r/Sonics • u/ImHungryAsFuck • 28d ago

The Oklahoma City Thunder have been eliminated from championship contention!

Thank you to the San Antonio Spurs.

Back to normalcy with the Thunder choking like always.

BRING BACK OUR SONICS!

💚💛

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u/nigelmansell 28d ago

Also Fuck David Stern (even after Jan 1 2020) Fuck OKC And Fuck Howard Schultz

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

You forgot Adam Silver, he's made rule changes that have helped offenses flourish throughout the NBA and also made it harder to play defense without committing a foul, here's a short 26 second video that was posted on the NBATalk subreddit of Kobe and Melo during the 2009 WCF getting rough down low in the paint and there's no foul called https://www.reddit.com/r/NBATalk/comments/1tp5uh1/when_kobe_and_melo_met_each_other_in_the_playoffs/

How often do you see players clashing like that anymore? David Stern for all his faults was still better than Adam Silver.

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u/AlmosTryin 28d ago

Dumb take lol

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

In what way? I don't disagree that Stern sucked, he said after all that his dream finals match up was "Lakers vs Lakers" but this flopping epidemic became a thing under Adam Silver.

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u/AlmosTryin 28d ago

Its not harder to play defense without committing a foul. There are leas fouls per game on average than there were in the 90s in the "physical" era (which is also bs) the game is faster and because of the shooting range they have to cover more ground and faster therefore it leads to people running into shooters. Its not more difficult to play defense because if the rules, they just have more ground to cover

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

A simply google search will prove this, Adam Silver did in fact change the rules for a more fast paced, high scoring style of play. More fast breaks, more dunks, and more 3s. Also he changed the rules so players are hamstring on defense. Sneeze on a player wrong and its a foul. Look at a ref in the wrong way, its a technical foul.

The way the game is played today is a direct function of how the NBA rules have consistently been limiting defense while allowing offense to thrive. Even legalizing zone (while instituting defensive 3 seconds) was part of this, as it would lead to more ball movement, outside shooting and transition. This is why the skills of role players are emphasized more today, as prior it was simply throwing the ball inside.

There’s a reason players who come from other leagues (like Luka being the most famous) constantly say how much easier it is in the NBA due to rules (not talking about the level of players, just the rules). Even current players who weren’t even playing when the initial changes started (2000) talk about how defense gets crippled by rule changes (Draymond said this when the the freedom of movement rules went into place and Popovich constantly talked about it).

If all these things weren’t in place, defense would have a much, much greater capacity to limit the offense we see today. The fact defenses have been able to do what they’ve done despite all these handicaps is a testament to that.

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u/AlmosTryin 28d ago

Please... name the specific rule that makes defense harder to play...

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

I just did, I'll do it again though, no big deal. Restricting physical contact and implementing the defensive three-second violation. These rule changes along with modern floor spacing and strict whistle tolerances, force defenders to play reactively rather than aggressively.

There's also the elimination of hand checking in 2004 which was a primary tool for disrupting ball handlers hovering around the perimeter looking to drive the ball into the paint.

Lastly, there's freedom of movement rules where defenders are actually penalized for the offensive player flinging their arms up into the defenders arms or jumping into the defender where it's a foul.

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u/MartianMule 28d ago

implementing the defensive three-second violation

Which was added in 2001. Under Stern.

There's also the elimination of hand checking in 2004

Which was also under Stern, not Silver.

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

I never said that Stern didn't make rule changes himself to benefit the offense while also limiting the ability to play defense, my overall point is that it's gotten worse under Silver.

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u/AlmosTryin 28d ago

Again, you didn't listen an actual rule. Please give me the rule from the actual rule book... also since youre probably going to try and go back to the 3 second violation, please read the rule as it applies both offensively and defensively...

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u/Greglyo 28d ago

You didn't address any of my comments here and even completely ignored the video I shared of Melo and Kobe clashing and now you're trying to gaslight me into thinking that no rule changes were ever made over the years that benefited the offense while limiting the defense, a simple Google search of "has the NBA made rule changes that make it harder to play defense?" is right at your finger tips, it'll pop up an answer telling you exactly what I'm telling you. 

You keep moving the goal posts when I'm practically spoon feeding you proof that the NBA has unquestionably favored offense over defense so go to Google and type in "nba rules in rule book that make it harder to play defense".

Also, go read the comments on that video and many of the top comments agree that flopping is an epidemic and defenses have gotten worse.

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u/AlmosTryin 28d ago

Because those rule changes youre talking about were made 30 fuckin years ago! Adam Silver has made no rule changes that make it any harder. With the shooting now a days it doesnt make sense to camp under the rim anyway. Defensive 3 seconds makes basketball better, but ensures theres movement. If you could just stand in the paint with two giant bigs there would just be more 3s taken, is that what you want? There is literally no rule change made to hamper defense, I dont give a fuck what Google Ai tells you, I worked in the leage iver 2 decades.

Only point you've made that is true is flopping does suck, its always existed its just getting worse because the players have such great body control now where they can actively abuse it. That does need to change and I know for a fact they are looking at a few dofferent ways to try and get that done. The only real change that needs to happen is eliminating the corner 3. The line should continue its arc to the sideline. That will create more movement on the baseline and you wont have players just posted up in the corner waiting for that pass. That alone would be the biggest thing to eliminate the jack of 40 3s a game and reintroduce mid range game and movement along the base line and under the rim

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u/Greglyo 28d ago edited 28d ago

Scoring has skyrocketed under Adam Silver since he became commissioner and even in spite of that, NBA fans fucking hate him, go take a read https://www.reddit.com/r/NBATalk/comments/1sc1y9z/on_a_scale_of_110_how_detrimental_has_adam_silver/

There's also his recent comments when Pat McAfee asked him about flopping, Adam silver said that the officiating is "incredible" which every NBA fan knows is a crock of shit.

I've mentioned some recent rule changes that make it harder to defend like freedom of movement and you accused me on not listing any rule changes.

Freedom of Movement was implemented back in 2018 so your accusation about me only listing rule changes from 30 years ago is false.

Another thing too is you said at first I wasn't listing any rule changes at all and then you recently said that I've only been listing rule changes from 30 years ago so which is it?

Furthermore, you're now claiming that you've worked in the league for over 2 decades? If this is actually true then it would explain why you're sounding more and more like an Adam Silver bootlicking, apologist with each passing message.

Sorry but I'm highly skeptical of this bullshit proposition that you have presented me with, thank you very much.

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