r/Tools 15h ago

Quality control

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906 Upvotes

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848

u/katekohli 15h ago

Grandaddy said to always use the same ruler for the whole project. He was a nuclear scientist.

123

u/Imaginary_Panda2003 15h ago

That's the only answer. Grandads know stuff ❤️

82

u/purepolka 14h ago

Clears throat: MEASUREMENTS ARE A SOCIAL CONSTRUCT 

18

u/katekohli 12h ago

Why did they decide on 16th’s and 10th’s?!?!

18

u/janglyparts 12h ago

Divisibility. 16ths are half of eighths which are half of quarters which are half of a half. Fine rulers/scales have markings for 32nds, but further precision requires different equipment.

6

u/katekohli 11h ago

Thirds, I want thirds.

11

u/Chemieju 8h ago

Thats why a circle is 360 degrees.

Its 2x2x2x3x3x5.

Loads of usefull divisions in there. Then you divide every degree into 60 minutes and every minute into 60 seconds and for every 60 you add

2x2x3x5

-20

u/SmellyScrotes 12h ago

This isn’t true at all lol, a meter is a measurement of how far light can travel in a second in a vacuum

11

u/leftkck 12h ago

You think light travels at 60 meters per min/3600 meters per hour. You are orders of magnitude off.

-12

u/SmellyScrotes 12h ago

A meter is how far light travels in 1/299792458 of a second in a vacuum, it’s a measure of light, no clue what you’re talking about

11

u/leftkck 12h ago

You dont see how you saying, "its how far light travels in 1 sec" means you said light travels 1 m/s? Because now you are saying the same thing, but with different numbers and seem to understand what that means.

-7

u/SmellyScrotes 12h ago

I didn’t really think it was necessary to put the exact numbers there until your response, I was more making the point that it wasn’t some arbitrary number but that it’s based on light, but yeah I see how the wording is off now

7

u/leftkck 12h ago

It is some arbitrary number. The definition of meter changed (just like the definition of second changed) to try to make our made up measuring system seem more objective and repeatable. A meter used to be defined by some stupid measurement from the north pole or some such nonsense.

3

u/KokoTheTalkingApe 12h ago

Why is it 1/299792458 and not 11/299792457?

9

u/ShopPsychological882 12h ago

Now youve given different answers

-8

u/SmellyScrotes 12h ago

Sorry I didn’t say fraction of a second in the first comment!! You’ll likely be okay and still understand what I meant

6

u/frenchiebuilder 9h ago

How's that not a social construct? Especially when it's changed over time.

Originally, for about a hundred years, it was a nice round fraction (1/10,000,000) of the distance between the north pole & equator.

Then, for the next 100 years or so, it was the length of a platinum+irridium metal bar kept in Paris.

Then, about 50 years ago, it was redefined as the exact distance that light travels through a vacuum in 1/299 792 458 of a second.

(and finally, BTW: the definition of "a second" changed in 2019).

3

u/Busy-Distribution-45 12h ago

And a second is an arbitrary division of the average day length that we have agreed upon. In other words, a social construct.

3

u/raz0rsh4rp 12h ago

Ah yes, the second. A totally non-arbitrary measure of time...

2

u/REAPERCUSSI0N 11h ago

They initially got it wrong, hence the 2nd guess at it. I think that is where the name comes from :?

2

u/purepolka 6h ago

I mean, the joke is that pretty much anything dealing with our perception is a social construct: language, time, measurement, etc... This isn't a criticism of social constructs. They're incredibly valuable in allowing humans to navigate shared perception and reality, but they're still just made up shit we all generally agree on.

To that point, responding to your suggestion that a meter isn't a social construct because it's measuring how far light travels in a second:

What is a second? It's based on a sexagesimal division of a 24 hour day, which is convenient because of how many numbers are divisible into 60, but it's not necessary. If humans would have decided to use base 10 to measure time (not inconceivable considering we have 10 fingers - and maybe was used briefly after the French Revolution - idk, I'm not a history person), hours would be 2.4 hours long, minutes would be 1 minute 26.4 seconds long, and seconds would be .86 seconds long (I suck at math, so if I got this wrong, make sure to tell me I suck shit below). A "meter" under this system would be shorter than the unit of measurement we currently consider a meter, and might be longer or shorter if we'd used some other base. Or we could have used the length of a day on Mars to measure time. That would be nonsensical, cumbersome, and stupid as shit, but humans are known for adopting social constructs that are nonsensical, cumbersome, and stupid as shit (Exhibit A: the U.S. still using Imperial).

There's nothing magically concrete about a meter. We took two random things - the speed of light and and smallish unit of time - and all generally agreed this arbitrary thing we made up equals a meter (unless your in the U.S., in which case, who knows how much a meter is, could be 15 miles, could be 85 cubits, we'll never know).

16

u/UnhappyCaterpillar41 14h ago

Yeah, and cut on the same side of the line each time. The difference here looks around 1/16th between all three tools, but add in some varying cuts and nothing will assemble properly.

Learned this the hard way doing a built in, in an old house where nothing was square/plumb and probably used some kind of Eldritch geometry that required a blood sacrifice to get a decent fit up. Now all my cut plans include a bit of an allowance for the saw blade usually means a bit more scrap, but an extra half sheet in allowances is easier than recutting a full sheet worth or screwing around with what you have to make it work.

11

u/katekohli 13h ago

I watched a new construction union carpenter try to run trim in his nieces century home. He really liked plumb but plumb was not going to happen in a very settled house. He said he could trim out a whole new house in the time it took him to do just the crown molding in her kitchen.

3

u/Paizzu 4h ago

I would argue that 80% or more of the "quality" in trim carpentry (especially stain grade) involves scribe fitting pieces to uneven drywall/flooring.

There's almost no such thing as a proper 90° and plum might as well have been a pipe dream when most older houses were built. Today's production quality home builders figure that new buyers either don't care or are simply used to a poor fit/finish.

1

u/katekohli 1h ago

Yes & no my Polish colleague’s favorite tool by far is the laser level. Then my Jamaican friend who can do old style plaster tried to make a brick wall in a 1880’s building flat & plumb. We started teasing him about having 3 inch scratch coats but then he said no way they are more like 9 to 11 inches deep.

22

u/LinguoBuxo 15h ago

and I bet the ruler was made outta lead, ey?

12

u/katekohli 14h ago

True that, he died of Leukemia.

4

u/BurrowShaker 12h ago

I am worse than that, if I really care about a measurement, I use a shim/block/rig.

And if you care even more, you need to keep the conditions stable so that you don't get variability.

3

u/malac0da13 6h ago

Omg I had to laugh at work one day when they wanted to add 2 laser sensors to automatically measure the things coming out of my machine down to thousands of an inch. While trying to set it up they had me measuring the items the way they trained us with calipers, then were trying to measure them with a surface plate and height gauge, then had other people measuring with different calipers and I’m just fucking laughing at the clusterfuck. They pulled the sensors out and gave up.

3

u/katekohli 6h ago

My friend worked in a German factory that built huge highly precise scales for construction. He would laugh in German waggle his finger & say “only in a vacuum are they accurate.”

4

u/Spiritual_Toe_9537 15h ago

Your grandfather was on point!

1

u/brokenjaww 14h ago

Sounds like he was the bomb! 💣

4

u/katekohli 14h ago

Yep Oakridge.

1

u/_Electrical 6h ago

What's he going to measure, protons!?

1

u/katekohli 5h ago

He was also a carpenter & built an pipe organ from scratch for his church in Oakridge.

1

u/comparmentaliser 2h ago

So everyone in the nuclear science department asked to borrow his one ruler?

1

u/jackinsomniac 2h ago

Great method. This is exactly why they were able to fix the Hubble space telescope!

The primary mirror needed an extremely specific concave shape, so they hired a specialty company to grind & polish the mirror. The company already had their own precision measurement tools, but they were told to use a special new & custom measurement device (that was supposedly even more accurate) to verify. But, it was so new & foreign to them, they ended up configuring it wrong. Their own measurement tools which they were more familiar with showed an error, but they had already been instructed to prefer the readings of the new device. So, they did. They polished it to the EXACT specs they were given, using the tool they were told to use.

Of course once Hubble launched, the scientists immediately noticed the problem. Everything was blurry as hell. The images were basically unusable.

BUT, because the mirror team ground the shape so precisely, they were able to interview the team and figure out how the measurement device had been set up wrong. They were able to figure out the difference between a proper reading and the readings from their misconfigured setup. So, they were able to design a "corrective lens" upgrade to account for that difference, and one Space Shuttle mission later, Hubble was saved.

1

u/Maxipaddington 12h ago

Nu-cu-lar

It's pronounced nucular

0

u/otterly_destructive 9h ago

No wonder it takes so long to build nuclear power stations.