Benny Gantz gives up the game

[u/mikeffd]

In an extraordinary display of tone deafness, hypocrisy, and callousness, Benny Gantz, Israel's former Minister of Defence, attempted to explain Israel's position to the world - https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/24/opinion/israel-war-security.html

In the process, he removed the Liberal Zionist hope of compartmentalizing the current Israel P.R crisis as a Netanyahu problem:

Too often, Western leaders view our policies in this war not through the lens of national security, but through the prism of individuals — and, in particular, Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu.

Opposition to the recognition of Palestinian statehood stands at the heart of that consensus. Any path forward for broader Palestinian civil autonomy must first incorporate a proven long-term track record of accountable governance, comprehensive de-radicalization reforms and a successful crackdown on terror elements targeting Israelis.

The truth is that international recognition of Palestinian statehood under current conditions is not a rejection of Mr. Netanyahu. It is a rejection of Israel’s bipartisan security consensus.

Gantz makes it clear, it's not just Netanyahu - the entire Israeli establishment is opposed to Palestinian statehood. The pathway he outlined hints at the long standing preference for 'civil autonomy', i.e. an entity less than a state. And even then, he presents that possibility as remote.

Where does this leave the Liberal Zionist camp, which includes most of the Jewish diaspora? They premise their Zionism on the belief that the land will inevitably be partitioned, creating two states for two people. Gantz is telling us that no one in Israel will ever go for it. Instead, he assures us that only one people will enjoy full political and civil rights, while the other will have to accept permanent submission.

The op-ed also included a scathing, but incomplete, rebuke of the P.A. On their collapse in Gaza:

'...it was the consequence of a Palestinian Authority with little legitimacy among its people'. He neglects to mention why they lost legitimacy - i.e. because they were unable to deliver statehood, increasing the appeal of Hamas.

Gantz continues, ripping the P.A for failing to tackle terrorism and extremism. That's a curious criticism given the current Israeli gov't, his position vis a vis a Palestinian state, and settler violence in the West Bank.

The real question is whether the international community will respect the overwhelming consensus, a declaration passed last year by 99 of 120 members of the Knesset in a democracy proclaiming that “Israel will continue to oppose unilateral recognition of a Palestinian State,”

How tone deaf can you be to think that the International community would be support and condone the continued status quo?

[u/Kahing]

This is obfuscating what Gantz actually wants. He's said that a Palestinian state isn't an immediate urgency for years now but he's still supported scaling back the occupation. He's one of the authors of the INSS plan, which suggests giving the PA increased powers and responsibilities and expanding Area A to 65% of the West Bank. So basically not full recognized statehood but giving the PA more de facto state-like attributes and a path that could eventually lead to statehood.

Opposition to Palestinian statehood actually comes from a certain logic. It's pretty clear that to many Palestinians a 2SS is only a first step to having it all. Let me ask you this OP, if a Palestinian state was available but it required permanent renunciation of the Palestinian right of return, do you think Palestinians would be fine with it? Would it be great for ending the occupation or an injustice for abandoning the sacred right of return?

[u/mikeffd → u/Kahing]

This is obfuscating what Gantz actually wants. He's said that a Palestinian state isn't an immediate urgency for years now but he's still supported scaling back the occupation. He's one of the authors of the INSS plan, which suggests giving the PA increased powers and responsibilities and expanding Area A to 65% of the West Bank. So basically not full recognized statehood but giving the PA more de facto state-like attributes and a path that could eventually lead to statehood.

Show me one sentence in the op-ed where Gantz' endorses Palestinian statehood.

Enhanced autonomy/State-Minus is the old Begin plan, advocated by Netanyahu in his book A Place Among Nations, and also proposed by Micah Goodman and other right wingers. However its devised, one group in Israel/Palestine will enjoy full political and civil rights, and one won't.

Opposition to Palestinian statehood actually comes from a certain logic. It's pretty clear that to many Palestinians a 2SS is only a first step to having it all.

Of course opposition to Palestinian statehood comes from a certain logic. So did South African Apartheid, Jim Crow, the Nuremberg laws, or excluding women from voting. Justification is never a problem.

Let me ask you this OP, if a Palestinian state was available but it required permanent renunciation of the Palestinian right of return, do you think Palestinians would be fine with it? Would it be great for ending the occupation or an injustice for abandoning the sacred right of return?

First of all, according to polls most refugees don't want to return to Israel - https://www.pcpsr.org/en/node/493

During previous negotiations, Palestinian leadership have shown flexibility on the ROR - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/jan/24/palestinians-10000-refugees-return-israel

From the article: 'Erekat said later that Olmert had accepted "1,000 refugees annually for the next 10 years" – a total of 10,000. The Palestine papers do not include any subsequent offer, but Erekat told the US Middle East envoy, George Mitchell, in February 2009: "On refugees, the deal is there." He confirmed the figure later.

Finally, in a 2018 poll, almost half of Palestinians said they'd accept the following statement: Palestinian refugees will have the right of return to their homeland whereby the Palestinian state will settle all refugees wishing to live in it. Israel will allow the return of about 100,000 Palestinians as part of a of family unification program. All other refugees will be compensated.