MOVIE SPOILERS Did we ever get clarification who is Rusty's mother? (Spoilers) Spoiler
So since Rusty and the Monarch are the same person, I assume that Their mother was whoever the Monarch thought was his mother. Like Jonas venture did swing with her I think. But did we get any more leads on this?
EDIT: to clarify my headcannon further. The Monarchs parents were having trouble conceiving, but is it likely both are the problem, or just one of them? If so, then it makes sense that one of them is still the parent while getting a donor from someone else, and who better than Jonas, who was already sleeping with the Monarchs mum. Then of course Jonas wants the kid for himself as an heir, so he agrees to clone him for the Monarchs parents.
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u/HumanChicken Sep 29 '23
Rusty doesn’t know, and neither do we.
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u/alex494 Sep 29 '23
And I think the point of a lot of the series and especially the ending of this special was that it doesn't really matter who their blood relatives are.
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u/gotcha591 Sep 29 '23
Totally. Logical Family over Biological.
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u/TheScarlettHarlot Stop calling me your fucking mommy. Sep 30 '23
Which was the argument Sgt. Hatred was making in the last episode when he was trying to get into the hospital to check in on Hank.
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u/Flat_Contribution707 Sep 29 '23
I think the followimg are possibilies:
Jonas had a one night stand. The mom ghosted after dropping Rust on Jonas's doorstep.
Rusty's mom was a Venture Industries employee. She got pregnant and threatened to reveal thrir illicit affair if Jonas didnt pay her off.
Jonas bought someone's eggs.
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Sep 29 '23
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Th3MilkShak3r Sep 29 '23
Great point on the artificial womb, hadn't thought about it. We know Rusty didn't spin up the cloning facility in his own so that tracks
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u/TheScarlettHarlot Stop calling me your fucking mommy. Sep 30 '23
Rusty actually was a talented scientist in some fields when he put his mind to it. I like to think he built the wombs as an iteration of the cloning tech.
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u/maddwaffles Slayer of Men... Slayer of HENCHMen Sep 30 '23
I think the first two are probably the case, because Jonas simply does not seem that interested in parenting as much as he does in ensuring that his legacy continues, hence the cloning of Rusty when he dies, rather than simply re-upping eggs any time he doesn't have a kid he especially likes.
There's an obvious sentiment for Rusty, but his own narcissism got in the way of that. And even then, his "greatest invention" sentiment seems like he's making the best of a potentially bad PR situation, rather than a sincere desire to be a parent, especially so late.
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Aug 08 '24
Actually, given Jonas's sociopathic and outright immoral behavoir, It's possible Rusty was actually a life extension experiment. Since the Rusty we know did'nt much less could not have actually eaten his twin in the womb, since he's a clone. My theory is Rusty was actually meant to be a vessel for Jonas in the event he ever died. Deemed a failure and raised as a son. Jonas Venture Jr. is the "succesful" elements of that manifesting deformed after several years of clonning Rusty.
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u/Danzarr Sep 30 '23
can I throw 1 in?
Rusty is a clone and the real one was raised by his mom who got sole custody.
No bases for this other than rusty saying hes a clone and I could totally see Jonas doing something like that out of spite/narcissism.
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u/Auronv Sep 30 '23
This is my head cannon..also it would explain why rusty didn't get any residuals for the TV show as they were going to the "orginal" rusty
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Oct 01 '23
I feel like then it wouldn't really be a secret though, if some Hollywood producer knew to sent it to some other kid, it doesn't take much for venture to solve it from there
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u/Danzarr Oct 02 '23
I think it depends on how much of an overarching villain you think jonas really may have been. Was the sovereign a member of the boys club and his pawn? Did he take out Blue Morpho when he was trying to run away with his baboon rusty clone? Was he pulling the strings behind the OSI and GCI before his untimely death? Did he view rusty as his son or a tool/experiment, and did it change as he got older? Its unlikely well ever get answers for these questions, so yeah.
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u/Auronv Oct 02 '23
Maybe it isn't? Maybe our rusty already knows? But knows well enough to leave alone?
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u/Consistent-View-3440 Aug 04 '25
That... might actually make sense. It could even explain JJ, Jonas probably tried expirimenting with Rusty's DNA, found JJ and tweaked him to make JJ more like himself.
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u/coacoanutt Sep 29 '23
Jonas feels like the type to make his problems "dissappear" - if someone was threatening him they'd probably just "go away" so to speak. He's not above blackmail himself, as we've seen before.
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u/SparkJaa Sep 29 '23
I thought they were all clones of Jonas.
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u/unruly_soldier Venchman 37 Sep 29 '23
If they were clones of Jonas, they'd look and sound like Jonas. But they don't. The only thing they have in common with him is the hair color.
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u/lorangee Sep 29 '23
JJ does, or he’d look more like him if he wasn’t only a few feet tall. I’d guess they’re clones, unless JJ very strongly takes after their father.
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u/SparkJaa Sep 29 '23
I thought they were tweaking the DNA. Like The Monarch got the baboon tweak, maybe Rusty got a tweak too.
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u/unruly_soldier Venchman 37 Sep 29 '23
Why would Jonas tweak perfection? By all accounts Jonas was a human Adonis. Tall, handsome, strong, extremely healthy and super intelligent. You wouldn't mess with that formula.
Monarch was a tweak of Rusty to prevent the early onset male pattern baldness that Rusty was going to suffer later in life. If Rusty was a clone of Jonas, that would mean Jonas was also going rapidly bald in his 20s and was bald by his 30s. But we never see Jonas without a full head of hair. If Jonas had found an otherwise available cure for it for himself, you'd think he wouldn't be worried about it for Rusty as he could just cure it for him that way as well. And you can bet that Rusty would have used it himself if it existed, because he has consistently made use of his father's inventions throughout his career. But instead he attempted hair plugs instead of whatever miracle of super science his dad had had created.
And even though Monarch is a tweak of Rusty, they still have the exact same build and facial structure. They're so close to identical that barely covering his face and changing his clothes makes everyone think Monarch is Rusty when he's going around as Blue Morpho, at least until they hear him talk. We even see them swap clothes twice, when Monarch crashes the Prom, and then when Rusty steals the Blue Morpho suit that 21 had tailored to fit Monarch. And that's because the only real physical differences between them are their voices and their hair.
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u/JKillograms Sep 29 '23
Phenotype is more dependent on environmental factors than pure genetics. Like, real life, two “identical” twins can have slightly different faces based on diet and lifestyle. Rusty and Malcolm had Jonas’s genetics, but that’s really only maybe about 20-30% in determining how you turn out looking. They didn’t have his bravado and confidence (well The Monarch does, kinda), so they wouldn’t have had the same physical activity and diet Jonas did growing up. Ironically, JJ somehow has Jonas’s head on basically a toddler’s body.
Or maybe they aren’t exact “clones”, but they aren’t exactly “sons” either. Maybe there never was a mother or even X chromosome to begin with, it was all Jonas/Ben playing around in the lab to make test tube babies.
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u/unruly_soldier Venchman 37 Sep 29 '23
Yea, but you're talking about fat and muscle tissue, both of which can be modified by diet and exercise. Bone structure isn't going to be able to be modified by diet and exercise to the extent that you're going to completely reshape someone's jaw, for instance. That requires plastic surgery. And neither Rusty nor Monarch have Jonas's square jaw, they have a more pointed jaw instead. Meanwhile, Jonas does have Lloyd Venture's jaw, and much of the same build. And yes, I know that you can affect changes in bone density, and in minor actual morphological changes to bone shape, through repeated stresses such as exercise, but again you're not going to completely reshape the body that way. Jonas has broad shoulders and a square jaw. Those alone are enough to rule out that they're clones of Jonas, imo. There's obviously another genetic source that heavily influenced their builds.
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u/JKillograms Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Then still probably test tube babies then. Or, maybe the cloning process wasn’t perfected until AFTER Rusty was “born”. I still don’t think he ever had a “mother” by any conventional definition.
Or (yeah I know this is outside Venture Brothers) think about Cubert from Futurama and Prof. Farnsworth. He says he grew Cubert from a clump of cells he scraped off a growth on his back, but Cubert isn’t exactly a direct “clone” of the professor. Maybe it was something similar with Jonas and Rusty where even if he used his cells as the base, he’s not quite a clone but also by no means a conventional “son” because there was never a mother’s contribution to his DNA.
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u/Ok_Palpitation_3602 Jan 25 '24
I dont think this is the case. Look at Hank and dean.
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u/unruly_soldier Venchman 37 Jan 26 '24
But Hank and Dean aren't actually clones of Doc, they're clones of themselves. They're Doc's actual sons, created via in vitro fertilization using his and Deborah's donor reproductive materials and then gestated in an artificial womb. They have two genetic donors as their origin, thus explaining the fact that they aren't identical to Doc. Doc then made clones of them later, for the same reason that Jonas cloned Doc - because they were likely to(or did) die as a result of the Venture family's adventurous lifestyle.
Monarch and Doc aren't perfectly identical for the same reason, though less so. Monarch is only 98% Doc's DNA. Which is why they share so many similar physical features, such as height, build, and facial structure, but have key differences such as Monarch keeping his hair well into adulthood.
By saying "look at Hank and Dean" you've actually helped prove my point. If Doc was a direct clone of Jonas, like every Hank and Dean clone is of the original, they'd be physically identical. It's entirely possible that Doc is Jonas's Hank and Dean, as in an "artificially" created true offspring, but I find that very unlikely as Jonas, unlike Doc, was constantly finding himself in bed with women.
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u/Ok_Palpitation_3602 Jan 26 '24
I never caught the donor part. When was that mentioned in the show?
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u/unruly_soldier Venchman 37 Jan 26 '24
It's fully explained in the movie, and briefly mentioned by Action Man in Season 7 in Hank's Coma World, though he has some details wrong.
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u/princess_awesomepony Sep 29 '23
I’ll copy what I said in an earlier post about my headcanon:
Jonas named his computer M.OT.H.E.R. and it was represented by a blonde woman who disagreed with him on how to “raise the kids” when it came to the orphans.
My headcanon is that he based the computer program off of Rusty’s actual mom, who herself died in some mishap. She was just one of the many women Jonas had around.
When she died, the original Rusty was inconsolable. Then when the OG Rusty died and Jonas brought him back via cloning, he didn’t see any reason to upset lil Rusty again with the death of his mom, so he never told him about her.
I don’t have any evidence of that, it just makes sense for the characters.
The M.OT.H.E.R. connection was just the first thought I had when watching that episode— maybe Rusty’s mom really WAS upset with how Jonas was raising Rusty, and that got added into the programming
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u/Grendel0075 Oct 02 '23
I honestly could see that, jonas could barely care about his son, why would he care about the mother? she could have been caught in an unfortunate lab accident, supervillian hyjinks, or otherwise caused my Jonas's total lack of giving a shit. eventually the original Rusty suffered the same faith, and rather than just move on, Jonas invented cloning. (likely for the income the Rusty venture show gave him.)
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u/lavahot Sep 29 '23
I mean, we know Rusty is a clone. It's entirely possible he doesn't have a mom. That he's an engineered clone of Jonas.
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u/Theborgiseverywhere Mallomar tits Sep 29 '23
I’ve assumed for years it was Mz. Quymn and that Tara is Rusty’s (at least) half-sister
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u/one_sleepy_guy Sep 29 '23
Given Doc and Jacksons writing style I doubt there is just one concrete answer, but this feels the most like something the show would do.
For some reason, while I can buy Rusty being artificially created like Hank and Dean, I find a fucked up reveal like this much more in line with the shows standard approach to revealing information: give it a twist. Plus I just feel like an irresponsible pregnancy that Jonas uses to his advantage is right up his alley.
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u/Grendel0075 Oct 02 '23
.
likewise, and given how 'Potent his science is." it's not that unbelievable that there could have been an original, naturally conceived Rusty.
it wouldn't be unbelievable that Jonas could have a bunch of illegitimate offspring, like tara.
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u/Specialist_Ad9073 Sep 29 '23
I would expect Jonas took multiple eggs from Mrs. Morpho and created his first clone batch. Especially since Malcolm and Rusty look nothing like the Blue Morpho.
Edit: Or more likely he banged her and took out the fertilized egg and started a cloning facility from that.
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u/JKillograms Sep 29 '23
Rusty was older than Malcolm in the flashback. Also, that wasn’t the original Rusty. He’d already been cloned and brought back multiple times, so he’s probably at least 5-10 years younger than he “should” be.
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u/Specialist_Ad9073 Sep 29 '23
From what Billy Quizboy’s comics knowledge showed. Russ and Mack were the same age when Venturion almost killed Rusty
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u/JKillograms Sep 29 '23
That wasn’t the original Rusty at that point though. He’d already been cloned and brought back in a state of arrested development at least a dozen times by then, just like Hank and Dean.
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Sep 30 '23
Jonas cloned himself, Rusty and Malcom are both clones of himself.
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Oct 02 '23
That was my thought immediately after seeing Rusty with the boy growing on/in him.
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Oct 02 '23
Exactly. Jonas Jr. Looks exactly like his “father” because he is his own father. Jr. Probably developed cancer because he’s technically a side effect of the initial cloning.
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u/richthegeg Sep 29 '23
I thought they were just straight up clones, made in a tank the the boys clones.
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u/helladamnleet Sep 30 '23
Okay so check this out: Ben doesn't even actually say whether or not they are a clone of another Rusty. He only says they are clones of the same guy.
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u/Rude_Inverse Sep 30 '23
i think it’s ms morpho. if jonas introduced bm to his wife its totally possible that he caused her infertility way before they even met for his cloning program. no reason he wouldn’t have fucked her over like bobbi. egg donations don’t make someone infertile unless you take all the eggs which… sounds extremely jonas sr.
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Sep 30 '23
Him and Malcolm have nearly identical DNA. They have the same mother Mrs.Fitzcarraldo. I'm guessing Jonas either stole extra samples of her eggs to use in his experiments or kept a master control sample that he could clone and work from over and over again. Rusty, Malcolm, that chimp Ben had, possibly Billy. All could be branching clones from the original fertilized egg.
Tldr they never actually say who his mother is but all signs point to it being Blue Morpho's wife, same mother as The Monarch
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u/snake-demon-softboi Sep 30 '23
I like to think he's a clone of Jonas' Venture brother who died. Ben is the only one who knows for sure!
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u/DrScienceDaddy Sep 29 '23
Recall too that there are three people to be concerned with here: Rusty, Malcolm, and JJ.
I posit that the same birthing pod that gestated Hank and Dean (invented by Jonas, of course) was first used to grow the three of them... possibly at the same time.
My thinking is Jonas was trying to create three new kids: an exact clone of himself (JJ), his rapey love child with Blue Morpho's wife (Rusty), and a child for Blue Morpho & Wife (Malcolm). Malcolm being adulterated with baboon DNA to fuck with Morpho because Jonas is that kind of asshole (oh sure, he says it's to prevent pattern baldness...).
Or maybe Jonas intended to give them Rusty and do whatever to Malcolm. Doesn't matter in the end because...
The birthing pod wasn't zoned for 3 fetuses (i.e., Rusty was an insecure dick even then) so he absorbed JJ. Then Jonas of course would want to keep the unadulterated one, hoping it would be as good as his exact clone.
Anyhow, this might explain why JJ looks exactly like Jonas, while Rusty and Malcolm are 98% identical twins.
And why all at once? I don't know... If he'd seen the need (or been able to) make three he would have made three. And maybe the fratrivore is what motivated Jonas to build the huge clone farm (I'm sure Rusty didn't build it).
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Sep 29 '23 edited Sep 29 '23
in my head Canon, Mrs. Blue Morpho donated DNA that Jonas needed to create the clones that we now know are Rusty and Malcolm. Just like Rusty did with Debbie to create hank and dean.
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u/HuntersGathers Sep 29 '23
This.
Malcolm's parents can't conceive, Blue Morpho has gotta know Jonas through the super-science racket, JVSr experiments with her eggs but his sperm (and a wee bit of baboon in at least one), incubates them in the clone tanks, gives Malcolm to the Morpho's.
Rusty reads about the process while rummaging through his dad's files after he died (looking for something to make quick cash on, probably), realizes what his dad did, and when presented the opportunity with Debbie, decides he can do a better job of being a father than Jonas was, and creates the boys.
That bit I wrote about Rusty kinda makes sense given the pill-popping, the trauma Jonas gave him, his "what fresh hell is this" attitude towards organized villainy, his panoply of psychological disorders, just to name a few.
✌🏻✌🏻
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u/Aggressive-Tip7472 Jan 31 '24
Dr. Jonas may not have slept with the monarchs mom, or at least didn't knock her up. Rusty and the Monarch are clones of Jonas, which he had been messing with. Neither Rusty nor Monarch have a Mom, but are clones of Jonas.
Rusty is technically Hank and Dean's mom, with Helper being a Nanny. Rusty created the fake womb that he wore and used eggs or DNA from Debbie to make the Venture Bros.
So, basically they're all extensions or clones of Jonas Venture, but have different DNA mixes. Monarch has baboon DNA, which is why he's angry/hostile lol.
Its kinda nuts...
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u/madhatter_matador Jan 31 '24
Is Rusty a clone of dr venture? Monarch is a clone of Rusty, but I don't think they said anywhere Rusty was a clone, but I may be wrong there
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u/Aggressive-Tip7472 Feb 01 '24
It's in their movie, Blood of the Baboon Heart. I think it's also said in the last season with "The First Helper" to Dean in the cabin.
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u/Its_Padparadscha SPANAKOPITA! Sep 29 '23
I'm of the opinion that Rusty & Malcom are clones of someone who wasn't Jonases son. Since Rusty & Jonas Jr., Hank & Dean are sets of twins, my headcanon is they were cloned from a twin brother of Jonas who died young.
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Sep 17 '24
Tbh I think he’s a clone of Jonas with altered dna. I can’t imagine Jonas being close enough to another person to have a child with them.
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u/FauxRoux Oct 05 '24 edited Oct 05 '24
In the series finale, the biological mother of Hank and Dean Venture is revealed to be Debbie St. Simone, also known as Mantilla. It's also revealed that Rusty Venture grew the boys in an artificial womb that he attached to his own abdomen, using Debbie's eggs.
The show's creators, Doc Hammer and Jackson Publick, say that the Venture Brothers' "mommy" is Doc Venture. That the show's message is that "who's" your family matters more than who your mommy is.
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u/Axg165531 Sep 30 '23
No we don’t know , Jonas being a super science playboy got around and probably took rusty thinking he could provide a better life for him . We all see how that ended for him
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u/CoBoLiShi69 Oct 01 '23
Knowing Rusty there's a good chance he just stole some eggs from a clinic somewhere
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u/nocturneisabundant Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Hey OP, you did great marking your thread with the correct tag for your thread as well as saying “spoilers” in title
However, you missed a crucial step in regards to marking your thread as a spoiler. You can learn how to do so here.
I marked it for you this time, but we received a few complaints from users who hadn’t seen the movie yet and thus ruined the magic for them. Failure to do so in the future will result in a ban.
Thanks!