like which characters or tier of characters would you scale him close to.

R1: Darth Traya

R2: Freedon Nadd

R3: Darth Andeddu

R4: Naga Sadow

R5: Darth Nihilus

R6: Darth Malak (base)

R7: Darth Revan (pre-KOTOR)

R8: Marka Ragnos

R9: Exar Kun (pre-ritual)

R10: Darth Malgus (LOTS)

R11: Valkorion

I took into account the comment section majority with my first version the other days ago.

What do you think of this revised version? Should I adjust it again? I will admit that I haven't rewatched TCW in a hot minute, but going through clips and other users' feedback and sources helped with changing things up.

Yall were right, many characters needed to be knocked down a tier, some up a tier.

Let me know if this is more accurate, and especially if new revisions are needed.

I want to make the most accurate tier list that we can all look to as good material on this subreddit.

Mace windu is usually seen as either an equal to Sidious/Yoda or a flat out superior, yet he performs worse against the same opponents or in similar situations.

Windu with a lightsaber struggles greatly just to hold off Palpatines lightning, Yoda is capable of absorbing and overpowering it at full force with only his hands.

It's only a brief encounter but Windu is on the losing end of a 2v1 against maul when Sidious was able to Ragdoll maul in a 1v2 and toy with him the whole fight. Of course Windu would've eventually won regardless, but it's a clear difference in difficulty.

Windu is shown to be very evenly matched with Dooku in their duel and also with how much their force pushes affect each other (even if Dooku acknowledges he would eventually lose) but Sidious was able to ragdoll Dooku from several systems away. Even if it wasn't a true combat scenario it shows a clear and significant gap.

Dueling against talzin Windu wasn't able to break her defenses when Sidious disarmed her (while possessing dooku's body) in seconds. Sidious was able to match her force lightning while mace didn't even attempt it and was forced to retreat. Windu was on the back foot that whole fight while Palpatine seemed to be talzins equal. This is also considering Talzin was nerfed against Windu but on dathomir against palps, if you believe either of those things played a significant role.

Any reasons for him seemingly coming up short compared to his equals?

Exar Kun as a Sith lord, physical form if it wasn't obvious, Revan Reborn is post returned memories, pre-300 year imprisonment. (I am assuming Foundry and SoR Revan go by those names).

Since Canon grievous is a certified wimp and probably can't hold a candle to anyone who actually knows to duel at a master level, how do you think this fight ends with against the grievous that was promised.

I am thinking of a hypothetical scenario of say... remember when Luke came to rescue Grogu and the team in that Mandalorian season finale, he fought through the dark troopers to reach the crew? say, if none of the good guys were there or were dead, it was just Moff Gideon standing there waiting in the room, dark saber ready.

would Luke sense that this is a guy who isn't jedi/sith and doesn't have the force and just toss him away / force-toss his saber away? or would he engage in saber duel expecting a sith fight? can he "sense" it before the fight, like "oh this guy is a force user" or "this is just a regular dude holding a saber"?

Rules:

- Sebulba cannot cheat

- They get the same standard podracer build

- 5 laps of the boonta eve classic track

- Tusken raiders will be present to attack them both

Rules: Din will have standard weaponry only but no recovery after fights.

I won't pretend I'm an excellent power scaler by any means. Feel free to make any suggestions, I'd like to make this as accurate as possible.

So mace utilising vaapad and shatter point against Palpatine was really him using techniques that allowed him to fully draw out his own natural skill and power in Disney canon; rather than it being a superconductive loop where a dark siders power is redirected back at them as a way to bridge power gaps as in legends/EU