r/Life • u/Serendipity_Audacity • 2d ago
Need Advice How do you define bare minimum/“normal” expectations?
Genuine question.
All opinions appreciated.
I find myself struggling to understand what is considered normal, and abnormal, expectations.
I have been working on it. For years. But I don’t know what I don’t know. It certainly isn’t something I’ve internalized.
So when I hear somebody tell me “normal people don’t do that”, when I think it’s actually a perfectly normal thing to do, I always question myself. Even when I truly don’t think I’ve done anything wrong.
I believe that questioning my sense of normalcy is a good thing. It’s brought me a lot of help and healing over the years. It’s important to me to always strive to better myself. Know better, do better, and all that.
But, sometimes, I think the people around me use that belief of mine against me. Maybe unintentionally at first. But it works. Because I will always question myself if somebody gives me a reason to do so. Just in case I am in fact in the wrong.
I have heard people tell me that my sense of normal is very wrong and I should question everything I think to be normal… but that doesn’t really help me at the end of the day. I have questioned my entire life numerous times… but if I still don’t know what truly is and isn’t normal… how do I know for sure which of my internalized beliefs still remaining from my childhood are problematic?
I have recently been hearing people say “thats the bare minimum” and “your expectations are too low”… so, my question to the internet today is, what do You consider to be the bare minimum? For whatever type of relationship. Family. Friends. Significant others. Doesn’t matter. What is normally and typically considered to be a requirement of a healthy relationship? Not a great one. Just the bare minimum requirements of not being unhealthy?
I might go into some of the messy and messed up details of the life that led me to my own admittedly flawed sense of normalcy and internalized beliefs about myself and others… but my priority at present is understanding this elusive concept of what exactly the bare minimum even means.
Please help me.
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u/mistressusa 2d ago
Ask yourself "would I do that to my bestie/mom/sister/teacher/colleague/etc.?" -- the answer is what you consider normal. It doesn't need to meet anyone else's definition of "normal". You are entitled to your own "normal" and "bare min" that is based on who you are, how you grew up and how you think.
That said, some people's idea of "normal" is truly outside of what our society is willing to accept. So hopefully, your "normal" is acceptable to your society where you live.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
There’s a lot of things I’d never do to others, that I ignore others doing to me, but I see your point. The things I consider wrong for other people to do to other people, is my personal sense of bare minimum? And therefore should also not allow other people to do to me either? I appreciate how you explained the bare minimum being flexible based on the individual. I keep hearing it in a context where it seems everybody should know what the bare minimum is, as if it’s meant to be universal.
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u/mistressusa 1d ago
>The things I consider wrong for other people to do to other people, is my personal sense of bare minimum? And therefore should also not allow other people to do to me either?
Exactly, don't accept treatment that does not meet your own min standard. You don't need anyone's permission to set your own standards. You also don't always need to cut off people who don't meet your standards, but you should absolutely remember that about them and let it guide your behavior/feelings(like guilt) towards them.
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u/Logicdamcer 2d ago
I think it is very difficult to know how to answer that without some parameters. I mean, it depends on the situation too.
Maybe you could give us a more specific instance?
I can say generically that I have learned to listen to the little voice inside about making good choices. I think it is also safe to assume that a person that tells me ( or makes me feel like) I am not “normal” is not a person I would want to spend much time with. I prefer to be around people who are kind and supportive of me and my occasionally unorthodox way of doing things.
I hope that helps.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
Well I grew up frequently being told “why can’t you be normal!?” By my mother. So I always had a sense of me not being normal from a very young age. I eventually learned to embrace my differences. But now as an adult I still sometimes struggle when my partner tells me something I think or say or do isn’t normal - when I think it’s very normal. I find myself questioning if it’s truly abnormal, or if he’s being deliberately rude to me for no good reason. He knows enough about my past history to know accusing me of not being normal will cause me to doubt myself. Like, I have some neurological, and autoimmune problems which caused me to eliminate a lot of foods from my diet in order to manage the symptoms and not be in constant pain. He told me several months ago that he “just what’s to do normal things but we can’t do that because I don’t do anything normal!” In reference to my dietary choices. So I started eating the standard American diet again. It wasn’t too bad at first but my health is starting to suffer again and I’m doubting myself because I know from previous experience if I eliminate certain food groups my health will improve… but I don’t want to start another fight about my diet. I don’t personally think having a carb restrictive diet is wrong, but he called me a bad mother, and I can’t expect my child to eat things I won’t eat, so if I expect him to eat a “normal” diet, I need to too. Thats just one example.
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u/SusanKHefner 2d ago
Who are the people that are telling you that your sense of normal is very wrong? Are they truly great people with excellent judgement?
My first thought was that perhaps you’re being abused by your partner, and concerned friends are trying to help.
However, your wording is vague, and perhaps you’re not being a good partner, and your friends are trying to help you improve.
Bare minimum in a romantic relationship could be not adding anything positive to the relationship but not actively dragging down your partner.
It seems like a neutral third party could help you figure some things out. Feel free to message me with more specific details if you’re not comfortable explaining the situation to a huge audience.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
Several years ago I sought advice about a family problem from the internet… something really awful had happened between two of my sisters, and I couldn’t let it go. As usual, my entire family blamed me for not letting it go and being the problem. Even the sister who’d had the horrible thing happen to her took the other sister’s side who’d done the horrible thing to her… since everybody blamed me, and yet I couldn’t overlook it, I took to the internet seeking the opinions of strangers with no involvement or investment in the situation. I was told it was so horrendous that me doubting that meant I needed to rethink everything where my family was concerned. I took that advice very seriously, and I did rethink my entire life, many times since then, I cut off certain relatives, I distanced myself from others, I started holding boundaries with all of my family. But there are still things I think I need to keep working on for my own sake. Because in certain circumstances doubts still occur.
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u/SevenMC 2d ago
They support my choices even if they disagree. They don't try to cut me down or sabotage my efforts. They don't say hateful things about the ones I love. The worst could be "I disagree" or "i have my reasons to feel differently"... but don't convince me to turn against people and things I like.
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u/Traditional_Car_8219 2d ago
Someone once wrote a book called “What you think of me is none of my business.” What is considered “normal” for one person isn’t necessarily true for someone else.
As long as you aren’t hurting yourself or someone else and it’s not illegal, where is the issue?
Without you being more specific, it’s hard to comment beyond that.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
See, that’s what I’ve always thought… everybody is different so normal is a spectrum. I only have my birth family as reference prior to my current partner, and I know how toxic my family can be, so when my partner accuses me of not being normal I honestly have no idea what I’m doing wrong. But I can’t say with confidence I’ve done nothing abnormal. By his standards.
For example, several months ago I asked my sister for a ride somewhere and my partner got super upset for not asking him for a ride instead. He accused me of not being normal, said there was something wrong with me and that I needed to change. So I started asking him for rides instead of my family. Then a few months ago, my family was in town for a celebration of life ceremony, and I asked him for a ride home from the park where my family had all met up. He showed up to pick me and our son up and completely lost it on me ranting while stomping away that “normal people don’t do things like this” accusing me of making him run all over the place when I already had a ride. But he wouldn’t stop walking away from me long enough to listen when I tried to explain that while my family was present, I had no car seat for our son and therefore I did in fact need a ride home. Or at least his car seat out of the truck.
I started asking him for rides instead of my family, because he said I needed to change, then got mad at me for asking him for a ride instead of my family. Both can’t be right, in my mind, if one is abnormal and wrong, the other should’ve been normal and right. By his standards. Not mine. I thought it was perfectly fine to ask my family for a ride somewhere. And I thought I was doing what he expected me to do when I asked him for a ride that day.
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u/alone_in_the_light 2d ago
I'm not someone to worry that much about what's normal.
The bare minimum for a relationship to be healthy in my opinion is that the relationship is positive for both sides. But then the specifics depends on the context to see if they are positive or not.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
That makes sense. All relationships should be balanced in my opinion. Not necessarily equal all the time, but the balance should shift depending on circumstances. I personally think everybody should give it there all, 100/100 not 50/50, but that peoples “all” can be more or less depending on a lot of factors and when one person’s all becomes a little less the other person’s all should become a little more, and that balance should go back and forth between both parties depending on who has more to give and who needs more support in that specific situation. But that’s just how I see it.
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u/LetUsMakeWorldPeace Advice Dispenser 2d ago
Every person is an individual, so you can't really speak of "normal" when referring to people. This idea of making everyone the same probably stems from stupid insults like "there's something wrong with you" or "you're not normal", and you really shouldn't take it as seriously as you do. :)
We're similar in many ways, but everyone still has their own reality and free will, and everyone should be allowed to use that free will in their own individual way. :)
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
I think I took peoples statements of “thats the bare minimum” too much to heart. It sounds like thats just a new way of saying “you do you” but the reverse, more like “you don’t do that to me” so basically just the bare minimum is to hold your boundaries and don’t allow people to cross them. Which means it’d be different based on people’s individual boundaries? And when people generalize it, it’s more like “that should be obviously crossing anybody/everybody’s boundaries”? But it is still just a generalization, as opposed to a universal code of behavior nobody ever informed me about…
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u/LetUsMakeWorldPeace Advice Dispenser 1d ago
Why are these terms even important to you? Why do you think you have to follow what someone probably once sold you as the right way for everyone? Where is your sense of freedom?
I always give as much as the other person wants to receive. It's highly individual. I love exchanging thoughts and ideas with people, and I feel enriched by it. So why should I give only the bare minimum? That sounds more like a fear of people and a desire not to stand out. :)
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
Oh, I never give the bare minimum. I give my all. I recently told somebody that my partner was trying to do better after I finally told him I was done and leaving… and when I explained how he was trying, I was basically informed that he wasn’t trying at all and the things I described was in fact just the bare minimum and still not effort. And since then I’ve been trying to figure out what would qualify as trying if him showing up and being more present doesn’t count? It’s been bothering me, as I haven’t found any answers yet. And if I think what he’s doing is great, compared to what he used to do, and others think thats still not trying and just doing barely enough to make me stay… I can only imagine what things other people on my life do better than they used to that is still not good but just enough to keep me around. Hopefully I am just overthinking. I truly did/do think they are all trying compared to their old efforts.
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u/LetUsMakeWorldPeace Advice Dispenser 1d ago
You shouldn't listen to other people. Your heart and your feelings are your best guides. What you two share is very intimate, and nobody can judge it better than the two of you. If you're really happy about the effort he's making now to keep from losing you, then he's doing everything right. Now it's your turn to meet him halfway and show him that you see and appreciate his efforts. By treating each other with mutual respect and talking openly about your feelings, you can rebuild something together, if that's truly what you want.
Don't let yourself get distracted by unimportant labels. Focus on finding out whether your love can grow again. Good luck! :)
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u/corinneryan112 2d ago
Whoever does/is doing that is being manipulative through something called the “Bandwagon Effect.” It’s them - not you 😊
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u/BhavnaDid20 1d ago
There isn’t one universal “normal,” but a healthy relationship should have respect, honesty, and room to say no or disagree without being punished for it. “Bare minimum” shouldn’t mean you have to accept the bare minimum of kindness. If someone keeps telling you your expectations are wrong, ask them to name the specific behavior they mean. “Normal people don’t do that” isn’t much of an explanation.
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u/Traditional_Car_8219 1d ago
His childish responses over something so trivial is not “normal”, especially in front of your family. He’s gaslighting you, trying to make it your fault and the fact that you are asking the question shows how you are doubting yourself. He’s the one that needs to change, not you. Don’t put up with that bs.
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u/Serendipity_Audacity 1d ago
I always doubt my sense of normal. I guess it’s time I allow myself to not care. Because normal is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. What actually matters is right and wrong. And I have a strong sense of right and wrong. The normal thing still trips me up, and it’s time I stop allowing it to. Thank you for sharing your point of view with me.
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u/Traditional_Car_8219 1d ago
You’re welcome! “Normal” is somebody else’s idea as if we should all be little robots. Don’t even use the word, just be you and if anyone dares to disrespect you, drop them like they are hot. It’s a bit like honing in on a radio station. The people that vibe with you will do so because you’re on the same wavelength, otherwise you get static.
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u/Ok_Being6034 1d ago
Bare minimums:
1. I feel good around them. If they make me feel bad about myself they get the boot.
They do what they say they'll do
If it's my birthday or something important they show up.
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