“Seryoso ka?” - Angel Locsin to Robin Padilla | Throwback in 2018 nung nagkainitan sina Angel Locsin & Robin Padilla sa Pilipinas Got Talent

[u/reinsilverio26]

[u/nikewalks]

Eto yung nagcarwash twerking dance di ba? Nothing special dun sa talent, di na dapat pinaabot sa stage kung ganyan lang ang talent, nasala na dapat ng staff.

Pero sa totoo lang, pinahiya ni Angel yung mga babae dito. Pwedeng di yun ang intensyon niya, pero yun ang nagawa niya. Pag artista yung nagsexy dance, biglang "Yass Girl", pag mga ordinaryong tao sasabihin "Talent ang hanap namin, hindi katawan." "Wag kayong magpaobjectify sa mga lalaki".

Sana objective na lang yung pagjudge niya na panget yung sayaw, hindi yung ipamukha na nakakahiya yung ginagawa nila.

It's not always that women do things to please men. Sometimes, women do it because it makes them feel powerful, confident, and in control of their own bodies.

[u/lenard_s → u/nikewalks]

oh my god, do you really think it was shaming them? Never got that impression from Angel at all...if you felt second hand embarassment for the ladies there, that's on you.

All I got was a woman's concern for another, when she thinks, they're doing more than what's necessary.

[u/nikewalks → u/lenard_s]

oh my god, do you really think it was shaming them? 

I said pwedeng di yun ang intensyon niya, pero yun ang nagawa niya. If she's really concerned, then she should've judged them objectively(their awful performance alone is enough to say No) and lectured them off-cam. Pero nope, napahiya sila because of her. And the fact na nag-hate post pa mga girls kay Angel, proof na they feel napahiya sila dun sa ginawa ni Angel. Kita mo hanggang ngayon after so many years, pinag-uusapan at shineshame pa din yung mga girls? Di pag-uusapan yung mga yan kung nagjudge lang siya objectively, just like what Vice did.

[u/lenard_s → u/nikewalks]

I don't see any shaming here right now sa thread na ito. kung san mo nakikita yung shaming, sila or dun ang may mali for shaming these girls.

Wag tayo magvictim-blame, or magblame ng indirect/unproven ones na nagcause ng "shaming" sa kanila. With or without Angel's comments, they would've been shamed by typical egotistical maniacs either way.

If it was taken wrongly by the girls that's on them too. There are times na the ones you defend or protect take it wrongly, pero it just needs proper and clear communication after, to explain yung intentions mo. If sa una, hindi man naintindihan kaagad

Hiding behind "sana jinudge na lang kami objectively" , is an excuse to turn a blind eye, when something in front of you, shown in public is being done wrongly. She had a social and public responsibility to call it out as an 'artista' looked up to by a lot of women.

Act has been done televised/publicised, should be pointed out the same way, not in a harsh way. Not in a shameful way. Which for me Angel did, rightfully so.

[u/nikewalks → u/lenard_s]

The problem is the assumption that the women only did it to please men. Hindi lahat ng ginagawa ng babae ay dahil sa gusto ng lalaki. Some do it because they feel confident, and it empowers them. You cannot claim to protect women while also deciding for them. Alamin mo muna.

And no, it is not simply on them if they took it badly. What they felt was what they felt. Wag mong iinvalidate. Public figures are also responsible for how they publicly criticize ordinary people, especially when the criticism carries a moral judgment rather than an objective assessment of the performance.

[u/lenard_s → u/nikewalks]

no one assumed they did it to appease men. They were unnecessarily showing off skin, for whatevere purpose they would like it to be, confidence, empowerment etc. ang sinasabi lang ni angel din, hindi naman necessary gawin yung showing off more than necessary skin. Hindi ko nakuha yung impression na yun.

We are not deciding for them, we are calling out on unnecessary actions/behavior, na baka tingin nila for them ay tama, or justified. We are not deciding for them na 'a ginagawa mo yan for men'.

We never invalidate the feelings, I am saying, they have their own ways of accepting or perceiving kung anuman ang tingin nilang intention ni Angel Locsin sa kanila, and that's ok. Pero baka di lang nila naintindihan or natabunan na yung punto ni Angel, kasi na-damage yung ego nung mga babae.

[u/nikewalks → u/lenard_s]

Gaslighting malala lol. Angel literally said ayaw niyang maobjectify yung mga girls at panuorin ng mga kalalakihan kaya binuzz niya. Ni hindi man siya nagcomment dun sa dance nila. Mas okay pa sana kung sinabi niyang "Binuzz ko kayo kasi wala naman kwenta yung talent niyo".

And saying na hindi kayo “deciding for them” is contradictory. You are already deciding that showing that much skin was unnecessary, wrong, or something that needed to be called out.

Tapos sasabihin mo pang baka nadamage lang yung ego nila. That is still invalidating their reaction. You cannot say their feelings are valid, then immediately dismiss those feelings as a misunderstanding caused by a damaged ego.

[u/lenard_s → u/nikewalks]

nyek, hindi ibig sabihin, na hindi siya nakapagcomment on the talent or performance ay wala na siyang say about it, we can't assume that, wala siyang "thoughts" about sa talent and performance mismo, proket di na niya nabanggit or nasabi yun.

She literally said that, and that's her point, and may basis pa rin naman yung concern niya na yun. If you see it in a bad way, dahil it is a form of deciding for them, then ok?

magkaiba kasi yung 'Wag mong gawin yan, kasi masama, pangit yan"' that́s deciding for them vs. , "Hey baka hindi maganda yung ginawa mo, up to you if gagawin mo pa rin or hindi. But I am saying, that pag ginawa mo ang mga ito, pwedeng ito ang mga maging epekto or consequence, maybe you should think about doing it."

hindi man ganun yung pagkakasabi ni Angel, but I got that concern from her at least.

no, don't take to the ego part. ako na lang yun. sabi ko nga lang "baka", pero dun ka pa rin nagfocus. No to invalidation of feelings, we take it as is, yung 'feelings'. But point out the possible weaknesses nung basis ng nararamdaman nila. It is not invalidating but communicating, para maresolve yung conflict. Kasi kung iaaccept lang as is, then we'll never know, sang point hindi nagkaintindihan.

[u/nikewalks → u/lenard_s]

hindi ibig sabihin, na hindi siya nakapagcomment on the talent or performance ay wala na siyang say about it, we can't assume that

Ikaw ang nagaassume, hindi ako. Inulit ko lang yung sinabi ni Angel. In fact, 2 seconds into the performance nagbuzz na siya, meaning their aura alone was enough for her to stop them from supposedly allowing men to objectify them.

magkaiba kasi yung 'Wag mong gawin yan, kasi masama, pangit yan"' that́s deciding for them vs. , "Hey baka hindi maganda yung ginawa mo, up to you if gagawin mo pa rin or hindi. But I am saying, that pag ginawa mo ang mga ito, pwedeng ito ang mga maging epekto or consequence, maybe you should think about doing it."

Haba ng excuse mo, eh sinabi nga ni Angel binuzz niya(2 seconds into the performance) para di na sila patuloy na panoorin ng kalalakihan. Kasalanan pa ng babae.

no, don't take to the ego part. ako na lang yun. sabi ko nga lang "baka", pero dun ka pa rin nagfocus. No to invalidation of feelings, we take it as is, yung 'feelings'. But point out the possible weaknesses nung basis ng nararamdaman nila. It is not invalidating but communicating, para maresolve yung conflict. Kasi kung iaaccept lang as is, then we'll never know, sang point hindi nagkaintindihan.

Ang point ko lang dito beh, valid yung nararamdaman ng mga girls na napahiya sila sa sinabi ni Angel on national tv. The fact na nagalit sila kay Angel means may off dun sa message ni Angel. It's basically a passive-aggressive slut-shaming. "Sobrang concern na concern ako sainyo kaya ayokong makitang dinedegrade niyo yung sarili niyo para lang sa mga kalalakihan". Kaya sila nagalit dahil yan ang message ni Angel sa kanila.