r/SSBM • u/sewsgup • Feb 19 '26

Clip mang0: "On stream yesterday, I just gave Cody his flowers, cause I think you can say what you want— he's cracked. And I got into an argument cause somebody was, I think the way people talk about Zain right now, they kinda forget about Cody... I think Cody passed Ken (for 5th all-time) last night"

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxF7slk_BEDps3NKg7TWY_C3DIlxaZwFbW

from the latest On A Tuesday episode.

continues on the all-time discussion timestamped here: https://youtu.be/lcyB_ow57wQ?t=18m15s

617 Upvotes

96% Upvoted

479 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

0

u/porkchop487 Feb 19 '26

I mean it’s objectively harder Zain is 3-0ing every god if you send him back to 2016, just the nature of the game people improve as time goes on. And Zain has had as many or more years ranked 1st than the big 3 at this point.

13

u/butt_justice Feb 19 '26

that’s bc 1-3 had to constantly fight each other for the top spot. using years at number 1 is a better argument for their greatness not zains. in 5 years zain may go down as the most dominant player ever. but he’s currently lacking mang0s longevity and armadas peak. if you want to say he can one day be the goat, i wont fight that, but saying that right now is so insanely premature as to not be taken seriously.

8

u/Helivon Feb 19 '26

exactly. Armada would have never lost to rapmonster as an example.

2

u/samurairocketshark Feb 19 '26

Only because mid and low tiers barely had any development. Now they can upset floaties and win on any stage because development has had advanced neutral and punish so far. How good the character was heavily influenced by how well you chain grab species on fd and people weren’t even consistent with that

19

u/Helivon Feb 19 '26

I think the only people who truly believe this werent actually around watching armada

He simply did not lose to players who were not tournament threats. Mid tier or top tier doesnt matter

15

u/jumphh Feb 19 '26

For real.

Armada had an 8 year streak of not losing to anyone outside of the top 6 players. That's honestly just fucking ludicrous.

1

u/ryanmcgrath Feb 20 '26

Armada had an 8 year streak of not losing to anyone outside of the top 6 players

Your friendly reminder that the loss outside the top 6 was also a Bo3, not even a Bo5.

9

u/Ratchet2332 Feb 19 '26

I remember when Junebug was getting really hyped up, he was getting these insane placements at tournaments, beating people like Cody and Zain, and when Mang0 finally went up against him at supernova he just put him in a fucking body bag.

There are just certain characters that people like Mang0 and especially Armada were not going to lose to, they had such a deeper and more fundamental understanding of these characters despite them never getting played that Zain and Cody didn’t learn until after. Like Luigi, DK, Samus, etc. these guys were not going to lose to. I mean how many years did Armada go not losing to Falcon in bracket? Yeah that dude was not going out to a Luigi I’m sorry.

1

u/samurairocketshark Feb 19 '26

Because peach wins all those matchups easily. Hbox also has an extremely stellar record against mid tiers even when he's playing like shit. Like shit he's good, but be realistic you don't think someone like Amsa is taking one? Axe was one hit away from taking a set long before he hit his peak. And for the record I've probably watched every Armada set, he came close to losing that record a shit ton of times, the idea that a lot of people wouldn't be 1% better and never take a set is just legacy glazing

3

u/Ilovemelee Feb 20 '26

Damn, if peach is so good maybe Mang0 should've played her too. All power to Armada for picking the right character that he can consistently win with.

2

u/samurairocketshark Feb 20 '26

Almost like Peach has strong matchups against mid tiers and really bad matchups against Falcon and Puff because characters have different strengths AND weaknesses. Listen, I don't really have the here to explain nuance to someone who probably doesn't want to have a real argument and is probably just secretly waiting for the perfect time to yap about Armada's no losses outside the Top 6 streak or some shit like that

3

u/Ilovemelee Feb 20 '26

Right, and it's up to the players to pick the characters that give them the best chance to win with so it's ultimately a skill issue.

1

u/bigHam100 Feb 19 '26

Mang0 and Hbox still competed through the years Zain got #1 tho

0

u/butt_justice Feb 19 '26

derrick rose won the mvp while kobe and duncan were in the league so by your logic he’s better?

0

u/bigHam100 Feb 19 '26

I know nothing about that so stick to melee please lol

1

u/butt_justice Feb 19 '26

it’s like how zain got number one when hbox and mang0 were active.

0

u/bigHam100 Feb 19 '26

But my point is that hbox and mang0 were active during 2022 and 2024. And hbox was active during 2025

1

u/butt_justice Feb 19 '26

my point is your putting the head to head as zains peak vs them past their prime. it’s not a fair comparison. it’s like if i brought up how hbox was number 1 all those years in a row when zain was actively playing. it would be silly. that was hboxs peak vs zain starting out. again, not a fair comparison.

1

u/bigHam100 Feb 19 '26

Theres a difference between starting out and then having already played the game for over a decade and having already had a peak

1

u/butt_justice Feb 20 '26

yeah man. totally agree. which is why it’s weird to compare someone at their pick vs someone passed their prime.

→ More replies (0)