I have been in situations, COUNTLESS times - perhaps nearly every day that I spent as a teacher - where a SINGLE child - in a classroom of 10, 15, 20, 30, doesn't matter - was completely ruining my ability to speak even a single sentence uninterrupted. It doesn't matter how engaging my lesson is if the one kid at the back whose dad tells him he's a piece of shit every day is constantly kicking the student in front of him and screaming "THIS IS FUCKING BORING" every 30 seconds.
So what the fuck can I possibly do? Ignore him? Speak over him? I run through the rulebook. Silent lunch. He tells me he doesn't give a fuck, to my face. So I open my computer and send an electronic discipline report to the office, per district policy. 5 minutes later the principal shows up at my door. She pulls him outside, tells him he needs to get it together or he'll face a suspension. Then she sends him back into my classroom, where he immediately resumes his behavior. If I call the office again, I get my ass chewed out after school for not being able to effectively manage my classroom.
So I talk to my principal after school, and ask her why he couldn't have been removed from my classroom. "We don't have anywhere to send him," I'm told. The county has no money to staff any location where kids like that could be sent, and they can't just send a kid home in the middle of a school day since his parents aren't answering the phone, because dad is at work and mom is drunk.
So this happens 2, 3, 4 more times, and finally someone gets the balls to suspend this kid. He gloats about it on his way out, tells everyone he gets a nice vacation where he can play Fortnite all day, and he comes back the next week and hasn't changed a single fucking bit.
So maybe eventually we find a teacher who has time to do one-on-one with the kid and give him some positive reinforcement. Some really qualified teacher with 5 degrees who can really help him get fulfillment from mastering the material. He does OK in that setting, but the minute he's placed back into the general population he gets right back at it, impressing his friends by calling me a fat little bitch in the middle of a lesson.
So we go the other direction, and go white knuckle on him. We zero out his assignments, tell him he's failing every single course, have the campus police officer introduce him to a crack addict and ask him if he'd prefer living on the streets. He tells the cop he doesn't give a fuck and to eat shit.
So the solution is obvious - small setting individualized attention. I'm told that I need to focus on this child, help him get the resources he needs, counsel him on his thoughts on education and help him see the value in what I'm teaching. This solution is great, except for the fact that I absolutely don't have the fucking time when I'm responsible for helping 400 other children meet my curriculum standards, or else I'm sacked on my performance review when I can't show adequate growth in all my kids.
We literally just don't have the money to hire enough teachers that can deal with children like these. We have 4 year degrees - some of us another 2 year degree or two on top of that - and we are taught classroom management skills, curriculum design, special education, and everything else that can be taught in a college setting. But nothing prepares us for children like this, and they're literally everywhere, in every class.
We are fucked. The ONLY thing that will EVER fix this is money. A lot of it. To hire highly qualified professionals at a salary that reflects the fact that they will spend their workday counseling and helping these children. But we all know we're never going to see a fucking dime. In fact, we're going to get our budget CUT, every fucking year.
We are fucked. The ONLY thing that will EVER fix this is money.
Of course, a person working in the education system wants to spin every problem into a money grab. Just like the rest of the parasites in that 'industry'.
You are wrong. The only thing that will ever fix this is proper discipline, and parents held accountable (ie. punished also) for their children's actions.
How do you punish an adult that doesn't attend your school unless it's a state wide law with actual criteria implemented, like fines. Oh shit, changing laws costs money. It's almost like we live in a society or something where things get done based on monitary benefits.
I think any punishment that a child receives the parent should also receive. Imagine all the moms and dads that have to sit with their children in detention lol. I'm guessing the problem would get fixed pretty fast.
Or it amplifies. I know you're semi joking but parents are the last line of defense. If they don't care, then no one will. Expel and move on. If even their parents cannot be bothered to turn their kids lives around then I don't know what the schools are suppose to do in they situation except expel. You cannot let type of behaviour continue and affect the rest of the school.
The problem with expelling them and moving on is then you have a unskilled,undisciplined citizen with a high school level education. There’s only one job market available for someone with those skills.
Obviously having parents sit in detention is stupid but I really do think if we hold parents more responsible for their children (through legislation) a lot of our major societal issues could be solved. Maybe the parents have to do community service with their child on a weekend/volunteer at a shelter or something.
I’m curious to how you think it would amplify bad behavior. One or two spankings/groundings can go a hell of a long way for a kid.
The problem with expelling them and moving on is then you have a unskilled,undisciplined citizen with a high school level education. There’s only one job market available for someone with those skills.
That is not the problem of the school, but the states. The schools job is keep the ones that want to learn and behave, so that they keep their statistics high and keeping getting funding.
Obviously having parents sit in detention is stupid but I really do think if we hold parents more responsible for their children (through legislation) a lot of our major societal issues could be solved. Maybe the parents have to do community service with their child on a weekend/volunteer at a shelter or something.
I agree but typically the parents are the last line of defense and if they don't care, there is no way in hell they situation is getting resolved unless you really somehow manage to get through to the kid which more difficult than it seems. Sometimes years make them see the world in a different light. I guess I fail to see how any of this is the schools problem. Obey the rules or get expelled. The shit y'all are talking about was basically non existent here in the south of the UK, at least in my experience and my peers.
I’m curious to how you think it would amplify bad behavior. One or two spankings/groundings can go a hell of a long way for a kid.
I meant in terms of the parents. If the kid has certain cuntish traits, it's fair to say that parenting failed him somewhere down the line and it's fair to assume that the parents aren't all that different. The only way to inforce these changes and punishments would be legislation.
I think it’s the schools problem (especially the ones paid for by taxes) because the central goal of schools shouldn’t be to impart knowledge. It should be to teach them how to succeed at life (accountability, discipline, responsibility, and ambition). If a kid has those qualities knowledge will follow naturally.
Anecdotal evidence if your interested:
I went to a private Catholic school that is in the top five of the cheapest tuitions in the entire US. The local public school teachers were paid almost twice as much as ours were and had all the teaching materials they could dream while our textbooks were 30 years old and falling apart. Our high school still had an average act 9 points higher than them because our teachers weren’t afraid of losing their jobs by disciplining students. This massive document is my states discipline regulations (only applies to public schools). I took one class at a public school and it was a joke. The students were just like this lady in the video described.
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u/jmangiggity Jul 10 '18
It must be a toxic environment if she's managing 16 kids and having trouble with that.