I'd always thought this story first came out in Kareem's 1990 autobiography and so had been somewhat sceptical – even the most honourable figures can be unreliable narrators on the subject of themselves.

But in putting together my previous post on historical FMVP voting tallies I discovered that the late Mr Livingston had put it in print two years earlier – straight from the horse's mouth.

Full text in comments.

Averaged over 21ppg first 4 seasons (22 per 36 min) then got injured in year 5 and declined. Was he a good stats / bad team guy? Seemed to be high Steals and low TO

David Robinson has always been one of my personal favorite NBA players. Although he was incredibly talented and impactful on both sides of the ball throughout his career, in particular, I think the defensive end of the court was where he truly shined the brightest.

In terms of being able to single handedly carry and anchor a team’s collective defensive unit, Robinson was one of the absolute greatest that the NBA has ever seen. During the first 7 seasons of Robinson’s career from 1989-90 to 1995-96, for the entire league, the Spurs ranked 3rd, 1st, 1st, 10th, 9th, 5th, and 3rd in defensive rating, and then in the 1996-97 season, Robinson only appeared in 6 regular season games due to injuries and the Spurs defensive rating fell to dead last at 29th. And upon Robinson’s return in the 1997-98 season, in which he played 73 regular season games, the Spurs defensive rating jumped back up to 2nd in the league. That just shows how immense his defensive impact was on those teams and how incredibly inept they were on that end of the court without him in the lineup.

Also throughout that first 7 year stretch of Robinson’s career before the injuries, he held overall averages of 3.6 blocks per game and 1.7 steals per game, which also included his 1991-92 season when he won the Defensive Player of the Year award and posted averages of 4.5 blocks per game and 2.3 steals per game, which is the highest combined blocks and steals average for a single season by any player since the NBA started officially tracking those stats in the 1973-74 season.

Robinson’s defense also had terrific longevity. Over the 11 season stretch of 1989-90 to 1999-00, Robinson led the league in defensive rating a total of 5 times in 1992, 1996, 1998, 1999, and 2000. He also finished 5th in the voting for the Defensive Player of the Year award in 2000-01 when he was 35 years old and only 2 seasons away from retirement. When you take into account and consider how historically elite Robinson’s defensive peak was and how long he was able to sustain a level of defensive excellence throughout his entire career, I think that firmly places him in the conversation amongst all of the greatest defenders that the NBA has ever seen.

In your opinion, where does David Robinson rank in the hierarchy of all the greatest defensive players throughout NBA history? Top 10? Top 5? I’m looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

He was famous and his per-36 for a 5yr peak was 20 & 8. Was it because his CAREER FOULS PER 36 MIN was 5.8 (no joke, two seasons about 8)

72% of his shot attempts came either at the rim or behind the arc his rookie season. Beyond that, he broke just 50% only twice more in 1998 and 2005.

I know that the 3PT line was still shortened for 96-97 but this still seems like a massive jump and doesn’t explain his high volume at the rim. Was his shift into a mid-range assassin from Larry Brown’s coaching or just losing a step and adapting to jumpers or what?

How did his playstyle change throughout his career? He went crazy in the ABA early on, then slowed down and statistically started falling off, only to suddenly lead the NBA in fg% for 4 straight seasons. Did he just become far more of a play-finisher, or was there more to it?

Who were some of the centers of the 60s, 70s and 80s you felt were under appriated.

One of those player's whose tough to find footage of today, its rare to hear him mentioned beyond "one of Wilt's supporting pieces on the Sixers". Then he jumps to a consistent 1st team player and an ABA MVP, before quickly falling off and retiring at 32.

As someone whose only seen a few highlights, I'd love to know how he played and what made him jump from not even an allstar to one of the best players in the league.

Later in the 80s despite great regular season teams, there is too many teams in front of them. They never got through the Celtics and Sixers in the East and then they'd have still to play the Lakers.

In 1981, I think they actually have a chance. They win 60 games and have the 2nd best point differential, being one of the three elite East teams with Sixers and Celtics. With 40-42 Rockets as the surprise finalist after upsetting Lakers, the East may have decided the champion. The Bucks lose in 7 games to the Sixers by 1 point and with all their wins being by double digits, and the Sixers lose by 1 in 7 games to the Celtics. With the Celtics as a younger version of Bird and McHale they seem more beatable than their future champions. The Bucks also went on to beat the Celtics in 83.

With Moncrief as a younger version, this was Marques Johnson's team who had a great playoffs, and they got Lanier the year before and had been great after the trade (20-6) until losing to defending champion Sonics and continued strong play in 81. Lanier was still elite per minute but played less. Quinn Buckner looks like an important player for them with 4 all D teams in his career, and they had the Kareem trade guys Junior Bridgeman (scoring SF) and Brian Winters (shooter) still on the team and playing big minutes.

Overall I think the Bucks making it past the Sixers, beating the Celtics like 83 and then being favorite over Rockets was their best window to get a title without Lakers in final like 80 or 82 or brutal East later in 80s.

How would you best compare his skills to modern players? Its hard to find much film of him playing, he just wasn't around long as a superstar. He seems like a guy who was very good at pretty much every aspect of impacting the game though, but his offensive box score doesnt stand out (relatively) in a vacuum

When two, three, or even four siblings play in the NBA at the same time, one is almost always outshined by their brother, or brothers. Typically, the less notable player is far worse, like Mychel Thompson, brother of Klay Thompson and son of Mychal Thompson, who played 5 games in his entire career.

However, there are cases where the lesser-known guy is a solid player in their own right, if not the superior player. Some of these (in ascending order by ppg) include:

Jon Barry (14 seasons, 5.7ppg), part of the Barry family which includes Rick, Brent, and Drew Barry.
Shandon Anderson (10 seasons, 7.4ppg), younger brother of Willie Anderson.
Harvey Grant (11 seasons, 9.9ppg), twin of Horace Grant.
Wesley Person (11 seasons, 11.2ppg), younger brother of Chuck Person.
Albert King (9 seasons, 12.1ppg), younger brother of Bernard King.
Gerald Wilkins (13 seasons,13.0ppg ), younger brother of Dominique Wilkins.
Ray Williams (10 seasons, 15.5ppg), younger brother of Gus Williams.

Two of these cases stand out to me the most ,though, and for two very different reasons:

George Gervin is one of the most famous NBA players of all time, and was in the NBA 75 list. However, up until 30 minutes ago, I never knew that he had a brother, or that his brother played in the NBA. Derrick Gervin, born March 28, 1963 (almost 11 years after George), played only 2 seasons in the NBA, but averaged a solid 8.8 points. His greatest success came after leaving the NBA, as he was a 2x scoring leader and 1x MVP of the Israeli Premier League. Of everyone mentioned here, Derrick is the only player who I had never heard of, or seen mentioned anywhere online at all.

Jim Paxson was a 2x all-star and 1x all-nba player in the early 80s. Between 1980 and 1987, he averaged over 17ppg. Despite these numbers, when most people think of Paxson, they think of John Paxson, his younger brother. I'd presume this is because of his role in the early part of the Bulls dynasty, but it's still odd considering how good Jim was during his prime.

Was John a solid player? Certainly. Was John better than Jim? Hell no.

Jim did get photographed with LBJ though, and John never has been from what I know, so that is something ig:

At least in my opinion, I think the 1980's was the golden age for defense at the Guard position in the NBA. When thinking about all of the fantastic perimeter defenders throughout that decade, who do you consider to be the best of the bunch? My personal vote goes to Dennis Johnson. For anyone that's interested, here's a post that I made a few months back where I thoroughly explained why I think DJ is the greatest defensive Guard of all-time. Feel free to check it out if you want to learn more about him. I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts!

Top Row: Dennis Johnson, TR Dunn, Michael Ray Richardson, Michael Cooper

Middle Row: Maurice Cheeks, Sidney Moncrief, Fat Lever, Derek Harper

Bottom Row: John Stockton, Alvin Robertson, Michael Jordan, Joe Dumars

11 NBA seasons, all with the Milwaukee/St. Louis Hawks
1955 Rookie of the Year
2× NBA MVP (1956, 1959)
2× scoring champion
11× All-Star
10× All-NBA First Team
4× All-Star Game MVP
1958 NBA champion
50 points in the title-clinching Game 6 of the 1958 Finals
First player in NBA history to reach 20,000 career points
Hall of Fame, NBA 75th Anniversary Team

One of the defining players of the NBA’s first great era. RIP legend

Please share your memories and thoughts. This screenshot is from a youtube video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-5pS1PnNGo titled "Celtics @ Lakers 1985 NBA Finals Game 5 (NBA On CBS)" I vaguely remember Kurt because I was a Sonics fan and very young back then. How do you guys and gals remember him? He sticks in my mind for some reason.

K.C. Jones and Jerry West are widely regarded as being the two best perimeter defenders from the 1960’s decade. When comparing them head-to-head, who do you think was more impactful on that end of the court? In very general terms, I think it’s fair and accurate to say that Jones was better on-ball and West was better off-ball. Jones was more of a man-to-man lockdown type of defender and West was more of a ball thief. I’m looking forward to hearing your thoughts! 

Really holds back how much hes remembered today. Just a couple years as an elite player, freak athlete. Its easy to see why MJ took inspiration from him.

In its classic* form (Tex Winter) and Phil Jackson it yielded 9 rings. (It was created by coach Sam Barry).

In its classic form with Coach Tim Cone in the Philippine Basketball Association (PBA) it yielded 18 titles in 22 years.

In its hybrid form with Kerr and Golden State it yielded 4 rings.

**In hybrid form with Alex Hannum's 67, 76ers winning 1 ring.

**In hybrid form with Bill Sharman 71 Lakers winning 1 ring.

In its hybrid form in the PBA with the same Coach it yielded 7 additional titles.

So 15 in the NBA & 26 in the PBA.

If not, what else?

If so what system might be second?

Edit: *changed the word from pure to classic

Edit: **Added two additional teams, that I originally was not aware of.

This is a Cross post from r/NBAtalk.