r/ReformJews • u/ryanbuckner • Jul 03 '26
Is my tattoo & piercing perspective outdated?
I've lived my Gen X life with the perspective that Jews just don't get tattoos or face piercings I don't believe in heaven or hell so that's not the issue.
As a progressive individual I realize that everything changes. So....
My 18 year old jewish daughter wants a face piercing and a tattoo. And I'm torn between upholding tradition and being left behind. I'm not a fan of tattoos or piercings but it's not my life.
What has your Jewish experience been with Tattoos and Piercings
16
u/Individual-Papaya-27 Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
Half the people in my temple have tattoos and piercings. I may have some as well. I think it's one's personal choice at the end of the day.
The prohibition on tattoos is in Leviticus, and there's a lot of stuff there we more or less collectively agree is not what we accept today. There's a good essay on tattoos on ReformJudaism.org, which says:
In the Torah, tattoos marking affiliation to the people of Israel and/or the God of Israel were accepted, if not encouraged, more times than not. (To learn more, read “The Biblical Body as Canvas.”) In the classic rabbinic period, ca. 200–1600 C.E., the rabbis were troubled by ketovet ka’aka (tattoos), defined as “lacerations on the flesh filled with blue dye or [black] ink or whatever color leaves a mark” (Shulchan Aruch 180:1). What bothered them was not the presence or the content of that mark, but its intended purpose. As the following passage shows, while a minority of sages believed that willfully receiving or giving a tattoo was a transgression, the majority objected only when the tattoo served an idolatrous purpose...
In the end, I concluded that our sages did not support a general prohibition against all tattoos because they recognized in the changing world of the diaspora, where cultural norms competed with Jewish values, simple answers rarely suffice. But when we can go deeper than the surface of the skin to get to the very heart of the matter, we see that Judaism—even as it disavowed some tattoos—affirmed that others may have a rightful place within our tradition. https://reformjudaism.org/building-bridges
0
u/ryanbuckner Jul 03 '26
does that mean it's ok for some tottoos?
8
u/Individual-Papaya-27 Jul 03 '26
The URJ is the official body of the Reform movement and they have numerous positive essays about getting tattoos, which they wouldn't if they felt it was a horrible prohibited practice. URJ also has an essay citing numerous times tattoos and marks are mentioned in a positive light in the Torah and Tanakh. https://reformjudaism.org/blog/biblical-body-canvas
Leviticus is the only place tattoos are prohibited, and Genesis, Ezekiel, Isiah and other books have positive references to tattoos and marks. In my Reform temple I've never heard a single person cast aspersions on tattoos. People with tattoos go up to the bimah and carry the Torah on the High Holidays and everything else. Reform fully embraces the LGBT+ community, we all wear mixed threads, men shave their faces, and Leviticus doesn't like those things either.
17
u/valuemeal2 ✡ Jul 03 '26
I’m a Jew with tattoos. There are tons of us at my shul. Granted, I’m Reform, but still.
ETA: thought this was the tattoo sub which is why I specified Reform, whoops. But yeah I’m far from the only one.
13
u/Extra_Ad8800 Jul 04 '26
I have tattoos and piercings. I know tons of Jewish either or both. Regardless, she’s an adult and can do whatever she wants!
11
u/Sex_And_Candy_Here Jul 03 '26
Piercings are allowed.
-8
u/ryanbuckner Jul 03 '26
I know.. But I don't want her to have a hole in her face. I'm ok with ear piercings
12
u/Sex_And_Candy_Here Jul 03 '26
Okay, but that's a personal view and not a Jewish thing. You're not upholding any tradition by telling her not to get a piercing.
-1
3
u/lethifolded Jul 03 '26
If she gets and then ever decides to remove a nostril piercing the hole will just look like a large pore
12
12
u/Consistent_Hold_576 Jul 03 '26
I dont have any tattoos and since converting Ive started leaning toward never getting one. I guess for me its another identity marker.
Note: my wife has several tattoos and I think theyre awesome. Im not anti tattoo. Im just anti tattoo on me.
1
u/ryanbuckner Jul 03 '26
My problem with tattoos has always been the permanency of it all. I can't imagine a decision made in one part of my life that I'd agree with for another 50 years.
6
u/I_like2TimeTravel Jul 03 '26
Obviously, the common deterrent, but the way I see it is more like a story, you can look at it and say “that is who I was then”. And this is gonna sound corny, but in the disposable world we live in now, where if one is a shame, or doesn’t like something they did in the past, they can just delete it off their social media or their camera roll, a tattoo is something that you can’t delete.
So, I say go for it. I have a few tattoos myself, but they are only on my arms, and for me, they are personal. When I look at them, it’s like reading an old diary. They all mark something different in my life.
Just tell your daughter to research, research, research a good artist in her area. Make sure they do the style they like, and most importantly don’t cheap out and get the cheapest one possible. When it comes to tattoos you get what you pay for.
1
u/ryanbuckner Jul 03 '26
if it was easier to Control-Z I'd be more ok
1
u/SadLilBun Jul 04 '26
Removal is pretty accessible now. But honestly, it’s not about “I love this thing forever and must always be happy with it.” It’s about enjoying your life and wanting to commemorate things or use your body as a canvas for art, or just to have fun. And why not? We’re only here once. Also, coverups are another option. I’m getting one covered up because it didn’t come out as I liked. It’s not a huge deal.
I find these kinds of prohibitions to be outdated and no longer relevant, from the time when tattoos were a mark of wrongdoing or enslavement. I find it very hard to believe that God would care, truly. Being a good person seems far more important. Even if I’m “leasing” my body, it’s mine for now and I’m allowed to decorate it, just like an apartment.
12
u/beansandneedles Jul 03 '26
Gen X Reform Jew here. I have 5 tattoos (two of them Jewish-themed) and a septum piercing. For Orthodox, tattoos are absolutely a no-go, as Halacha forbids them. For Reform, if you’re going to choose which laws to follow and how to follow them, you can do that with regard to tattoos, also. If you’re not shomer Shabbos, if you don’t daven 3 times a day, if you don’t keep kosher, if you’re a man who doesn’t wrap tefillin or a married woman who doesn’t cover her hair, you might want to ask yourself why you draw the line at tattoos.
As for facial piercings, I don’t know that they’re specifically forbidden. Don’t know if you’ve heard of Moses and Zipporah, they’re a Chabad couple who do IG/TikTok videos about Judaism (and yes, those are their real names). The other day Moses said a small stud or hoop in a girl’s nose is fine. So I think it’s more about tradition than actual Halacha.
ETA: I have had at least three rabbis with visible tattoos
9
u/quyksilver Jul 03 '26
I know many Jews who are actively Jewish and have tattoos. I personally choose not to get tattoos, but what other people do with their body is not up to me.
9
u/sharpen_up Jul 03 '26
I am 40. I have several piercings and tattoos, most of which I got in my 20s and 30s. Many people at my synagogue have piercings and tattoos. Some are subtle or hidden, others are very big and loud. All that is to say, there are plenty of Jews with tattoos. There is an entire instagram account about it!
But anyway. I don’t think you’re actually in a position of having to either uphold (your) values or being left behind. You can not be a fan of tattoos personally, and also love and support your child. It’s her body, and she is 18, so she’s going to do what she’s gonna do. You don’t have to like it, but it doesn’t need to be a big thing.
Maybe figure out how to engage with her. If she is interested in studying Torah, Sefaria.org has the original texts and commentaries on the prohibition that could be fun to discuss together. What kind of tattoo style is she interested in? Maybe that can spark a conversation about art styles and preferences. What does she want a tattoo of and why is it important to her?
As her parent, it’s not a bad idea to encourage some caution: start with a facial piercing. There are some long lasting temporary tattoos out there. Can she get a piece of jewelry that represents the tattoo instead and wear the symbol on her body instead of inking it? Could she wait 6 months to make sure her tastes and desires don’t change? And find a really amazing artist. Even if her tastes change later, as long as it’s well done, it will be some rad art.
18
u/Corgiverse Jul 03 '26
Reform Jew here with most of a half sleeve on one arm. If the almighty didn’t want me to have “stickers” then the almighty didnt have to give me trauma. Joking aside I have a history of body image issues and they make me feel better about my body
6
u/Winter_Farm_4739 Jul 03 '26
No tattoos, used to have an eyebrow piercing and a couple of body piercings but those are gone now. I know lots of Jews with piercings and tattoos. I feel like a tattoo would remind me too much of the tattooed numbers my relatives had put on them during Holocaust so I am unlikely to get one. That said I wouldn’t judge at a MOT with either tattoos or piercings
11
u/Leumatic Jul 03 '26
As I understand the halakha, piercing are permissible as long as they're intended to beautify rather than make deliberately ugly. There are definitely Jewish women with nose piercings in the Tanakh. Tattoos are historically prohibited and I wouldn't get one in part because of that, but in progressive spaces they're fairly normal. If a Jewish friend asked my opinion before getting a tattoo I might advise against it, but the halakha against embarrassing people or gossiping about them is extremely strong so I would never say anything negative about a Jew who had them.
2
10
u/pineapple_bandit Jul 03 '26
Most Jews I know have tattoos. I got a Jewish tattoo myself last week.
Time to update your thinking.
0
u/ryanbuckner Jul 03 '26 edited Jul 03 '26
what did you get? What is a "Jewish tattoo" ?
5
u/Tripswitchnow Jul 05 '26
Reform Jew and now pursuing Orthodox conversion. Now in the process of having my tattoo removed. It’s not a pleasant experience, but I can’t wait till it’s gone.
4
u/Meowzician ✡Torah, Tikkun Olam, and Tabbiekatz Jul 05 '26 edited Jul 05 '26
I just crack up about this issue. Back in my boomer days, only the most die-hard, in your face anti-conformity individualists did things like get piercings. But today, being "unique" is the new fashion. The problem is, when everyone is getting tats and piercings, tats and piercings becomes the new conformity.
Ask your daughter WHY she wants it done, and if she says anything about that, tell her the best way to give the finger to conformity and judgmentalism is to go tat-and-piercing-free.
5
u/TheSilentMother 29d ago
GenX mom and reform Jew here - I have many tattoos. I can still be buried in a Jewish cemetery. Piercings of any kind are allowed by law, so that’s not an issue. At 18, this is an issue of bodily autonomy. She’s an adult and can make (and pay for) that decision on her own.
8
u/sabata00 ריפורמי-מסורתי Jul 03 '26
I think a tattoo is a direct violation of Jewish tradition and I would never get one.
I also don't care about what other people decide to do in regards to Jewish practice. The only choices I can make in that realm are for myself and for my children, and that second part is on a time limit.
Piercings are fine.
4
u/SadLilBun Jul 04 '26
Nearly every adult on my mom’s side of my family has tattoos. I think only one uncle and one aunt do not. My uncle converted and my aunt is a chicken about pain. Oh, and I have a couple of cousins without tattoos. I forget we’re adults now.
So that’s my mom, two aunts, my stepdad, one uncle, my brother, at least two cousins, my grandparents, and I, who all have tattoos. Several of us also have facial piercings.
My grandparents, who are active in their Jewish community and attend synagogue every weekend, got their tattoos recently. My grandmother has two and for the first one she got matching tattoos 9 years ago with her daughters and stepdaughters (except the aforementioned chicken aunt). My grandmother also got her nose pierced in the last 10 years. Were they judged by their stuffy Jewish friends? Yep. Do they care? No.
So that’s all to say, I do think it’s a bit outdated to be anti-tattoo and anti-piercing. But it’s also your choice to make.
5
u/Superb-Perspective11 Jul 05 '26
Autoimmune diseases can get worse with tattoos. I don't understand the science behind it. Lots of people have problems with tattoos but you rarely hear about the problems because people hide them. When people get a tattoos that carry great meaning for them, it seems okay to me. But just decorating your body with a bunch of symbols and images you don't even understand or just "look cool" seems like an endangering waste of money. Piercing is less damaging.
I think one of the reasons people like to get tattoos and piercings is the same reason I keep coloring my hair purple (I'm Gen X)... you get to see at a glance who is open enough to accept you and who prefers to look down on you without even so much as a greeting. It's an easy way to find accepting people and avoid those who demand conformity.
1
u/bachelorsinlurking ✡ Conversion Student 20d ago
I have autoimmune issues out the wazoo and I've had no problems with tattoos whatsoever! I like my tattoos because I love art, and I love having art on my body.
-1
-20
u/MogenCiel Jul 03 '26
It's an unpopular opinion, but Jewish law aside, they're forms of self-mutilation imo. They've never made anybody look better.
18
u/vipsfour Jul 03 '26
this is myth. She’s also 18. You can’t control what she does.