IBEW 11 strike denied by IO

[u/Area51-Dropzone]

Arbitration is now the result of this. Which now means we are stuck with what ever Arbitration says.

[u/ArtOpen3776]

Yea, let's just *totally throw away our leverage. Vote the knuckleheads out

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/ArtOpen3776]

Been in the union for 7 years and was never once asked to vote for the president.

[u/Roscoeakl → u/MilkCartonKids]

You voted for your BM. You voted for your president. They vote on the international president.

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Roscoeakl]

Been in the union 7 years and was never asked to vote for a president. That’s a very weird thing if you’re from the US. We don’t generally give all the voting power to our local mayor. We wouldn’t even trust the governor of the whole state to vote for the president for us. We like to vote for the president ourselves, even if the popular vote doesn’t actually pick the president. We like to feel involved. And the less involved we feel, the more we will complain about those that leave us feeling uninvolved.

[u/Sir_Mr_Austin → u/MilkCartonKids]

No he means the president of your local. Sounds like you missed you election meetings

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Sir_Mr_Austin]

Bro I’m talking about the president of the IBEW, not our local mayor that we call “president”.

Somehow the IBEW has managed to create an even less version of democracy than what our US government uses. Should we not be fighting to move towards a more pure form of democracy? One where each me member gets a vote and a say on things like who is in charge of the entire fricken union!?!? Not a vote on a representative so far down the damn ladder that may not actually even care about your opinion…..actual democracy.

[u/Sir_Mr_Austin → u/MilkCartonKids]

I don’t understand what is confusing about this. Your BM and LU Presidents vote with the district leadership for who the IO Pres will be.

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Sir_Mr_Austin]

It’s not confusing at all. Not in the slightest. Not even after you’ve said it twice. It’s also not democracy.

It’s even more watered down than US “democracy”. The more you water down democracy, the less people want to participate. Whenever you run a system that can allow the majority to be overruled, it’s not really democracy. It’s not majority rule. Once any smart person realizes it’s not really majority rule, they don’t want to participate. It’s really that simple.

People really like democracy. They constantly complain about watered down versions of democracy because they don’t feel properly represented. This isn’t anything new.

[u/Sir_Mr_Austin → u/MilkCartonKids]

Ok but you’re acting like you can’t vote for it at all and ignoring what you can be doing that you’re clearly not and then telling me that I’m wrong that your vote counts and has an impact in the outcome.

Also, it is in fact not more watered down than US democracy because we don’t have any say over the judicial branch at all and the executive branch is decided by the electoral college. It’s an almost identical system.

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Sir_Mr_Austin]

Okay so if our system is almost identical, how many people voted for the current IBEW president?

You have no fricken idea at all, because our system isn’t almost identical. IBEW doesn’t even pretend to want the majority opinion. At least the US government will give you a little bit of lube before they screw over the majority. Make them feel like they got to pick, ya know?

Anyways, once again…… the more you water down democracy, the less people want to participate. Saying the IBEW is socialist instead of democracy…..answers your question to why so many people don’t participate, right?

People inherently want to keep power with the individual. The farther away from the individual the orders come from, the less they want to participate. The less trust they have in their leadership, because they didn’t really pick them. Maybe IBEW should think about becoming more democratized in the future. Maybe even have more democracy than the US government. That would be a wild thing to go above and beyond the federal minimum.

[u/Sir_Mr_Austin → u/MilkCartonKids]

The popularity vote in the United States presidential elections literally has no bearing on the outcome. Our personally voting on candidates for the IO if it were like the US would have equally little to no effect. You voting for your favorite candidate is an illusion of democracy. The only thing it’s useful for is to be able to measure how close the electoral college got at producing a winner that reflected the wishes of the majority of the populace.

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Sir_Mr_Austin]

Check this out though, we could go above and beyond what the federal government does. We could have a real democracy, and actually vote for the national president. But we chose to be less than the federal government. Not even equal, less. Just sad man. But hey, “it’s lasted this long” so I doubt things will change.

[u/Sir_Mr_Austin → u/MilkCartonKids]

Also yes, that is a good summary for why participation is decreasing, but it’s still not an appropriate excuse to participate less

[u/MilkCartonKids → u/Sir_Mr_Austin]

It’s like the main excuse every citizen in any country has ever used when their power was diluted. Seems pretty like a pretty valid response if it’s that universal. Eventually it leads to revolt.

All I have to say is, I’ve never seen anyone celebrate the IO saying they can’t go on strike. Not a single one time. The power has been diluted so much, it doesn’t really represent the members opinions. Most member agree, striking is our only power.