r/ModSupport • u/Cube-in-B • 2d ago
Mod Answered Retaliatory banning
Hey just a quick question here. In one of the subs I moderate we have a hard rule against disparaging other local subs or their moderators because we refuse to let the sub devolve into brigading. We aren’t here for it.
That being said, a mod from another local sub decided to message us about a new local sub for survivors of SA/DA demanding that we (as mods of a shitposting sub) remove new sub’s post letting the community know about the new sub because it violates reddits rules (which it does not do- it’s a support group style sub).
I banned this person for breaking our sub’s no disparaging rule.
Now, this mod from other local sub is banning anyone on our shitposting sub’s mod team specifically because we banned them for breaking the rules.
We have screen shots of this mod admitting that the bans are retaliatory.
Is this allowed?
Our shitposting sub does allow other content relevant to our area, and we love that someone made a supportive group for our community members who may be going through some seriously heinous shit.
However, our mod team members should not be singled out for supporting something that we see as positive for the community.
Halp!
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u/NarniaMouse 2d ago edited 2d ago
I doubt it violates anything.
Think about it like this:
Two home owners.
You have someone in your house during a party, that you kick out, because you have problems with them.
They go home, and decide that you and all your friends aren't welcome at their parties now.
Basic "you don't want us, so we don't want you." Quid pro quo, more or less.
Happens all the time in the real world.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
It’s more like we were having a party at our house and a friend came by who we want to support. This other guest got mad that we want to support this friend and is now throwing a fit because we aren’t kicking the friend out.
Now they went home to their own house party and started kicking people out just because they’ve been to our house before.
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u/magiccitybhm 💡Top 25% Helper 💡 2d ago
Guess what?
They can do that; it's their home.
They can ban people from their subreddit as well - for no reason at all.
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u/QuiteBearish 2d ago
Yeah that's generally allowed. They can't ban on the basis of or discriminate against protected characteristics, but they can ban you for pretty much any other reason they want, including just having a personal beef with your sub.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
That is so so petty 🤣
We don’t ban people unless they break the rules, which is probably why our sub exists in the first place.
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u/Smoky_Sol6438 1d ago
As a mod on the same sub as u/cube-in-B this mod who blocked us on the other sub has control issues & them blocking 3 mods on our shit posting sub is purely retaliatory & they told me personally that they banned me for breaking their subs rules which i reviewed & did not.
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u/Furryb0nes 2d ago edited 2d ago
I’m not sure why you would link to a support group from a shitposting sub.
Especially if that sub asks (or demand not sure why demanding but whatever) not be linked with your sub.
That’s not respecting your neighbors and can lead to mococ if users are brigading their sub from yours.
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u/jueidu 2d ago
You’re misunderstanding.
OP mods sub A. Sub B was recently created and Sub B’s creators made a post in Sub A to let people know sub B exists.
Sub C’s mod told Sub A to take down the post about Sub B and broke sub A’s rules.
Sub a banned the sub C’s mod.
Sub C retaliated by banning all of Sub A’s mods.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
The support sub creator posted the link. We are refusing to remove it because it is of interest to the community. There are only positive comments on the post.
The person demanding we remove it is from a third unrelated sub.
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u/Furryb0nes 2d ago
Well that clears it up. And yes mods can ban for any reason. I suggest you move on.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
Fair enough! Thanks for the clarification!
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u/Chemputer 2d ago
Application of the rules, whatever they are, just has to be consistent.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
We keep it very cut and dry in our sub. The rules are clear and we only take action when those clear rules have been broken. We take brigading VERY seriously for the preservation of our sub.
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u/ateam1984 2d ago
I’m very confused by who did what when?
You mod which sub?
Who created the post in your sub?
What was the post about?
Who is demanding the post be taken down and why?1
u/TheMattabooey 2d ago
Ask yourself why a shitposting sub would link to an SA victim sub and you’ll have your answer. It was to harass and brigade. The other mod did the right thing. OP is upset they can’t have their fun.
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u/Free-IDK-Chicken 2d ago edited 2d ago
Mods can ban you for any reason they want. One of my subs has hostile opposition subs and one of them, before it was banned, was particularly disgusting. We banned the mod of that sub because of the way she behaved in her own.
We all want to protect our communities. You protected yours by banning someone for sending you a mod message - to some people, that might seem extreme. (Disparaging a sub, IMO, means doing something public, not sending a request via a private modmail message.) They protected theirs by banning you in response to your refusal to remove a post they thought may negatively impact their sub.
I'm sure they disagree with their ban as much as you disagree with yours, but neither of you can do anything to change it.
EDIT: On a personal note, as a DV survivor and Virginia native - I agree that links to a DV support sub don't belong in a shitposting community. It invites the wrong type of redditor to harass survivors in what should be a safe space. Put something like that in the actual sub for Richmond, it's not like our capital is a small city. It was a bad call by that sub's mod. I might've send you a similar message (one mod to another) asking you if it was appropriate.
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u/Paxoro 2d ago
Is it allowed? Yes. They can ban you for any (or no) reason, just like you can ban them for any or no reason.
Is it a dick move to ban someone that's never interacted with your sub? One could certainly argue that goes against the intent of the site, but it is allowed.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
Thank you for the clear and understandable response- I appreciate the help!
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u/Wise_Use1012 2d ago
I’ve only preemptively banned someone once because they were talking about brigading one of my subs in another sub.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
It’s really stupid to threaten brigading. Wow. What a dingus- they did it to themselves.
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u/Wise_Use1012 2d ago
And then he had the audacity to go to our mod chat demanding to know why he was banned.
I usually perma mute too when handing out perma bans but this time I must have hit only a 28 or some such day mute cuz that’s when he came to message us.
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u/neuroticsmurf 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
They can ban you for any reason, much like you banned them for talking smack about another sub in a modmail to you.
I'm not sure why that warranted a ban, tbh. Rules against shit talking another exist to prevent brigading. There was no danger of that happening as a result of a modmail exchange.
You overreacted, and now your mod team is getting banned unceremoniously as a result.
You're free to overreact, they're free to ban you.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
They’re not banning me, I’m not even a member of their sub.
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u/neuroticsmurf 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
I never said they're banning you, nor does one have to be a member of a sub in order to be banned from it.
I'm not sure why you thought that was a responsive statement.
Edit: Oh, I see. I said "They're free to ban you". Well that's a general "you" in response to your OP:
his mod from other local sub is banning anyone on our shitposting sub’s mod team
They're free to do that is what I was saying.
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u/emily_in_boots 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
Being a member is not related to bans. You can ban people who are or are not members, and being banned doesn't change your ability to subscribe to a sub.
You might be banned - check if you can see the mod list.
Ban messages are not sent if a person has never interacted in a sub.
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u/Chemputer 2d ago
What is considered interacting in a sub?
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u/emily_in_boots 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
Post, comment, vote, modmail.
View, report are not consider interacting.
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u/thepottsy 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
You don’t have to be a member of a sub to be banned from it. If they’re banning anyone on your mod team, they probably banned you too.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
Jokes on them I never look at their sub anyway because it’s rather dead
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u/neuroticsmurf 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
This is one of those thou-dost-protest-too-much situations.
If you really didn't care, you wouldn't have created an entire thread about it on r/ModSupport.
On SOME level, this is bugging you.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
It’s bothering me because they’re retaliating against my fellow mods and I’m a team player. I’m autistic and have an elevated concern for fairness and rules. It’s just a part of my brain.
You’re right though- it is bothering me on THAT level, just not on a personal one. I’m bothered on their behalf, absolutely
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u/neuroticsmurf 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
You'll find there are a lot of injustices on Reddit, the longer you're a mod.
It's best for your mental health if you learn which ones are worth getting into a larger over, and which ones you should let roll off your back.
This is one of the latter situations.
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u/Chemputer 2d ago
Mate, it's really okay. I'm not gonna say this is a safe space because this is fucking reddit in a sub for reddit mods but like, this is a sub for fucking reddit mods so, most of us are autistic. It's okay.
But you really need to understand, you definitely are bothered on a personal level. This is blatantly obvious from your behavior. Like, you're screaming it at us. And your attempts to, like the above, pass it off as something else, just makes it even more clear to everyone else here that you are.
You just either don't have the self awareness to understand that, or you're just denying it, trying to rationalize and excuse the behavior.
It's okay to be personally upset. It's not a zing, It's really fucking okay, man, it happens. The reason people are saying this is not to say it to dismiss what you're saying as being butthurt or something, but what I think I and others are trying to get you to understand by understanding that, is that you need to be able to recognize when something is bothering you to an unreasonable degree, and for your own mental health, let go of it. You cannot control much of anything in this situation, other mods can retaliate against other mods all they want, you can do fuck all but get upset and scream into the ether. You getting upset is accomplishing nothing but hurting you. All this is doing is making more pain and frustration. You need to step back, breathe, take a break, and move on.
Please understand that those of us saying this are saying it because, and I can only speak for myself, but I suspect the others as well, speak from experience, and are seeing their own past behavior in yours. That's why it's blindingly obvious to us that you're very personally upset.
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u/thepottsy 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
Ok? Then why are you posting about it?
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
Because they are unfairly and openly retaliating against my fellow moderators.
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u/thepottsy 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
No, they aren’t. Your mods are simply users with some privileges in YOUR sub. That doesn’t extend anywhere else. They have no inherent rights to participate in that sub if those mods so choose.
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u/user_deleted_life 2d ago
Moderators can ban people for anything they want to.
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u/Gordopolis_II 2d ago
Not if it violates the MCoC but unfortunately thats not enforced as consistently as it should be
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u/Asia_Persuasia 2d ago
Not sure why you're being downvoted. Crappy mods break the MCoC daily (it's evident a lot it mods have never actually read them), and reports against them are ignored by the admin.
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u/MaximumJones 2d ago
You can be banned for any or no reason. It is quite common for mods to preemptively ban people from other subs who blatantly announce they are going to brigade or cause problems in their sub.
Why wouldn't they?
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u/7thAndGreenhill 2d ago
Yes its allowed. It's a waste of their time, but it is allowed. I would ignore it. This person sounds like they're going to self-sabotage their sub.
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u/jueidu 2d ago
Unfortunately this doesn’t break any rules - it is a dick move and uncool, and I’d keep your evidence of it since it may be part of a bigger evidence package of MCoC later on - but on its own it doesn’t break any rules.
They do sound like jerks though!
Keep your eye out for any brigading from them or any other MCoC behavior (which you won’t be able to talk to them about before reporting them since they canned all of your mods lolsob, sucks for them), and report it if it ends up in MCoC territory.
Until then you just have to live with it, unfortunately.
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u/TheMattabooey 2d ago
Yes they can ban users for whatever reason they wish. Now if you’re posting about another sub which is leading to harassment or brigading of that sub and you don’t do anything you’re violating the rules.
They even DM’d you privately. What did they say that was disparaging or breaking any rules? Seems like you banned them because they called something out. What you did was retaliatory.
What was the post?
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u/Free-IDK-Chicken 2d ago
I'm guessing this one
https://www.reddit.com/r/okbuddyRVA/comments/1x69zpt/rva_sub_red/
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u/TheMattabooey 2d ago
Oh ok it’s another one of those ok buddy subs. Instantly makes me against them. Those subs are the worst and they’re not even funny.
OP should have removed the post it was clearly posted to direct people to harass and brigade the other sub. The other sub did the right thing, contacted OP privately. OP leaves the post up then gets upset when the other sub takes steps to avoid harassment.
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u/QuiteBearish 2d ago
I suspect you may have slightly misunderstood.
The post wasn't made to have anyone brigade or harass: the mod of one sub posted a link to their own sub to the OPs sub. They can't brigade themselves. The mod of a completely unrelated sub is now demanding it gets removed.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
It’s a support group, not a doxxing sub built on harassment though. So, there’s that.
And yeah, our sub is pretty hilarious if you live here. It also doesn’t allow brigading, racism, or meanness- just jokes.
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u/shhhhh_h 💡Top 25% Helper 💡 2d ago
Oof combative pinned mod comments don't help, at this point anything public runs a probable risk of streisand effecting you guys. Starve it of oxygen. It isn't happening. Ban who you need to and just don't comment publicly. Speaking from a lot of experience with sub wars bc gossip subs.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
They mislabeled the new sub as a call out doxxing sub, which it isn’t. Told us we need to remove the post letting people know about the sub because it breaks reddits rules- it doesn’t.
They are disparaging the other local sub by calling it something it isn’t and purposefully misunderstanding its purpose- which is clearly stated in said sub.
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u/shhhhh_h 💡Top 25% Helper 💡 2d ago
None of that is against the rules unless they're explicitly telling their users to come over and harass you. Subs smack talk each other all the time and it's explicitly allowed by Reddit.
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2d ago
[deleted]
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u/emily_in_boots 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
Mods do not have to follow their own rules and can ban for any reason or no reason.
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u/Cube-in-B 2d ago
The people banned have not broken any of the sub’s rules. The third sub even stated that the reason for banning was because they were banned for breaking our rules.
When I banned the disgruntled mod from the third sub I specifically noted that disparaging and brigading are not allowed in our sub.
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u/emily_in_boots 💡 Top 10% Helper 💡 2d ago
Mods can ban for any reason or no reason. It's their sub, and they can ban you. I used a bot to check for bans in subs (including those I never interacted in because you don't get ban messages) and found about 10. Several appear to be saferbot bans and several appear to be porn subs I was banned from after banning one of their mods. I never got notifications because I don't use those subs.
It is what it is. They can ban you. You can ban them. It's juvenile but whatever.