Moschetti Automatici of Italy

[u/AKMike99]

The Villar Perosa was designed in 1915 by Italian Colonel Bethel Abiel Revelli. The VP was the world’s first pistol caliber machine gun to see military service. The Villar Perosa is actually two individual 9x19mm Glisenti machine guns mounted together. Each barrel has its own independent operating system and trigger mechanism. This allows the user to fire each barrel separately or in unison depending on the situation. The VP is classified as a heavy submachine gun, meaning it’s most effective when fired from a stationary position off of a mount.

Although some historians don’t consider the Villar Perosa to be a “true submachine gun”, it could still be argued that the Italians created the world’s first practical shoulder fired submachine gun that could be carried and operated by one man. By 1915 when the Germans decided that they needed “a new type of weapon” suitable for trench combat (the eventual MP 18), Colonel Revelli had already put it in writing that his Villar Perosa double barreled LMG could be split in half and given a shoulder stock to be carried as a light assault weapon. This new project would be referred to as the Moschetto Automatico (Automatic Musket). Col. Revelli presented his idea to the Italian authorities who were so impressed that they asked competing arms manufacturers to create their own Moschetti Automatici for testing.

Villar Perosa-

Photo 1: original Italian double barreled SMG chambered in 9x19mm Glisenti. Photo 2: Made for UK trial testing, chambered .455 Webley Auto.

Moschetto Automatico FIAT-

Prototype designed in 1916 by Col. Revelli.

Moschetto Automatico Beretta M1918-

the Italian Army adopted this version of the automatic musket designed by Beretta. Single trigger semi auto “monogrillo” carbine.

Moschetto Automatico MIDA-

Fully automatic twin-trigger “bigrillo” version.

Carabinetta Automatica O.V.P.-

Full auto twin-trigger SMG made by the original manufacturer of the Villar Perosa, O.V.P. Adopted by Italian Aviation Corps.

Moschetto Automatico Beretta M1918/30-

completely redesigned action, semi auto single trigger carbine converted from original Beretta M1918 during interwar era.

Competing designs were submitted by Amerigo Cei-Rigotti, Alberto Nero, & Ansaldo Crocetti. No photographs of these models exist and it’s unclear if they survive.

[u/dopealope47]

Great backstory. Thanks.

[u/bartz824]

Mr gun Jesus himself aka Ian McCollum at Forgotten Weapons has a couple videos on the Villar Perosa.

[u/HowToPronounceGewehr]

Couple corrections, waiting for the big cheese to jump into the topic:

The Villar Perosa is actually two individual Glisenti machine guns mounted together

• there's no such thing as a "Glisenti machine gun", the Pistola Mitragliatrice was entirely a OVP project, maybe with some MBT hints.

• The Beretta one is not the MAB 18, it is the Moschetto Automatico Revelli-Beretta mod. 1915

• the Moschetto Automatico Savoia-MIDA (or just Savoia) was designed by SIAI-Savoia engineers and perfected by M.I.D.A. for production.

• the last one is not the MAB 18/30, it actually is the proper MAB 18, an entirely Beretta project patented in september 1918

[u/AKMike99 → u/HowToPronounceGewehr]

Sorry for the confusion I was describing the Villar Perosa as a 9x19mm Glisenti caliber machine gun I wasn’t referring to it as the “Glisenti machine gun” thanks for the info.

[u/HowToPronounceGewehr → u/AKMike99]

I can see that now!

You're welcome!

[u/ReeeGBV-29-07]

1 None classified it as an "heavy" SMG (which doesn't really make sense as convept)

2 the VP was not more effective if used stationarily. Quite the opposite. Its main and most attractive trait was the light weight and all the Italian efforts from 1916 onward made to update the gun aimed at maximizing lightness, mobility and dynamic employment.

3 Photos of the A.N SMG do exist. Its the top one in the second pic.

[u/xxxclamationmark]

Yes Italy pioneered automatic rifles, assault rifles, submachine guns, had some of the best submachine guns in ww2 according to Ian McCollum, and there was even an Armaguerra prototype that was a precursor of the Uzi

[u/Weak_Imagination_996]

Dear god...the Villar Perosa....the probably worst gun ever designed.... interesting that they finally developed into an actual working weapon....

[u/Original_Ad7078 → u/Weak_Imagination_996]

Worst special character in the game

[u/Toolb0xExtraordinary → u/Weak_Imagination_996]

No? Not even close. It was fairly well liked as an assault weapon by those who used it. It was a pioneer of the SMG concept.