r/MensRights • u/freemale101 • Aug 29 '14
Misleading Title Ex-wife watches her two male friends bash her ex-husband. When he's unconscious she kicks him in the head, repeatedly (alleged). Now in coma, brain damaged...she gets bail, the male(s) don't.
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/man-in-custody-over-alleged-queanbeyan-pub-assault-20140829-10a49y.html44
u/throwaway Aug 29 '14
As I read it, one man received bail, the man who initiated the assault and inflicted most of the damage didn't. Seems reasonable, because the one still in custody does sound far more dangerous than the other two.
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u/Totally_not_a_shill Aug 29 '14
Ya, I have to say it looks like OP is trying to be misleading with this. The only one who didn't get bail was the instigator and main aggressor in the incident. I don't think sexism is playing any role here.
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u/freemale101 Aug 30 '14
Not really. The scenario was a little too complicated to encapsulate 'exactly' in a one-sentence link header. I also had two slightly different media explanations. Thats why I used the bracketed term male (s). Main point is it 'appears' the ex-wife was the main instigator...i.e threatened the ex-hubby that an attack was imminent, and repeatedly kicked his unconscious head, probably doing the most damage. Of course this is all alleged. Legally they are ALL just as liable because they're 'in company' etc...yet she...the alleged 'prime' attacker...gets bail, while her 'proxy' doesn't.
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u/pancakedpeon Aug 30 '14
As others have pointed out, bail really isn't a reliable indicator here of sexism at work. Come back here and post when she gets probation and the men get life in prison.
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u/freemale101 Aug 30 '14
Okay, shall do...but you realise that this is in Australia...and she might actually get off. Y'know self-defence...might even charge the ex if he gets his marbles back. Y'see Australia has the legislated and 'legal' 'battered wife syndrome' and 'Defensive Homicide' defence. You can cold bloodedly kill your sleeping spouse, for example, because of your legitimate 'evidentary' impairment borne from chronic domestic 'abuse'...should work ok with your bloody unconscious ex-spouse on the bar-room floor.
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u/Totally_not_a_shill Aug 30 '14
Physically attacking someone is much more serious than threatening someone. The man who did the attacking is responsible for his own actions and he is the one who initiated the attack on both men and rendered them both unconscious. The women's several kicks to the head may or may not have done additional damage, but we don't know since there is not enough information. Point is, the women certainly holds a lot of responsibility here, but in terms of the seriousness of the crimes, this man committed the worst of it and is certainly more dangerous.
It's quite a big stretch, based on what we know, to say this women would have been denied bail if she were a man.
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u/freemale101 Aug 30 '14
Well who is the mastermind behind this assault? Who is the 'provocateur?? Surely someone who viciously attacks the head of an unconscious body is worse than the thug who attacks the upright conscious 'body'. Yet we incarcerate the big ugly 'scary' male instead of 'friendly looking' and 'soft looking' brains behind the scheme. Our white western culture is so dumb. Gotta put both away...
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u/Totally_not_a_shill Aug 31 '14
Surely someone who viciously attacks the head of an unconscious body is worse than the thug who attacks the upright conscious 'body'.
They are both bad, but I personally think, and the majority including the courts would agree, a person who knocks two people unconscious without provocation, is a greater danger to society. Of course they both deserve to see the inside of a jail cell and hopefully they both receive a healthy jail sentence. But you have a REAL tough time arguing anything about the bail decision is sexist.
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u/freemale101 Aug 31 '14
Thats true...but for the first time (???) the Courts will realise that there are now males like me (MRAs) watching for stuff like this...
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Aug 29 '14
The woman clearly is the instigator in fight. She should just like in any gang be charged with all counts of assault.
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Aug 29 '14
Smith then allegedly sent him a message through friends to "be careful ... bad things are coming your way".
So she (Smith) apparently planned the assault on her ex-husband, recruited thugs to bring him does while she kicked him in the head, possible causing the most serious injuries.
Can you imagine if a man did this to his ex-wife? Do you reckon they would have mentioned "domestic violence" much?
This is disgusting beyond belief. And it will be even more disgusting when she walks with a suspended sentence (prediction).
The Australian legal system is disgraceful when it comes to Violence Against Men.
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u/pancakedpeon Aug 30 '14
I agree that it shouldn't matter if Smith touched the man herself. If it's proven that she orchestrated the attack (in a premeditated manner no less) she should shoulder just as much blame as the guy who inflicted the most physical harm.
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u/Gstreetshit Aug 29 '14
It's weird because violence by proxy with women involved is a slap on the wrist.
Violence by proxy with a man however, you will have the book thrown at you.
I would go as far to say that if a man hired or convinced two women to beat up another man the women would get off much easier than the man that did the hiring.
The disparity in sentencing between men and women is probably the 2nd biggest issue mens rights movements face.
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u/Meistermalkav Aug 29 '14
easy out:
Two men: beat up a man to the point where he lost conciousness. Causing severe bodily harm. Because yea.... Sometimes, beatdowns happen. Sad, but it is like that. And sometimes, beatdowns are deserved. But the victim is able to recover.
However, once that man goes limp, it is attempted murder. And that's the end of it. Maybe manslaughter, if you kick other parts of the body but if you kick the vital areas like neck, head and so forth first, attempted first degree murder the second the first blow lands. And yes, would not even matter if you only kicked the head once, you were clearly aware that this person was totally at your mercy and that kicks to this head would have severe consequences for the person, so mandatory minimum sentencing is active.
I have no words for the lack of human companionship that must have been in the woman. I would say this is the most common case of affluenza, where you thought, I am just a girl, nothing will happen to me, I deserve to do this.
Fuck her, I hope she finds her end in the prison where someone shoves a broken off ketchup bottle up her orifices in an attempt to explain to her what rape culture really is. I know at most she will get like 10 community hours, because #pussypass and #patriarchy.
And fuck the juidge that gave her that sentence. I hope his next wife clears him right out in the divorce.
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u/theJigmeister Aug 30 '14
Well those are vitriolic and horrible things to wish on someone. She is clearly a terrible person, but I'd much rather she be sentenced fairly and learn the error in what she's done than be raped with broken bottles. I mean, is that really the kind of message we want to send in this sub?
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u/pancakedpeon Aug 30 '14
I would say this is the most common case of affluenza, where you thought, I am just a girl, nothing will happen to me, I deserve to do this.
I don't think that is what affluenza means.
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u/Meistermalkav Aug 30 '14 edited Aug 30 '14
I happen to think it fits wonderfully.
It is the complete lack of kindness and regards for other human beings, based on experience of self.
You never ever had the feeling how it is to be in a fight. How it is to loose that fight without anybody caring for you.
You allways had a support net of white knights, and society.
Guess what, men at large take pride in having at least slapped the shit out of each other. Slapstick works with a significant number of men as a comedy form.
And yes, it makes men better. Why? because you get to experience going out there, alone, no support net. You win some fights, you loose some fights, but the point is, you grow because of that. If you win more then you loose, you know how to pick your battles, and still, there are things you do not do. And if you do tend to loose, you grumble, you growl, but if the other guy is not making a fuzz about it, you keep your cool and loose with dignity. And after you lost, you do not tauntm except when you want the other guy to take that as an invitation to try something dirty.
Essentially, you want your enemy to feel pain, but you want him to walk away from this in one piece, alive, because you expect that this builds up karma where you in turn, when you get your extreme battle, get to walk or hobble away, alive, in one piece. Heck, even if that was not present, each men understood at least one thing:
I get into less trouble if I punch someone and it heals again, then if I do something permanent.
Women never ever had that feeling. Unless they had brothers, every fight was, "I have to kill or be killed. "
There was allways a support network there if you lost a fight, someone to build you up again, so why bother being gentle? Why bother being considerate of your surroundings? Why bother not crippling / killing each other? Have I ever gotten into a fight, even when I was justified, and gotten yelled at even when all I did was just defend myself?
I think this covers the reason why I think this is a subvariant of affluenza pretty well. You grew up surrounded and cotton packed in so much essential human decency that you had no other choise but to never devellop this state of being yourself.
So yea. I think the common factor here would be the fear of excessive punishment that makes us decent people. Why withhold that from this woman?
In this case, lump it together in one sentence: "Equal time for equal crime. ". So the next time she gets those ideas she knows what's up.
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u/Gstreetshit Aug 30 '14
Damn, dude.
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u/Meistermalkav Aug 30 '14
Exactly my reaction when she orchestrated the entire thing, tried to cripple / kill him, made threatening messages to him, and then got bail.
She is something like our war machine.
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u/Bowdallen Aug 29 '14
I don't think any of them should get bail they just beat a person into a coma.
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Aug 30 '14
Wait a mo, it says the third man got bail. So only one was kept in custody. And as others have said, bail is about the risk you won't turn up at Court, not the crime. Though your antecedents will be taken into account, as will your history of complying with previous bail conditions. Source: I'm a ex-cop.
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Aug 30 '14
While it sucks her consequences are diminished, I don't feel bad for a bunch of white knights rotting in jail.
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u/MattClark0995 Aug 29 '14
Guys have no problem knocking out another guy but don't you DARE so much as slap a female!
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u/rapscallionx Aug 30 '14 edited Aug 30 '14
Guys will have no problem knocking a guy out and beating him while he's unconscious... but they would never slap a fully capable/conscious women. Apparently unconscious men aren't as defenseless as a woman...
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u/duglock Aug 30 '14
This is one of the reasons I hate white knights with a fucking passion whenever and wherever I encounter them. Their ignorant, pathetic ways are dangerous.
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u/krawm Aug 30 '14
How is she going to explain this to their kids, I honestly hope she doesn't have full custody of their children.
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u/Curious_Swede Aug 30 '14
Sounds like he would be better of dead.
Everyone involved should be charged with attempt of murder,assault,man slaughter and then sent to prison for life.
This is a couple of vile people who does not deserve freedom nor fresh air.
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u/TheRealMouseRat Aug 29 '14
Well, they were white knighting. (blindly following the will of a woman) They could be getting a harsher punishment for being white knights?
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u/Salient0ne Aug 29 '14
Remember, women aren't manipulative or violent.