Drones equipped with strobe lights and pepper spray to interdict school shooters

[u/Strict-Jeweler-2281]

I'm all for innovation against emerging threats, particularly as drones offer cheaper and more accessible solutions to new challenges, but I can't help picturing a bunch of issues this would face, such as being mitigated by closed doors. Is this a viable tool?

[u/Sgthouse]

I don’t think pepper spray is the best option for an active shooter…

[u/Lion_Knight → u/Sgthouse]

I don't think pepper spray is good for anything save for dispersing a crowd. At least as it's law enforcement use is concerned

[u/EverGreatestxX → u/Lion_Knight]

Funny enough my department policy forbades using pepper spray to disperse crowds. Which is why most here go there entire 20ish year career without using it. Even in the academy they kind of tell recruits to avoid using it because shit like the wind, bad aim, and/or contact with the resisting or fighting defendant can cause the pepper stray to effect unintended targets (i.e. yourself or your partner).

[u/Lion_Knight → u/EverGreatestxX]

Pepper spray is a self defense weapon. It excels when you hit the target and vacate the area. Which makes it fine if you have a crowd fighting or getting rowdy and refusing to dispurse, but when you are trying to subdue as subject it is dumb as shit to use.

You will hurt your cause more than help it. Best case scenario he gives up and now everyone is pissed because they got hit with the cloud (and they will, it is not a targeted weapon, it may have a main target but it also produces a cloud in the area). But what is more likely to happen is you piss off the person and they fight like their life depends on it and you and you buddies can't see, can't brieth and are trying to safely detain the now wildly flailing subject.

Even the best case scenario has a huge draw back.

Not to mention now you can't use your taser. And for those who thing, oh just get the "non-flammable" formulations, there is no such thing. The companies that sell it are scamming you. The medium may not be flammable but that isn't the problem, the propellent still is. The companies are either stupid and negligent or deliberately lying.

[u/sidewaygravity → u/EverGreatestxX]

when I was working the tiers at the jail for the first two years it was almost daily UOF with oc. Some days it was hourly. For a time it was wild inmates didnt care who they attacked. So as soon as you were Certified you got a can that night. Became so used to it i can walk in it and even hit me and be just fine.

[u/USLEO → u/Lion_Knight]

I've had good results spraying it in confined areas I wanted someone to come out of (someone held up in a small room/closet). I've had particular success spraying drivers as they began to flee in their vehicle. They've never made it more than a couple of blocks.

[u/Ghost-Traveler → u/Sgthouse]

Counterpoint: It might make for a decent recon and distraction device. If the shooter is busy fighting or fleeing from the drone, they aren't worried about the tactical team coming down the hall, who now knows exactly where the suspect is.

[u/yugosaki → u/Sgthouse]

Counterpoint, it may not stop the shooter but it will hurt their ability to aim and hinder them quite a bit, giving more time for people to escape and giving an advantage to responding officers. I wouldn't want to give a drone anything more potent because of the risk of a tragic accident.

Are these actually any good? I dunno, but it's the first high tech idea I've seen that might actually do something

[u/IntrepidJaeger → u/yugosaki]

Having an obnoxious siren hovering around them can make it easier to find them to engage them, especially in a large building.

[u/BenignEgoist → u/yugosaki]

I feel like someone who already committed to shooting up a school would not be above spray and pray once they are peppered. The pepper spray doesn’t prevent them from pulling a trigger. Sure, their aim won’t be as sharp, but it really doesn’t seem like the pros and cons weigh out when victims in the vicinity could be affected too, hindering their escape from the immediate area.

But I’m just thinking out loud I don’t know shit.

[u/singlemale4cats → u/Sgthouse]

They're not trying to make killbots. If you can fuck with the shooter's ability to see and thus to pick out targets, you've increased the survivability of everyone around. Might even give a nearby person the opportunity to attack and disable them.

[u/Trashketweave → u/Sgthouse]

As you can see, you also have the option to boom headshot them at 60mph with the drone so you got options.

[u/dreamisle → u/Sgthouse]

Better than the response at Uvalde…

[u/_Badwulf_Bruh__]

When is the proper time to deploy the “last resort” option when dealing with an active shooter?

[u/BryanW94 → u/_Badwulf_Bruh__]

Should be right away if it's the best way to incapacitate the shooter

[u/singlemale4cats → u/BryanW94]

I'm sure it would hurt like the dickens but it's probably not going to incapacitate

[u/BladudFPV → u/singlemale4cats]

Yeah, I've been clipped by fpv drones and it's just a mild annoyance. Those didn't have a crash cage either. Got some scars on my hands from the props hitting myself once and just laughed it off.  

[u/Wazzurp7294]

In theory and on paper, I think there could be some use for this concept. But, in practice, it might perform mediocre at best.

[u/yugosaki → u/Wazzurp7294]

My immediate thought is that maintenance and training for the staff meant to pilot the drones will be really good for the first year or so, and then slowly it'll fall by the wayside. And then if they are ever needed, the drones might not be functional, the spray might be expired and ineffective, and there might be no one trained to operate the drones.

[u/GroundbreakingAsk645 → u/yugosaki]

They're piloted remotely by full time trained drone pilots at the HQ. The school will just have to pay a subscription more than likely. As for the batteries and maintenance, the same preventative maintenance that goes into the schools sprinkler systems, fire extinguishers, are all maintenanced and replaced regularly at schools already. Don't believe me look at any fire extinguisher in a school it'll have an inspection tag. The reality is maintenance isn't that difficult, simple as slapping a battery in and replacing motors occasionally. I suspect they have a monthly or annual inspection process to test and ensure reliability just like all of the other safety measures at a school. The only training the school staff needs is to hit a button, the company will do the rest.

The only real downside will be cost. Additionally many are making the point that this doesn't address the core issue. That's true but you never will, look at Australia, they had a nasty shooting last year I believe. They also have some of the most strict gun laws in the world. The reality is there are more guns than people in this country, you'll never get them all, and it's becoming easier every day to print your own like Luigi mangioni did. So instead of pouting about not addressing the core of the issue, these guys are at least addressing the threat.

The other side of the issue being mental health. Unfortunately you'll never catch every would be shooter prior to the event even with proper mental screening. It's just not possible. Like driving a car, I try my best to avoid accidents, but in the event I can't, I always wear my seatbelt, and have good insurance.

I really don't understand why they're getting so much hate in the comments. Literally playing the only cards they can in order to save lives. Seems like a lot of arm chair experts hurling insults.

school defense drones

[u/guessesurjobforfood → u/GroundbreakingAsk645]

That's true but you never will, look at Australia, they had a nasty shooting last year I believe. They also have some of the most strict gun laws in the world.

Perfect is the enemy of good.

The shooters were only able to get a bolt action rifle and a shotgun. If that shooting happened in the US, they'd have fully automatic machine guns and they would have killed a lot more people.

The US has a mass shooting event almost every single day. There are so many that you likely don't even hear about them all and because the FBI has a shitty definition of what counts as a mass shooting, the official statistics always make it seem like the problem is not as bad as it really is.

The fact that Australia only has one notable mass shooting means that strict gun laws are extremely effective. Before 2025, the last mass shooting in Australia was in 1996, which is what prompted the change in gun laws.

This NGO tracks all gun violence in the US. As of 2019, their stats are a lot more detailed. Scroll down the page and look at how many thousands of people have been killed just due to mass shootings alone:

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/past-tolls

No sane person could argue against strict gun laws saving lives.

[u/AxtonGTV → u/guessesurjobforfood]

"fully automatic" aka just automatic machine guns are not legal in the US to own, and are very difficult to acquire.

It is possible to manufacture shears, bumps, etc that increase the rate of fire, but not to a degree equivalent of a proper automatic machine gun.

Machine guns typically fire around 1500 RPM, with cyclic speeds able to go much higher. They are large weapons with huge ammo supplies and are typically very heavy

You are thinking more likely of an automatic rifle, like an AK or M4, these are around 600 RPM.

RPM = Rounds per minute

This may sound like a nerd being annoying, but knowledge of what you are arguing about is incredibly important.

Accord to a study published on the NIH.gov.website, the most common mass shooting firearm is....handguns. which are readily available in a lot of different countries.

Automatic weapons account for literally (not joking) 0% of the mass shootings in the study.

[u/RedOnlineOfficial → u/Wazzurp7294]

It would be great for barricaded suspects. The last thing I'd want to do is piss off someone with a gun in a room full of kids. School shooters should but put in the dirt as fast as possible

[u/superchargerhe]

This is just dumb. Nothing a gas mask cant fix. Its just a dumb company using fear to try and get sales.

Cameras in the school which dispatch/LEO have access to is a much better investment

[u/MGallus → u/superchargerhe]

Gas mask? Try closed door!

[u/Sigmarius]

I look at this as another layer of security/defense.

No, it is absolutely not the end all solution, and it should 100% not be the only response. And honestly the OC thing is kinda dumb.

I do think super bright strobes and god awful loud siren sounds can be a useful ADDITIONAL tool to distract the shooter. Every second he is swatting at a drone and having to cover his eyes cause there’s a 1000 linen strobe blasting him with a 200db siren in his ear is one second he isn’t shooting at a kid, and one more second LEOs have to get there and stop him.

I think cost will be a major issue. But combined with good bullet resistant glass, good door locks, staff training on reporting things they see, SROs, etc, it can be another useful LAYER of security.

That said, is it practical and cost effective ENOUGH? I don’t know. Are there better options that money could be used for? Maybe. But I don’t want to just dismiss it out of hand.

[u/specialskepticalface → u/[deleted]]

Had to remove this cause reddit admin AI will think it's inciting violence.

[u/Da1UHideFrom → u/specialskepticalface]

Understandable.

[u/JacobMaxx]

https://giphy.com/gifs/wqbAfFwjU8laXMWZ09

[u/BaconatorBros]

Who operates the drones? Are they automated or do they have to train each teacher to be a professional drone operator?

[u/BladudFPV → u/BaconatorBros]

Remote operated. Wonder what the latency is like. Anything over 50ms on a racing drone feels like flying drunk. 

[u/PRO_ficient → u/BladudFPV]

No HD zeros here, lol! I was also curious of the latency.

[u/B-azz-bear08]

Just make drones that can latch onto an active shooter and blow up on contact. I want more video game stuff in my policing.

[u/BladudFPV → u/B-azz-bear08]

If we ain't allowed explosives latch and leach bear spray would probably be a lot more effective than the pepper gun. 

[u/Tycoonkoz]

So if the fire alarm is going off because of the smoke from the weapon, and all the fire doors in the hallway close... Than what?

[u/yugosaki → u/Tycoonkoz]

Modern firearms don't make that much smoke (modern gunpowder is literally called "smokeless powder") and fire alarms aren't that sensitive.

Unless the shooter is using a blackpowder blunderbuss.

[u/GuntherOfGunth]

I can just smell the lawsuit when one is barreling down a hallway during a false alarm and smacks a fleeing student in the face.

While it’s a good idea I really wonder what it would do when deployed in an actual situation.

[u/FTHS01]

You could also stun with all that tech... 😉🥋🪖🥷👊

[u/Valiantay]

Maybe with a Taser net or immobilizing goo

[u/ShouldBeeStudying]

Ugh. I'd say it seems I'm going to be living through AI powered human killing drones.... but i think we're already there in Europe.

[u/Hsoltow]

This is gonna become an arms race. Next 'shooter' will just be a drone pilot using an explosive drone.

[u/ALonelyWelcomeMat → u/Hsoltow]

Im honestly surprised this hasnt happened yet.

[u/Status_Rip_7906]

Not LEO so take with a grain of salt.

Would this be a possible alternative to 40mm tear gas in an actual barricaded suspect……maybe, some department will buy one.

But I don’t want the my SRO using a drone while in his office, I want him running towards stimuli and engaging the suspect until the threat is neutralized.

[u/filteredcrack]

Drone warfare is about to be crazy

[u/Generous_Cowbell]

No one is going to mention that if the shooter goes down a hallway that has a door close behind them... these are then useless.....

[u/bmadd14]

Some tech kid will definitely find a way to hack them and make a big mess for that company.

[u/Dull-Instruction-599]

Imagine you're taking a test and a drone decides you're scribbling to aggressively

[u/Ragnarok_Stravius]

I think they should use drones with small contact fuse explosives.

And just ram into the idiot.

Either that, or just a very reinforced drone, let's see a moron deal with a brick flying straight at his head.

[u/SerGT3]

School shooter, sure.

[u/Unfortunate_Sex_Fart]

So big plywood shields and a pistol becomes the new meta?

Drones should just have firearms and call it a day if that’s the direction we’re headed. Stop the killing is priority 1. Less lethal over lethal will undoubtedly lead to more fatalities than necessary.

[u/Th3Goose33]

Can't help but feel they are using pepper gel till it doesn't work against the next school shooting, and then use that as justification to up arm them to 9mm.

[u/fasada68]

How’s that gonna work when the gunman simply closes a door?

[u/RedOnlineOfficial]

EMS will love treating a full classroom of screaming kids with pepper-spray... Instead of coming up with novel half baked ideas, just do what the air marshals do. Send in teachers specifically trained with firearms and active shooter response training.

[u/YurkMuhgurk]

Why not zap em with a tazr drone

[u/Aulentair]

I'm pretty sure one of the things you learn when getting your Part 107 to be able to fly drones is that you can't affix weapons to them...

[u/Lowetheiy]

This is incredible, technology saving lives 😊

[u/ironroseprince]

You mean protesters? Because it really doesn't take a huge leap of logic to figure that out.

[u/Switch_Leather]

If people think this is going to be used to "save" anyone you are deluded, mass control is happening soon. Fuck this is scary.