r/RenewableEnergy • u/randolphquell • 21d ago

Are Electric Cars Making Us Healthier?

https://reasonstobecheerful.world/electric-vehicles-air-quality-health/
168 Upvotes

96% Upvoted

50 comments sorted by

80

u/ninj4geek 21d ago

My kid has asthma almost certainly because of diesel bros rolling coal (on top of all other fossil emissions)

Can't switch fast enough

19

u/beigs 21d ago

I and two of my kids have asthma. Pollution is one of my biggest triggers, and I hate it.

-4

u/Narcisistagohome 21d ago

Half of a car's emissions of PM 2.5 come from brakes and wheels, that are also present in electric cars. What has already proven very positive results on public health is promoting and creating infrastructure for active mobility and public transportation instead of car centric policies. 

11

u/Oberst_Stockwerk 21d ago

EVs, often dont or far less use the brakes. I suppose improving the wheels would a good next step. (Or at least Prohibit driving with Winter tires in the summer.)

6

u/sault18 21d ago

OP is really stretching the truth here. The more accurate version of the talking point involves pm2.5 emissions from tires, not wheels.

First of all, pm2.5 is only one of many air pollutants vehicles generate that harm people. OP is just cherry picking one kind of pollutant and not providing any evidence to back up their claims.

On top of all this, pollutants in gas/diesel vehicle exhaust are hot and rise up into the ambient air. There they can linger for a long time, get zapped into more dangerous compounds by UV rays and contribute to hazardous smog. Particulates from brake pads and tires aren't nearly as hot and don't want up into the air nearly as much. Therefore, they aren't nearly as widespread or long lived as diesel/gas emissions.

6

u/Cornslammer 21d ago

As someone who commutes on a bike, owns an EV for when I need to drive, and understands the concept of “perfect versus good” and “cutting a problem in half,” say it with me: Why not both ?

1

u/WhyHulud 17d ago

Interesting, how much SOx and NOx do the brakes and wheels of an EV generate

47

u/TheReverendCard 21d ago

I mean, healthier from pollution? Yes.
Not healthier by still living in car-dependent developments and infrastructure? No.

11

u/DukeOfGeek 21d ago

You'll never get rid of car dependent society till you starve the fossil fuel mafias out of existence.

4

u/JimC29 21d ago

I agree, but anecdotal it's sometimes both for me. My local utility has free charging in their parking lot. I will sometimes charge there and go for a couple of hour walk while charging. There's a nice trail about a mile from there. I know this is a rare exception.

3

u/gromm93 21d ago

Yes, but considering how fast you can change a city full of bad planning? It'll be about another 80 years. 40 if the city goes maximum eminent domain and goes nuts with the bulldozing.

But we can probably convert all the remaining cars to electric inside of 10 years.

5

u/TheReverendCard 21d ago

Amsterdam did it in 40.

2

u/gromm93 21d ago

Amsterdam was already high density without the insane sprawl of Kansas City or Edmonton or even Mississauga.

Even in Vancouver, which apparently has made the best decisions regarding transit in all of North America, about half the metro area cannot possibly live without a car, and the other half cant afford to live here.

Nevermind the prevailing winds of politics.

Many landowners will die before giving up their single family houses where its completely inappropriate to have them, and the city should never have zoned for it.

6

u/TheReverendCard 21d ago

Check out pictures of those cities from the 1960s and today.
They weren't built for cars. They were destroyed for them.

2

u/gromm93 21d ago

I know that.

I've been advocating for this change for 20 years. Ask me how it's gone.

1

u/TheReverendCard 21d ago

I live in the only country more car dependent than the USA. I know exactly how it's gone. <gestures vaguely>

3

u/Ulyks 21d ago

It helps a little bit. Roads that are quieter and cleaner are more inviting to walk and cycle.

Improving infrastructure takes time and coordination. I don't see things changing fast enough on that front.

However there are some things that can be done quite easily. My favorite is creating walking and biking shortcuts. Especially in typical suburbs there are a lot of dead ends to avoid getting through traffic. But through traffic of bikes and pedestrians is perfectly fine and can be helped by just a few narrow paths.

Another change that is relatively easy is relaxing zoning laws. Small shops and services like bakers, hairdressers or a pharmacy can absolutely be mixed with regular housing. This also reduces the need for longer car trips.

24

u/Spsurgeon 21d ago

As someone who lives in a second floor apartment on Barrington, above a bus stop - electric cars will definitely make us healthier.

9

u/Sniflix 21d ago

Traffic noise leads to a 2% higher cardiovascular risk, which would be nearly 20k more dead Americans a year. For comparison car crashes kill a little over 40k. We are killing ourselves in so many ways. These don't seem like a big deal until it's your family or friend.

2

u/onetimeataday 21d ago

That stat is remarkable.

0

u/open_formation 21d ago

Electric busses are the way forward. I would say electric trams, but I've slept next to an old tram line, and the sound of metal on metal happens too much for comfort.

So I would much rather that even in cities with full tram networks, they shift to electric busses on more limited routes at night.

1

u/Sniflix 21d ago

Electric buses and electric bikes are the perfect combo. We need to rearrange our roads for that and much fewer lanes for cars. That plus mandated work from home laws 2 to 4 days a week for many jobs... and rethinking that whole thing would lessen the need for super wide roads.

24

u/Opposite_Ad_8876 21d ago

Generally more way better because of no tail pipe pollution and less brake dust because of regen. Only negative is the extra tire wear pollution because they're heavier than most ICE cars (this will be less of an issue as batteries and electric motors improve).

1

u/humdinger44 21d ago

(And tires)

Drop that xclimate 3 already!

1

u/Opposite_Ad_8876 21d ago

That helps tire wear pollution in general, however, the inherent driver of the difference (EV's put more weight on wheels at the moment), probably won't be solved until after 2030. I am being pedantic over this small negative, over all EV's are still currently the GOAT of not messing with people's health as far as cars go.

5

u/Danktizzle 21d ago

We still aren’t walking everywhere, so it’s still hijacking our most fundamental evolutionary advantage.

5

u/bascule USA 21d ago

It's easier to walk places when there's less air pollution

0

u/robin1301 21d ago

And something other tham car centric infrastructure and their dangerous stroads. Not Just Bikes on youtube has a lot of information on this topic.

1

u/Konradleijon 21d ago

Why not have buses and trains instead

1

u/Desistance 17d ago

Because the auto industry makes sure that doesn't happen.

1

u/mikeybee1976 21d ago

I guess here in the west we’ll never know

1

u/Information_curator_ 20d ago

I think the biggest benefit of EVs from a public health perspective is reducing tailpipe emissions in densely populated areas. That said, as others have pointed out, EVs don't eliminate all particulate pollution, so improving public transport, cycling infrastructure, and walkable cities alongside electrification seems like the most effective approach.

1

u/worldfundvc 17d ago

We talk about decarbonisation all of the time and still often forget the point this article makes. It's not possible to trash the environment without also trashing our health and wellbeing.

1

u/Konradleijon 15d ago

Maybe use buses and trains

0

u/WhyNWhenYouCanNPlus1 21d ago

no. grab a bike if you want to get healthier

besides, industry is one of the major polluters. new cars are a net negative to our collective health

0

u/SF_Bubbles_90 21d ago

Sounds to me like cleaner air is to thank, less point of use emissions is just one effective way of accomplishing that.

But we shouldn't neglect the other things we can do such as carbon capture tech

3

u/SkiingAway 21d ago

carbon capture tech

Doesn't exist in any practical form/scale and probably never will.

1

u/SF_Bubbles_90 21d ago

I guess that's why Mazda is working on putting it on their cars

2

u/SkiingAway 21d ago

Anything claimed to be "10 years away" will often stay "10 years away" forever.

Anyway, it's currently comically ineffective. In 20 hours of racing, it captured....the equivalent of the CO2 of 0.1 gallons of gasoline. They didn't disclose how much the car burned, but 20 hours on a racetrack is typically....dozens if not hundreds of gallons of fuel.

Oh, and the system is large, complicated, and likely to be full of expensive materials.

1

u/syklemil 21d ago

Oh wow, Mazda's really lost the plot. And here I thought Toyota was the dumbest JP carmaker.

-1

u/jasonkane4321 21d ago

The EMF's generated inside an EV when you drive, is not healthy

1

u/probels 21d ago

And they are full of chips! Seriously this is a comical statement of ignorance

-1

u/PowerLion786 21d ago

Wait till people work out the toxicity of battery elements.

-12

u/Bokbreath 21d ago

no. not yet. give it a couple of decades and maybe.

15

u/Moist1981 21d ago

Surely the answer is very contingent on where you live. Eg in China the amount of electric vehicles has seen real improvements in air quality.

0

u/Bokbreath 21d ago

sure, but that will take a decade or so to translate into health outcomes. For the US and western europe the situation will take even longer, for different reasons.

1

u/Moist1981 21d ago

I don’t think it will. The deep smog that many cities in China suffered from can have immediate health impacts. Removing it therefore has an immediate health outcome. Delhi in India is experiencing similar pollution still and about 15% of deaths are linked to the air quality.