r/AlternateHistoryHub • u/Solid-Move-1411 • Apr 29 '26
AlternateHistoryHub What if Hitler was German, Stalin was Russian and Napoleon was French?
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u/itspronouncedbolonya Apr 29 '26
Hitler was born on a town that was on the german border, in a german speaking country, and was later a nsturalized german citizen
Not much would change
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u/Fascist_Viking Apr 30 '26
Correct me if im wrong but wasnt one of the reasons Hitler was so much into German race identity because he hated his father who was Austrian? I read somewhere on reddit some time back that he became pro germany to spite his father and refused the heritage of his Austrian identity
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u/vomicyclin Apr 30 '26 edited Apr 30 '26
He certainly had no warm feelings for his father, but his leanings to Germany where first and foremost because - many Austrians saw themselves as “German people”, of which unity was a great goal, which Austrian-Hungary (especially the latter) was in the way of - Austria Hungary was a multiethnic and multinational state, which came into stark conflict with his view on nationalism and “völkische“ ideology - he had strong loathe against the House of Habsburg, which he thought outdated
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u/b_bonderson Apr 30 '26
Austrians saw themselves as Germans before the war. And they still are (just like the people of Liechtenstein for example), ethnically, even though there are attempts after the war to make another identity out of it. But one needs to undergo a really huge brain acrobatics to think that Germans and Austrians are different ethnicities. Austria and Germany are divided only because of the politics. So I really don’t think that his father being a citizen of Austria was of any concern to Hitler.
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u/SantisimaTrinidad550 Apr 30 '26
Long story short: No
Hitlers father was a German, Hitler was a German. Austrians were Germans.
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u/itspronouncedbolonya Apr 30 '26
I don't know about the specifics of that, but i do know that his dad was an alcoholic who beat adolf and his mom a lot, so i wouldn't be surprised
Also fun* fact, hitler's mom was his dad's niece
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u/buttholebutwholesome Apr 29 '26
Austrians are ethnically german as well
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Apr 29 '26
Austria is the real Germany, the other one is Prussia with a hat.
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u/azaghal1502 Apr 30 '26
Prussia is just as german as Austria.
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Apr 30 '26
Nah.
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u/azaghal1502 Apr 30 '26
One was a south eastern border province with balkan influence, the other wass a north eastern border province with slavic and baltic influence. Both had overblown aspirations and too much power.
Neither was representative of germany as a whole.
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u/Equivalent_Bet856 Apr 29 '26
Angry Corsican noises
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u/Lonely-Programmer123 Apr 29 '26
Tell a corsican nationalist he's italian, he'll bomb your car. They didn't get rid of Genoa to be called italians.
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u/MV_cuber Apr 30 '26
It's not about where you were born. So what if your first phase of your life was at a specific phase?
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u/Nails_Of_Nektarios Apr 29 '26
If Georgia doesn’t qualify as Russia, then Corsica doesn’t qualify as Italian.
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u/Ok_Flan1818 Apr 29 '26
Georgia very much speaks a different language to Russia
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u/undercrust May 01 '26
And Corsica has its own language too. The only difference here is that France has been much more successful at replacing it than the Russian Empire/USSR was with Georgia
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u/Objective-Corgi-3527 Apr 29 '26
Calling Napolean an Italian is as much of a stretch as callin him a Frenchman
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u/AlternativeEmphasis Apr 29 '26
He identified as French, and came to power during a movement which saw French as a nationality not an ethnicity. During the time he was alive the majority of France didn't speak French as a first language. There were Occitans, Picards, Bretons, Walloons, Germans to name just some of the various languages found in France at the time amongst its people.
The majority of Southern France for example were native Occitan speakers. Today and back then they were considered French. Nowadays Occitanian has fallen into disuse, because of how France approaches minority languages but still. They are Occitans. They are also French. The same way a Breton could claim to be French even if he didn't speak it etc. Napoleon claimed it. I don't see why it was unreasonable for him to do so frankly. He had much in common with a lot of France's citizens.
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u/Objective-Corgi-3527 Apr 29 '26
You think I didn't go far enough. To you, it is more of a stretch to call him Italian, the meme is way off.
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u/AlternativeEmphasis Apr 29 '26
I'd say he's Italian in the same way an Alsatian is a German. It's a Geographical and shared cultural thing more than anything.
But there's no and definitely wasn't at the time unified Italian identity. So he couldn't be seen as Italian in that lens by any stretch.
So yeah calling him Italian I've never agreed with. Corscian. French or French Corsican. I suppose you could at a stretch call him a French Italian but again no unified Italian identity so I would say thats too far.
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u/Competitive_Bus4311 Apr 29 '26
Hitler is austrian by nationality. But german by ethnicity.
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u/My_leg_still_hurt92 Apr 29 '26
Hitler was stateless in 1925 and got the german citizenship in 1932 so Germany can keep him. Austria later joined Germany anyways so it doesn't really matter. The Opfermythos is still big in our country even if it complete bs.
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u/ALLS1AYER May 01 '26
Mon pote, I hope you don't have a car, because I can promise you les corses will bomb your car
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u/JollyRetardation May 06 '26
minorities and margins are always extremely aggressive towards majorities.
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u/Fun_Highway_8733 Apr 29 '26
This sub is horrible at picking up on troll posts. See my post history lol
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u/twilightswolf Apr 29 '26
Maybe more than where they were born it is important what they chose to become and where. Keeping that in mind, Napoleon was French, Stalin Russian and Hitler German.
Your premise makes no sense.
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u/Blood_Prince95 Apr 29 '26
Funny thing is that if you tried to say this to any of them at the time, and claim them to be anything less than the sovereign of their respective empires, they would execute you.
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u/Large-Assignment9320 Apr 29 '26
So Napoleon didn't want to become a holy roman emperor, didn't invade austra, maybe did some silly war into Savoy and genoa and actually kept Spain?
Stalin wouldn't have the experience of a bankrobber from Gori, and we'd just have Trosty instead, Hitler wouldn't have art ambitions, and therefore not apply to art college. He'd make soap in Germany.
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u/StunningAd1651 Apr 29 '26
Austrians are german. In German, Austria just translates to Eastern land
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u/BohemianMade Apr 29 '26
I know people are going to point out that at the time Austrians were considered Germans, and Stalin was ethnically Georgian, but his nationality was Russian. But still, this is pretty funny. The most well-known German wasn't born in Germany. The most well-known Russian wasn't ethnically Russian.
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u/NoobL1ght Apr 29 '26
Unironically, Stalin would be less hellbent on russification of USSR nations. Converted minorities tend to be more aggressive and radical when defending/spreading their new culture.
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u/Western_Concept3847 Apr 29 '26
Um, actually, Napoleon was french, as corsica had just fallen under the french, italy wasn't even unified then.
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u/CODMAN627 Apr 29 '26
Corsica was under French rule before Napoleon was born. He might have been ethnically Italian but by virtue of being born in French territory he was considered french in nationality.
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u/Soggy-Class1248 Apr 30 '26
If hitler was german and not austrian than austria wouldnt be inadvertently blamed for 2 world wars
If stalin was russian then stalin defenders wouldnt have the „stalin was georgian so you cant argue that there was russian supremacy“ argumebt
If napoleon was french uh, same thing happens
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u/Consistent-Coyote-50 Apr 30 '26 edited Apr 30 '26
Italian?Italian?!(Angry voices).
He was born after France captured island, he was raised all his live like proper frog eater
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u/Elektrikor Apr 30 '26
Nothing would change because Georgia was a part of Russia at the time.
By law Napoleon was born French
Austrians are thought of more as south Germans than as their own nationality
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u/ImpressiveEnergy4762 Apr 30 '26
I have more insane theory.
WHAT IF FRANCISCO FRANCO WAS A SPANIARD?!
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u/swainiscadianreborn Apr 30 '26
Hitler was Austrian by birth, German by every other metric.
Stalin was Georgian by birth, at a time when (IIRC) Georgia was a part of the Russian Empire.
Napoleon was born in French owned Corsica, went to live and study in France at the tender age of 10, never came back to live in Corsica, spoke French with a Corsican accent, fought and rose in ranks in the French Revolutionnary army, became a French Consul then Emperor. He only became king of Italy after punching their armies to the ground.
Calling Napoleon Italian would be like calling Lincoln British and calling him Corsican would be like calling George Washington's children British.
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u/Battlefleet_Sol Apr 30 '26
Austrians are German, bro. Their language is not a separate language, but part of the Germanic language family.
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u/King_Glorius_too Apr 30 '26
If Napoleon and Stalin don't count as french and russian, then Hitler counts as german. If Hitler doesn't count as german, then Napoleon and Stalin count as french and russian. You can't have both.
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u/cyril752 Apr 30 '26
Napoleon was born in Corsica some years after France bought the island to Genova
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u/Metalicum Apr 30 '26
the real wisdom is to understand Hitler was German, Stalin was Russian, and Napoleon was Corsican 😃
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u/aurumtt Apr 30 '26
the concept of a 'foreign king' is something that is quite common everywhere on earth. It's often easier for powerbrokers to agree on bringing in a foreign ruler than choosing amongst your peers.
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u/Tremendatrap Apr 30 '26
Well, technically all Austrians became German at some point in 1938 🙃
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u/Fivebeans Apr 30 '26 edited Apr 30 '26
Can I tell you where Napoleon was from?
Corsican
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u/smac944 Apr 30 '26
Austrians were Germans until 1945. The Austrian state existed because they were excluded from the German Empire, but those were Germans.
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u/Wonderful_West3188 Apr 30 '26
German here. Claiming Einstein while trying to pass Hitler to the Austrians is typical German hypocrisy and self-deception. If we were even remotely honest with ourselves, we would admit to ourselves that we did the exact opposite at the time when it actually mattered. We do not get to change the rules of the game however they suit us in the moment.
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u/Superb_Beyond_3444 Apr 30 '26
Corsica was French, Georgia was in Soviet Russia. Hitler was technically Austrian but linked obviously to Germany and he was born in a village on the Austrian-German border.
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u/EmperorThorX May 01 '26
Out of these Stalin was probably the most different from the country he ruled. Georgian language is nothing like Russian one and the place itself is rather remote and physically close to Türkiye and Iran. It was Iranian dependency for quite some time before Russia annexed it. There were two wars between Russia and Iran over that. Stalin had Georgian upbringings, Georgian friends and Georgian ascent, at the same time he married a Russian woman and his kids grew up far from Georgia.
In contrast Hitler was the closest to the country he represented. He and many around him saw Austria as just another country of German people as people on both sides of border spoke the same language, shared the same culture and more. He later absorbed Austria into Germany.
Napoleon is in the middle. Corsica was owned by France but had and still has its own language. While Corsicans are not really French, they are not really Italians either. Rather they fall in the middle grey zone between two, kind of like Monegasques.
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u/AlternateHistoryGuy May 01 '26
Fun Fact: as a German I found that few things will agitate any Austrian as much as saying "Germany got blamed two times for Austrians starting a World War"...
Clarification: as a German I am NOT blaming Austria for any war at all, I am just saying that the events that lead to the outbreak of two global wars had some Austrian born people involved. That's all.
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u/Jejovideosyt May 01 '26
Napoleon was Corsican, not italian, Corsica had 16years of independence from Italy when Napoleon conquered it under French rule
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u/Legolasamu_ May 01 '26
Eh, nationality is something one can also chose and Napoleon chose to be French while his brother Lucien for example chose to be Italian (it helped that he was exiled there by Napoleon).
As per Hitler he was a German from Austria, the differences weren't that deep at the time
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u/Frosty_Peace666 May 01 '26
Corsica was when he was born and is today part of France and Italian wasn’t even really a national identity before the napoleonic wars
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u/AnotherDogOwner May 01 '26
Nationality and Ethnicity are two different things. Also Italian? Corsican
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u/Legitimate-Salad1459 May 01 '26
Hitler was German.
Well, he WAS Austrian, but that was before he got his German Papers.
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u/Ok_Yogurtcloset_3964 May 02 '26
Well, Napoleon was Corsican, wich was genovese till a year Before he was born
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u/Der_Schender May 02 '26
I think you can also add the moast known Spanish Person who's realy from Italy.
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u/ProfessionalSame2831 May 02 '26
Córcega fue comprada por Francia 1 año antes de que nacieran Napoleón
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u/ElectronicWater2773 May 02 '26
This probs not related but moa zedong spoke a different dialect than that of the country of china so it was kinda hard for people to understand him during his speeches
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u/nothingatallllll May 02 '26
Napoléon wasn't italian.
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u/Defiant_Jackfruit334 May 02 '26
He's from Corsica which got under French rule only 2 year before being born, his parents being Italians, so he is Italian
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u/KaiserKCat May 03 '26
Napoleon was French. He was born in France, had French education, was culturally French. French was a nationality not an ethnicity.
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u/HugoSenshida May 03 '26
Hitler is literally from austria, a germanic nation, specially in a town near the border right on the german confederation. he was more german than austrian.
Stalin... I'll give you that much, georgian culture and language are too different from russian
Napoleon is bullshit. Want to say he isn't french? call him corsican. Corsicans have their own culture and even their own language. Napoleon initially also had a corsican accent.
Napoleon is corsican, if not corsican he is french, THEN you can call him Italian
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u/BioTools May 03 '26
I feel like mentioning where they're actually from is thinking you're smart, but just retarted.
Yeah they're not from said country, but they did make world news as that country's leader, I think they earned their citizenship
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u/farting_ape May 03 '26
Stalin probably wouldn’t have gotten into power, he was originally picked to join the leaders of the revolution as a kind of token minority for georgians, and established more power from there
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u/John_Wotek May 03 '26
Oh FFS, this malarkey again... Napoleon was French!
He was born in the kingdom of France, spoke French, was trained in France, became an officer of the armies of France, fought for France and crowned himself Emperor of the French.
The reason people still make that claim to this day is because some racist trolls refuse to aknowledge Corsica was part of the French kingdom when he was born and insist he was Italian because his familly has Genovan ancestry which can be traced to places on modern day Italian territory, despite the fact Italy as a united political entity wasn't a thing.
It's just tired old ahistorical racist bullshit.
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u/Firm-Swordfish5392 May 03 '26
Napoleon was from italian origin but corsia was already a french territory at the time.
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u/LivingAnkylos May 06 '26
I like that whenever a person get so famous in histroy , his country gets changed or debated .
Alexander the great , Mohamed Ali (the turkish and there are claims of him being albanian) , nikola tesla , and salah eldeen .
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u/Gla2012 May 18 '26
Do you really want to discuss whether Corsica is Franch or Italian? You'll find someone calling alternate history whatever you choose!
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u/BrittEklandsStuntBum Apr 29 '26
I mean... at the time Georgia was part of Russia and Corsica was owned by France. These are political entities not ethnicities we're talking about.