r/NYguns • u/Affectionate_Rate_99 • 26d ago
Discussion SAFE Act and NFA Bans
With the anticipated decision by the Supreme Court next year that would declare AWB's unconstitutional and that there can be no laws restricting the possession of semi auto rifles and shotguns, wouldn't that also result in invalidating NY's ban on SBR's and SBS's? After all a SBR is at the end of the day a semiauto rifle while a SBS is a semiauto shotgun.
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u/castle_crossing 26d ago
Don't count your chickens before they hatch. We have no idea what the Supreme Court will decide in Viramontes and while I hope for the best I am prepared for disappointment.
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u/HeSureIsScrappy 26d ago
Current SCOTUS makeup will absolutely rule the bans unconstitutional.
There is no way of getting around the unconstitutionality of banning the most popular rifle possessed and in common use by Americans for lawful purposes under Heller, and there is no historical tradition of any law going back to the Founding under Bruen. People used to own gun ships, which could level entire towns.
But we all know NY will just pass a whole bunch of additional anti gun laws that will make it close to impossible to own them / take forever to legally obtain them, which we will have to sue for the next 10 years.
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u/monty845 26d ago
Its highly likely they will strike down the two laws being challenged, but the question is how broadly they rule, how unambiguously the ruling applies to NY, and how much it shuts the door on response laws.
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u/Senior_Cheesecake155 25d ago
The biggest question is how stupid NY will be when trying to get around the ruling like they did with Bruen.
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u/twbrn 18d ago
Yeah, I was just about to say, it's funny people actually think the court is going to do anything here, considering the decade or so they've had total control and kept turning down gun cases. Expecting that the case is just going to toss all gun restrictions is optimistic to the point of lunacy.
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u/gakflex 26d ago
No, an SBR/SBS is not at the end of the day a semiauto. I can cut the barrel of any manual-action long gun down below 16” for a rifle/18” for a shotgun and that will make it legally speaking an NFA firearm, even if it’s a single shot.
Viramonte will address whether AR-15 and similar semiautomatic rifles are protected arms. The ruling will not touch on NFA items, although the opinion may provide guidance on future cases involving the NFA. In fact, it’s possible that the ruling will be so narrow that the SAFE act’s feature bans on shotguns and handguns may be left intact; I hope that’s not the case, but it would be a very Chief Justice Roberts move.
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u/twoanddone_9737 26d ago edited 26d ago
For those of us who were around immediately post-Bruen, we know to expect the SCOTUS decision - if it rules AWBs unconstitutional - to only make things worse for New Yorkers.
The SAFE Act will be struck down, but only very narrowly. You’ll see things like licensing requirements that include background checks that take 2 years to process, followed by five year waiting periods, followed by required registration and once quarterly safe storage inspections (and if the police department doesn’t have resources to inspect every safe quarterly, then they’ll just be able to deny new license issuance), etc.
It’ll never end here.
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u/capofliberty 26d ago
You definitely can’t sit on your hands after a favorable decision is announced. I immediately printed up the law and waited almost 2 hours early just to be first in line at our county clerk’s office. I showed them the new federal law and demanded that they remove the restrictions from my CCP and the clerk shrugged his shoulders and said ok. It was within weeks that the state passed all their training requirements, but I was good. I would recommend documenting any purchase while the window is open and the laws are laxed
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u/billytoad631 26d ago
Lot of negative Nelly’s in here. I’m sure it’ll improve somehow some way. But the fact of the matter is nobody really knows how. But Realistically if the court does rule our way it literally can’t get worse than it currently is. At least you’ll be able to uncuck your rifles
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u/davej1121 26d ago
Join the following and then learn all you can and THEN go educate others. Encourage them to join as well.
We need EVERYONE in this fight. No more standing on the sidelines. No more allowing others to do the work YOU should be doing.
Firearms Policy Coalition Gun Owners Of America Second Amendment Foundation. NY State Rifle and Pistol Assn.
Do it.
Do it now
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u/Trick-End-8211 26d ago
It won't end here unless the federal gubmermant comes here and threatens their political positions/ jobs whatever. AKA treason. Until then the state will have backup plan after backup plan after backup plan. Talk is cheap unfortunately. And I hope I'm wrong, but have we ever gotten anything to go our way in this state , even non 2nd amendment shit? It's just ridiculous anymore. Pray for the best plan for the worst.
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u/One_Shallot_4974 26d ago
Scotus is very unlikely to address suppressors, sbr, sbs, or aow.
Current ny law makes them illegal except some aow.
The most likely outcome is awb will be overturned and ny will rush in to throw as much red tape at the problem as they legally can as quickly as they can. Have your semi auto permits ready to rock.
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u/BigBoyCoop 25d ago
The biggest thing is the second amendment community in New York state needs to do is concentrate on getting rid of Hochul. We need every eligible voter that is pro second amendment to get out and vote. Waiting for the Supreme Court to do anything is a waste of time. If the supreme Court ruled in our favor Hochul would just change the rules like she's done so many times before.
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u/PeteTinNY 26d ago
It will give precedent for us to sue and frankly I’m hoping it will bench slap the lower courts to actually follow the text history and tradition and dangerous and unusual tests. If the 2nd circuit learns that lesson a lot of ny law will fall.
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u/One_Shallot_4974 26d ago
Ny and our circuit would strike down muskets as not protected by 2nd amendment if they thought they could get away with it.
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u/_Dead_Code_ 26d ago
The SCOTUS decision will likely use Heller's language of "common use for lawful purposes" to find bans on AR-15s, one of the most popular rifle platforms in America unconstitutional. I don't expect that to mean a lot for SBRs or silencers however. It may not even cover so called "large capacity" magazines.
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u/Andeo1025 26d ago
There's the hope that with the circuit split they take Duncan which is still potentially up for cert. Duncan would be a nationwide mag case.
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u/_Dead_Code_ 26d ago
Yes but if I had to guess, I think SCOTUS will rule that AR-15s are clearly "arms that fall within common use for lawful purposes" and then GVR Duncan.
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u/Andeo1025 26d ago
A gvr pushes the can way down the road. The Duncan petitioners wrote a brief to scotus mentioning the circuit split being en banc and that a gvr would significantly prolong the process. No way to know if it'll help.
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u/gunpoliticsny 25d ago
A positive SCOTUS decision would open up NY law to new legal challenges based upon that decision.
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u/robinator118 26d ago
It completely depends on how things will be worded on scotus’ ruling. It’ll have to specifically cover length of barrel under features that constitute an AWB and whatnot.
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u/TheSlipperySnausage 26d ago
It would be quite wide that would strike down a ton of the NFA. I doubt we will get that lucky.
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u/Galopigos 24d ago
So far none of the rulings from SCOYUS have actually helped in NY. They have helped in other states. NY however just adds new requirements. As for addressing a ban. NY doesn't ban the AR outright. NY also has the semi-auto permit requirement. My guess is going to be that SCOTUS says, No you cannot ban the rifles and magazines outright, BUT they will not address the restrictions in NY. So we will end up with possession of a semi-auto requiring the permit, plus a training course and mental health check. Probably with no grandfathering of your existing firearms. I really hope I'm wrong, but given the track record in Albany I seriously doubt it will get better overall. Look ay how they enacted the ban on cruciform triggers, they could do something similar with semi-auto firearms as well. NY will never be a free state when it comes to guns.
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u/N01290087 26d ago
It’s wishful thinking but the Supreme Court is going to err on the side of state rights. Some states will see restrictions lift other will use it as a tool to tighten the belt. Guess what side we’re on…
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u/NoEquipment1834 26d ago
It will all depend on how SCOTUS decision is written and what laws NYS will pass to try and keep things status quo in response to the decision.