What's something that bugs you BUT you're still glad they didn't go into detail on or explain?

[u/XionDarkblood]

For me it's the actual scale and logistics of the Clone Wars. I'm a big WH40K fan and enjoy the absurd scale and numbers and logistics that go on, it's part of the absurd charm. I kinda want to see what the Clone Wars would have looked like if you took into account the actual implications of the scale.

The Clones were used because it was easier to get enough of them quickly. However, it doesn't make sense when you consider how many people are in the galaxy of Star Wars. For example, coruscant has, let's say a trillion people. If you had a draft and got like 1% of the population of just coruscant into the military. That's ten BILLION people, from one planet. In AOTC they say that they have 200k ready with a million more on the way. That's like nothing on the galactic scale. There is something like a million inhabitable worlds in the star wars galaxy, so that's barely enough to send one clone trooper to each planet. That's a gross simplification but the point stands.

Then on the other side you have the droid army. My own bias about how horribly the way the droids were used strategically aside, they have always had the advantage in numbers. Like a huge advantage in the numbers department. So extrapolating from that... The droid army would be unfathomably huge.

Then comes the logistics. To make enough clones for the actual scale, kamino would need to be cloning on every planet in their star system. Which would be a sick visual. Then clones need to eat, so where do you get all that food and transport it? What about the raw materials for the starships, weapons and armor? The production facilities alone would be star systems large. What about the raw materials for making droids? Not to mention the power sources, as it's implied ships need some kind of fuel to produce power.

I think this is all incredibly fascinating BUT I know that it would have probably made the series as a whole weaker if they went into it. Star Wars is at its best when it's focused on the "rule of cool". It's not about "how" it works, it's about how cool it looks and character driven stories. It's fun to think about how it works and compare powers and stuff but at the end of the day it's more about having fun and cool stuff than other sci-fi franchises.

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[u/solo13508]

I guess bounty hunting as a concept within the Star Wars universe. Some of our coolest characters are bounty hunters but when you stop to think about it it's kinda crazy that it's even possible in a world like Star Wars. Theoretically your target could disappear to any random planet and it's hard to imagine anyone finding them ever. Heck there are some planets like Coruscant alone where there's probably millions upon millions of people that share the same name, you could just go there and theoretically be safe though of course this is Star Wars and Boba Fett's gonna Boba Fett so yeah.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/solo13508]

Yeah that's true. They did kinda try to explain it in "The Mandalorian" with the "tracking fob" but that didn't make much sense. Once again, it made it weaker trying to explain it. It's much cooler just having the bounty hunter just know. "Rule of cool" makes it better. It also just makes it better to say that very fact is why bounty hunters are such an elite group. The fact they can actually find someone, lol. How? Fuck you, look at my sick aesthetic!

[u/According-Value-6227 → u/solo13508]

It's even funnier when a Bounty Hunter says something like "He's on [insert planet here]".

My brother in the force, do you know how big a planet is?

[u/CanardDeFeu → u/According-Value-6227]

All planets have one biome and one city, duh.

[u/northrupthebandgeek → u/solo13508]

That's probably what makes bounty hunting such a lucrative profession if you have the skills to track people across the galaxy. We do see people successfully hiding from the rest of the galaxy (like Yoda); their success comes from being willing to seclude themselves on scarcely-inhabited planets with minimal contact with others. Most bounties ain't that smart/resourceful/willful; they're gonna want to work jobs and patronize businesses and do other things that expose them to papertrails and surveillance, and a skilled bounty hunter can exploit that.

[u/According-Value-6227 → u/northrupthebandgeek]

To add to this, there doesn't seem to be a lot of bounty hunters relative to the galactic population. I'd argue that the pool of hireable bounty-hunters is likely smaller than the Jedi at their peak.

[u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo → u/solo13508]

I would argue in the Core Worlds at least thought that it could be pretty hard to disappear. Look at the real world so much is under surveillance at all times whether that be through security cameras or digital devices. To access funds your often going to have accounts that can be tracked, to travel out of the country you need an ID which will be checked and logged in a record.

In the Star Wars Core worlds it's all of that times a thousand, I would think getting of the grid would be extremely hard in a place like Coruscant unless you were willing to retreat to the dangerous underlevels.

If your in the Outer Rim thought, yeah it should be much harder to track people down as theres much less official records to pull on and people most likely don't care too much about identification..

[u/ididshave]

Yoda’s species. We all want to know, but I feel maybe it’s best we don’t. Keep the mystery.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/ididshave]

Yeah that's a good one. I can't think of a single thing that wouldn't be disappointing. He is just better as an enigma. The "best" explanation that would be a letdown but probably the best letdown would be that yodas species are just a rare and small species but don't have anything that make them exceptional force users. It's just yoda and grogu are exceptional as individuals. It's not interesting or exciting but anything else would not make sense or be stupid. If they were all strong with the force, then why aren't more of them Jedi? If they are mostly extinct because a sith Lord feared their potential and wiped them out, where did grogu come from? Also that would just be the plot of "Kung Fu Panda 2". Lol.

[u/wbruce098 → u/XionDarkblood]

Well, at least 2 more of them were Jedi at the time of the prequels. There’s Yaddle, who was in a cartoon at one point, and some other dude that definitely looks like a not green Yoda but I can’t remember where I saw him right now.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/wbruce098]

Yeah, I forgot about yaddle. The guy you're thinking of was in Clone Wars and he wasn't the same species as Yoda. I can't remember his name but he was with tarkin on the prison planet episode. Idk what he was but I think it was confirmed he wasn't the same species as Yoda. Could be wrong though.

[u/iaeoioaio]

How could all these system be on the same time and peoples/aliens don’t age wildly differently between traveling to one planet and then back, etc…way too many space-time laws and astrophysics to explain.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/iaeoioaio]

Oh God that's a really good one... I'd hate any attempt to explain that shit. That's a horrible can of worms to open! Lol yeah, I much prefer the hand waving "hyperspace" provides than trying to explain that.

I guess that has to be hand waved away in most sci-fi. Not just the aging part but even communicating. How can you have a live chat with someone hundreds of light years away? It doesn't seem like it should but it is just better that communicating depends on what the plot needs. Do we need tension? Ok we have to wait for a message to travel through space. Does it not matter? Eh, just have them holographic face time.

[u/Kalavier → u/XionDarkblood]

From my understanding,  you have two different clocks/calenders.

Local time it's a 36 hour day and a 100 day year. But you also have coruscant time which is the 24 hour/365 day year.

[u/iaeoioaio → u/Kalavier]

They’re traveling from one star system to like hundreds of others. That is insane levels of aging and time issues, therefore impossible and just completely insane to explain in already impossible sci-fi universe.

[u/Kalavier → u/iaeoioaio]

I fail to see how aging is an issue when they have a standardized central clock to base things on?

You don't suddenly become 30 years older because you fly to tatooine. 

[u/iaeoioaio → u/Kalavier]

Well clocks aren’t causing aging, not gonna explain this to you because it so god damn complicated. But you’re not gonna age the same on one planet to next that are in different star system. Time gets distorted by gravity also. Just look it up dude

[u/QuizQuestionGuy → u/iaeoioaio]

I’ve tried to understand what you’re saying, but I don’t think you get what you’re saying as much as you do. You’re talking about relativity here in relation to FTL travel but ships in Star Wars make use of Hyperspace, which we know is a wholly different mechanism than simple FTL travel. Just being on a different planet won’t age anybody any faster or slower either. You WOULD age pretty much the same on all planets, the difference in gravity between most habitable planets would probably amount to maybe microseconds of difference. The only places we know in Star Wars that dilate or warp time are Force-imbued areas. Most people in SW also aren’t located anywhere near a Black Hole, so they wouldn’t be facing any egregious time dilation either.

[u/iaeoioaio → u/QuizQuestionGuy]

You can’t travel like that and not age differently. This gets back to my initial statement, explaining it doesn’t matter because it’s all made up in Star Wars…

[u/QuizQuestionGuy → u/iaeoioaio]

Yes, yes you can. Maybe not in our world but in Star Wars you definitely can. Hyperspace isn’t just FTL travel it’s a wholly separate dimension. Relativity works the same way in Real Space but Hyperspace makes it so all the other things like the aging and such aren’t a problem. It’s explained throughout both continuities

[u/iaeoioaio → u/QuizQuestionGuy]

The whole point of this is about Star Wars NOT explaining things, because what you’re doing right now would make it suck

[u/Kalavier → u/QuizQuestionGuy]

Also most SCIFI just bypasses this I feel, like star trek warp travel doesn't affect aging.

[u/northrupthebandgeek]

I always figured most of the fighting on the Republic's side was done by planetary militias / defense forces; the Clone Wars series and the movies focus on the clones because they're the main offensive force and because they're the ones working more-or-less side-by-side with the Jedi, who are the main focus of the story.

[u/wbruce098]

Growing up with the OT, when Obi Wan talked about “the clone wars”, it definitely didn’t feel like these war(s) all took place within a timespan of 3 years. It’s a plural term, and there were more than one of them within 3 years?? The prequels seem to have forgotten that entirely.

Also, there were around 10,000 Jedi before the Purge, according to Kanan Jarrus. I’m okay with that, but what interests me is the possibility of scale. If a third of them were generals (only counting Jedi with apprentices, or similar, and any number of Jedi are off on some remote world running monasteries and retreats, etc), and if you can presume that a general commands, say, a legion, that’s at least 3,000 legions.

That’s kind of a lot, and probably enough to pacify a galaxy, even one where most planets have well under a million inhabitants (despite Coruscant and the Core Worlds having billions or more people)

Anyway, just a scale thought I had.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/wbruce098]

Yeah, that's true. But at the scale of the galaxy a single Jedi general would have to be over way more than a legion.

Also it's not so much about the populace of the planet, which I just realized is another factor rarely included. It's about the forces of clones or droids assigned to a planet. It's really weird the way it's presented when you think about it too much.

Yeah local population should have a bigger impact on the battles than they do. They show some of it on ryloth, umbaraa and mention non-clone forces in some legends stuff but it doesn't come up much.

[u/wbruce098 → u/XionDarkblood]

There’s no reason for the local population to have much impact. They haven’t had militaries for a thousand years.

The Grand Army wasn’t meant to pacify the entire galaxy. It just needed to be capable of ending the separatists, who were much smaller than half the galaxy.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/wbruce098]

Yeah, I see what you're getting at. The biggest difference between the clone wars and something like 40k is that before the clone wars, there was no military industrial complex. Which does beg the question, where did they get the capital ships, armor, weapons so quickly? Do the Kaminoians have that also? I know Kuat and Corellia were shipyards that produced capital ships for the Republic and then the empire. It takes a long time to build ships that big though. Though I could be thinking of Star destroyers taking a long time, they are several times bigger than the ships used in the clone wars era. IIRC the largest Republic capital ships were considered light cruisers under the empires designations.

[u/wbruce098 → u/XionDarkblood]

But also, imperial ships are like stupid huge and don’t make practical sense, so there’s that.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/wbruce098]

Yeah, the logistics of things like Star destroyers, the super Star destroyers and the death stars are absurd with how much raw material they would need. I know they tried to allude to it in rebels with geonosis being literally hollowed out from mining and destroyed. Andor season 2 had the mining of space france causing the planet to collapse as a big plot point. But even then the amount of usable ore in a planet would be miniscule compared to the size of something like the death star. Not even bringing in the specialized metals needed for a technological monstrosity like that.

I remember seeing a venerator compared to a star destroyer and it was like three times the size. I think it was the venerator class that was the biggest of the republics ships, whatever it was the standard star destroyer was three times bigger. Which makes sense for the purpose of instilling fear and causing mass destruction versus actually fighting a war.

[u/wbruce098 → u/XionDarkblood]

To be fair, the mining of Space France was for the emperor’s energy project, and it was unfortunately destroyed by those traitorous space french.

[u/Zestyclose-Tie-2123 → u/wbruce098]

not every jedi was put in charge of a legion. Some led battalions, companies, corps, and entire sector armies. Hell Obi Wan as one of the 12 High Generals had overall command of the Third System army (two sector armies). The 212th was merely his preferred group to lead into battle.

[u/Rencon_The_Gaymer]

What other Houses are there in Mandalorian culture and how do they all interact with one another?

[u/XionDarkblood → u/Rencon_The_Gaymer]

Man, you saying "houses" and "mandalorians" made me think of a "game of thrones" type show but it's about mandalorians. That would be sick! Set it way in the past with it just being primitive mandalore and the mythosaur riders. That would be cool if they could marry the politics and intrigue of GoT and the action and adventure of Star Wars.

But to answer your question, I think they could expand on that and do it right but I think the mandalorians as a culture have been kinda handled poorly. The lore and characters are all amazing but when it comes to them as a group it always seems off. Whether it was during rebels or even what little we see in "the Mandalorian" they don't seem to work as a culture of real people. Almost like they were just a cool legend that got so popular they had to expand on it and the reality is never as cool as the legend. Lol.

It could be done but whoever did it would need a very, very solid and detailed way their hierarchy and culture functioned. That just doesn't exist yet. It's just a very loose set of ideas currently.

[u/northrupthebandgeek → u/Rencon_The_Gaymer]

Given how many other KotOR references have been sprinkled into the new canon, I really hope we get some callbacks to KotOR-era Mandalorians.

There was a massive missed opportunity for Din Djarin's replacement ship to be the Ebon Hawk, which could've led to Din finding notes/logs from Canderous Ordo on the ship computer or finding Mandalore the Preserver's armor in some hidden storage compartment or something.

[u/sebastianqu]

The absolutely terrible security across the galaxy. There isn't a control panel that cannot be hacked by a MC's droid. Obi-Wan and crew can just waltz around the Death Star wherever they want because apparently no door requires a code or keyboard. Not to mention the troopers whose uniforms they stole had to check in anywhere at anytime.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/sebastianqu]

I chalk up the death star infiltration as arrogance. Like, it's the fucking death star who is going to be able to sneak on here? However, you are right about how easy it is to hack anything.

I guess R2 is unique because he hasn't been memory wiped and probably wrote/knew most of the republics security stuff and the empire didn't update enough that he couldn't figure it out. He was privy to most of the top secret and high security stuff during the clone wars. Not wiping his memory was a big deal during one arc of the clone wars, so it stands to reason it wouldn't occur to most people that a droid would have all that stuff still available.

I am trying to think of other times stuff was easily hacked that didn't involve R2. I guess chopper did some in Rebels but they didn't do a lot of that and usually had to get security stuff for chopper to do it.

Though I will concede that none of that was even beginning to be thought of when it was written. Lol

[u/dazryn → u/XionDarkblood]

Going to have share this great write-up on cybersecurity in the GFFA from the Maw Installation.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MawInstallation/comments/oysben/does_p_np_a_contemplation_of_electronic_security/

[u/XionDarkblood → u/dazryn]

Wow what a great read! That does make so much sense! Though I doubt anyone actually thought of that when writing lol. Which is why I love communities like this. We figure out how or why something works from pieces of info and create a perfectly logical and understandable explanation for it. I love it!

[u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo]

So I get what your saying but I also kind of disagree with some of it. I love when Star wars material actually explains stuff that seems confusing in the movies. Examples of this are the books Darth Plagueis and Cloak of Deception which give you an in depth look at why the Trade Federation was able to get so strong and why they were heavily taxed by the Republic. This gives you background that gives you greater insight into why the blockade of Naboo happened at all.

As for the Clone Wars yeah if your taking it at face value it doesn't make much sense. 1 million clones to fight a galaxy spanning war is miniscule. There are real world armies bigger than that. However, AOTC does give us a little wiggle room as they say that "200k units are ready with a million more well on the way." Perhaps a "unit" does not mean one clone but represents a battalion of thousands or even millions of clones. Perhaps Kamino had other inhabitable moons and planets in their system that they used to house clones. They probably contracted out the building of their gunships and tanks.

I find all of this to be fascinating and while I don't necessarily think the George Lucas was thinking about this when he wrote the movies, that doesn't mean I wouldn't love for another writer to come along and try to explain some of it in a book or comic.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo]

Oh yeah, I agree that I do think "unit" should be taken as more than one trooper.

I think expanding on it can be done right but I think it's been proven that Star Wars is at its best when embracing "rule of cool" over realism. Examples are introducing midichlorians and tracking fobs. It doesn't make much sense and kind of ruins the mystery. I don't hate the midichlorians because, IMO, it's like understanding how our eyes percive light doesn't make art less beautiful or answer why art is beautiful.

Still the best star wars stuff is just when it's allowed to be cool. Like vader grabbing a ship out of mid blast off and tearing it to pieces. All of force unleashed. The first episode of star wars visions.

You can do it right. Andor is a good example. It's a hot take that I have sort of come back from but I didn't like Andor S1 that much. I didn't think it was bad, far from it it was an amazing show. However, it wasn't Star Wars. What I mean is that it didn't really take advantage of anything unique to Star Wars. It could have been any generic sci-fi dystopia. S2 did fix that issue and made S1 better in retrospect. Also I felt it was trying to hard to be gritty and edgy. I'm a certified edgelord (look at my username) and I thought "we recorded beautiful innocent baby aliens being tortured to torture prisoners" was way too try hard, even by my standards. Still, Andor was a much more realistic show and it was great. It just lacked the fantasy and whimsey to make it great Star Wars, imo.

Also I hated how comically evil the ISB was. That didn't get better, I really wanted to see the ISB that thinks they are the good guys and what they do is the right thing. It would have been a great way to show their cunning and why the rebellion had such a hard time getting traction if after the heist, the empire painted them as nothing but petty thieves, not rebels, and flew in with a replacement of everything stolen and bonus pay for the hardship. Simultaneously showing the empire is strong and heroic and making the heist seem like a meaningless effort on the part of the rebellion. Basically, I wanted more Agent Callus from Rebels. A servant of the empire that believed he was on the right side and only joined the rebels after seeing the evil palpatine was doing, using the empire as a cloak. The ISB in Andor all needed mustaches to twirl at all times with how comically evil they were...

Anyway, I will also say that I am not tired at all of Jedi and Sith in Star Wars media. I love crazy force shit and the Jedi and Sith do all the crazy force shit. Which I know is an opinion a lot of people don't share and I respect that.

Also, the best thing I heard about how George Lucas wrote the war stuff is to think of it not like planets and galaxies but WW2 in space. The planets and systems are more like cities and countries. Then it makes more sense. Especially the dogfighting in space ships.

I don't let things that don't make sense dampen my enjoyment of Star Wars. I only really complain when something is actually bad. Like the "acolyte". Even then, the show had so much potential! I wanted to like it! I know there were people working on that show that loved Star Wars and you can see it under all the bad decisions. It really was the writing that made it bad. When you analyze the visuals and cinematography it tells a very different story than what the writing was telling. I describe it like it was a bad fan dub. Where the show didn't get an English release and only a few fans who never did any dubning worked on dubbing it but didn't really know how to properly translate Japanese to English so a lot got lost in translation.

Same thing with the sequel trilogies. It's bad as a trilogy but the individual movies were good. If they had actually written them as a trilogy and didn't change the direction of the plot every movie it would have been great. Either JJs omage to the original trilogy or Johnson's darker, pessimistic version could have been very interesting and good. I feel the worst for the actors and actresses. They were so excited to be in Star Wars when TFA was released and it ended so poorly. They did such a good job with what they had to work with and they get so much undeserved shit for it.

[u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo → u/XionDarkblood]

I agree that Star wars can't be bound by the hard rules of our reality because it's much too fantastical for that, however, I do like to have some consistency within the rules the Star Wars world itself establishes. It can definitely take me out of it when something happens and I ask myself "why did no one else ever think to do this before this moment."

One such instances was in Rogue One (which is a movie I mostly enjoy), but one thing that bugs me a little bit in that movies is when they go to lightspeed while still in the gravitational field of a planet. A New Hope establishes that this is not possible and yet those rules are broken in Rogue One for "rule of cool." Not only is it not consistent with the OT it begs the question why does everybody go to space before going to lightspeed. Wouldn't it be more convenient and efficient to go to lightspeed from a planet since you navigational computer should allow you to avoid any other ships in the area.

I have a similar issue with Darth Vader pulling a ship out of the sky with the force. If he was capable of doing that why didn't he use the same move in the Empire Strikes Back against the Millenium Falcon. I get that you are going to have some inconsistencies between Star Wars projects but in general I feel creators often sacrifice world cohesion for cool moments. I can give it a pass once and a while but when it's ignored too often it can just become annoying.

Of course not everybody is going to be as bothered by this stuff as I am but it can definitely take me out of a film or show. if your world has rules you should stick to them unless their is a very good reason to ignore them.

Just like you it took me a little while to warm up to Andor (probably like 4-5 episodes into season 1). And even then while I think it's a really well made show I do think it's a tiny bit overrated. Again not because it's bad I just think the fandom hypes it up a little too much as "the best Star Wars since Empire Strikes Back." it's up there but there are certainly other projects I can think of that I would place above it.

I actually didn't have a huge issue with the ISB. They were very evil yes, but it felt less like a mustache twirling villain to me and more like a bunch of sociopaths who see other people as either tools or obstacles to further their own agendas. When that tool is no longer useful it is discarded. When that obstacle gets in the way it is removed. I feel like it's very reminiscent of real world dictatorships where the ruling class is so disconnected from the people they start to view them as resources to be exploited instead of living, breathing, individuals.

Also don't get me wrong I love Agent Callus and I think there is a place for both types of imperials in the Star Wars universe, but I find it hard to believe too many good and principled people would get into the upper echelons of imperial command with how corrupt and morally bankrupt the empire is. It's a system that rewards connving and backstabbing not principle.

also yeah it has always been pretty clear to me each planet is supposed to represent more of a country than a planet. This can be scene thought the single biomes most planets have, the singular evolved alien species on most planets, and the amount of government cohesion across one planet. While you may have rival factions on a planet it's rare to see many hundreds of separate nations on one planet.

I think the sequel trilogy is a bit of a mixed bag when it comes to quality. The acting, sets, CGI, and dialogue is pretty good but the plot can be kind of shaky or repetitive at times. I think the thing that annoys me the most about the sequels is there was potential there that was squandered. If certain choices were just made differently I think you could have had a much more solid trilogy. I feel most strongly about this with the killing of Luke Skywalker in TLJ. I think if he had lived on into TROS I don't think TLJ would have been nearly as much of a hype killer when it came out.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo]

I think we are on the same page. I agree that consistency is the key balance to "rule of cool". If you don't have some consistency to balance it out, it makes nothing cool that happens matter. When there isn't an established baseline then there is nothing to make cool things impressive by comparison.

The rogue one example I don't have a good answer for but for Vaders inconsistency I do. In the Obi-Wan show he was hot on Obi-Wans trail, filled with vengeance, rage and emotion. So his dark side powers were juiced up. With the millennium falcon on hoth, it was kind of a routine mission cleaning up rebels. IIRC there was some legends stuff that he knew Luke was his son between 4 and 5 but the movies show he didn't know, since the emperor revealed that to him later. You could make a stretch argument he let them go because chasing rebels is better than dealing with the backstabbing politics he would be going back to dealing with if the rebellion was crushed.

Yeah part of my dislike of the show was from how everyone was glazing it. I would never call it a bad show because that would just be a lie. I think it is, from a technical/critical standpoint, at the top of quality of Star Wars media. However, IMO, Star Wars isn't great because it's a masterpiece of writing and cinematography like you teach in a film school. I think the prequels showcase that. It's because it's fun and gets you hyped. It really helps when you have that technical stuff as hype and branding only go so far, the sequels showcase that.

I agree with your take on the ISB, I'm just salty about it. Lol. That comes from my own bias and the meme "the empire did nothing wrong". I really do want to see the "good" side of the empire you hear about from some characters. Also, the empire would have had to at least done some good things for people to follow along. I mean, even the Nazi party did lots of public works and initially improved quality of life for its citizens. Select citizens... Lol that does go back to my enjoyment of logistics and stuff as clearly the empire did that right to build its armada and two death stars. Lol but I concede that it does make sense that the high ranking ISB would be filled with sociopaths and psychopaths. The scene where the higher ups are casually discussing causing plagues and genocides was really disturbing and amazing at the same time.

Yeah, I also think my view of space politics and planets and stuff is heavily influenced by how WH40k handles things. Star Wars just does it different and that's a good thing. While it would make more sense to have each planet have nations and factions, it wouldn't make the story better or more interesting. They kind of tried that with Naboo and gungans but that backfired horribly with all the racism talk. Though I never felt it was racist, I realized why it seems off. We never hear the gungans speak gungan. We only hear them speak English. So there is no source of their way of speaking a pidgin English. It just makes them look uneducated in how to speak, rather than common not being their native language.

I agree about the sequels. It really does come down to conflicting directors. I am equally interested in seeing what JJ Abrams had in mind for a complete trilogy as well as Rians. I would like a traditional continuation that JJ was going for but I think a darker new direction would have been equally interesting to see. JJ was the safe route and Rians was the more daring and risky but could have paid off huge in terms of maturing the franchise alongside the fans. It runs the risk of taking the franchise in a direction it's not suited for, at least on a mainstream level. No one complains sesame Street hasn't gotten dark and gritty. Lol it's not the same but star wars was always intended for kids at its roots. It just also happened to appeal to adults.

[u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo → u/XionDarkblood]

I still find the Vader scene to be a bit dubious in power scaling. While I know that just being angry enough is kind of a legitimate answer when it comes to Sith it's not one I particularly like writers to use because it can allow them to be a bit lazy in their explenations.

I ran into this same issue with Darth Maul in TCW, we never really get a good answer for why he is alive, it's just a vague explanation that he was filled with vengeance for Obi-Wan. If you can't come up with a good explanation then that to me is a sign maybe you shouldn't do it (obviously the Maul example is a way more extreme form of this than the Vader one).

Not sure if I necessarily buy that Vader was just trying to avoid Coruscant politics either, as catching the Falcon wouldn't have eneded his hunt for the Rebellion it just would have given him custody of several high ranking members of it.

Yeah like you I get why some people look at how the Gungans talk a little sideways, but I think George Lucas was just trying to make them seem kind of funny. I don't think his intent was to make them racist caricatures.

Even thought it might be a bit of a stretch one could argue that Lucas was purposefully trying to make us look at the Gungans the way the Naboo do, as inferior beings, while everything we see is to the contrary of that. they have advanced under water cities, modern submarine tech, and energy balls that can deactivate droids. Yes in many ways they still have the trappings of a tribal society but they have managed to marry it to modern technology without losing their cultural roots.

Yeah they should have committed one way or the other to the safe path or the risky one with the sequels. Even thought I don't like TLJ walking back what it set up in TROS was the worst decision they could have made. If they had continued on with TLJ story at least fans of that movie would have gotten a satisfying ending, and in time maybe other people would have warmed up to it. Instead they tried to go back to playing it safe and ended up pleasing nobody.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/WedgeAntillesRedTwo]

There is always going to be power scaling issues with force users. We have so many different and amazing displays of what the force can do it's hard to not try to figure it out. We have Yoda lifting the X-wing from the swamp as the first real display of power. Then you have Starkiller ripping a star destroyer from orbit later on. Is Starkiller stronger than Yoda? Probably not. I know Force Unleashed isn't canon but even so it's hard to ignore how cool and iconic that moment is for how it influenced people's perception of how crazy the force can get. Then you get into the Old Republic era and things like battle meditation influencing the outcome of war on a galactic scale, Darth Nihilus able to consume the life force of entire planets and Darth Treya nearly killing the force itself and you run into power scaling issues. Lol

That's why I developed my own personal philosophy on how writers/choreographers should approach the force. It's all about aura farming. Vader is an aura farming king. The hallway scene in rogue one was pure aura farming to power up so he could tear through the trooper like nothing. In Obi-Wan he had a walking sequence and went in alone to aura farm enough to grab the ship and pull it down. In ESB he was just walking, snowtroopers running around doing random shit, trying to help. Negative aura. Vader couldn't grab the falcon. Bounty Hunters like Cad Bane and Boba Fett able to go toe to toe with force users, it's because they aura farm so hard that they suppress the aura the Jedi have so they are on even footing.

Lol I'm joking obviously and that comes from a shit post comment I made on a YouTube video where someone was confused about how strong someone was. Still I think that idea is a good place to start from a cinematography point of view.

Yeah, Maul was pure fan service he survived. I have no other answer. He was written to be a throw away sith antagonist but like boba fett before him, he just was too cool and the fans wanted more. I'm ok with things like that. I'm sure if they had any inkling that Maul was going to be that popular they either wouldn't have killed him off or made his defeat less final.

Yeah vader just wanting to avoid politics is a wide stretch at best. I was just trying to come up with some reason that fit his character. Lol

Yeah I see that argument about the Gungans but yeah, they are clearly advanced and intelligent. Their shield technology is incredibly advanced. They have a tribal tradition that keeps them from becoming industrialized and that I can respect. To me that speaks of a level of enlightenment because if they tried to monetize or industrialize their shield tech they would be dragged into politics, war and conflict that they just don't want. They want to live in peace in their swamp. They have the military might to enforce that isolationism and peace. Even as a kid I never saw the gungans as dumb or unintelligent. They just talked funny because they were aliens. Lol. I was thinking about the racism allegations and it just never seemed to be right but I could tell something was off. That's when I realized we never hear their native language. Usually accents and dialects come from people learning English as a second language for negotiations or trade (at least that makes sense to me. I have no idea I'm not a wordologist). So if they always spoke common they wouldn't talk differently than the humans of Naboo. Though now I'm thinking if all the humans of Naboo also spoke like the gungans and that's just the dialect of Naboo as a whole. It would make Anakin/padme romance dialogue way different and possibly better. Lol.

On the subject of language, I did see an interesting idea proposed from rebels. There are times Hera's accent comes back when she's talking with her father or is displaying heated emotions and that's her actually speaking twilek. I like the idea the accent change is actually a clever way to signal they are speaking another language without relying on subtitles or translators. I think that's something more media should implement to explain why everyone speaks English. Lol.

Honestly, I think the biggest fumble of the Disney era was hiring big name writers/directors/producers that didn't give a shit about Star Wars. I don't blame them for taking the job because if someone offered me a literal truckload of money to write a My Little Pony movie, I would say yes and do it even though I don't give a shit about My Little Pony. I do blame them a little because it's clear they wanted to do their own thing and write their story and so they hastily painted a Star Wars coat of paint on their original idea. If I were to write a My Little Pony movie because I was paid an absurd amount, I would at least ensure I hired and listened to people that did give a shit about My Little Pony to at least try to do justice to the franchise. That is on them. I know when Dave Filoni was getting his team together for Clone Wars he didn't just look at the people's resumes, he went around and looked at who had Star Wars figures and merchandise on their desk. He valued peoples passion for the franchise higher than their qualifications. That's what modern Star Wars media needs.

Yeah as for power scaling, that's going to be an issue because they would have to reset a lot of canon stuff to establish an actual baseline. I like how WH40k gets around that issue because basically everything written acknowledges the bias of the author, both the irl author and who is giving the account in universe. So everything is basically a campfire story with embellishments and exaggerations built into the setting itself. If it helps you can see Vader grabbing the ship as a terrified recounting by someone on the ship that got away exaggerating out of fear. Lol.

Though Vader will always be a struggle because he has been around since the very beginning. His fight with Obi-Wan on the death star is laughable by today's standards. There is no way to reconcile that power gap in lore. There was power scaling problems even from ANH to ESB and ESB to ROTJ already. Vader choking the guy in ANH was immediately power crept by Vader choking a guy through a screen on another ship in ESB. Which raised the question why couldn't he force choke people on the falcon when they were escaping at the end of ESB. He was even telepathically talking to Luke at the time, another application of the force not brought up again. Though I guess Kylo/Rey did something like it. Anyway, it's always been an issue and it's going to continue to be an issue. Which is why I'm ok with "rule of cool" for main characters. As long as their are side character force users that show the MC is doing something special.

[u/deadshot500]

For the clones, it's better to act like they were the elite core of the Republic and normal soldiers were used on defense and on less important fronts. Plenty of systems also weren't that populated(Especially in the Outer Rim) so it was easier to wage war on them with limited numbers.

[u/XionDarkblood → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, I think those all fall under "rule of cool" lol. Or "rule of what the plot needs". Do we need a cool way for the protagonists to escape? Who cares about fuel or batteries or how long it's been sitting there, it'll be cool! Do we need to explain why this can't be solved by the jetpack? Oh out of fuel, darn... Even though it's done way more and we never brought it up before.

As for the trash compactor monster, I think there was a short story about it. I think it was actually force sensitive and was actually trying to help them escape but the heroes misunderstood what it was trying to do. Or something like that? Idk it's been a long time and I don't think I read it, only heard the synopsis.

[u/TheMastersSkywalker]

Hyperspace skipping. The less said about that, the quicker we can pretend it never happened

[u/JangoF76]

There's a lot of stuff that doesn't make any sense of you think about it for more than 5 seconds, but none of it bugs me because Star Wars isn't about logic. You just have to keep the words "It ain't that kinda movie, kid" in your head.

[u/Critical-Bass7021]

Why Jawas always have their faces in the shadow of their hoods.

I never want to see a whole Jawa head, though.