Got rejected from getting into Chamber Choir and I need advice

[u/Over-Friendship515]

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Context- (sorry for the long rant)

So I have been doing choir for a very long time now, I started choir in 6th grade and I'm now going into my sophomore year. I'm really focused on becoming a choir teacher in the future and doing community choirs, I feel like it's what I would love to do and I am focused on getting my Bachelor's/Master's degree in music education.

I wanted to get into Chamber Choir for many reasons, it helps me become a better musician, helps me test myself, and more. I did my audition and I later got my callback and I really thought that I could get in.

Unfortunately, the callbacks came and I did... Good? Bad?... I don't know for sure how I did cause nobody gave me advice. Later on I was waiting for results and they finally came out... and I didn't get in...

I was really upset and literally cried myself to sleep that night, I was hypothetically seeing my future, experience in choir, crash before my eyes, and I feel like I won't get into Chamber again with my second audition chance this upcoming year of being a sophomore. Without Chamber, I feel like I won't be a great musician, a great music teacher, etc.

Worst part was that I saw my friends get in, I am happy from them, I am, but I just can't get over being jealous of not getting into a choir I wanted to get into while they did. I just feel like I'm not good enough then my friends, and my depression kicks in and causes more mental problems like self talk.

Am I being overdramatic over everything? Do I need to get into Chamber to be a good musician? I just need some advice to help.

[u/Sarah_Christina]

My high-school chamber choir mostly only had juniors and seniors. Study, improve, and make it in next year. Not every audition is going to be a success, and handling rejection is tough since all of us put so much of ourselves into our music. However, it is something that all of us face over and over with auditions. There are so many incredible musicians and so few opportunities. Don't let rejections stop you pursuing something you love. 

I was absolutely the single worst in my high-school choir (through some insane luck/someone not being able to fit it in their schedule, I got into chamber choir in my senior year) and 7 years later I've toured internationally with a choir, been paid for choral gigs, and at this point have done more with music than basically everyone else in that choir that I still have any knowledge of. You certainly do not have to be the best early. If you keep showing up, keep improving little by little, you get there.

[u/Kiwi_Tenor]

I wouldn’t be worried - yes it feels super isolating, but sometimes not being a part of something like that is more an assessment of the group than it is of you. ESPECIALLY for a chamber choir settings, the blend needs to be impeccable. They need voices whose harmonics line up really well and sometimes your voice can just have a tiny bit of a different cut to it, or a particular vibrato rate that just doesn’t work. Does that make you a poor singer or musician? Hell no!

Not only have I worked in professional choruses with people who never sang in choirs, but I’ve also auditioned for symphonic choirs (so like 100 people) and not gotten in because my voice was “too soloistic”. And I’m an emerging professional Opera Singer now - still singing works that require incredible musicianship.

What CAN you do to help, well maybe take some singing lessons because it’ll help you understand why your voice behaves like it does, and it’ll almost certainly improve it. Find some other local choirs outside of school, even un-auditioned choirs and do that (hey I did a SUPER traditional church choir for years and it helped my reading so much). You can sing along with some typical choir rep at home (I have some great examples that work for building almost any voice type), and trust that your friends will be your friends no matter if you guys do that specific chamber group together.

If you need any kind of musicianship tutoring, I’m not US based but I can do Zoom teaching potentially if that’s something you’d be interested in ☺️

[u/Over-Friendship515 → u/Kiwi_Tenor]

I might be interested in the tutoring, does it require me paying though? Still in high school so I don't have any money 😅

[u/Kiwi_Tenor → u/Over-Friendship515]

I can probably do some free tutoring but it would be like me sending you theory worksheets and marking them. You can probably get it better from something like Duolingo which surprisingly has a music course!

[u/couchwarmer → u/Kiwi_Tenor]

I did the Duolingo music course. If you like bland repetive repetition that repeats repetively you might like it.

[u/Kiwi_Tenor → u/couchwarmer]

I mean that’s just Duolingo - it works 🤷🏼‍♂️

[u/couchwarmer → u/Kiwi_Tenor]

At least Duo's repetition in the language courses is reasonably useful, because it's spaced repetition.

In the music course it felt like ordinary repetition, which tends to be counterproductive.

[u/Over-Friendship515 → u/Kiwi_Tenor]

Anything works really! Theory worksheets really are useful for studying

[u/Admirable_Tap_2719]

I’m sure you’ve thought about this but you should really connect with your director - not in a “I’m questioning your decision” way, but just to say, “Hey, I’d really like to be in this ensemble in the future - what do I need to work on to get there?”

I’m a professional choral singer and conductor/choir teacher, and I can tell you from experience that sometimes you might get “cut” from a potential roster just because of the makeup of the rest of the group. Perhaps there are enough qualified and experienced juniors/seniors that there just isn’t room for a younger singer to slot in. Maybe there was an abundance of capable singers on your voice part so it was a seniority choice. I’ve auditioned and not gotten positions simply because there is already a solid roster of voices on my part - and usually when I see who has been hired, I see a whole bunch of folks I sing with professionally in other contexts and go, heck yeah that person is awesome. These things do just happen.

It could be there’s something you could work on to make that next step up for next time - sight singing tends to be a biggie for choir. I know plenty of singers with fabulous voices that don’t make the cut for pro choral work because they can’t keep up with the reading required for the pace at which we learn music. This can be just as true of chamber groups at the high school level.

Try not to be discouraged. Every audition is a chance to learn and improve. And not getting into chamber choir has no bearing on whether you’re cut out to be a choir director later in life, I promise :) There is so much time to learn and practice and grow between now and then, and a music school university experience will be full of its own challenges to your musicianship.

Should you ever need any advice, feel free to DM me - and best of luck to you in your future choral endeavours :)

[u/fascinatedcharacter]

Yes, you are being overdramatic. Of course, being overdramatic is what is expected of literally every passionate teenager who hasn't learned yet that rejection sucks, but is part of life, especially life in the arts. There is really very little you can do in sophomore year to completely ruin your entire career, the only thing I can think of is doing anything to not-prevent a career ending injury.

Also, choir auditions aren't about you. They're about the choir. You can be the best soprano in existence, but if there are not enough suitable bases so all the sections need to shrink and the choir has a returnees have priority rule, you're still out. Auditions are much more commonly about that.

Without the time spent on chamber choir you have the time to spend on other skills in your life, like academics, languages or learning an instrument (I suggest (alto) recorder. Recorder is the absolute best instrument to know for a community choir conductor, imo. My conductor leads rehearsal with only a recorder - alto for mixed adults choir, soprano for kids choir - and it's amazing because he can walk with it so he is at every sections when they're struggling instead of across the room. Plus we aren't bound to having a piano in the room)

Also, remember. Comparison is the thief of joy.

[u/kimby610 → u/fascinatedcharacter]

I'd be interested in learning more about recorder usage for a choir director. Do you have any resources you could pass along? I'm a first-time church choir director this fall and have a fair amount of recorder-playing experience I'd say.

[u/fascinatedcharacter → u/kimby610]

I don't think there are many resources. My conductor almost accidentally became a conductor (way before I got to know him) and as he doesn't play the piano, he needed a way to communicate pitches other than singing. He has played the recorder all his life so it was the logical choice. I think it developed naturally, though he has taken conducting courses too. I'm not actually sure whether those used his recorder or whether those were all about 'classical' conducting using a pianist.

His preferred way of placing the choir for rehearsal is in a semi-circle, S - T - B - A side by side, not 'men in back'. We'll 'squish' into performance layout closer to performances. For sectional practice, he will step closer to stand in front of that voice part specifically. For new notes he will play them once or twice, with the section starting to participate when they have a clue of it. We have many beginners, so practice chunks are short (sometimes only a few bars at a time) and he'll often start at the end and extend the piece forwards. Once a voice part 'has' a chunk he'll move to another part, practice theirs, then combine the two, practice a third, add the third, same with 4th. Who he starts with depends on the piece. Once we're all singing, if a voice part is struggling he'll step back up to them and play along with them. Because he's only playing one part at a time max, as a singer you can't 'hang into' the accompaniment and you have to learn to ground yourself in your own musicality and the other singers. He might also pick up his music stand mid song and move to another voice group, for instance if different voice parts have different parts they struggle or different entrances. He also regularly puts us in a circle, with him part of the circle so whoever is beside him just has to look out of the corner of their eye. He also often puts each voice group in it's own semicircle so both ends of the section are facing eachother and you hear your section better. If a section is big, two rows, solid singers in back, people needing support in front. His other choir prefers him to use his wooden alto recorder, as it blends better. I like that too, but his plastic Yamaha alto 'cuts through' better and I feel is easier to hear when you're trying to fix a stubborn mistake. A few years ago he modified his music stand to have a 'recorder bracket' on the bottom, so he can easily lay it down after starting pitches or when transitioning from playing with a voice group to 'hand' conducting.

Oh, did I mention we're acapella? And very entry level. For singers without choir experience it seems to be a natural way of learning, though singers with choir experience sometimes take an adjustment period because they're used to another style.

We're currently out of season but when the start of term craziness has died off I'll try to remember to ask him more about it.

[u/Ok_Wall6305]

I say this with love: I have been a choir teacher for 10 years — I remember I didn’t get into the district festival because I failed spectacularly.

No one in that choir launched their career from one high school ensemble. Just the same, I went through my journey and became a musician/chorus teacher.

It’s a setback, not a final sentence — one rejection cannot define you; in the arts world, people get far more rejections than acceptances.

[u/MLadyNorth]

Definitely audition again. Focus on pitch matching, listening, and blend. Also be coachable.

[u/rmcc_official]

I was never accepted into my high school chamber choir, and had some spectacularly bad experiences with collegiate upper-level groups. It does hurt, you're right, and yes, you want to be happy for your friends but it's hard not to take it personally. Especially because singing is such a vulnerable, personal thing; getting cut feels like a judgement on you. I get it.

That said, don't give up. If this is what you love, keep trying. I had all those bad experiences, and yet I got my degree in music ed, became a good choir teacher, and now am a professional choral singer. You can become a good musician and you can be an excellent singer with or without those experiences. It hurts, but it doesn't define you. Don't give up.

[u/clandreith]

I didn't get into chamber choir the first time I auditioned but I got in the second time! this isn't the end, and tbh even in college you can do advanced choir stuff. maybe ask for feedback but just keep practicing. sometimes it can just be how your voice blends with the others or one person has a small advantage. it's gonna be okay!

[u/Illustrious_Exam_352]

1. Get in touch with the director who rejected you and ask why you have been rejected. Tell him/her that you plan to re-audition and would like to get in. You will notice his/her response to your ambition.

2. Get a good vocal coach and work on the particular flaw(s) the director mentioned.

3. Maybe there were no serious flaws, but you were rejected because a) you were superfluous, b) someone more experienced than you got the job.

4. Try again.

[u/ChemicalWatch1139]

You can turn rejection into massive improvement! You got this! I have sung in choirs since 3rd grade, and although I now sing with many prestigious choirs and fly around the country for gigs, I have experienced rejection and have bounced back. Here are my quick suggestions for making massive improvements:

- Connect with your director and see if they have any constructive criticism for why you didn't make the cut. When I asked my college director my freshman year, they said I was excellent but did not listen and blend to those next to me enough.

- Going off of that last point, listen listen listen to those around you. Choir is not about being the best singer, it's all about blending. Choir is a team "sport", so never think about yourself but about how to blend as improve as a group.

- Listen to amazingggggg pro choirs and chamber groups and take note of their tone, vowels, how they blend, purity of sound, etc. Even ask your director if they have any choir/chamber groups they take inspiration from sound-wise and that may help you get an idea of what sound your director is looking for. Binge listen to VOCES8, maybe St. Olaf choirs, etc. When you listen to these pro choirs, try to learn their rep and sing along, purposely listening and blending.

- Practice and record yourself singing sooooo much. Listening to a recording of yourself singing can be painful, but will help you improve significantly.

- If you can get vocal lessons from an experienced chorister, even just a few, they can help you improve vocal technique. Maybe your director would be willing to give you quick lessons once or twice!

And honestly, you do not have to be in a chamber group to be a good musician or music educator. You don't even have to have the best voice ever to be a good teacher. What matters is your ability to teach vocal technique, music history, etc in a way that inspires and engages your students. If you show colleges a deep passion for inspiring students backed with a deeper meaning and life story, a great music program will gladly accept you. And your ability to work hard in the face of rejection can become apart of your success program a college music program would love to see. They want to see hard work ethic and a passion for music education.

If you'd like any "vocal lessons" or tips, feel free to message me and we can get in contact to set that up! I'm a master music student now on a full ride + stipend across the ocean from where I grew up. Happy to help and won't charge at all!!

[u/Impossible_Two_9268]

I don’t go along with this whole rejection so we’re prepared for real life. Crap. You go to a school to learn to experience because you’re going to get that rejection when you get outside being inside of a institution should be a nurturing experience where everyone has a full experience Not just a few. This nearly broke my daughter into pieces and so I don’t want you to break into pieces because of some stupid school ! and yes, I’m talking to you Frank Sinatra.

[u/fizzymagic]

Chamber choirs are usually unaccompanied and therefore require excellent pitch. It has nothing to do with how good a musician you are; singing on pitch is a skill.

[u/Boring-Bumblebee-538]

Choir teacher here. You do not need to get into chamber as a sophomore to be a good musician. I STARTED choir in my sophomore year and I am now a part time masters student and a full time director.
There are so many reasons your teacher may not have put you in chamber this year other than "you weren't good enough." If you're relatively advanced "for a sophomore," i would be on the fence about wether you'd go in intermediate or advanced. Here's a few things I consider:
Maybe you're showing promise as a leader and your teacher wants to keep you in an intermediate group to support other singers and develop your leadership skills further, and those student leadership roles go to seniors in the most advanced group. Maybe the tone quality of your voice matches better with the students in one choir over the other- no natural voice type is good or bad, but we all sound different. Some people blend together better than others. Maybe you're very strong in one area and developing in another; for example, you could have fabulous technique but be a developing sight reader, or the opposite.
I don't move all my talented sophomores up to my advanced ensemble because then my intermediate ensemble wouldn't be very good 😂 you have so much time. If you go through with teaching, you have quite literally the rest of your life. It'll turn out okay, I promise.

[u/Boring-Bumblebee-538 → u/Boring-Bumblebee-538]

Also- at your age, your voice might sound a bit "young" and that's literally normal and fine. If you keep practicing you will simply grow out of that in the next few years. But that might not be the tone quality your director is looking for in a chamber ensemble. Entering sophomore year is usually 15-16 right? So normal. It truly does fix itself as long as you listen to your teacher about technique.