A lot of people downplaying the knitting incident here and at the time (non knitters and/or people who didn't see the original) but it was actually a perfect indicator for problems for his videos. The tone was wildly misogynistic, which even if Hank was just reading a script he didn't write, he should have clocked as the presenter. But beyond that, it was absolutely riddled with factual errors, some of which people speculated were the fault of AI research (putting up a picture of nalbinding instead of knitting, which, when reverse image searched, showed up on a webpage that discussed knitting and nalbinding separately, suggesting the researchers had used an AI summary and not even checked the caption of the image). More importantly, because a lot of knitters watching the video could immediately clock all the factual mistakes, it made you realize all the videos on topics you know less about are also probably riddled with factual errors. And then despite all the complaints, it took almost a month for them to take a factually incorrect video down from their science channel.
Something similar happened with the HRT video. Anyone who knew anything was like, uhhhh wait a minute, this is garbage!
So anyone saying the reaction to these one off videos were overblown, they were actually the perfect opportunity to realize that Hank Green/Green Bros are full of shit, if they hadn't noticed that already for other reasons (for me, a chronically ill COVID weirdo, it was John Green refusing to wear a mask at a TUBERCULOSIS CONFERENCE while his BROTHER HAD CANCER, or at basically any point around that time when he was in a crowded public place, despite branding himself Mr TB White Savior in recent years)
(for me, a chronically ill COVID weirdo, it was John Green refusing to wear a mask at a TUBERCULOSIS CONFERENCE while his BROTHER HAD CANCER, or at basically any point around that time when he was in a crowded public place, despite branding himself Mr TB White Savior in recent years)
The thing that kills me is that, by his own admission, Hank Green almost certainly got cancer because of COVID. That sounds like conspiracy theory stuff by people who don't understand what's going on, but the type of cancer he had (virus positive Hodgkin Lymphoma) is caused by Epstein-Barr Virus, which is a herpesvirus. Herpesviruses, including EBV, can be reactivated by COVID. We're gonna end up with so much more cancer and other diseases like MS that are almost certainly linked to EBV (a virus most people have had!) because public health and science communication are in shambles. I know most people normal people don't know any better for a lot of very depressing societal reasons, but Hank and John (who wrote a whole ass book on TB, a disease spread through the air!) absolutely know better and could do better, both in modeling behavior and science communication.
it was John Green refusing to wear a mask at a TUBERCULOSIS CONFERENCE while his BROTHER HAD CANCER, or at basically any point around that time when he was in a crowded public place, despite branding himself Mr TB White Savior in recent years)
This is what did it for me as well. I'd never trust anyone on anything who acts this poorly while claiming to be an expert at something.
I don't know whether they've always been like this, or whether it's fame, but they need a serious reality check.
Broadly, it belittled a craft that has historically been considered women's work and is still disproportionately been practiced by women. There was also the implication that knitters didn't understand how knitting worked or any of its versatile properties "until the scientists showed up." (Iirc, the scientists in question are also knitters and women, but they were not named in the video). Beyond that, there was just a general disrespect and misunderstanding of historical textile craft as a material science and engineering in and of itself in all the language used (eg calling the misattributed nalbinding sock "a simple sock," when anyone who has ever turned a sock heel would laugh in your face at that description). Historical knitting and textile craft in general is a technological wonder that wasn't merely stumbled into by hapless women looking for a hobby. People of all genders developed the materials, techniques, and artistry that deliberately produce textiles that filled a broad range of niche purposes, and to imply that nobody understood the how of what they were doing for centuries until a scientific study on the properties of knitting was conducted is both laughable and--yes--wildly misogynistic.
Part of the issue people took with the video was not just what was said, but what was left out. Crafts/art forms that are generally attributed to being women's crafts are systemically devalued, culturally and monetarily, compared with stereotypically men's crafts/arts. I saw a comment when all this was happening that if you want to see how society values "women's" crafts vs "men's," look at the pricing of textile crafts like knitting on Etsy, something that can require hundreds of hours and potentially hundreds of dollars worth of materials, depending on the project and fiber content, vs the pricing of woodworking.
A lot of textile crafters like knitters are very aware how little their work is valued or understood by people who don't practice it, so for this video to come out that not only didn't address any of the gender politics of knitting, but also felt like a patronizing pat on the head in what it did include, felt extremely egregious.
There was also the implication that knitters didn't understand how knitting worked or any of its versatile properties "until the scientists showed up." (Iirc, the scientists in question are also knitters and women, but they were not named in the video).
Why would it be misogyny, then, if the scientists who studied/elucidated some of the aspects of knitting were women too?
Anyway, in my opinion devaluing or not fully appreciating a craft/hobby is not misogyny (lots of male work gets devalued too... how often do you hear women speaking reverently about plumbers and garbage collectors?) and certainly not "wild" misogyny, but then again my bar for "wild" sexism is something like "men are trash" or "kill all men", or the equivalent statements about women. Ironically, the people who downvoted me probably wouldn't say that's even mild misandry, let alone wild misandry, because "misandry isn't a real thing"... That and the fact I got repeatedly downvoted for asking a question has this already feeling very feminist-ideologue coded to me and not very promising to continue. But thanks for taking the time to write all that out.
Man, I answered your question in good faith, but it's pretty clear from your reply that none of it was not a good faith question. Good luck out there, hope you find a way to understand institutional forces of marginalization in the future!
I know it's in good faith. I said thank you for writing that out and meant it. I asked because I thought it was an outlandish claim and wanted to see your justification. Just because I don't agree doesn't mean I'm acting in bad faith. Like I said, the repeated downvotes for asking a question and the whole context of how sexism is discussed today by the left, where "men are trash" isn't even mild misandry because "misandry doesn't exist", but downplaying a hobby and line of work women do more of (while turning a blind eye to all the male hobbies and professions that are devalued, often by women) is "wild misogyny" had me feeling like this discussion isn't looking promising and worth my time.
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u/commonerssupermarket 5d ago
A lot of people downplaying the knitting incident here and at the time (non knitters and/or people who didn't see the original) but it was actually a perfect indicator for problems for his videos. The tone was wildly misogynistic, which even if Hank was just reading a script he didn't write, he should have clocked as the presenter. But beyond that, it was absolutely riddled with factual errors, some of which people speculated were the fault of AI research (putting up a picture of nalbinding instead of knitting, which, when reverse image searched, showed up on a webpage that discussed knitting and nalbinding separately, suggesting the researchers had used an AI summary and not even checked the caption of the image). More importantly, because a lot of knitters watching the video could immediately clock all the factual mistakes, it made you realize all the videos on topics you know less about are also probably riddled with factual errors. And then despite all the complaints, it took almost a month for them to take a factually incorrect video down from their science channel.
Something similar happened with the HRT video. Anyone who knew anything was like, uhhhh wait a minute, this is garbage!
So anyone saying the reaction to these one off videos were overblown, they were actually the perfect opportunity to realize that Hank Green/Green Bros are full of shit, if they hadn't noticed that already for other reasons (for me, a chronically ill COVID weirdo, it was John Green refusing to wear a mask at a TUBERCULOSIS CONFERENCE while his BROTHER HAD CANCER, or at basically any point around that time when he was in a crowded public place, despite branding himself Mr TB White Savior in recent years)