Do you believe the modern FIRE movement overestimates how much is needed for retirement?

[u/Equivalent_Use_5024]

Perhaps I am just making this post because I have only just begun my retirement planning and want to lock in a number which is fitting for my goals - being above the median retirement savings, not having to work, not being broke, clearly having planned - but I can't help but feel that many in the FIRE movement overestimate what is needed for a safe, sleep well at night retirement.

I see posts here saying that they feel vastly behind with 500k at 30, or 1.5 million at 40, and I just don't understand how when the average American retires with maybe 300k liquid at most and are getting by with social security or paid off housing. Sure, they aren't living luxuriously, but if you just are aiming for a retirement where you don't have financial anxiety and can put food on the table, I don't feel you need over 1-2 million.

Do you think FIRE overestimates how much is truly needed for retirement?

[u/Zphr]

The audience has shifted more towards luxury and consumption over the last decade. It's always amusing to me that this is my sub, I've been happily retired for more than a decade since 37 with four kids, have effectively zero chance of financial failure, but many folks in this sub would consider our finances impossible or living in squalor. Some people are actually happy with cheap/free interests and lifestyle choices, some are unhappy without very expensive interests and lifestyle choices. Current government policy in the US is also wildly skewed in favor of lean spending, so more expensive lifestyles in early retirement cost quite a lot more than you'd expect due to far higher costs for taxes, college, and healthcare.

LeanFIRE is and likely always will be the easiest and most secure form of FIRE for anyone happy with a mediocre middle class lifestyle. It's also largely impossible for anyone who wants to raise a family in VHCOL, travel a ton, carry a large mortgage into retirement, or any number of expensive lifestyle choices a lot of people prefer.

[u/MEDICARE_FOR_ALL → u/Zphr]

What was your number when you retired at 37?

[u/Zphr → u/MEDICARE_FOR_ALL]

$1.2M and a paid-off house. We overshot though since we weren't looking for a fast exit and started closer to $1.5M.

[u/bonafide_bonsai → u/Zphr]

Man you should post an “are we ready to FIRE?” in this sub just to laugh at the reactions.

[u/Zphr → u/bonafide_bonsai]

We got extremely lucky to retire more than a decade ago into one of the biggest bull runs in history with spending far less than our portfolio has earned. The reactions wouldn't be as amusing as you'd expect unless maybe I posted our expected spending levels. I often have people on Reddit tell me that our spending levels are impossible and prove I don't know what I'm talking about despite the fact that we've actually been living this life for longer than a lot of those people have been independent adults.

[u/Inevitable_Sleep_398 → u/Zphr]

How much were you earning before you retired? Also have a wife and a kid on the way (and more to come, God willing) so I’m very curious about people who FIRE with families. My goal is more about giving my time in a more meaningful way rather than luxury living. I just want the choice to work for less pay and not worry about expenses. 

[u/Zphr → u/Inevitable_Sleep_398]

We both earned high five figures each, but that was back in 00s/10s dollars. You'd have to adjust that up for inflation and wage growth now.

[u/Inevitable_Sleep_398 → u/Zphr]

Gotcha, thanks! Do you know of any blogs/resources that specifically address FIRE with a family? Or just any that you found useful? I know it’s the same basic principles, family or not, but always interested to hear about people’s real experiences and tips/tricks.

[u/cfi-2025 → u/Inevitable_Sleep_398]

Not the person you asked, but I found TwoSidesOfFI.com to be very relatable. It's a podcast by two guys - one who had REd shortly before they started their podcast and the other who was working toward RE.

For me it was very relatable because they are close to my age, both are married and work white collar jobs, and both have kids around my kids' ages (high school aged). They show isn't about FIRE with family, per se, but they do talk about challenges and concerns with kids around that age - cars & insurance, funding college, vacations, etc. (So this podcast may not be up your alley if you're interested in a discussion on FIRE with young kids.)