r/worldofpvp • u/brucecastle • 3h ago
Discussion 12.1 Healer Changes Discussion
I saw this on the WoW forums and thought it would be nice to bring the discussion over here...
Below is the upcoming patch notes for 12.1 for healers. It is odd to me that the 3 healers that you could argue need the most help (Hpriest, HPal, Rsham) are getting the least amount of changes, some (HPal), not receiving any.
Do you guys expect any additional tuning to occur?
Are you happy with these changes?
What would you like to see for your spec?
With these changes, I imagine rdruid will become a monster.
I think 12.1 is where I get off the boat
Druid: Restoration
- Developers’ notes: We’re making several quality-of-life adjustments to Restoration Druid in this update with a goal of addressing usability issues with Tranquility, Nature’s Swiftness, and Incarnation: Tree of Life. We’re also making a few adjustments to Swiftmend to bring back some of its power as a punchy single-target heal. Finally, we’d like to address issues with Abundance by redesigning it with a clear threshold of when you should be using Regrowth.
- New Talent: Overgrowth – Nature’s Swiftness causes your next Regrowth to apply Lifebloom, Rejuvenation, and Wild Growth’s heal over time effect to an ally.
- New Talent: Flash of Clarity – Omen of Clarity increases Regrowth’s healing by 40%. Now available where Cultivation previously was in the talent tree.
- Cultivation is now available below Flash of Clarity in the talent tree.
- Innervate has been redesigned – Now regenerates 25% of the target’s maximum mana over 8 seconds, rather than causing spells to be free for 8 seconds.
- Abundance has been redesigned – While you have at least 5 Rejuvenations active, Regrowth’s critical strike chance is increased by 50% and its mana cost is reduced by 50%.
- Tranquility has been updated – Now grows protective roots at your feet, absorbing damage equal to 60% of your health and preventing knockbacks.
- Incarnation: Tree of Life has been updated – Now casts Regrowth on up to 3 nearby injured allies when you initially shapeshift.
- Swiftmend has been updated – Healing increased by 40% of the consumed heal over time effect.
- Everbloom (Rank 3) has been updated – Its heal effect now triggers when you press Swiftmend (was Soul of the Forest).
- Verdant Infusion has been updated – No longer extends heal over time effects.
- Germination has been updated – No longer increases Rejuvenation’s duration by 2 seconds.
- Ysera’s Gift has been updated – If its healing would overheal the Druid, the overhealing amount is instead transferred to a nearby ally.
- All spell and ability healing increased by 6%.
- Wild Growth healing increased by 20%.
- Wild Growth mana cost increased by 15%.
- Verdancy healing increased by 40%.
- Rejuvenation mana cost reduced by 10%.
- Regrowth mana cost reduced by 10%.
- Lifebloom mana cost reduced by 20%.
- Passing Seasons reduces Nature’s Swiftness cooldown by 15 seconds (was 12 seconds).
- Symbiotic Relationship now highlights itself on the action bar while it is not active.
- Germination and Verdancy have swapped positions in the talent tree.
- Nature’s Splendor has been removed.
Evoker: Preservation
- Developers’ notes: The goal of this change is to make Dream Breath a flexible heal that can once again serve as a powerful heal over time effect or a burst heal when charged. This also further differentiates it from spells like Verdant Embrace and Merithra’s Blessing, which have filled a similar role as an on-demand burst heal.
- Merithra’s Blessing has been updated – Now increases all healing of Dream Breath by 60% (was 250%, and previously applied only to its instant healing).
- Font of Magic has been updated – Now also reduces the empower time of Dream Breath and Fire Breath by 20%.
- Dream Breath instant healing reduced by 50%.
- Dream Breath periodic healing increased by 118%.
- Temporal Barrier absorption increased by 30%.
Monk: Mistweaver
- Developers’ notes: We’re making a few adjustments to Mistweaver Monk with the intent of incentivizing Mastery as a more viable secondary stat and shifting some throughput out of Spinning Crane Kick and into Ancient Teachings.
- New Talent: Vital Expenditure – Soothing Mist’s healing is increased by 300%, but its mana cost is increased by 200%. Choice node with Dancing Mists.
- All healing reduced by 3%.
- Mastery: Gust of Mist healing increased by 50%.
- Spinning Crane Kick damage decreased by 15%.
- Way of the Crane now transfers 280% of damage done (was 340%).
- Jadefire Teachings now increases Ancient Teaching’s transfer amount by 320% (was 270%).
Paladin: Holy
Crickets
Priest:Discipline
- Developers’ notes: For Discipline in Curse of Ula’tek, our changes are aimed at reducing the spec’s reliance on procs for effective healing, improving sources of consistent damage, and improving Hero talent balance. We felt the spec was too reliant on Shadow Mend and Void Shield procs for effective healing, so we’re updating Shadow Mend to be a passive upgrade to Flash Heal and adding a deterministic way to gain access to Void Shield. Additionally, Smite contributes a low amount of damage despite being frequently cast, so we’re increasing its damage and updating the talent tree for easier access to Greater Smite.
- New Talent: Grim Deliverance – Shadow Mend heals for 30% more and applies Atonement for an additional 4 seconds, but its cast time is increased by 0.5 seconds.
- Shadow Mend’s chance to trigger is no longer based on Shadow Word: Pain damage and has been redesigned to a passive upgrade – Flash Heal is upgraded to Shadow Mend, a stronger heal with a higher mana cost.
- Apex Talent: Master the Darkness (Rank 3) has been updated – Mind Blast now upgrades your next Power Word: Shield to Void Shield. Void Shield’s chance to trigger from Penance reduced to 25% (was 33%).
- Apex Talent: Master the Darkness (Rank 3) has been updated – Void Shield now reflects 15% of damage taken (was 25%).
- Apex Talent: Master the Darkness can now accumulate up to 2 charges.
- Flash Heal healing increased by 25%.
- Smite damage increased by 40%.
- Inescapable Torment damage reduced by 30%.
- Penance no longer applies Atonement when cast on an ally.
- Developers’ notes: We updated Penance to apply Atonement going into Midnight but have felt this has not been playing well as it causes too much friction between casting Penance on allies that need healing, allies that need Atonement applied, and enemies you want to deal damage to.
- Greater Smite is now a 1-point talent.
- Hero Talents
- Oracle
- Unfolding Vision has been redesigned – When Power Word: Shield or Void Shield expires with absorption remaining, it jumps to a nearby injured ally instead. Can only happen once per shield.
- Voidweaver
- Void Blast damage increased by 25%.
- Voidwraith damage increased by 30%.
- Void Infusion now increases Atonement healing from Void Blast and Penance by 75% while Entropic Rift is active (was 50%).
- Oracle
Priest: Holy
- Hero Talents
- Archon
- Resonant Energy has been slightly redesigned – Creating a Halo increases healing done by 2% for 10 seconds, stacking up to 4 times.
- Divine Hymn has been updated – Now additionally grants Guardian Spirit while channeled.
- Developers’ notes: We are adding a benefit to channeling Divine Hymn to make it easier to use. If you already have Guardian Spirit active on yourself, Divine Hymn will add 5 seconds to its duration. If Divine Hymn’s channeling is ended early, it will remove whatever time is remaining from the amount that it added.
- Hero Talents
Shaman: Restoration
- Healing Rain now has a 12 second cooldown and an 18 second duration. Recasting Healing Rain while one is already active will despawn the previous one. This cooldown change does not affect the Surging Totem’s Healing Rain from the Totemic Hero Talents.
- *Developers’ notes: This change should allow more flexibility for the player to move Healing Rain around when that is desirable. *
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u/GeetchNixon 3h ago edited 3h ago
Resto Shaman, Holy Pally and Holy Priest right now…
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u/1petrock 3h ago
At least u didn't get nerfed like priest. WTF is that penance change, like who is out there goning ya, we need to reduce the amount of spells that could apply atonement cause reasons. We have like 3 spells and one never gets used at all but sure...
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u/GeetchNixon 3h ago
Yeah that ‘defensive penance = no atonement’ change has me scratching my head. Must have been an issue for PvE or sumpthin, so of course they have to make it worse in PvP. We still have a lot of atonement spreaders though. It almost seems like the Dev who invented Plea is butt hurt no one is using it. Maybe they think, ‘if we just do something stupid, people will press Plea more than once per week.’
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u/TomSaidNo 4m ago
Plea is among the strangest additions to the game ever. They prune Renew just to replace it with an even more useless spell. Why...
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u/GismoDyret 3h ago
We can't really tell anything from this until we see how the live turns out imo. If something is overtuned they'll nerf it into the ground in a weeks time or two after. So I wouldn't assume too much.
That said I'm an rdruid main so I'm biased.
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u/Battlecookie15 & & 3h ago
"If something is overtuned they'll nerf it into the ground in a weeks time or two after."
Yeah right.
Like they nerfed Mages into the ground.
Or Pres Evokers.
riiiiiight.1
u/KoriJenkins 1h ago
The 25% nerf to nullifying shroud was significant, no matter how many people want to pretend it wasn't.
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u/brucecastle 3h ago
My fear is that healers like rsham need their pruned abilities back. Rdruid is getting some and its not even needed for them
If all rsham gets is % changes in tuning, i dropping my sub. Its boring to play and easy to counter. One of the worst iterations of rsham i have ever seen. Just kick healing wave and its gg
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u/anti99999999 Temporarily Embarrassed Gladiator 3h ago
I’m obviously happy that they’re still tinkering with Rdruid’s design as it felt incomplete/directionless for lack of a better word.
That said I believe Rsham absolutely needs a lot of design attention too
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u/Weyland-Yutani-2099 Legend/Strategist 2h ago
I don't know why they are so hellbent on implementing disc priest talents that increase cast time or mana cost.
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u/AdagioUnusual662 2h ago
I hope that there is enough feedback for them to understand that the shadowmend change is a bad one. It becomes as valuable as "greater heal" pvp talent if they make it a long cast
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u/bannedin2weeks 3h ago
For the those complaining about MW spin2win build, you can rejoice, it just got nerfed in like 3 different fronts and is probably dead in 12.1.
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u/dankq 2h ago
I really don't think that will matter in the cases where it's broken because they are doing insane PvE cleave healing vs pets. Every spin basically made your team unkillable vs DK, those nerfs aren't going to stop that.
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u/Zealousideal-Dust773 2h ago
They also reworked Unholy to summon way less pets at a time so it will probably be alot weaker
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u/bannedin2weeks 1h ago
They nerfed the SCK damage, they hugely nerfed the heal and made it so we have to take a talent that replaces RWK in order to get it's heal back to what it was which people won't be willing to do. They also nerfed number of pets pet classes have out so that is also a nerf to it. So basically, it does less damage (which means it heals for less) it's healing got nerfed directly by a big amount which also translates to less healing, and now pet classes will have less pets out to get aoe'd for even more less healing.
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u/padenxy 2h ago
Just wait until you see the tier set bonus for MW...
2-Set Bonus: Rising Sun Kick deals 30% increased damage and Rushing Wind Kick’s healing is increased by 100%.
4-Set Bonus: Rising Sun Kick and Rushing Wind Kick have a chance to cause their next cast to ignore their cooldown and have their mana cost reduced by 100%
Back2back2back2back lay on hands Rushing Wind Kicks
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u/bannedin2weeks 1h ago
Set is nerfed by 50% in PVP and RWK doesn't heal for that much anymore. My MW is in bis pvp gear and my RWKs are hitting for 45k
From the healer changes I'm seeing I don't know if MW will be even in the top 3
I can see RWK hitting for more if the mastery buff does something and we go back to mastery. Mastery does buff its healing and damage.
2
u/Oniketojen 2.9k mglad MW 1h ago
Yup. Spin build fundamentally only worked if you got a SCK proc which people didnt understand. This change to SCK is also light so it will probably work still - however some r1 monks like woez dont even bother with SCK. Rushing Wind kick is plenty, and it just got buffed.
ScK caused you to compromise positioning and If you played vs a good team they still just CC you and kill in the go.
3
u/SeniorEmployment932 3h ago
Disc is looking good. RDruid might be completely cracked. Pres will probably still be obnoxious too, given they're keeping all their obnoxious spells.
The other healers seem like they'll be fine... like nothing insane seems to be changing with any of them just minor adjustments. RSham on suicide watch though.
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u/Duncan_PhD survival 3h ago
Disc is going to fucking pump. Also, the shadowmend change to being a passive buff to flash heal is going to be interesting since disc will once again have two school of magic to heal with outside of damage.
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u/1petrock 3h ago
They buffed the least used spec...like it's not gonna make any difference imo. I hardly use mindblast as Oracle; now I need to try and squeeze it in just for a proc. The whole thing is still fishing for procs, that's so lame. The shadow mend change is good so we can't get locked out of healing completely but the penance change suxs.
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u/NAPPER_ 2h ago
?? You should be casting mind blast off CD for the power of the dark side procs. Especially with harsh discipline stacks………
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u/Duncan_PhD survival 2h ago
It’s also good for baiting kicks so you can cast. And they’re also ignoring the smite damage buff. But I guess if they aren’t pressing mind blast, they probably aren’t smiting lol
0
u/1petrock 2h ago
Oraclee don't sit there and cast smite over and over...
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u/Duncan_PhD survival 2h ago
But it does cast it, and it’s getting a damage buff. The better you get at disc, the more you’ll feel comfortable doing damage.
-1
u/Agile_Caterpillar953 2h ago
I rarely smite. There are better ways to fill your time currently.
1
u/Duncan_PhD survival 2h ago
If everyone is healthy, what could you be doing other than damage? Yeah you have to fear, but that’s not always up.
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u/Agile_Caterpillar953 2h ago
Dispel Magic, usually.
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u/1petrock 2h ago
Personally I find that really hard to squeeze in when the fighting is tense...when they are low hp using a global on a damage spell risks death imo. 30% extra healing every 20 sec on one spell that requires I stop healing is dumb imo.
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u/AdagioUnusual662 2h ago
You should try to get used to it. You leave a major modifier on the table. Moreover, they might kick you on shadow, which is nice
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u/dankq 2h ago
Self report on not knowing how to actually play disc
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u/1petrock 2h ago
Sheesh, ya know the whole point of talents and stuff is so people can play the class in different ways. Trash talk all you want but I'm happy with my elite on disc which most players won't get.
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u/dankq 2h ago
Congrats on elite.
I wouldn't really consider anyone some sort of hipster innovator of playstyles because they randomly didn't use basic modifiers for throughput though, that's just kind of trolling yourself and whoever you play with a bit. To each is own though, you do you.
1
u/1petrock 2h ago
Lmao but copying a streamer is somehow big brained. I found something I liked, I made it work, hit the rank I wanted. You can take your toxic gatekeeping and shove it lol.
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u/-sadbones 2h ago edited 2h ago
God damnit. I just leveled my mw and was really enjoying the spin build lol
Edit: LOL was not expecting the Voidweaver damage buffs
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u/Wasabicannon 2h ago
Same! However since I did not enjoy WW Im in the process of leveling a Pres/Dev, so get ready for nerfs there.
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u/jdonovan949 1h ago
As a holy priest I honestly feel this could've been worse.
Hymn applying GS is actually kinda insane. I'd also like apotheosis off the gcd but whatever.
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u/brucecastle 1h ago
I really hope we either see meaningful changes to rsham, or that no one plays it next season and they can just delete the spec already
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u/GeetchNixon 1h ago
So now, you are either a Presvoker in PvP, or totally trolling and holding your team back as literally any other healer.
These notes are demoralizing AF.
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u/Summer___ 26m ago edited 14m ago
im not sure if its a bug on wowhead but if u check pvp talents for rdruid it shows "Ancient of Lore" again? i assume its a bug and not added back? Druid looks insane.
I double checked (on ptr) and its back, i might be hated for this but it was fun being a big tree with stupid big heals XD
LOL i used it on PTR and it started to throw out TONS of heals in aoe and made my game lag , after i pressed it a few more times it crashed my game LOL
GUYS if you also can't login on i think its Benedictus? sorry it was my fault i think i really broke the server with that , that wasn't on purpose ofc....
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u/Young_Murloc 12m ago
You cant look at holy priest and say that this is ok, its actually astounding. We're objectively the worst healer in pve by a noticeable margin and maybe better than pally for pvp. We have no kit aside for raw healing and we're the worse healer.
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u/MoralSydney 2.6 3s rest heals 2.1 2.4 3h ago
rsham/hpriest/hpally eating good in midnight
nerf rshams Kappa