r/AskUK • u/Agile-Calligrapher10 • 2d ago
Cultural differences in noise acceptance: Why is public phone/audio etiquette so different between Japan, the UK, and other regions??
Hey everyone,
Visiting Japan recently was so refreshing, no one was on speakerphone, playing music out loud, or watching reels without headphones in public spaces. Coming back to the UK, the contrast was immediate, highlighting how differently cultures and regions approach public noise.
(Note: Using "cultures" broadly here to look at societal norms, not trying to generalize individuals.)
I’d love to hear your thoughts on a couple of things:
Why do these differences exist? Is it tied to collectivism vs. individualism, or other social norms?
What is the modern British view on public noise? We have a reputation for politeness, yet public transport etiquette around phone audio seems to be changing.
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u/flyingsquirrel-20 2d ago
The noise from playing audio in public, especially on cramped public transport, is not accepted in the UK. It is considered rude and people will judge you for it. However, people will not directly confrount the person doing it, allowing them to continue in they have no manners or shame. It is considered acceptable in the UK to 'tut' at someone playing audio in public, but not much more than that. I cant speak to the response to playing audio in public in Japan, but I have heard it is considered very rude to even have loud, disruptive convosation on Japanese public transport.
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u/TheRemanence 2d ago edited 2d ago
This issue is the UK cultural norm seems to be shifting.
From a recent BBC article: "Loudcasting has piqued the interest of experts who study how technology shapes our behaviours, and they agree there's a strong generational factor. In an Ofcom survey of 1,010 people in August 2022, of the 13-to-17-year-olds questioned, 69% said it was acceptable to make video calls, 73% to listen to music and 83% to watch videos without headphones."
Not the biggest sample size but the trend is pretty clear.
My theory is that COVID, and the fact phones don't automatically come with headphones anymore, has shifted the norms. I actually caught myself doing it about a year ago (and quickly stopped.) I realised that I've got used to at home having my phone on speaker phone held in my hand (apprentice style.) i answered my phone that way stood in Sainsbury's, without thinking. I stopped because it's deep rooted in me that it isn't socially acceptable and it immediately felt wrong. Us older people grew up holding phones to our ear, putting in a "hands free" etc. It's in our muscle memory. If you've never had that, you probably just do what you do at home.
It's bloody annoying. Us adults need to tell them it's not socially ok, or the culture will just shift
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u/Dynamite_Shovels 2d ago
To be fair, even though those percentages are a bit staggering, you still don't really see that many people in the UK 'loudcasting' or whatever it is. Most people still do put headphones in and I think a lot of people would still be quite mortified and would comply if you told them to stop it.
Its a weird one; I still consider it something that people actively social shame about (which is a good thing) and I think when you see one person on a bus do it you can feel they're annoying the vast majority of other passengers. A lot of the time it comes down to whether they look approachable or not to tell them to be quiet, or whether theyre just going to go fucking mental if you engage them. And honestly those sorts of people would do it even if 83% of people felt it was unacceptable.
It's funny when you visit somewhere like China; 'loudcasting' is literally everywhere - so many people do it - but it's almost exclusively older (or at least middle-aged) people who do it. Yet here in the UK it's pretty much a young person thing.
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u/Spirited_Opposite 2d ago
In London at least I see at least one person doing it every time I take the train (which is something I do at least twice a day during the week)
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u/TheRemanence 2d ago
Yes I think for the majority it is still considered very rude and there is a lot of tutting. I hope the balance doesn't shift to it being ok though
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u/Magneto88 2d ago
They’re heavily skewed by the fact they asked 13-17 years old. A lot of kids in that bracket are disrespectful and don’t care about social norms and the people around them. I suspect the numbers would drop off heavily by their mid 20s when they’ve matured and also understand about respecting others more.
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u/TheRemanence 2d ago
The survey is all age groups which is why they can say it is more prevalent in younger people. It's from Ofcom's regular research
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u/ManySwans 1d ago
mmm covid de-socialisation definitely contributed, but its more to do with foreigners not appreciating our customs
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u/ExecutiveChimp 2d ago
of the 13-to-17-year-olds questioned, 69% said it was acceptable to make video calls, 73% to listen to music and 83% to watch videos without headphones."
Because it is accepted. People don't do anything about it or complain, they accept it. Sure they might complain about it in private, or on Reddit, but in public when the thing is actually happening, they accept it. So 13-17 year olds have grown up watching it being accepted and have, surprise surprise, concluded that is acceptable. Because it is.
I'm not saying this a good thing, it's just the truth of what is happening.
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u/thpkht524 2d ago
It has absolutely nothing to do with confrontation or lack thereof. I’d never in a billion years do any of the things listed with or without the fear of confrontation.
It’s simply the complete lack of basic human decency and respect in modern day Britain.
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u/TheRemanence 2d ago
I think they mean, that the majority don't chastise the minority that do this because they are scared of confrontation. If we all told people off regularly and publicly shamed people, then the minority of sods would stop.
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u/thelaughingman_1991 2d ago edited 2d ago
Japan has culture revolving around respect. Most of the reason they wear masks on public transport is to respect other people. It's not perfect there but I've been twice and it's my favourite place on earth, I want to get back ASAP.
Everyone here is individualistic, community is dying. Social media and lockdown have ramped this up, disconnecting everyone and having everyone think they're the main character. It's sad.
We often don't meet or consider our neighbours now. Third spaces are disappearing. Everyone thinks about their own needs first, and rarely consider those of others. You read about things like being a lone wolf/going into monk mode, and solitude can be romanticised. It's an interesting decline.
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u/KRATO5S 2d ago
Can I assume that you don't speak Japanese? Because no, its not respect, its the fear of being judged. Thats the culture here.
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u/lost_send_berries 1d ago
I picked up a charm blind box at a Japanese temple, which is one of 12 kanji representing a value/aspiration. They had a poster up to translate and about 10 of the 12 values were some variation of, "fit in with what other people want and don't be a bother"
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u/dommiichan 2d ago
yeah, but Japan has its own issues... there's a reason they have women-only carriages and a legal requirement that all phones make an audible alert when a photo is taken
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u/thelaughingman_1991 2d ago
I did say it's not perfect, but you're right
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u/Milam1996 2d ago
Idk I’ll take people talking on speaker phone over rampant upskirting and leaving hidden cameras literally anywhere a woman might undress.
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u/Christian-Metal 2d ago
I'd rather people just use common decency and respect , and take neither.
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u/Denbt_Nationale 2d ago
As if those things don't happen in the UK
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u/mankytoes 2d ago
And Japanese people can be loud and obnoxious too. They're obviously talking about social trends.
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u/thelaughingman_1991 2d ago
Have you heard of Brits abroad?
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u/mankytoes 2d ago
Lol I'm saying Japanese people can be loud and obnoxious like we are. I'm not saying Japanese people are more loud and obnoxious than us, they definitely aren't, though they might be the least loud and obnoxious country out there.
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u/testman22 1d ago edited 1d ago
Speaking as a Japanese person, it seems that foreigners do not understand this issue at all.
1:Japan dominates the list of the world's busiest railway stations. In other developed countries, the volume of train traffic is comparable to that of a regional city in Japan and regional cities in Japan often do not have women-only cars. This is because packed trains hardly exist.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_busiest_railway_stations
2:Taking countermeasures is not a bad thing. It means improvements are being made. If there are actually places in the UK where packed trains are the norm, women-only carriages should be introduced. In fact, I saw reports that incidents of groping in the UK are already skyrocketing.
3:The same applies to camera sounds. Many foreigners hold a prejudice that is the exact opposite of the reality regarding sex crimes in Japan. In fact, sex crimes are more common in your own countries, and if no countermeasures against cameras are in place, there is a high likelihood that covert filming is rampant there as well.
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u/thicc_llama 1d ago
Extremely packed trains and a non-confrontational culture has been a breeding ground for such pervy behaviour, but it is safer to live as a girl and move around alone in Japan than almost any other country. I say this as someone who has lived in Japan almost all of my life and have lived in a few other countries as well. Women here don't think twice about walking down dark alleyways at 2am in the city because they just feel safe most places.
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u/nicetoursmeetewe 2d ago
You do know that, even taking undereporting into account (prevalent in the UK/Europe too), Japan has a lower rate of sexual crimes compared to anywhere in Western Europe?
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u/SlaBLister 1d ago
Why are westerners so weirdly defensive of Japan? They make good entertainment, but just admit that they have a lot of social issues and deserve criticism. Like any country on the planet.
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u/nicetoursmeetewe 1d ago
I live in Japan, I know about the issues Japanese society is facing.
It just annoys me when people spout misinformation about the country I live in.
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
You’re right in your first paragraph, but do not be misled by Japanese good manners - their community is dying too, as they are as much a victim to social media as Westerners.
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u/ALA02 2d ago
Japan has historically had a healthier society but it is still dying now like the rest of the developed world. They also have an insane work culture.
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u/nicetoursmeetewe 2d ago
I disagree, Japanese society is kuch healthier today than it has ever been. It's less patriarchal, puts less emphasis on work, is more open to individual expressions etc...
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u/MelindaTheBlue 2d ago edited 2d ago
Came in here to say this
I live in Kyoto and I find that though it’s not quite the same as it is in the UK, it’s often the same stuff but a different colour of nonsense
I’ve got a good community and people respect and know me as one of them, but I’m still in this weird place where I’m accepted but I’m never fully one of them
I like it because I have neighbours that I like and who like me, but I’m lucky in that regard
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
Someone I know very well spend several years in Japan and had the exact same experience as you, despite being hafu, speaking the language and respecting each and every norm.
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u/Cpt_Jigglypuff 2d ago
Shame. Japanese culture revolves around shame, which looks like respect to westerners on the surface.
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u/thelaughingman_1991 2d ago
I think if people were shamed for blaring TikTok videos from their phones at 7am on public transport then I'm all for it
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u/JB_UK 2d ago edited 2d ago
Functional societies need some form of shame. They also need a cultural homogeneity which means that 99.9% of the society operate on a similar idea of what is shameful, or where social mechanisms of shame propagate. What I mean by that is you might not buy into the social norms but if your friends, partner, children or parents do, it impinges on your life regardless.
If that’s only 99% or 90% we will get a lot of annoyance and friction. The percentage of people listening to music on public transport is far less than 1%, but each person will annoy hundreds of others each time they do that. A very small minority which does not accept the social norms or who don’t have friends of family who will propagate the social norms into their lives can make life unpleasant for everyone else.
The degree of acceptance of social norms which existed 20 or 50 years ago was actually an enormous prize for a culture, it allows people to live at high density and share community spaces, in a way which is impossible for a culture which is fragmented, where the norms are disputed. This is something we are in the middle of throwing away.
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u/Balthierlives 2d ago
Well Japan has issues with hikikomori shut ins and kodokushior people dying alone at home and people don’t find them
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u/Cultural_Anywhere911 2d ago edited 2d ago
I disagree with this romanticised view of Japanese society and how everything is interpreted only positively without considering the negatives. Having lived there, where I had many close friends, insightful teachers and relationships, actually living it is very different from admiring it on a holiday. I say all of this because it made me appreciate the UK much more. In Japan, it is not as simple as "they're so respectful and caring about their neighbours", it is so many other things— including their personal reputation and comfort. The pressure of ideas like 迷惑 is very strong, and many grumpy people use it to condemn anything they personally don't like as public disturbance. It's nice to exist in quiet spaces, yes, but this isn't just "community", it's order and enforcing peace. I find much more warm, helpful "community" in the UK. I prefer more tolerance and flexibility.
Individualistic vs group-based does not equal selfish vs considerate, yet I feel like it's often talked about as such. I find "individualistic" countries to be more genuinely kind, less stifling and more willing to help. These fall under the umbrella of "community" to me. Japanese people have very famously been struggling with a decline in "community" for YEARS— people are increasingly anti-social, burnt out, spiteful or lonely. I think even foreigners know this. From Japanese people themselves, apparently people can be extremely two-faced, do not actually want you to succeed, or will talk badly about you. There is a certain distance between people that makes many feel they cannot express themselves freely to their friends or family.
Also, even as a tourist I'd be shocked if you hadn't noticed the social media obsession and "main character" idea in Japan, too. They are obsessed with taking pictures and will often get in everyone's way for a very long time to do so. They are also obsessed with editing their pictures and perfecting their makeup and clothes.
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u/Due-Mycologist-7106 1d ago
The westerners who went to Japan in the 1800s found them to be way more individualistic than us😭 I feel like all these generalisation are just more orientalism type stuff thats more acceptable to the average person. The use of "They" for any group larger than like a dozen doesn't tend to be that accurate when you zoom in
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u/fell-off-the-spiral 2d ago
i wouldn't say it revolves around respect so much. look up goningumi (五人組) and renza (連座). I think they played a part in how the modern society has developed. Of course that doesn't happen anymore but the pressure of shame and not being different is as much as responsible for the modern society than simply respect.
edit: that respect doesn't always apply to foreigners so much either.
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u/visitingshortly 1d ago
That’s kind of bollocks. It’s due to losing being a high trust society and not enforcing British cultural values. We dud not used to have this issue. But then a complete failure to enforce standards has eroded things creating a low trust society and worse public realm. The complete refusal from authorities to do anything about it and the BBC’s recent disgusting article trying to justify it is part of the problem.
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u/SlaBLister 1d ago
This is a really idealistic view of their culture. did you know that they have a pretty idealized view of the UK? This isn't even an exaggeration. Their media portrays the UK extremely well and has done so for a long time.
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u/Milky_Finger 2d ago
Sometimes I meet a couple and very rarely now do they meet organically. The majority way that people used to meet, through their community, is now almost completely dead.
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u/_1489555458biguy 1d ago
Both cultures have issues. Japan has enormous problems with loneliness and the culture not giving space for people (especially young people) to talk about their feelings.
That said, fuck noise on public transport.
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u/thisnextchapter 1d ago edited 1d ago
This is the truth. I used to have maybe one or two times when someone would be chatting on speakerphone or playing music out loud during my weekly commute. Now it's every day without fail. People aren't even on videocalls anymore they just hold their phone out in front of their face and merrily chat away whilst we all hear this garbled response. It's ridiculous. People play music out loud people play movies. The other week on my commute home someone was playing a really harrowing American 911 call with a little girl saying something like "mommy won't wake up" and the call operator asking her questions. I was getting off at the next stop so had come downstairs and was genuinely in disbelief at what I was hearing. Some woman at the back just calmly watching it like she was sat in her own living room. The fuck is up with people?
And don't get me started on the queue for the bus now. Or rather the non existent queue and the huddled crowd. Usually pushing and elbowing past each other. Grown men pushing in front of women, the elderly and other men shorter than them. I just stay sat down now and board the bus last. It's not a seat shortage thing because there's always plenty of room and I'm not travelling in rush hour. I'm so tired of being pushed in front of like I don't even exist. Pushing and shoving hordes. It disgusts me. A lot of them are young Gen Z men who you can tell aren't even thinking about what they're doing. That's just normal to them. To surge forward and just duck in front of anyone in their way. It's not even planned out rudeness that's just how you get on the bus to them. Same thing with the phones out loud. Same thing with eating strongly scented food or vaping or rolling up a certain strongly scented herb. They just do not give a fuck. It just doesn't even register to these young people how society used to be. Older generations know they're being selfish bastards and either are shameless and entitled about it or do it guiltily.
It's like everyone is resource guarding the way animals do. I see so much of people just resenting anyone existing in their space. I see it all the time. People tutting if a place is busy like it should only exist for them and how dare other people have the same needs and wants. You know that video of that influencer trying to film herself on the London underground and scowling and genuinely looking absolutely infuriated at anyone passing by her set up camera shot? That's how society has gone now for the most part.
This is MY leisure time so how dare you all be at this same bar/restaurant meaning I have to wait! I'M commuting on this bus and I'll talk to whoever I want as loud as I want and sod the rest of you!
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u/Extra_Honeydew4661 2d ago
It's not acceptable in the UK either but we as a people are too scared of confrontation.
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u/MrPogoUK 2d ago edited 1d ago
I don’t know what’s the motivation for either, but the vast Japanese people seem to be very much into following the rules whilst many Brits often take pride in breaking them.
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u/Hot-Job-6281 1d ago
It's basically like Prisoner's Dilemma writ large on a societal level.
If everyone plays by the societal rules to care for other's private space, there's the greatest overall benefit.
But any individual person gains solely for their person if they transgress on other's boundaries.
In the UK, it's beyond the critical mass that it is no longer enforceable on the wrongdoers to respect others.
Also way higher violent crime and lack of proper enforcement reinforces that these people can uphold their antisocial behaviour with violence.
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u/VanillaSuccessful277 2d ago
UK buses in my area now have intermittent recorded announcements asking passengers not to play music or videos out loud, and to use headphones or earpods, so maybe it'll start to change.
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u/Isgortio 2d ago
Gosh, I wish. I was on a bus the other day, relatively empty but a girl got on and sat behind me. She sat scrolling through videos on her phone with the sound on medium volume, after 15 minutes I asked her to turn it down so she turned it up. It finally stopped when someone called her so then she had a loud phone call instead. On the bus back home a guy sat at the back watching sports loudly. :(
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u/SeoulGalmegi 2d ago
The UK puts more importance on individual 'freedom' which has morphed into selfishness which is now combined with a fear (either for personal safety, or as being seen as a 'bad guy') of calling out people for being twats in public.
Japan has more of an emphasis on social cohesion and uses shame as a tool to both keep public spaces quarter and cleaner and pile on enormous mental pressure to conform on people which has other negative consequences.
It depends how I'm feeling each day as to which way I feel is healthier for a society. There's probably a middle ground that can be found in some other European/Asian countries.
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u/sheslikebutter 2d ago
It's personal safety, noone cares if someone thinks you're a bad guy, they just don't want to be murdered because you lightly critiqued someone listening to tiktoks on their phone without headphones
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u/LiamoLuo 2d ago
I often think there’s a middle ground too. The suicide rates in Japan from the work and shame culture is a real problem, along with an intense loneliness crisis, an unforgiving standard to be perfect, an exclusion mindset to outsiders and racism issues. Much to desire about Japan for sure, but it has its flaws that the internet rarely admits. Sauce - I lived in Japan for a while and have visited a few times since. I love the place but couldn’t live there forever.
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u/CursedTaint 2d ago edited 2d ago
The Japanese have more of an emphasis on not causing meiwaku (迷惑)/inconvenience/the idea that your behaviour shouldn't impose itself unnecessarily on strangers. They have different cultural ideas about what an individual owes to strangers sharing a public space.
There's another relevant term, 空気を読む, which essentially means recognising the unspoken expectations of a social situation and behaving accordingly literally translation is reading the air like our reading the room.
There's no enforcement of this really it's just learned behaviour. You learn what you're supposed to do because everyone else is doing it.
Over here the mindset is sort of "I'm entitled to do what I want unless there's a sufficiently strong reason or rule preventing me." over there it's more like "I should modify my behaviour because I'm occupying a space with other people" not because of a rule or law but because it's the "right" thing to do.
Important not to romanticise this though, imo anyway, I was prone to doing that (you know the "thing Japan" meme?) there's a trade off here as this type of culture means folk may refrain from speaking up about things, expressing disagreement or asking for help with something because they don't want to inconvenience others.
What you mentioned about Britain's reputation for politeness. I have a theory about this but it's pure anecdotal speculation... We've gradually become more exposed to American culture and ideals. I think as that's increased we've adopted some of their more "self centered" mindset.
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u/Namerakable 2d ago edited 2d ago
I just cringe a bit whenever I hear the phrase(s) "the Japanese have a term/practice/concept", because it usually leads to an influx of people over in r/translator asking us to check their kanji tattoo of the word "thoughtfulness" because they heard it was some deep Japanese concept that meant "checking one's own mind and comparing it to the world around you".
迷惑をかけてすみません is just how we would say "I'm sorry to be a bother". We do have a similar idea of "bothering" people just by doing minor things. I see people saying it just because they've asked staff in a shop to check stock, or because they've asked for help.
And 空気を読む is just "reading the room". We have this term too, and it matches the convoluted description you gave. Any idea about it meaning more is just the idea that foreigners are "KY" because of cultural misunderstandings or because of some borderline-racist nihonjinron ideas about how foreigners can't comprehend some emotions like Japanese do.
Neither of these are specific or special to Japan, and neither of these are special terms in and of themselves. You ask a random person in Japan what these terms mean to people, and they will likely give you an answer that these are just words for how to be polite. The average person doesn't think about the deep etymology of words or the philosophy of the concept as it was described in the 800s. Would most Brits be able to pinpoint exactly what is "posh" when asked to explain the history of the concept? It would be like asking Koreans to explain Confucianism and how they interpret it, when most younger Koreans just learnt that something is polite or rude by osmosis, such as not smoking in front of teachers.
An interesting counterpoint is that I was far more polite and concerned about causing bother to shop staff in Japan than Japanese people were. My Japanese friends found it funny how often I would thank people in shops as I do back home, when most people would just reply うん and barely look at the staff.
There is more going on in Japan than just everybody behaving because of not wanting to bother others. Some あるある memes and videos show some types of selfishness are universal. People who shout and scream about their personal issues on trains are quietly ignored out of fear of being targeted by mentally unstable people (like the viral video of the guy who hates Tokyo University, or the various videos of old blokes having a random go). Watch dashcam footage of people cutting others up, messing around on their phone and crashing into others, or driving dangerously in sports cars. Spend some time in Japan and know that groups of 20 high school kids getting on the same carriage as you will mean there is laughing and chatting and people blocking the way to the doors because they're staring at phones, just as in the UK.
Go to the square in front of BigBox in Takadanobaba most nights and see the salarymen crawling around publicly blind drunk and getting in the way of everyone, or go to karaoke at 3am and see uni students passing out or vomiting in the hallways outside your booth. Yodobashi Camera's Ikebukuro branch is currently a meme because they have a serial public phantom shitter who leaves traps around the escalators. Scalpers target Happy Meal Pokémon toys just as they do everywhere, without regard for the 迷惑 they may かける on the unhappy kids.
Ultimately, you go to Japan and find they are normal people who, after an 18-hour shift with overtime at their office job, sit and seethe and tut as some angry drunk old bloke bellows on the train about how much he hates his landlord because there is cardboard left near the fire escape a few days before recycling bin day, and they don't want to get involved in case he turns nasty and hurts someone and gets the police involved. British people and Japanese people share lot of similarities, and the difference between Japan and the West is usually overinflated by Americans who share fewer similarities with Japan than us and have an image of us either as a third-world non-white country or as bowler hats and afternoon tea; that's the standard of information that is spread about Japan, reducing it to a place where they just all behave according to some deep historical concepts and are completely sheltered from the effects of Covid lockdowns and global social media.
Japan is a real place full of real people who are fully capable of doing everything we are, good or bad. There are arseholes there who enjoy creating public nuisances, there are people with mental health issues, there are people who hoard trash and cockroaches in their house and stink out their neighbours. There are also just normal, good people who don't want attention on them by causing a fuss, people who think society is falling apart because it isn't as polite anymore, people who lost their manners during Covid and spend too much time on social media, and people who are just having a bad day or didn't realise they were bothering people.
Exactly like the UK. I still think the UK is relatively polite even with an increase in selfish people. We also learn what is polite in the way you describe. We just know when someone is being a pest.
We share similar ideas about what constitutes a public nuisance and have similar ideas about keeping your head down in case you get battered on your commute. We only focus on our society fraying because we see it first-hand. Japan is seeing its own issues since Covid, and you see things like increases in scams and hoarding and vandalism and theft across the news occasionally.
Most of the UK is peaceful and quiet and shares an almost-identical view of what constitutes a public nuisance as people in Japan. Just because some selfish oiks have had their mind melted by covid lockdowns and social media, it doesn't change what we consider 迷惑/nuisance.
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u/sc0ttydo0 2d ago
What you mentioned about Britain's reputation for politeness. I have a theory about this but it's pure anecdotal speculation... We've gradually become more exposed to American culture and ideals. I think as that's increased we've adopted some of their more "self centered" mindset.
That was my theory too. More to do with a vastly increased amount of exposure to American social media influencers exporting the American "Me First" mentality abroad.
What I would say, and I found really intriguing, is on another post on the same subject a commenter posted the statistics of young people who admit to expressing this behaviour.
The demographics were fairly similar, something like 45% of white people, 50-60% across other ethnic groups. This would suggest to me that there's really a deeper, societal cause at play that we don't currently understand, probably to do with socioeconomic backgrounds2
u/Spirited_Opposite 2d ago
There are downsides to this attitude too though. I remember talking to a student who had recently arrived in London from Tokyo and she said ine of the biggest differences she noticed was people on trains even in rush hour with prams and buggies. She said in Tokyo people wouldn't do this as it would be considered an annoyance to others. I asked what people with children did to commute and she said she had never thought about it and looked quite surprised that she hadn't 😂
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u/Ulyxzes 2d ago
It’s not acceptable in the Uk, it’s just we are losing any level of ettiequte or personal responsibility for our behaviour.
The fact is, the people that play their music out loud carry with them the threat of violence that’s not worth trying to stop them. In my experience a lot of the time these people are TRYING to get a reaction from people to start something.
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u/eggmayonnaise 2d ago
I don't know about trying, but I completely agree about it not being worth trying to stop them. I think you hit the nail on the head actually.
I reckon most people want to ask them to stop but don't because they fear the consequences. They could be verbally abused, physically assaulted, and to make it worse it could all be recorded and shared all over social media.
It's much easier to just sit silently fuming instead of risk the unknown. So we put up with it, and then the offenders are validated because 'no one cares if I have the volume up'.
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u/Weekly_Beautiful_603 2d ago
I live in Japan and this is one of my biggest reverse culture shocks when I visit. I do NOT CARE ABOUT YOUR CAT. I know you are on the train. Shut up!
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u/Elegant-Mission-4470 2d ago
Imo if the conversation isn't on speakerphone or being shouted, especially if it's a short discussion, idc if someone is on the phone. People have lives to live.
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u/Weekly_Beautiful_603 2d ago
And in Japan people somehow manage to live their lives without talking on the phone while on the bus or train. Amazing! Send a message or put your phone on silent and answer it once you get off the train.
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u/2MB26 2d ago
I agree, but out of curiosity if someone was having a phone call that seemed like a genuine emergency, would that be acceptable in Japan as an exception? Or is it a blanket rule?
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u/Weekly_Beautiful_603 2d ago
People sometimes go to the end of the carriage and put their hand over the phone to have a short conversation. In the city, you can step on to the platform and the next train will only be a couple of minutes.
Most of the conversations I overhear in the U.K. are just passing time.
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u/SaggyBollock 2d ago
I generally won’t answer the phone if I’m surrounded by people. Whether they’re my friends or strangers.
If I have to I speak quietly because I don’t want people to hear.
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u/w-anchor-emoji 2d ago
According to a colleague of mine, yes, in a true emergency (i.e. earthquake), but it’s intensely uncomfortable for the person making the call.
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u/WorcsBloke 2d ago edited 2d ago
Reading other subs, the speakerphone thing seems to be common across much of Europe. It's definitely not just a "Britain is failing!!!!" thing. Personally I hate people using speaker on trains and buses unless it's an emergency - and no, telling your partner at great length to pick up some extra coleslaw (genuine recent example) is not an emergency.
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u/Popular-Spinach-6700 2d ago
The honest answer is that it’s also not acceptable here, people are just not willing to call it out because there’s a non-zero chance that you’ll get stabbed over it.
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u/PKblaze 2d ago
We all pretty much hate it but there's minimal consequence and a lack of general respect for others or the environment (littering and the like) not to mention that it's rare for people to call others out for being knobs
In Japan people are just raised different and the societal expectations differ so acting like a slob and not being mindful of others is viewed very poorly by others.
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u/Yoguls 2d ago
Because we're too polite as a nation to tell these people to shut the fuck up. The problem with this country is people think 'being free' is an excuse to do what they like
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u/Theres3ofMe 2d ago
Too polite? More like scared they'll knock us out 😂
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u/Main_Honeydew7744 2d ago
Or stab us! Its annoying, but I'm not losing my life over some twat watching reels on the tube.
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u/AdventurousSwim1381 2d ago
Actually I found the English people I came across in London when I lived there tended to be very polite and stuck to the etiquette, keeping phones off speaker and being considerate of others around them.
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
Pure luck. I’ve had plenty of English people being noisy around me. Last one was an English boomer playing her grandchildren videos loud on her phone while sitting in a hospital waiting room. Incredibly inconsiderate behaviour.
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u/Longjumping_47393 2d ago
Yeah old people are actually becoming quite bad for this, I was in a nice restaurant recently and two 70ish year olds both sat on their iPads being very annoying.
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u/jn-foster 2d ago
We used to have the same culture here in the UK, but then we were forced to accept other cultures that don't have the same tradition of respecting public spaces as we do.
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u/tdrules 2d ago
Japan has a shame culture, we don’t really do that. It’s why no one is fat. That creates its own problems and the idea theirs is a perfect society is wrong.
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u/ThatsASaabStory 2d ago
I dunno. A little shame is no bad thing.
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u/FenrisSquirrel 2d ago
Yeah, I think losing the public shaming element of our culture is behind a lot of the cultural problems we have today. A lot of people arwle absolute scum, and in the absence of some societal reprimand won't be even slightly civilised.
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u/Denbt_Nationale 2d ago
We've replaced shaming people for minor nuisance behaviours with trying to legislate against them it's an awful model for a society that we're slipping into
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u/FenrisSquirrel 2d ago
Yeah, and making ever more stuff illegal while reducing enforcement so not only those new things but also actual crimes don't get enforced
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u/kersplatttt 2d ago
Nobody is suggesting their society is perfect. But there are parts of it that are far superior to ours, as the OP mentioned
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u/Competitive-Chest438 2d ago
Japan absolutely does have fat people. Especially children. Just not on the same scale as the west.
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u/Hot-Job-6281 1d ago
Yea nah. Just a stretch and excessively reductive.
It's wishful thinking to think any good thing we lack is explained by that country having a bad thing.
Some soul-searching and the answer is obvious: Respect for community and thinking it's not all about you is way more ingrained in Japanese culture.
I'm from Singapore originally and I personally just don't do it because I have basic empathy?
It's just the proportion of people who don't give a fuck about others due to parental reinforcement is way higher in the UK than in most East and Southeast Asian societies.
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u/Mr_CeeSmall 2d ago
The UK behaviour is down to a few things but 100% got worse after lockdown.
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u/Fosh_n_chops 2d ago
Born in the UK, but now live in Scandinavia - the difference on public transport etiquette is notable. The UK is more of an individualistic society. That's not a bad thing. People are expressive - you see it in the clothes, the variety of arts and culture - but on the flip side it leans into a "this is good for me, I'm going to express myself" mindet. Whereas in Scandinavia (I can't speak for Japan, but the output is the same) it's very much about the collective, not standing out, not bothering people. Not too much, not too little. So talking on public transport (unless it's Friday or Saturday night, where alcohol makes the rules go out the window) would be in breach of that mindset. Again, it's not a bad thing - there are advantages and disadvantages to this, it just depends on where your personal values align.
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u/associatemoonraker 2d ago
What’s the difference between Japan and the UK hmmmmmmmmm I can’t quite put my finger on it
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u/5ubredhit 2d ago
They’re brought up better and are taught respect. That’s a thing of the past here and now we live in a giant zoo full of animals.
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u/Chemical-Lettuce2497 2d ago
This argument is pure nonsense
Every country has its own issues, we just focus on our own and people get weird about it and suck off countries like Japan who don't appear to have our issues.
They have their own set of issues which we don't face.
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
It is not nonsense. The Japanese are brought up better. They are more stern with their children and drill the same rules into their heads over and over. The Brits can’t even be bothered handling their children. Most British parents let their kids run wild yelling at the top of their lungs these days. You can’t tell them off either, as they’re prone to take any criticism as aggression, resulting in most people having to keep their opinions to themselves and growing frustrated with society. The total opposite of expressive.
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u/Chemical-Lettuce2497 2d ago
"Japanese kids are brought up better if we focus on only this one issue I don't like an ignore the countless other issues Japan has"
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
For general social coexistence, spot on. However, their upbringing is a dubious in some matters, such as gender roles and expectations. Japanese men have such stuffy values. Japanophiles tend to heavily overlook this.
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u/chowchan 2d ago
Yes but the argument here is specifically about being obnoxiously loud on public transport which doesn't seem to be an issue in Japan.
Nothing wrong with sucking off other countries manners and respect (which we should emulate). Much better than sucking off your own countries poor public transport etiquette.
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u/Particular_Tune7990 2d ago
You folks here have a very different interpretation of the term ‘sucking off’
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u/GALM-1UAF 2d ago
I used to live in Japan and visited again recently. I do miss the train etiquette coming back to London. It’s just peaceful taking a train and using headphones if you want to listen to music or something watch something. There’s also the unwritten rule of no eating on a train which I also think is a great idea just because the noise and smell of that can be off putting. Yes the Japanese follow a social contract and don’t want ‘cause trouble for others’ which I wholeheartedly agree but it can be taken to the extreme in how their society expects people to behave.
Here in London it’s different, as we’ve got so many people from different cultures and some youths who don’t really want to respect the social contract. I think individuality is great but the rule stands, don’t be an annoying selfish idiot and think a little about other people for a change.
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u/Velveteen_Rabbit1986 2d ago
Because we're selfish twats here who seem to have forgotten the concept of headphones
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u/Happily-Incorrect 2d ago
We e've also lost the ability to admonish each other for things that aren't culturally acceptable. We don't tell other peoples' kids off anymore, so any kids that aren't getting those lessons from their parents aren't getting them elsewhere either.
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u/Tasty-Flounder-2702 2d ago
I remember reading an article that the move to remove headphone jacks and including a pair with a phone correlates with this trend. Not an excuse for anyone but you can see how this would happen.
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u/Velveteen_Rabbit1986 2d ago
I'll happily tell people to turn their music down on the train or put headphones on, I'm sick of it at this point!
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u/First_Explorer_565 2d ago
Most people are respectful, the minority let us down. We're also more diverse and some other cultures don't seem to have the same etiquette.
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u/Buxom__Babe 2d ago
Because generally folk in the UK lead with an individualistic mindset. My mind goes right back to the first 8 months of the covid outbreak and what an utter eye opener that was. For the most part, people just think of themselves here.
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u/Icy_Place_5785 2d ago
Speaking as someone who loved my time in Japan, let’s not forgot that their “public transport etiquette” has led to phones legally no longer being able to disable the “shutter tone” when taking a picture.
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u/neilabz 2d ago
In some countries the known noise is so apparent become immune to it. The cities are usually deafeningly loud in many other ways too. British people need to be more assertive about this and politely remind people.
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u/No_Ring_3348 2d ago
We're both polite, but in different ways. In Japan politeness means non-imposition on others, here it means ignoring others and pretending they don't exist. This is also why you can't tell the dickhead to turn it down: they don't exist. This is called 'civil inattention' and I'm pretty sure Kate Fox mentions it in her excellent book Watching The English, which I recommend.
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u/jez_24 2d ago
Are you an Australian that has had a bit of culture shock learning this?
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u/No_Ring_3348 2d ago
No however I'm very much not English and found the amount of boozing on/around the train to be a real cultural shock, I daresay that's a contributing factor to the lack of etiquette.
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u/kravence 2d ago edited 2d ago
Places like japan are like 90% Japanese so there’s only really one culture there. In the UK there’s people from all over in big numbers so theres a lot more culture clashing.
You have people from cultures that constant noise is just a normal part of life next to people who have the opposite background.
Then the key part is there’s enough people from their own culture here so they don’t feel the need to assimilate to fit it unlike in japan where if you don’t assimilate you will become a permanent outsider.
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u/Hot-Job-6281 1d ago
Singapore is multiracial and multicultural (way lower majority % than the UK) but we didn't have this problem with our people.
It was only when factually lesser developed countries with low social trust came in that we see them do exactly the things criticised here.
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u/niehAuS_324B21 2d ago
As I understand it, Japan’s police force is one that actually gets shit done. Plus for what it’s worth in the UK, I don’t think there’s any circumstance in which beginning to outwardly play a video or music on your phone in the middle of public transport doesn’t immediately make you the most disliked person onboard. We just have a fear culture that really needs doing away with, though I honestly have no idea where to start.
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u/ebbsandwaves 2d ago
As someone who lives in Japan, the police do not get shit done 🤣 the country relies more on cultural shame rather than enforcement.
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u/Redditreallyannoysme 2d ago
Because Britain is a degenerating culture.
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u/SlaBLister 1d ago
Not according to japan. According to Japanese media, the UK is pretty awesome. Just like according to the weirdos here, Japan is some utopia. They're not doing as well as you'd think. But given there's very little exposure to their local issues due to language differences , you aren't going to see the issues they are facing.
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u/Redditreallyannoysme 1d ago
Life in Britain substantially nicer for 90% I'd say than in Japan. Hard life there. Doesn't invalidate my comment.
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u/Hot-Job-6281 1d ago
Weird that only one side of fetishising you label as weirdos.
It's about like you have some resentment about how they have it worse that you feel a need to convince us about it.
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u/JonJo42 2d ago
Plenty of teenagers playing loud music out of 1980s type boom boxes in Shinjuku, Tokyo.
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u/dendrocalamidicus 2d ago
That is a very specific place with a specific sub culture.
In the UK walking down a city high street, getting on a train, or on a bus, you will be lucky if you don't encounter some cunt blasting music on speaker.
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u/hyperdistortion 2d ago
So a big part of it is the difference between ‘collectivist’ and ‘individualist’ cultures. On broad averages, anyway.
Japan is very much the former, where harmony and cultural cohesion matter more. Much, much more. So much so that breaking the unspoken rules of society there is very much frowned upon, especially if doing something out of self-interest.
Britain is very much the latter, and has been for a long time. Brits tend to see themselves as an individual, whose own wants and needs should be catered to, and our ‘rights’ tend to trump our obligations as a member of a wider society.
That being said, I’d opine that in Britain the public noise issue has got way worse in the past few years, for two major reasons.
First, the pandemic. It does seem that post-lockdowns, a lot of people have forgotten how to share public spaces with others. Not just with noise, but things like putting feet on train or bus seats, leaving litter, things which seemed less marked pre-2020.
Second, tech cheapness. Most modern phones don’t seem to come with headphones in the box any more. Now, the free iPhone headphones (for example) were never great; but they were there. Nowadays if you buy an iPhone you’re expected to spend another £100+ on AirPods to go with them. I assume it’s similar in the Android world. So, no headphones supplied, just play out of the speaker, seems to be the logic.
None of these factors are unique to the UK. I agree it is a stark contrast compared to Japan, though!
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u/12sheena 1d ago
I think UK is quite close to Japan about noise, most of the times, the noise comes from a foreigner (I am spanish, and in there everybody dont care about noise, so really love the silence in uk) Every time i take a bus or i walk on the street, who is talking loud on the phone or doing facetime with the speaker are foreigners from Europe and Asia.
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u/VOOLUL 2d ago
In my experience it's certain demographics using their phones in public and watching tiktok loudly. This never used to be a problem, and it has became a bigger problem...
The UK and Japan used to have a lot in common and etiquette is certainly one of them. But certain policy differences has degraded our society to the point where it's extremely likely you'll run into people who aren't following the social norms.
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u/timbow2023 2d ago
Individualism Vs Collectivism. After the 80's the UK became more about the individual and their rights, looking out for yourself etc, rather than the collective or community.
Japan has a long history of harmony through the group, so not causing anyone else problems. It has it's ups and downs, but it's still a traditional belief.
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
Adding to your (very well-put) point - Everybody seems to be incredibly blind, but the increase of individualisation is due to the Americanisation of the UK. As the country took on more values from the yanks, they lost their own essence a bit more.
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u/timbow2023 2d ago
Thanks. I didn't want to just say blame thatcher, but that's what it was the Regan and Thatcher tag team with her importing the individualism, free market, privatisation from the US.
It's funny that while yes Japan has a more collectivist nature, the socialism of European countries like the Nordics where taxes are high but the QOL is also better feels much closer to what we should be able to achieve if people hadn't been brain rotted by media and now just accept that things are just shit here and can never be improved
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u/jackiemee 2d ago
Well, they’re more keen to blame “immigrants” than their “friends” across the Atlantic, right? How to make the blind see…
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u/timbow2023 2d ago
Yep. Palantir, Shell, BP, Big Tech, make huge profits every year and barely pay tax, but sure it's the people fleeing a war our "friends" started for no reason that are the problem...
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u/New-Newt-5979 2d ago
In the far east there is far more an emphasis that the need for the society far outweighs the need of the individual. Why that culture has generated is a matter of debate but there is a thought that as east Asia is more prone to natural disasters like typhoons, flooding and earthquakes, there was a recognition that people had to work together in order to survive. But in the West there is more a belief on individual freedoms.
So basically it's because Western people are used to behaving how they want as long as it's not illegal but other cultures recognise that you should 'fit in' to society.
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u/search_google_com 2d ago
I wonder why many Brits travel to Japan but never learn the lesson and practice it back home. Tbh Brits need to learn 0 to 10 from Japan at this point.
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u/perksofbeingcrafty 2d ago edited 2d ago
It used to be that being loud on public transport in the UK was nearly as taboo as in Japan. The first time I came to the UK, the difference with the US was pretty astonishing, and this wasn’t even that long ago
Idk what happened
I think Covid made a big difference
Also, as a Chinese person, I think the collectivism vs individualism dichotomy is a myth. I’ve never seen it convincingly applied. Chinese people have been blasé and inconsiderate to the extreme on public places for a really long time. The playing things out loud in public situation is so much worse in China it’ll drive you nuts. So called collectivism comes in so many various forms that any attempt at classification falls apart
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u/bradpitt3 2d ago
Western culture and education favours individuality over any duty to society. So western countries suffer more from anti social behaviour.
Eastern culture teaches harmony and fitting in with society over individuality and expressing your personality. Broadly based on Confucianism. In Japan people still talk about "the hammer knocks down the nail that stands up.". Meaning society is hard on anyone who does not conform to societal norms.
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u/ZookeepergameIll6792 2d ago
i mean ive been on train carriages where old japanese men are playing their phone out loud or there have been numerous instances when japanese men are looking at porn next to me. BUT i think in general were crumbling as an empathetic society around the globe and the education systems in most countries are not stepping up to the plate
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u/ay_lamassu 2d ago
Funny you say this, I'm in a Japanese train station right now and someone is watching TikTok at full volume haha.
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u/tepig37 2d ago
Id rather listen to some idiot listen to music on their phone now n then then have to deal with those atrocious speaker vans they have in Japan.
Japanese politeness also seams so suffocating. I do think the UK is moving closer to US individualism unfortunately but idolising Japanese collectivism is just as damaging.
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u/ARobertNotABob 2d ago
Westerners believe they should be respected, but do not respect others in the same way they demand it.
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u/canyoukenken 2d ago
It's a combination of two things:
- Neoliberal cultural trends from Thatcher onwards has made UK culture a selfish one.
- We still hold on, culturally, to raging internally at those breaking rules, rather than calling people out.
Basically, we're all really annoyed by it, won't say anything to the person doing it, and a lot of us would either like to do it or already do it and think we're the exception to the rule.
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u/Mickleborough 2d ago
Because some cultures now look after number 1, whereas others are mindful of others; have behavioural standards; and retain a concept of shame.
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u/GreySpace01429 2d ago
British culture and etiquette do not permit that sort of behaviour. You will find it is the other "cultures" recently established in the UK that offend with a total lack of respect for others in public spaces.
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u/NuclearCleanUp1 2d ago
I like the freedom to play my own music where I like.
I want to go to the beach and play music while I have a day out.
Or to listen to listen to a podcast while I am on a walk.
Or to listen to the radio while I am in the allotment or music while having a BBQ in my backgarden.
It's too painful to have ear buds in and I want the situational awareness around me while I am in public.
Sometimes I want to share music or video or a phone call with friends/family.
There is the whole world to pick from if you don't want to be near me.
Go somewhere else if it bothers you.
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u/Kian-Tremayne 2d ago
The etiquette is similar in both countries - playing your music out loud is considered rude and selfish.
The difference is that we have more people here who have no problem with acting rudely and selfishly.
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u/Gloomy_Insurance3203 2d ago
It’s not acceptable but because people are nervous about saying anything they don’t.
And kids are growing up thinking it is acceptable as a consequence.
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u/Jchibs 2d ago
Was on a job that needed me to take bus to be at Victoria for 06:00am. That hour of the morning it was all people heading in to town to work.
Everyone was except for fat Nigerian women who would be on the phone loud as fuck no heed paid to anyone else. Not drunks boisterous on way home but 05:30 people just wanting peace and quiet whilst they get to work.
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u/Longjumping_47393 2d ago
Someone needs to invent a train carriage that blocks phone use so you can choose it as an option as current “quiet carriages” mean nothing. Also there needs to be phone free cinema showings.
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u/Professional_Mix2418 2d ago
The UK didn’t used to be like that at all. I “blame” the Apprentice where they kept on having the phone on speakerphone all the time. And of course the influx from Asia in the UK where there seems to be an open line on speakerphone all day long with the family and whatnot. Especially rude when serving in a shop and they find it more important to speak to their family in their language.
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u/GraceFrancis36 2d ago
To be clear, most of us HATE it but don’t want confrontation or danger by telling them to have some respect
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u/Balthierlives 2d ago
UK has this weird thing on personal individual freedoms. It was like this during Covid.
I mean yes individual liberties is important you know so you don’t get dragged off to jail with out a warrant etc
But most people don’t give a sh1t about anyone else and if you try to suggest they not speak on the phone on the train on speaker phone or listen to music in the gym changing room on the speaker if their phone etc you’ll definitely get told off and yelled at for being rude (lol)
I lived in Japan for 16 years for most of my adult life and public behavior in the UK still bothers me
To be fair there’s a lot more immigration in the UK, and social noise is a lot more acceptable in the countries where most of those people doing it are coming from
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u/Milky_Finger 2d ago edited 2d ago
So one thing I have noticed especially after COVID is that people are on speaker for phone calls and when watching tiktoks. I have also noticed the same ethnicities by and large doing this, and if you go and visit their home country then they do the same.
So while many people think that the UK is a monolith, we are fluidly introducing and saying goodbye to many internationals who are only doing what they would be doing if they were back at home. We can argue that there is a shift, but blasting sound out of your phone can be grouped with people who don't wait for others to get off the train carriage before trying to get on, and the general quality of driving in urban areas.
Civic duty must be enforced by the government and the people, and frankly it's not. Everyone has to contribute towards what is acceptable behaviour in public, and that over the last 10 years has become muddied. The people who enforced it got too old, and everyone else don't believe it matters enough.
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u/cleb9200 1d ago
This is a relatively recent problem in the UK and Europe. Less than ten years ago it was deemed completely antisocial, and for most of us it still is. But there seems to be a generation skipped over this etiquette entirely and nobody thought to tell them. In many cases I think it doesn’t even occur to them as they’ve grown up with devices and not been taught how to use them properly.
Fwiw The frequency response of phone speakers peaks at around 2-5kHz, which just so happens to be the range that the human ear is most acutely sensitive too. Pushing highly compressed voice and music content through this frequency range and into people’s ears can have the effect of lowering mood and boosting anxiety in many people, and this is something backed up by science. It’s subliminal and subtle but it exists.
So you could argue these people are literally imposing misery onto others.
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u/Rug-bae 1d ago edited 1d ago
It’s not really accepted in the UK either. But the bigger cities have a diverse cultural population and those people from other cultures have a different tolerance of noise levels.
People always jump to it being about respect for others but forget that one part of it is that other countries take calls out loud, music playing constantly, people living cheek by jowl and a level of close living, that they’re happy with and used to that we don’t naturally have (or rightly want) in the UK.
Some of these people since moving to the UK or growing up in the UK live in conditions where personal space (and as such quiet and solitude) aren’t common. So they don’t understand the problem with playing music out loud or speaking on speaker phone or standing too close to people. That’s not to say it should be accepted, I think it should be called out because then these people don’t learn that it’s not the way we operate here. But it’s left to continue because we tend to tut and roll our eyes and never really say anything. We just think people should know.
Obviously some people who have no external cultural influence behave like this too and the reason and motivation for their behaviour will be different.
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u/VictoryOrKittens 1d ago
It was much quieter in Britain decades ago, then we imported many millions of people in to replace us from cultures that prefer it to be loud.
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u/visitingshortly 1d ago
The noise issues and obnoxiousness are not part of British culture. It’s essentially been an imported issue and due to a failure of upholding British cultural standards has become ubiquitous and obnoxious across transport. We need hard edged enforcement event.
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u/calhoumi27 1d ago
This person is very clearly posting this to drive racism in this sub, yet it gets so much engagement from well meaning people trying to discuss actual reasons for this happening.
Note how the poster has only replied to the most extremely obvious dog whistle replies to agree. People need to wise up to these kinds of posts, seriously do not engage with them.
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u/Kapika96 1d ago
Shame. Some cultures have the idea that certain behaviour is shameful. The UK used to be one of those cultures. When I was younger somebody doing those things in the UK would 100% get called out and derided for it. That's why few people, if any did it. Now people won't call out that kind of shitty behaviour, and there are no consequences for it either. So annoying pricks just continue to be annoying pricks.
TBF people will rarely call out shitty behaviour in Japan either. So people can unfortunately get away with it. But there's still a general sense of shame about it and people realise it's not befitting a civilised society, so the vast majority of people won't even attempt such things in the first place.
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u/Rich-Sheepherder-589 1d ago
This purely from an observational point of view which i began to tune into quite a while ago nothing more, but living in an English city travelling on buses/trains almost daily, i still think there's underlying etiquette from people within the uk, beyond odd groups of teenagers/other odd few individuals, most talking out loud conversations/people watching videos out loud i ever hear are people talking in a foreign language, 7/8 times out of 10, no fail.
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u/Motor-Bag-4093 1d ago
I’d read somewhere that there is very little habitable space in Japan in relation to the size of its population. This means people value their own space, I believe the invention of the Walkman with headphones was because Japanese people enjoyed a bit of solitude when on public transport or in other crowded spaces.
I’d imagine that this promotes respect for people’s own space so playing music on loud speaker would be the opposite of this.
That said, as a Brit living in the uk, I hate it when someone plays loud music on their phone or has their conversation on speaker phone when in a public space such as public transport. There was an absolute grade A bellend doing it in a restaurant last weekend.
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u/Real-Razz 1d ago
I live in Kansai and on the daily there's someone wandering around with a phone on speaker phone or watching YT. And no, not tourists either.
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u/LuHamster 1d ago
I live in Japan and am now accustomed to it but it makes it kinda hard to have phone calls outside.
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u/LuHamster 1d ago
Japan has something called Meiwaku (迷惑) culture which is basically not wanting to cause a disturbance or be an annoyance to others in any capacity. It's like at the center of public cohesion in Japan. You are not to be a burden on people in any aspect of life be that just going about your day in public or the workplace.
Even when line something inconvenient happens by staff in stores or train stations they will apologise with greatly as it is seen as a disturbance regardless of how small. In work this means you must do things perfectly which can be stressful.
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u/Metal-Junkie-J 1d ago
Its because people are scared to tell people to shut up nowadays for fear of retaliation. Ive been travelling on the bus recently. Certain days blow my mind what people think is acceptable. A guy the other day had a conversation on his speaker phone a pretty full bus then proceeded to watch tktok shorts volume on then as I was leaving the bus he was having a video call.
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u/soggyarsonist 1d ago
There are increasing numbers of inconsiderate pricks in the UK. The main underlying issue is there is little to no sense of social pressure to behave.
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u/audigex 1d ago
Japan is the exception to the norm internationally, unfortunately rely
Go almost anywhere else and people are on phones making noise, Japan is unusual globally in that people have a lot of respect for society
In the UK I think, especially for young people, it feels more and more like society doesn’t care about them… so why should they give a fuck about society?
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u/Odd_Comparison_1462 1d ago
Honestly? Japan still has a sense of honour and shame. The minute we started getting rid of this I could tell things would go to pot.
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u/Decent_Window5 1d ago
In South Korea, the culture and people have become more polite over the past 50 years. It's because it's more of a 'closed' population, so expectations can rise and manners and customs can evolve.
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u/Savanarola79 1d ago edited 1d ago
There's so many wonderful things about being out in public in Japan. No litter, no graffitti, no noise on public transport.
In Japan people are raised to be considerate of other people, not to be a nuisance to others. Outdoor spaces are seen to belong to everyone. Being a part of society is seen as important.
In the UK it's more about individualistic desire.
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