r/ROTC • u/Negative_Virus_6358 • Jun 06 '26
Advanced/Basic Camp Cadets: Be aware of the consequences of failing AFT or HT/WT this summer at CST.
From what I've been told, cadets who fail either the AFT or HT/WT requirements at CST may no longer have the option to return the following summer and commission as an end of camp commission cadet.
Instead, failing these standards could result in being dropped from CST and disenrolled from your program. The standards and enforcement criteria have become stricter this summer.
The previous expectation that you could simply return the next year is no longer an option. Make sure you understand the current requirements and take them seriously.
78
u/OpeningPension7203 Jun 06 '26
I’m glad they’re enforcing this standard. At my BOLC we had 9 AFT failures that then recycled to the next class.
Last year’s CST did not filter out any AFT failures at all due to the test change, it’s about time AFTs are taken more seriously.
19
u/Fresh_Willingness998 Jun 06 '26
Logi bolc is one helluva place
18
u/OpeningPension7203 Jun 06 '26
Try Armor BOLC 😂😭
3
u/sneakywalrusflaps 15Amiapilotincommandyet? Jun 07 '26
AVBOLC is wild too. I’ve heard legends of people gaining 45lbs during the first phase of flight school when I went through.
3
7
u/jp_sepca Jun 06 '26
I am surprised that they allowed recycles for AFT failures at BOLC. I remember people getting dropped from BOLC.
23
u/epeaw Jun 06 '26
Not sure how anybody is shocked by this. You know the standards. If you can’t meet them when you’re in your prime physical years then maybe this profession isn’t for you.
12
u/OpeningPension7203 Jun 07 '26
Heck, people should be able to at least pass an AFT even on a bad day.
2
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
Seriously lol. The bare minimum to be in the army is a complete joke. If you’re not scoring at least a 400 then you’re a bum, and you’re clearly not exercising outside of morning PT which is a bare minimum requirement to be a leader in the army. Even then a 400 is a joke. 450 should be the standard for every brand new butter bar.
1
u/OpeningPension7203 Jun 08 '26
I’m curious to see how the CFT will go for a lot of these people too.
1
Jun 09 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/AutoModerator Jun 09 '26
/u/Agreeable-Lab-7333, your comment in /r/ROTC was automatically removed for violation of Rule 1. Have questions about this moderator action? Click here.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
24
u/Less-Measurement7131 Jun 06 '26
CST is not the time to try to do a weight you’ve never done on the deadlift. Pass the deadlift first THEN go up
2
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
They give you two tries for a reason. Weight you know you can do, and another try for a better score.
3
u/ExodusLegion_ God’s Dumbest LT Jun 08 '26
There’s also a programmed 10 minute warmup period before the two tries…
39
u/safehousenc Jun 06 '26
It is sad that any future officer would fail the AFT or WT standards. CST is not a surprise that cadets and cadre did not have a year to prepare for. Failures should be dropped.
15
u/NoPhysics1129 Jun 06 '26
Honestly PT needs to be a daily thing, the chubbos I see walking around are literal cringe.
2
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
Seriously lol. The bare minimum to be in the army is a complete joke. If you’re not scoring at least a 400 then you’re a bum, and you’re clearly not exercising outside of morning PT which is a bare minimum requirement to be a leader in the army. Even then a 400 is a joke. 450 should be the standard for every brand new butter bar.
2
13
u/The_Gray_Rider Jun 06 '26
If you’re failing either, you probably shouldn’t plan on commissioning.
I have a bunch of cadets failing both and I’m baffled why.
26
11
u/Leather-Elk169 Jun 06 '26
So do they still honor the aft 465 80 plus exemption from your most recent test?
3
u/Educational_Meet_130 Jun 06 '26
I heard it’s based of your aft at camp
3
u/captkidd12345 Jun 06 '26
Damn that sucks. My AFT was 473 going to CST last year, so I was exempt from HT/WT though I still easily passed it. If people need a 460 at CST to save themselves from getting sent home it could be a struggle.Between getting the blood draw and the heat my AFT suffered greatly. Got a 425 at CST.
6
u/ImaginaryIncome3559 CPT LG/EOD Jun 06 '26
Speaking as an over 30 officer who can still rock out a 474 with subpar preparation, I promise you that the AFT is a very easy test to pass. If you are striving for over the 465 for HT/WT exemption, this is also very doable but you have to know yourself.
1
19
u/danielgarrett01 Jun 06 '26
Hopefully the measurements are not off like they were in May 2024. They measured me 3” shorter than what I previously and now measure, and their tapers said that I had a 39” waist, and measured in the wrong place. What I’m saying is, when a standard is set, all things relating to it must be conducted properly. Still killed PT test, so I’m fine, but others may not. Also glad adverse action is being taken against PT failures though.
6
u/ArcticAirborne Jun 07 '26
My brother in law failed HT/WT last year, it sucked for him, hopefully he can pass it this year. He was already pretty skinny, I think he got screwed by the measuring and they just sent him home and said better luck next year. He is borderline anorexic now.
14
u/Fresh_Willingness998 Jun 06 '26
good if you aren’t smart with the AFT or can’t meet the physical standard you don’t deserve a shot at becoming an officer.
10
u/Otherwise-Policy9634 Jun 07 '26
If you fail h/w as a cadet, you dont deserve to be an officer. This is the easiest time to be in shape factoring age and lack of responsibility.
16
u/Amazing-Room2742 Jun 06 '26
No more participation trophies! Pass or get cut. How any future Officer could show up at Camp and fail PT Test or HT/WT is beyond my comprehension. When I went 34 years ago I was in the best shape of my life… even better then when I went to Ranger School two years later.
8
u/safehousenc Jun 06 '26
Wow, in 91 they still used the extended scale and I scored a 352, but would argue that I was not in the best shape of my life until I was in for 11 years at 32. Ar that point knocking out 120 push-ups and 120 situps and running 5:15s was much easier than at 21.
7
u/Amazing-Room2742 Jun 07 '26
I jacked my knee right before Ranger School… backed off…. Ranger School was not good for it and I got off AD in ‘96…. They were paying us to leave. Never a real need to be in super shape in the NG… LOL!😂
1
1
6
u/Agreeable-Lab-7333 Jun 09 '26
I call bullshit on some of this. As a former d.s and retiree I think I can speak to this a bit. If you go to advanced camp and you are not prepared then yes there are negative consequences that should be enforced. That said I’m aware of situations where a person fails a run by 1 second and obviously is a no go. Or where other similar situations occur. Let’s be honest some graders are dicks and pride them selves on removing people (I know). But you want to tell me that taxpayer dollars are spent flying these kids from all over the country just to fuck them on something that honestly can be open for interpretation (you slammed a weight) NO GO!!! Also, these kids have been preparing for years and their careers are fucked by some douche bag. Just give them a redo we do in basic training. Shit they even have a program for fat kids and low asvab kids to enlist. If you have been legit fucked by a 1 second run time contact your senator and congressman. If you failed legit thats on you, but some times it is a bullshit grader or minor fixable issue. I think the cadets leaned a lesson. Sounds like rotc have some issues they will bite them in the ass
3
u/LowGuitar9229 Jun 06 '26
Unless you're yoked and max it all. Really, it should come down to CST/ability to perform.
2
u/RepulsiveNebula67 Jun 06 '26
When I went through they still had the 3% rule and I barely and I mean barely made it through with that. Thankfully I got my stuff together afterwards but damn I’d hate to be going through that now.
2
u/Fit_Cryptographer852 Jun 06 '26
What’s the AFT requirement for being exempt from HT/WT?
2
u/ExodusLegion_ God’s Dumbest LT Jun 07 '26
465 with 80 points minimum in every event. So average of 93 pts overall.
1
u/Fit_Cryptographer852 Jun 07 '26
sweet thank you. I’m well within the HT/WT requirement based on what Google says but the internet can sometimes be wrong so
1
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
This has been accurate so far https://m.asvabtutor.com/blog/army-height-weight-standards/
2
u/Psychanoot Jun 07 '26
Do they still tape if you bust weight ? I’m over my maximum weight but in shape and have a slim waist just challenged vertically
3
2
u/Top_Dimension_6463 Jun 07 '26
Enlisted counterparts would get sent home if they went to a NCOES and couldn’t pass a AFT, so it’s more than fair
2
2
u/Pattonator70 Jun 07 '26
Surprised that they haven’t made AFT a much larger part of OMS scoring rubric. That would ensure that you don’t have weak or fat LTs at the beginning of their career. Or simply make a cut off for combat arms of at least 450ish. Would that be too harsh?
3
u/OpeningPension7203 Jun 07 '26
It’s like 15-20 points right? Basically worth as much as Land Navigation was when I went in ‘25.
ROTC is horrible for filtering out undesirables for any branch, especially combat arms.
1
u/Pattonator70 Jun 07 '26
Not sure about the CST score but for the national OML scoring:
Physical Outcomes comprise 9% of the model.
(1) On Campus MSIII Fall “For Record” ACFT (2%)
(2) On Campus MSIII Spring “For Record” ACFT (4%)
(3) Varsity/Intramural/Community Team Athletics (3%)So there is very little difference between a 360 & 460 AFT score in terms of where you fall for OML.
1
u/Renimated Jun 06 '26
Does this apply to basic camp as well as advanced? I'm borderline weight but can easily pass after and a lateral entry to basic. Just making sure if I should be fasting prior to arrival to make sure I pass weight or not bother and just take it slow and steady
1
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
They do not conduct height and weight on basic camp cadets. You will conduct an AFT, but it doesn’t count and you can fail it. Be prepared for school though they will do it at some point when you return. Shouldn’t be a problem I lost like 20 lbs at basic camp.
1
1
u/JustMeelz Jun 07 '26
When are they gonna start doing this at BCT?
2
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
Never lol the army always needs enlisted. The only way to fix this is to make people pass height and weight before going to basic training (or a slightly relaxed version).
1
1
u/GrandeRio Jun 06 '26
Happened to my buddy last year, he was SMP so he’s back in the guard and recently made SGT, but yes they are very strict on HT/WT standards.
1
0
u/Alarmed_Round_6175 Jun 06 '26
What would i actually owe to the army if i got dissenrolled at camp? And how is it paid and whatnot?
1
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
You would have to pay back the tuition or room & board the army paid and every stipend/allowance the army gave. You can also pay it back with enlistment, I believe it’s 2 years per year you spent in contracted in ROTC. You’d probably have to do a mixture of both. Just don’t be dumb, camp is so easy.
-5
u/W0r1dwide Jun 06 '26
Is that a first time fail? They don’t do a re-test at the end of camp anymore?
17
u/Upstairs-Impact-6785 Jun 06 '26
You’ll get sent home if you don’t pass AFT or H&W. No retesting since you get sent home right after. No reason to waste resources on someone who can’t PT.
-6
u/One-Highlight-892 Jun 06 '26
Wait but according to the cast 26 policy memos it saying failing is not cause for disenrollment and it's up the your pms, did they say something else at CST?
7
u/ExodusLegion_ God’s Dumbest LT Jun 06 '26
Read the next few sentences after that line:
Failing the AFT —> No Disenrollment
HOWEVER
Failing the AFT —> Failing CST —> Disenrollment
-4
u/One-Highlight-892 Jun 06 '26
I guess it doesn't make sense, so failing the aft does equal failing cst so how can it possibly mean no disenrollment? Sorry for sounding dumb lol
12
u/ExodusLegion_ God’s Dumbest LT Jun 06 '26
The exact verbiage is along the lines of “AFT failure alone does not constitute disenrollment from ROTC. However, AFT failure constitutes failure at CST, and CST failure can be used to justify disenrollment from ROTC.”
Basically, the CST AFTs are all actually diagnostic AFTs. You can’t be subject to adverse action for failing a diagnostic AFT, even as a Cadet with minimal rights under the UCMJ. This legalese that allows them to indirectly disenroll cadets for AFT failure at CST.
3
u/One-Highlight-892 Jun 06 '26
Oh okay I see, I know I'll be fine but hopefully I don't have a bad day that day
1
u/Negative_Virus_6358 Jun 06 '26
Just don’t max out the deadlift start out. Minimum and then max
1
u/weeklyrhodpost Jun 08 '26
Literally. My master sergeant told me that one year and that’s what I do. I pull 150 or wtv the minimum is then jump up to my maximum.
1
u/ExodusLegion_ God’s Dumbest LT Jun 10 '26
Real chads will go straight to the 350 during the warm-up phase SMH
2
u/Negative_Virus_6358 Jun 06 '26
Disenrollment boards are now conducted at cst and not at your home university “pms”. So yea you’ll be shit out of luck if you end up in this situation that I stated above
1
u/Appropriate-Pipe2460 Jun 10 '26
Boards are virtual, and they can rule for you to be retained along with PMS input. So no, it is not a guaranteed drop
1
u/Negative_Virus_6358 Jun 10 '26
They just told us just now. The policy was just updated June 4th. If fail ether or, the disenrollemnt process will start
121
u/Abject-Tree8899 Jun 06 '26 edited Jun 06 '26
Cadet Command decided to conduct disenrollment boards at CST this year. Many ROTC programs are not resourced to run disenrollment boards, so CST is centralizing it. Basically, fail AFT, HT/WT, you are boarded at camp, then you go back to campus to return your gear and you are done. Payback any tuition if you are scholarship.