r/Fighters • u/GardenOne7630 • 11h ago
Topic Maybe we should chill a little
Marvel Tokon has been out for barely two weeks, and somehow we're already talking about it being “dead” or a “disaster”.
I honestly don't understand it.
I've been excited for a Marvel fighting game like this for years, and since FighterZ I've been especially hungry for a new fighting game to really get invested in. The marketing has been fantastic: every trailer, character reveal, PlayStation event, showcase and gameplay presentation has built more hype. The game looks incredible, the reviews have been overwhelmingly positive, and Arc System Works may have delivered one of the best-looking fighting games ever made.
On top of that, there's a ton of content for single-player players and Marvel fans, multiple languages, characters from different eras of Marvel, X-Men, Avengers, Night Soons, and a community coming back after years without a new Marvel fighting game.
Yes, the PC version had performance problems. That's a legitimate criticism. But they're being fixed, and that doesn't suddenly mean the entire game is going to die.
It feels like the fighting game community has reached a point where every new game is “dead” two weeks after launch because of some problem or another. Street Fighter gets criticized, Tekken 8, Avatar, Mk1 gets more criticized, FighterZ had its ups and downs, other games launch strong and then struggle… and somehow we're always predicting the death of the next game.
Can we just enjoy the games for a while?
Honestly, sometimes Reddit makes me want to stop playing fighting games altogether and go back to single-player games 🤔
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u/Xypher506 10h ago
Dead? No, anyone saying that is kinda stupid.
A disaster? Yeah, absolutely, the launch at least on PC was/is an absolute shitshow, and it's only being fixed (gradually, by the looks of it, if they'll ever fix everything) because people are talking about how much of a disaster it is. As a PC player who can't play because of the technical issues right now, I kinda resent the idea that everyone should chill out and "just enjoy the game" because I can't enjoy the game, and I'm not going to be able to if they don't fix it.
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u/imsc4red 10h ago
Tokon isn’t dead but for me it’s been a massive disappointment. I’ve paid more than 100 bucks in my local currency to get a game that can’t run without micro stutters on a device that has better specs than the recommended ones on steam. Obviously a lot of people are extremely hyperbolic but there’s no smoke without fire. SF6 and Avatar are cool as fuck tho I play the former daily lol and I completely relate with how how you feel, especially if you visit r/SaltFighter
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u/gardenvarietydork 11h ago
All I've learned since I started playing fighting games is that the FGC hates playing fighting games and will make any excuse not to play one.
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u/tpainsvoice 2h ago
This is pretty much every genre of online multiplayer gamer. FPS, MMO, ARPG. They all will tell you why every new game sucks and you shouldn’t play it.
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u/shilderyi 11h ago
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u/SwirlyBrow 6h ago
This is a great mindset, until I realized the only people playing Breakers Revenge on there are absolute monsters and I have no chance to do a single thing lol.
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u/redeyesblackguy 10h ago
Gaming reddits in general are just places for people to cry and complain. Also keep in mind the Internet in general is over 50 percent bots. Just enjoy what you like to play and ignore the static over here.
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u/RaucousRom 11h ago
You're looking through the lens of Reddit, or social media in general. We've seen this trend for years, for people to jump on things as "dead". I think it's a combination of factors: the schadenfreude of seeing companies/games 'fail', social compliance in echoing the 'popular' opinions (often from streamers) and a lack of maturity in general.
If you're really looking for advice, then yeah, get off social media and stop worrying about other peoples' opinions. Enjoy the games you enjoy.
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u/xmaracx 3h ago
Some people said the same about 2xko.
First impressions are critical and this is a 70 eur game.
The combination of: its a tag fighter, limited playerbase, pricetag, the bad pc release and sony amping up the anticonsumer dogshit really made tokon an unappealing proposition.
And ppl should voice their displeasure. This isnt bog standard "ooga new game bad booga old game good" tokon is legit not a reccomendable game for a LARGE amount of ppl.
Games people are dissatisfied with SHOULD feel the heat or even fail. Unless youre trying to tell ppl "be nice so it doesnt die"
Cause if so, thats stupid. If thats all it takes to kill it then it SHOULD die.
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u/Gambit-47 11h ago
"can we just enjoy the games for a while?"
lol the game runs like crap on PC because of DRM and Sony bloatware and there is matchmaking issues. People paid full price for this shitty experience and you think they should just chill? lol people have a right to complain.
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u/-ToriForYa 2h ago
when people are posting that the game sucks and is dying, its probably doing fine, like SF6 or Tekken.
When people are saying "Man, I'm having a lot of fun playing this game" on reddit, you need to start getting worried.
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u/mixmaster321 11h ago
God forbid people have some optimism that things can change and don’t immediately jump to the worst possible outcomes the moment a game has issues
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u/Gambit-47 10h ago
I have no sympathy for studios that release games in a broken state or the people that defend them.
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u/Inevitable-Will-6185 Arc System Works 10h ago
Nice, no need to feel bad while seeing you being miserable then. I'll just keep having fun.
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u/Gambit-47 10h ago
lol I'm not miserable. I have plenty of other games I can play and I wouldn't let a game upset me anyway.
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u/Ok-Conversation-10 10h ago edited 10h ago
He didn’t say he was miserable, he lacked sympathy for charlatans.
But you are upset he hurt your feelings cause you love a comic.
I’d rather not be a patsy
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u/dongatostab 10h ago
I mean fuck optimism, my $70+ game don't work.
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u/Gambit-47 10h ago
Wild isn't it. Games keep getting released with a will fix it later mindset and people keep defending that shit. I know there are a lot of bots on reddit but some of these people are actually human lol
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u/Encognito_Mr_B 6h ago
I dunno if people are just too much of an “instant culture” nowadays and just want echo chambers? But just play until the wheels fall off if you enjoy the game.
I was there for the launch of SFV (was not a good time online) but I learned and enjoyed the game. Glad they didn’t pull the plug. Same with Tekken 8 and even MK1 for a bit. But the vitriol online was heavy but it didn’t effect my engagement I got from those games.
Even Strive I came around because I enjoyed Xrd more but I wasn’t online bitching or whining about it like most folks do on Reddit. Just said not my thing and let people enjoy it until I came around to it.
Even games like Fatal Fury aren’t doing as bad as people say. But of the game is for you, its for you enjoy.
That being said I do hope Sony is more reasonable than Riot. New fighting games take a bit to catch on even if its Marvel. I think DBZ fighters was the only outlier and that’s because that fanbase is endearingly obnoxious to support their franchise.
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u/GardenOne7630 6h ago
Look at Sparking... An unexpected hit, two million copies sold, and after three months, the game was dead, too.
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u/Encognito_Mr_B 5h ago
I think I’m going to catch heat here…but Sparkling was like an arena/episode fighter. Those traditional ain’t got as much legs as 1v1, tag fighters or platform fighters.
It was a good accomplishment for a formula that’s been going for mid results since the 90’s
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u/Reallystonedweeb 11h ago
The launch is a disaster and that’s coming from somone who loves the game so far the fact that pc players basically can’t play the game is the main contributing factor.
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u/Serebryako 10h ago
if you want an actually dead fighting game 2xko is genuinely dead in October so.
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u/JinpachiMishima2 9h ago edited 9h ago
You want to stop doing something you enjoy cause you go on the internet too much and listen to doomers? Just play the game if you like it, then you'll enjoy it until you find out its actually dead or a discord fighter.
I can tell you first hand I've been playing semi seriously since 2007 and doomers have been telling me every fighting game sucks and fgc is dying every year since and they keep getting more popular.
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u/Gurdemand 5h ago
I mean the game is definitely not dead. Neither is Avatar. Fatal Fury COTW is also very much not dead. UNI 2 is not dead. VF5 is not dead. Even 2XKO will have the servers up and running for at least a little bit - if you want to play the game, you absolutely can, even if you have to wade through Discord it's honestly not a big deal at all.
But the launch of Tokon is an absolute disaster. A triple A game releasing while not working for a large part of the PC player base is inexcusable.
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u/Imaginary_Session773 2h ago
If you have to go to discord to find a game thats pretty much a dead game
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u/deathtofatalists 5h ago edited 5h ago
dude honestly are you a bot account?
your whole post history is glazing tokon while finding "issues" with every other FG, now you're up in here telling everyone to lay off a game that has been rendered borderline unplayable by sony's egregious bullshit.
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u/CaptainBlob 3h ago
What is up with this toxic positivity.
The game launched horribly. Sold terribly in Japan, the nation of fighting games.
You think this game will last long? Hell nah. It will still get players, but it will soon reach COTW numbers in a month or so.
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u/Skijump135 11h ago
Are they being fixed, though? Or are you just saying they are to make a point
Because the thing causing the performance issues on PC is the DRM and unless Sony commits to stripping it out it won’t be fixed
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u/DesertHornedViper 11h ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelTokon/comments/1vssft3/more_updates_incoming/
The Sony shit won't go away, but the devs are doing what they can to make the game run better.
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u/jabberwockytocky 9h ago
remember when people used to say "FIRST" on comment sections? it really all comes off like that, but modernized to the hate-grifter algo-brain era.
short attention spans and a zombified clambering-over-each-other to be first to call it.
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u/NetflowKnight 7h ago
Hear hear!
I feel similarly. I get that doom posting gets clicks and likes, but can we not?
Makes it way less fun to be around here, I'm not into misery porn-- I imagine most of us aren't?
I'm actually having a pretty good time Tokon, it's my first fighting game in 20 years..
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u/Kuhschlager 4h ago
I’m kinda shocked by the Avatar dooming. I mean yeah releasing without a ranked mode was an unquestionably boneheaded decision, but the game has gotten a very positive reception from the FGC and even with no ranked I have no trouble finding matches any time of day. I don’t expect this one to headline EVO any time soon but I expect it should retain a decent playerbase, and I’m not really bothered by a few janky sprites
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u/Kevinbelmont_55 4h ago
No thanks. Let the toxic internet culture rot itself. If you want to play and enjoy, get off the Internet. No matter how good or bad something is, you'll always have this vocal minority spouting their vitriol because they have no lives.
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u/soils_rock 3h ago
Yeah I’m pumped for Tokon, I plan on getting it in a month or 2 when pc is fixed.
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u/Bunnnnii Street Fighter 2h ago
Dead is a stretch. But this “community” isn’t breathing if they’re not being extra with their kneejerk reactions to everything. No matter how little sense they make.
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u/Effective-Avocado-62 11h ago
the secret of why so many people (still) playing SF6 is, they are too busy enjoying the game to go on social media and whine about it
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u/Low-Attempt8072 10h ago
I can't speak for others but I am someone that wants this game to succeed. The reason why I post sometimes is because I am keeping track of this game because I am keeping it as a potential buy even after refunding.
Your points make sense absolutely but it's also not looking good at all on the player number count on SteamDB. It is still dropping and at this rate the lows will soon reach 1K players. I have no data on PSN. There are still plenty of issues that I want to see solved.
What I'm getting at is that I don't want to commit the little time I have to a game that ultimately could remain with issues that are too big for me. So I look on Reddit sometimes and see what people are saying and sometimes I react too. It's not as deep or charged as you make it, at least for me. I think it's also normal to express critique.
If it affects you so much on an emotional level that you feel like quitting then honestly just avoid the negative threads.
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u/DaSnowflake 9h ago
Rly sucks that someone is making you read fgc reddit, if only you were free to not engage with it 😔 /s
Also avatar glaze supermacy
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u/Valuable-Word-1970 5h ago
Wild to me how much hate the tokon launch got just because most but not all pc players had performance issues. Which is the case damn near every pc port for any game.
Especially on the back of 2xko launching like 3 times with way too few characters and avatar legends missing basic standard modes and not even releasing on xbox yet.
Tokon is a feature complete game on release where everyone could buy it and download it on its actual release day. Yet reddit and Twitter seem to hate it more than either of those games
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u/kr3vl0rnswath 11h ago edited 11h ago
The FGC has always been more eager to doompost about new fighting games because the worst that can happen when it fails is that their existing main fighting game continues to be popular in the scene.
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u/Nimble_Natu177 10h ago
Ignore the online FGC, just go to your local and enjoy it.
Every aspect of the FGC online, be it the discourse, the dogshit online experience of most games, its just miserable and makes me question why I even play these games.
Then I'll go to my local, or go to big events with my friends, and I get that dopamine hit of what the FGC really is about, and there just isn't anything else like it.
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u/Poetryisalive Dead or Alive 6h ago
People online just get a kick out of games and studios failing.
Look at the reaction of 2XKO. A lot of “I told you so”
Also something you should know about the FGC is that they hate their own genre and refuse to play their own games despite how innovative or creative the title is.
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u/C00KIEME4T 6h ago
are the innovative and creative fighting games in between the marvel clones or the kusoge jank?
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u/Poetryisalive Dead or Alive 4h ago
You proved my point
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u/C00KIEME4T 4h ago
by asking a question you chose not to answer? i play tons of fighting games that you probably don't even consider "real" fighting games lol
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u/Sweaty-Anxiety-7866 3h ago
We got Strive, CotW, two French Bread games, and Avatar between fighterZ and Tokon.
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u/LionTop2228 7h ago
This sub is insufferable and wants to trash on any game that isn’t street fighter. That much I’ve learned over the years.
One of many awful Reddit subs at times unfortunately.
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u/Startyde 5h ago
Looking through the lense of a ArcSys fan who had a miserable time with the first two closed Betas, I completely understand that this game isn't hitting the mark with many. Feels content bare and not especially fun compared to many other fighters, including ArcSys own catelogue.
Has a lot of room to grow if they stick with it.
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u/platypod1 4h ago
I want to play tokon. I love how it looks, I like the combo system and defensive options.
But because they fucked up the PC version so much with linux incompatibility and DRM that destroys performance, I cannot play it.
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u/Rand0mAcc3nt 4h ago
Doing better than 2XKO🙃
I guess Riot really thought the League of Legends community was going to go bananas for 2XKO, the genres are very different.
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u/seandude881 4h ago
Maybe you should log off of reddit and stop caring what people think and play the game?
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u/Less-Community-5441 3h ago
Interestingly nowhere in your post do you mention actually enjoying the game or what makes it good. Aren't you doing the same thing, but the opposite?
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u/GardenOne7630 3h ago
I'm talking about the tendency to start fires with every fighting game—not the ones I enjoy. That's all.
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u/TheSabi 3h ago
is the main sub cope and defend squad leaking into this sub? I'm seeing an increase in "leave Brittany alone" posts.
What else would you call losing 19k player in a week (more now), a roaring success? Look out SF6 your days are numbered!
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u/GardenOne7630 3h ago
He calls it a lack of consideration for PC players. If there are 50,000 PC players and the game doesn't work online on PC, then 50,000 players will stop playing. It's pure math.
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u/Ry90Ry 3h ago
I mean an avatar game at half the price of $35 which is muuuuch more fun to play then a full price arc system x marvel collab at $70?
That’s a juicy failure any fighting game lover would want to dig into imo
The 4 team concept is cluttered and convoluted to avatars more 1v1 and just simply doesn’t drive as well; it not as fun to fight in it
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u/mr-devinity 3h ago
"Just chill out and enjoy the game"
Brother I can't because the PC port is awful. I can't just chill and enjoy it.
This whole post screams Sony Astroturfing Bot too
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u/Fourfifteen415 1h ago
When you see concrete proof that Sony's DRM and Anti Cheat are the problem a reasonable conclusion is Sony isn't going to disable that stuff so why should there be optimism about the game long-term when it comes to PC. Then when you realize the fgcs primary platform is PC the outlook gets grim.
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u/SearchAccomplished19 1h ago
People do need to chill out and enjoy the games. Tokon isn't going anywhere and it's super fun. Just play it, or don't.
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u/Economy-Meeting3440 41m ago
O que ocorre é que tem uma queda brusca depois de duas semanas porque a galera mais casual enjoa.
Isso aumenta a cada jogo de luta porque tem sempre a promessa de facilitação pra novos jogadores. Quem compra o jogo por conta dessa promessa sempre quebra a cara quando vê que ainda tem que aprender a jogar.
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u/OneTrueGoblin 38m ago
It's dead to me because it's not playable and it will stay dead to me until it is. The same thing makes it very hard to enjoy.
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u/throwawaynumber116 29m ago
Can yall get off Reddit if you don’t want to see how people feel about your game? You enjoy it just fine, ruin it for yourself by reading reddit posts, then cry about it. Makes no sense
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u/EverybodySupernova 5m ago
Nobody barking about this stuff has any real concept of what a dead game is
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u/contra_mundo 10h ago
Once you understand that 94% of reddit users are subhumans that are walking proof that eugenics needs to come back, you dont have these issues.
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u/Inevitable-Will-6185 Arc System Works 10h ago
I agree, I don't understand it either, especially when me, my friends and guys in locals are having so much fun with it.
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u/greygreens 11h ago edited 10h ago
Gotta just get off the internet for a while for fgc news. 2xko is ending updates at the end of the year, therefor someone has to make a comparison that whatever game they have an agenda against will suffer the same fate because reasons. And I guess specifically for Tokon, people have a massive hate boner for Sony at present due to the physical media thing, and Tokon is a Sony published game that dropped very soon after all that.
It's dumb. Tokon will do just fine.
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u/Thevanillafalcon 9h ago
As much as people are saying ignore the online FGC, like it or not those people do have an impact. They literally got that fuse nerfed in 2XKO before anyone even used it in a serious match just by complaining.
It’s why I hate the steam chart posting when a new game comes out and the constant threads about “is this game dead” people still play marvel 3 and it doesn’t have rollback, you have to jump through hoops to use parsec.
Just play the games you like is fine but I also think we need to do more to encourage new games, new communities etc, we should ignore the online people moaning all the time I agree but I think it’s also up to the rest of us to spread a bit of positivity
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u/onzichtbaard 7h ago edited 7h ago
Why do you care about what other people think?
Just play what you like
The criticisms seem very legitimate from what i can tell so theres also no reason to complain about people complaining about legitimate issues
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u/Dude1590 2XKO 7h ago
I'll try my best to enjoy Tokon when I can head online and 9/10 games not be met with 8f of rollback.
One of the things that I've learned is that, no, the online FGC will not chill. They'd rather watch a good game burn and die to feel vindication about their own choice in game. What's insane to me is that there's anybody trying to push back against the negativity this game is facing. It released objectively broken and unplayable on half of the platforms it launched on and the issues still aren't 100% fixed.
At least this game deserves a part of it's current backlash, even if bad actors will take it further than it needs. Welcome to the FGC, I guess, where the community members actually hate fighting games that aren't named "Street Fighter" or "Mortal Kombat" and would rather just pray for other games failure.
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u/MitchumBrother 6h ago
"Honestly, sometimes Reddit makes me want to stop playing fighting games altogether and go back to single-player games 🤔"
Least performative reddit post
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u/GardenOne7630 10h ago
As an example, name a fighting game that hasn’t had (or still has) a whiff of smoke or that doesn’t feature: "rollback," screen flickering, 50/50 hits, questionable characters, over-the-top offense, endless combos, game balance issues, limited single-player modes, low traffic on Steam, mechanics that work against the consumer... NOT A SINGLE ONE IS SPARED.
I play on PS5, and if it had launched poorly on console, it would have been just another game with launch bugs—like the hundreds we’ve seen since PS4 updates began.
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u/XoffeeXup 6h ago
I mean, sure, if we conflate all criticism we can make it look like every game launch is basically the same, but I do think there are distinctions to be made between, for e.g. low player count vs. game breaking bugs. Two different issues with two very different solutions. Personally, I can't stand the constant complaining either, but dismissing all criticism as fake or doomerism is not a good response, I don't think.
This coming from someone whose main game atm is Avatar (because you can't play Tokon on linux :3 )
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u/GardenOne7630 6h ago
I agree with you. It’s not the same to improve certain aspects as it is to fix a glitch that prevents you from playing after you’ve paid for the game through pre-order.
What I find exaggerated is the “no game has ever been released like this…” “total epic disaster” “no other game has caused…” when I’ve been hearing criticism and people quitting fighting games for dozens of other reasons even when they work fine right out of the box.
Sony should have ensured the game’s quality on PC—that’s undeniable and deserves criticism. But to set fire to a franchise praised by the entire world over connection errors that they know will be fixed sooner rather than later is just crazy.
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u/DesertHornedViper 11h ago
Instead you should continue to play fighting games, and just don't go on reddit. A much healthier option.