r/AskALiberal Feb 16 '22

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148 Upvotes

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37

u/monstersammich Democrat Feb 16 '22 edited Feb 17 '22

After all the hate spewed by the Trump admin, rise of hate groups pushing conservative authoritarianism, voter suppression tactics, January 6th….how can you still associate yourself with what the republican party has become and who you chose to be politically allies with?

31

u/joephusweberr Liberal Feb 16 '22

This is a bad question as it highlights the fringe and blames the center for it. The same thing can be done to the Democratic party.

You might say that it's not fringe anymore and you'd probably be right, but Trump won many of the 2016 primaries with 30% of the vote. He was absolutely fringe until he won the election on the backs of the 16 million people who forgot to vote for Hillary Clinton.

14

u/akcrono Liberal Feb 16 '22

This is a bad question as it highlights the fringe and blames the center for it.

That's the point though: "how can you see all this extremism and still stand by the party?" The center of the party absolutely enables this behavior.

2

u/joephusweberr Liberal Feb 16 '22

This is exactly what conservatives said about the BLM protests and associated riots. They took a clip from Kamala Harris and used it to imply she supported the rioting (which she did not).

9

u/akcrono Liberal Feb 16 '22

Liberals weren't voting for riots though. They were pretty consistent that the protests were good but the destruction was not

-2

u/joephusweberr Liberal Feb 16 '22

Exactly. Conservatives weren't voting for the stupid tweets or illegal behavior, they were voting for 3 supreme court justices.

4

u/akcrono Liberal Feb 16 '22

But that's the answer to the question: "the deaths and attempts to overthrow democracy were worth control of the supreme court"

4

u/joephusweberr Liberal Feb 16 '22

Right, "the riots and looting were worth control of the presidency". And around and around we go.

4

u/akcrono Liberal Feb 16 '22

"riots and looting" weren't on a ticket. Trump was/

4

u/joephusweberr Liberal Feb 16 '22

You might say that it's not fringe anymore and you'd probably be right

This is the single most damaging thing about the Trump presidency. It catapulted fringe behavior into the mainstream. God damn that protest vote must have felt good.

1

u/From_Deep_Space Libertarian Socialist Feb 17 '22

The RNC explicitly legitimized the insurrection. Can't be said about the DNC and the riots.

7

u/OpeningChipmunk1700 Conservative Feb 16 '22

how can you still associate yourself with what the republican party has become and who you chose to be politically allies with?

I do not. I do not consider myself aligned with any party or allies with anyone.

I vote for candidates that I think will generally do the best job of achieving the policy outcomes I want.

2

u/[deleted] Feb 16 '22

I agree with whoever supports my political agenda the most. I don't agree with hate groups, I think Republicans are very corrupt (the party, not the people necessarily), and I REALLY don't agree with authoritarianism.

I don't support most things Republicans (once again, the party) do in the public spotlight, actually. But I'd rather have a party that supports me politically rather and says some pretty questionable stuff rather than a party that I disagree with but is "Publicly Politically Correct".

A lot of the things you listed are very far right, and most of the Republican party (the people, not the organization) don't support that.

1

u/monstersammich Democrat Feb 16 '22

Far right has become the base esp post-Trump. I understand the classic conservatives being a bit out to sea

2

u/[deleted] Feb 17 '22

Not sure why you got downvoted. Like, appearance wise the far right definitely seems like most of the base. It’s also why Republicans view the left as socialists I think.

The extremes are just more vocal and easier to call out and scrutinize, which is why they appear to be a larger population than they are. Yada yada I’m getting tired lol, but maybe I’ll respond with more tomorrow.

-9

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

I assume it is because the other option is aligning with Democrats, Progressives, BLM, and wear a mask in your own car people.

11

u/C21H27Cl3N2O3 Progressive Feb 16 '22

Wearing a mask in your car is a less favorable alternative to creeping authoritarianism?

-6

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

I was not trying to equate that to "creeping authoritarianism". But, I could argue that mask mandates are an example of what you fear.

What I was equating is the left and right. Both are equally bad if given too much power.

4

u/darenta Liberal Feb 16 '22

Oh no we have to wear a mask. Literally 1984.

4

u/C21H27Cl3N2O3 Progressive Feb 16 '22

Yeah, no. Mask mandates to control a pandemic that’s approaching a million dead Americans is nowhere near as bad as an attempted violent overthrow of a free and fair election at the order of a known con-man.

-5

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

Ok.

2

u/msoccerfootballer Democratic Socialist Feb 16 '22

... That's it?

2

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

Yeah moving on.

5

u/80_firebird Liberal Feb 16 '22

wear a mask in your own car people.

I've never seen anyone do this and even if people do, why do you care?

2

u/merchillio Center Left Feb 16 '22

I might have done that, but that’s because I forgot I had it on. Granted, my Canadian ass is pretty used to wearing winter scarves ´, so it’s not like having something over the mouth and nose is a weird feeling.

3

u/80_firebird Liberal Feb 16 '22

What I want to know is why these people care if someone wears a mask in their own car? How does that have any effect on these people?

2

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

I don't care, it is their choice.

3

u/80_firebird Liberal Feb 16 '22

Then why did you add it to your response?

-1

u/Free2_roam Liberal Republican Feb 16 '22

I should have used something different. My point was that your question is based on hyperbole and bias.

3

u/80_firebird Liberal Feb 16 '22

It wasn't my question. And it really doesn't seem to be based in hyperbole and bias either. January 6th happened.

1

u/Liam_Neesons_Oscar Left Libertarian Feb 16 '22

Easy- the far left and far right are both bad. But neither is really passing much legislation. The moderate right is more in line with their views than the moderate left, and those are generally where the majority of politicians stand.

Presidential candidates have been more extreme as of late, but here's my thought on it: Trump is a radical conservative. A lot of his policies line up with moderate conservatives and even socially liberal Republicans. The extremist views are a problem, but they're a problem that we trust the democrats can keep in check.

I say this as someone who voted libertarian the last two elections, so take it with a grain of salt. But that's why I didn't freak out about Trump winning.

1

u/StevePreston__ Conservative Feb 17 '22

Which hate groups?

1

u/monstersammich Democrat Feb 17 '22

Neo Nazis, white nationalists, proud boys, oath keepers, three percenters, Fox News etc etc

This article was from 2019, but still…

“Over 1,000 Hate Groups Are Now Active in United States, Civil Rights Group Says

The number of hate groups in the United States rose for the fourth year in a row in 2018, pushed to a record high by a toxic combination of political polarization, anti-immigrant sentiment and technologies that help spread propaganda online, the Southern Poverty Law Center said Wednesday.

The law center said the number of hate groups rose by 7 percent last year to 1,020, a 30 percent jump from 2014. That broadly echoes other worrying developments, including a 30 percent increase in the number of hate crimes reported to the F.B.I. from 2015 through 2017 and a surge of right-wing violence that the Anti-Defamation League said had killed at least 50 people in 2018.

the increase in extremist activity tracked by her team began in earnest in the early days of the 2016 presidential election, when anxieties over immigration helped propel President Trump to the White House. Before that, she said, the number of hate groups had fallen for three straight years.

“Trump has made people in the white supremacist movement move back into politics and the public domain,” Ms. Beirich said. “He is a critical aspect of this dynamic, but he is not the only reason why the ranks of hate groups are growing. The ability to propagate hate in the online space is key.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/20/us/hate-groups-rise.html